The Gold Road Chapter – which includes the Scribing system – and Update 42 is now available to test on the PTS! You can read the latest patch notes here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/656454/
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• PC/Mac: NA and EU megaservers for patch maintenance – April 22, 4:00AM EDT (08:00 UTC) - 9:00AM EDT (13:00 UTC)
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Vampiric Drain should'nt be a Criminal Act, Its lore breaking its also mage magic not just vampire.
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Synaki✭✭✭There is no good vampire, vampires are undead, corrupted abominations, and are only to be allowed to enter town after being turned to ash.5 -
TequilaFire✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Meanwhile they should make the vampire hunters's crossbow Silver Bolts do extra damage against vampires again.
1 -
Juhasow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭StormeReigns wrote: »StormeReigns wrote: »No god damn skill should be a criminal act, it's annoying and serves no purpose.
I agree. Want to use Blade of Woe on neutral npcs in front of guards and townfolk without issues.
Pickpocket with zero repercussions. Want to use Blastbones on all guards without being attacked - or crit.charge on them with out them getting angry. We should be rewarded the best items for just zoning into an area without working for it, BiS gear soon as we log in, etc...
I think You've missed the point @StormeReigns . I am almost certain OP was talking about using abilities when guards or citizens can see You but You dont use said abilities to attack them.
No point was missed. Self Control, a little forethought and positioning / situational awareness can go a long ways, especially when there is plausibility and probabilities of danger.
Take the venom out of a cobra and what do you get? A belt.
Problem starts when 1 class requires those and others doesn't. And seriously You're talking about "positioning and self awarness" while visiting merchant in the city ? Maybe we also should make dk abilities a criminal act because they can burn our cities by coincidence ? And I fail to see how removing criminal acts from necro is "taking venom out of cobra". You're not taking away necro strenght by that. Quite opposite , You're actually infusing cobra with more venom.2 -
Tessitura✭✭✭✭✭Dusk_Coven wrote: »I think we can't really compare them to class skills because the context of a Criminal Act is that people link it to what society considers a Criminal automatically. That person doesn't have to commit a crime -- being a Vampire (or Necromancer) is itself a type of "crime" that causes law enforcement to want to hunt you down.
By using an ability that people recognize to be Vampiric-specific, whether you are using it on an "innocent" or not, you are outing yourself as being a Vampire, and therefore a Criminal, in the eyes of society.
With class skills, presumably people have come to recognize that particular skill as not 100% indicative of Vampirism?
Of course ZOS has confused the issue with Rivenspire and Vampirism sort-of-not-illegal there but that's another issue.
And the fact that the guards know you are a Vampire (or Necromancer) but let you off with a bounty.... so they can farm bounty money from you? Because next time you're outed as a Vampire (which they know you are!) you'll just get another bounty?
If they took away the blood geyser and returned to just biting people it would be more clear.
Man if I recall, they mention that High Elf being a vampire is not common knowledge, it's not that it's legal, it's a well kept secret. Don't ask don't tell kind of thing, but only for him and his house.
As far as the bounty issue, thats just the limitations of this game's criminal system.... It could have been so much more.1 -
FakeFox✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭StormeReigns wrote: »No god damn skill should be a criminal act, it's annoying and serves no purpose.
I agree. Want to use Blade of Woe on neutral npcs in front of guards and townfolk without issues.
Pickpocket with zero repercussions. Want to use Blastbones on all guards without being attacked - or crit.charge on them with out them getting angry. We should be rewarded the best items for just zoning into an area without working for it, BiS gear soon as we log in, etc...
Pickpocket and Blade of Woe are not even skills and I wont even comment on the rest.EU/PC (GER) - Healermain since 2014 - 50305 Achievement Points - Youtube (PvE Healing Guides, Builds & Gameplay)0 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭.Thevampirenight wrote: »There is another reason for this the lore.
They are breaking the lore on this, The Vampiric Drain and Brain Drain are a form of Absorption spells and anyone can use such magic its not vampire exclusive as these types of spells are part of the Restoration/Mysticism schools. Also known as vampiric spell effects that means anyone and I mean anyone can use these types of spells. Even Weapons can be enchanted with them.
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Notes_On_The_Lunar_Forge
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Absorb_Health
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Absorb_Health
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Absorb_Magicka
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Absorb_Fatigue
Example Morrowind Vampire ability. Vampire Touch spell, which Absorbs Health 10-30 points on touch. It will always have a 100% success rate.
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Morrowind:Absorb_Health
So that is another reason why Vampiric Drain shouldn't be a crime how is it any different from a absorb health spell? Let me tell you something it isn't.
All it is restoration/mysticism some vampire strains can have the power along with invisibility and both are not vampire exclusive abilties.
Even Priests in Oblivion sold these types of Absorb Spells. So your local priest of Arkay could be using such a spell and it would look similar or even exactly the same as the Vampires ability.
The lore is very flexible but there is only so much flexibility. For Vampiric Drain to be criminal would mean all forms of absorption magic would be as well since technically there would be no distinction between the two. Since it uses the same effects and it is good reason why they should change this.
You are twisting things where. This has to do with the vampire itself casting the drain and not the basis of the spell itself. You are attempting to craft a case to support your incorrect conclusion.9 -
FakeFox✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭StormeReigns wrote: »No god damn skill should be a criminal act, it's annoying and serves no purpose.
I agree. Want to use Blade of Woe on neutral npcs in front of guards and townfolk without issues.
Pickpocket with zero repercussions. Want to use Blastbones on all guards without being attacked - or crit.charge on them with out them getting angry. We should be rewarded the best items for just zoning into an area without working for it, BiS gear soon as we log in, etc...
I think You've missed the point @StormeReigns . I am almost certain OP was talking about using abilities when guards or citizens can see You but You dont use said abilities to attack them or to cause any other harm to them. Something like using spirit guardian in a duel nearby guard. Nobody is talking about attacking guards or NPC mobs in towns without punishment
Thank you!
EU/PC (GER) - Healermain since 2014 - 50305 Achievement Points - Youtube (PvE Healing Guides, Builds & Gameplay)0 -
Thevampirenight✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭.Thevampirenight wrote: »There is another reason for this the lore.
They are breaking the lore on this, The Vampiric Drain and Brain Drain are a form of Absorption spells and anyone can use such magic its not vampire exclusive as these types of spells are part of the Restoration/Mysticism schools. Also known as vampiric spell effects that means anyone and I mean anyone can use these types of spells. Even Weapons can be enchanted with them.
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Notes_On_The_Lunar_Forge
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Absorb_Health
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Absorb_Health
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Absorb_Magicka
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Absorb_Fatigue
Example Morrowind Vampire ability. Vampire Touch spell, which Absorbs Health 10-30 points on touch. It will always have a 100% success rate.
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Morrowind:Absorb_Health
So that is another reason why Vampiric Drain shouldn't be a crime how is it any different from a absorb health spell? Let me tell you something it isn't.
All it is restoration/mysticism some vampire strains can have the power along with invisibility and both are not vampire exclusive abilties.
Even Priests in Oblivion sold these types of Absorb Spells. So your local priest of Arkay could be using such a spell and it would look similar or even exactly the same as the Vampires ability.
The lore is very flexible but there is only so much flexibility. For Vampiric Drain to be criminal would mean all forms of absorption magic would be as well since technically there would be no distinction between the two. Since it uses the same effects and it is good reason why they should change this.
You are twisting things where. This has to do with the vampire itself casting the drain and not the basis of the spell itself. You are attempting to craft a case to support your incorrect conclusion.
Doesn't matter what is casting it, its just a absorb spell not a vampire spell. So how would if say a vampire didn't look so pale and using a skin would a guard know a vampire was using it? No that is immersion breaking and thus I feel is lore breaking plus immersion breaking unless they make all absorb magic spells a crime.
It was not a crime in Morrowind it was not a crime in Oblivon and it was not a crime in Skyrim to use absorb Health. Including vampire versions of the absorb health spell and if its a crime in Eso it should and rightfully so be a crime for all versions including the nightblade. Otherwise I call lore break/immersion breaking and for very good reason and I do feel I should call them out on that one and hope they change it because it is.
All they have to do is switch the criminal act part with Hypnotic gaze and then the Skill line would look just fine with the Justice system.
This is video from Oblivon if you mind the swearing in the start of it of it you can see what Absorb Health can do only one I can find though. Also the person isn't a vampire. So any mage can do this if they have the knowledge to use a spell like vampiric drain, so its a mage spell as much as it is a vampire one. So how can a spell any mage can do be criminal? A pale stranger casts strife doesn't get a bounty and suddenly gets a bounty from using vampiric drain I don't think so. Since they are both Absorb Health effects. The same type of magic basically.
I'm fine with them making vampire skills criminal but not that one and for the reasons I've listed.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ciAfVhdzdvE
Edited by Thevampirenight on March 31, 2020 4:56PMPC NA
Please add Fangs to Vampires.0 -
Thokri✭✭✭✭✭If animating bones I carry in bag is criminal act, then surely killing innocents by feeding is.
I am not 100% sure about previous ES feeding but I don't remember it killing your cattle, in new feeding it looks like target dies.2 -
Thevampirenight✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭If animating bones I carry in bag is criminal act, then surely killing innocents by feeding is.
I am not 100% sure about previous ES feeding but I don't remember it killing your cattle, in new feeding it looks like target dies.
Yeah that is something that should be criminal, but using absorb health (Vampiric Drain) against enemies and hostile evil enemies should not be a crime as its not necromancy but is a form of Restoration Magic.Edited by Thevampirenight on March 31, 2020 4:50PMPC NA
Please add Fangs to Vampires.0 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Thevampirenight wrote: ».Thevampirenight wrote: »There is another reason for this the lore.
They are breaking the lore on this, The Vampiric Drain and Brain Drain are a form of Absorption spells and anyone can use such magic its not vampire exclusive as these types of spells are part of the Restoration/Mysticism schools. Also known as vampiric spell effects that means anyone and I mean anyone can use these types of spells. Even Weapons can be enchanted with them.
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Notes_On_The_Lunar_Forge
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Absorb_Health
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Absorb_Health
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Absorb_Magicka
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Absorb_Fatigue
Example Morrowind Vampire ability. Vampire Touch spell, which Absorbs Health 10-30 points on touch. It will always have a 100% success rate.
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Morrowind:Absorb_Health
So that is another reason why Vampiric Drain shouldn't be a crime how is it any different from a absorb health spell? Let me tell you something it isn't.
All it is restoration/mysticism some vampire strains can have the power along with invisibility and both are not vampire exclusive abilties.
Even Priests in Oblivion sold these types of Absorb Spells. So your local priest of Arkay could be using such a spell and it would look similar or even exactly the same as the Vampires ability.
The lore is very flexible but there is only so much flexibility. For Vampiric Drain to be criminal would mean all forms of absorption magic would be as well since technically there would be no distinction between the two. Since it uses the same effects and it is good reason why they should change this.
You are twisting things where. This has to do with the vampire itself casting the drain and not the basis of the spell itself. You are attempting to craft a case to support your incorrect conclusion.
Doesn't matter what is casting it, its just a absorb spell not a vampire spell. So how would if say a vampire didn't look so pale and using a skin would a guard know a vampire was using it? No that is immersion breaking and thus I feel is lore breaking plus immersion breaking unless they make all absorb magic spells a crime.
It was not a crime in Morrowind it was not a crime in Oblivon and it was not a crime in Skyrim to use absorb Health. Including vampire versions of the absorb health spell and if its a crime in Eso it should and rightfully so be a crime for all versions including the nightblade. Otherwise I call lore break/immersion breaking and for very good reason and I do feel I should call them out on that one and hope they change it because it is.
All they have to do is switch the criminal act part with Hypnotic gaze and then the Skill line would look just fine with the Justice system.
This is video from Oblivon if you mind the swearing in the start of it of it you can see what Absorb Health can do only one I can find though. Also the person isn't a vampire. So any mage can do this if they have the knowledge to use a spell like vampiric drain, so its a mage spell as much as it is a vampire one. So how can a spell any mage can do be criminal? A pale stranger casts strife doesn't get a bounty and suddenly gets a bounty from using vampiric drain I don't think so. Since they are both Absorb Health effects. The same type of magic basically.
I'm fine with them making vampire skills criminal but not that one and for the reasons I've listed.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ciAfVhdzdvE
You keep ignoring the fact that this is a vampire skill and as such you are absolutely wrong. If a vampire uses this skill on a legitimate target but is in an area where the "criminal act" is relevant then they are in fact exposing themselves as a vampire. As such your comparisons to other non-vampire skills are completely irrelevant just as the video you linked above is not germane to the skill.9 -
StormeReigns✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
Technically, they are skills; just not traditional. Pickpocket is inherent to the base game and apart of the legerdemain world skill line. Which passives greatly assist in making the PP skill easier to use, and the other, blade of woe requires to be part of the DB guild to even use.Pickpocket and Blade of Woe are not even skills.
Not all classes, nor skill lines / abilities need to be treated the same, or be alike, let alone the same. Honestly the game really doesn't need anymore homogenization added into it - and some of you are avid about this in your past post history and yet, here you are just doing that, wanting to add more.Problem starts when 1 class requires those and others doesn't. And seriously You're talking about "positioning and self awarness" while visiting merchant in the city ? Maybe we also should make dk abilities a criminal act because they can burn our cities by coincidence ? And I fail to see how removing criminal acts from necro is "taking venom out of cobra". You're not taking away necro strenght by that. Quite opposite , You're actually infusing cobra with more venom.
If certain skills / classes are considered taboo or criminal in certain areas, great. Those who have lack of self-control and must spam everything everywhere, they should earn those bounties rightfully for not considering the risk. Risk. High or low, doesn't always have to have to guarantee a reward.1 -
Siohwenoeht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭StormeReigns wrote: »No [Snip] skill should be a criminal act, it's annoying and serves no purpose.
[Edited for profanity bypass]
I agree. Want to use Blade of Woe on neutral npcs in front of guards and townfolk without issues.
Pickpocket with zero repercussions. Want to use Blastbones on all guards without being attacked - or crit.charge on them with out them getting angry. We should be rewarded the best items for just zoning into an area without working for it, BiS gear soon as we log in, etc...
I think You've missed the point @StormeReigns . I am almost certain OP was talking about using abilities when guards or citizens can see You but You dont use said abilities to attack them or to cause any other harm to them. Something like using spirit guardian in a duel nearby guard. Nobody is talking about attacking guards or NPC mobs in towns without punishment
Dueling in towns/crafting areas etc should be illegal already. Plenty of open space for that. I enjoy the layer that the justice system adds including the new additions of some abilities.
If vamps were attacked on sight for just being vamps, I'd agree with you. But if you're roleplaying a paragon vamp, you wouldn't be in any fear of the justice system as it is."It is a lovely language, but it takes a very long time saying anything in it, because we do not say anything in it, unless it is worth taking a long time to say, and to listen to." - Treebeard0 -
NotaDaedraWorshipper✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭TheShadowScout wrote: »IF anything, then you could make a case for all transformed werewolves to be "kill on sight" as well, saying the guards get itching to try out their newly issues anti-lycanthrope silver dagger or something...
@TheShadowScout I heard that transforming into a werewolf will be a criminal act aswell. Not 100% sure though.[Lie] Of course! I don't even worship Daedra!0 -
Thevampirenight✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Siohwenoeht wrote: »StormeReigns wrote: »No [Snip] skill should be a criminal act, it's annoying and serves no purpose.
[Edited for profanity bypass]
I agree. Want to use Blade of Woe on neutral npcs in front of guards and townfolk without issues.
Pickpocket with zero repercussions. Want to use Blastbones on all guards without being attacked - or crit.charge on them with out them getting angry. We should be rewarded the best items for just zoning into an area without working for it, BiS gear soon as we log in, etc...
I think You've missed the point @StormeReigns . I am almost certain OP was talking about using abilities when guards or citizens can see You but You dont use said abilities to attack them or to cause any other harm to them. Something like using spirit guardian in a duel nearby guard. Nobody is talking about attacking guards or NPC mobs in towns without punishment
Dueling in towns/crafting areas etc should be illegal already. Plenty of open space for that. I enjoy the layer that the justice system adds including the new additions of some abilities.
If vamps were attacked on sight for just being vamps, I'd agree with you. But if you're roleplaying a paragon vamp, you wouldn't be in any fear of the justice system as it is.
Yeah it would be nice if players had to take it out a certain feet from a city.
Or even use the in game arenas.
I support vampiric drain used on an innocent to be a crime I don't support it for attacking a hostile npc that attacks you on sight.
The justice system really does need a rework I feel.
I know because of limitations its possible the justice system has to be game wide. But its really silly that you steal a carrot in daggerfall have to pay for it in Stonefalls.
Its half baked as it is. No jailing system that gives an illusion of serving time in a jail.
I do understand the desire that vampires be part of the justice system and they are doing that with certain vampire abilties. I just feel that the Vampiric drain is the wrong one to place it on because of well its magic used by non vampires.
I mean if they do my suggestion of switching it with hypnotic gaze 3 of 5 abilities would be criminal including the ultimate.
That is all I want them to do is switch the one that isn't a crime to be a crime and make vampiric drain not a crime.PC NA
Please add Fangs to Vampires.0 -
Thevampirenight✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭NotaDaedraWorshipper wrote: »TheShadowScout wrote: »IF anything, then you could make a case for all transformed werewolves to be "kill on sight" as well, saying the guards get itching to try out their newly issues anti-lycanthrope silver dagger or something...
@TheShadowScout I heard that transforming into a werewolf will be a criminal act aswell. Not 100% sure though.
Its 100% it was confirmed in the german life stream and shown to be the case in a video except every werewolf abiltiy will be a crime.
Edited by Thevampirenight on March 31, 2020 10:12PMPC NA
Please add Fangs to Vampires.1 -
NotaDaedraWorshipper✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Thevampirenight wrote: »NotaDaedraWorshipper wrote: »TheShadowScout wrote: »IF anything, then you could make a case for all transformed werewolves to be "kill on sight" as well, saying the guards get itching to try out their newly issues anti-lycanthrope silver dagger or something...
@TheShadowScout I heard that transforming into a werewolf will be a criminal act aswell. Not 100% sure though.
Its 100% it was confirmed in the german life stream and shown to be the case in a video except every werewolf abiltiy will be a crime.
Ah, good. Then I remembered correctly. And of course all the abilities are going to be a criminal act when transforming is one, since you are a werewolf.[Lie] Of course! I don't even worship Daedra!1 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭NotaDaedraWorshipper wrote: »Thevampirenight wrote: »NotaDaedraWorshipper wrote: »TheShadowScout wrote: »IF anything, then you could make a case for all transformed werewolves to be "kill on sight" as well, saying the guards get itching to try out their newly issues anti-lycanthrope silver dagger or something...
@TheShadowScout I heard that transforming into a werewolf will be a criminal act aswell. Not 100% sure though.
Its 100% it was confirmed in the german life stream and shown to be the case in a video except every werewolf abiltiy will be a crime.
Ah, good. Then I remembered correctly. And of course all the abilities are going to be a criminal act when transforming is one, since you are a werewolf.
For similar reasons all but one vampire skill will be a criminal act but the logic is different. Using one makes it obvious you are a vampire. Not sure why Bloody Mess is not a criminal act. Maybe that will be changed.1 -
Thevampirenight✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭NotaDaedraWorshipper wrote: »Thevampirenight wrote: »NotaDaedraWorshipper wrote: »TheShadowScout wrote: »IF anything, then you could make a case for all transformed werewolves to be "kill on sight" as well, saying the guards get itching to try out their newly issues anti-lycanthrope silver dagger or something...
@TheShadowScout I heard that transforming into a werewolf will be a criminal act aswell. Not 100% sure though.
Its 100% it was confirmed in the german life stream and shown to be the case in a video except every werewolf abiltiy will be a crime.
Ah, good. Then I remembered correctly. And of course all the abilities are going to be a criminal act when transforming is one, since you are a werewolf.
For similar reasons all but one vampire skill will be a criminal act but the logic is different. Using one makes it obvious you are a vampire. Not sure why Bloody Mess is not a criminal act. Maybe that will be changed.
Two vampire abilties won't be criminal that one and hypnotic gaze. However I think it would be better if one of those abilties switched their non criminal status with vampire drain.
PC NA
Please add Fangs to Vampires.0 -
Ratzkifal✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I'm pretty sure there is an internal distinction to be made here. Just like summoning Atronachs is different from raising the dead. It needs to be noted that the magic schools are a construct and not something that actually exists within the universe.
No school of magic is inherently evil, not even conjuration.
This means that whether a conjuration spell is evil or not and considered a crime is dependent on the context of that spell.
Extrapolating from this, the same must be true for applied mysticism and restoration magic. I am certain that you could use restoration magic to grow tumors and soul traps are considered a form of mysticism too and if we'd ask Vanus Galerion, then soul traps would be made illegal as well.
Now why are vampiric drains considered crimes? It's simple. A vampiric drain, is recognizable as a vampiric ability, only possessed by people with the affliction. It's not the nature of the attack itself or the magic behind it that is considered evil, it is the threat that vampires pose to society that gets you the bounty for outing yourself publicly as a vampire. The Mesmerize skill doesn't fall into this category and is not flagged as a criminal act, because it is not easily recognized as a skill of vampiric origin.
As for Mistform, I think that yes, this skill should be made a criminal act too for the very same reason. You can sprint and turn invisible while in Mistform anyway (assuming stage 4), so it wouldn't be a big deal anyway as it's not your go-to to escape from guards anymore either.This Bosmer was tortured to death. There is nothing left to be done.7 -
NotaDaedraWorshipper✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭NotaDaedraWorshipper wrote: »Thevampirenight wrote: »NotaDaedraWorshipper wrote: »TheShadowScout wrote: »IF anything, then you could make a case for all transformed werewolves to be "kill on sight" as well, saying the guards get itching to try out their newly issues anti-lycanthrope silver dagger or something...
@TheShadowScout I heard that transforming into a werewolf will be a criminal act aswell. Not 100% sure though.
Its 100% it was confirmed in the german life stream and shown to be the case in a video except every werewolf abiltiy will be a crime.
Ah, good. Then I remembered correctly. And of course all the abilities are going to be a criminal act when transforming is one, since you are a werewolf.
For similar reasons all but one vampire skill will be a criminal act but the logic is different. Using one makes it obvious you are a vampire. Not sure why Bloody Mess is not a criminal act. Maybe that will be changed.
That's what I said. It's obvious you are a werewolf when you're using them, so it's a criminal act, because you are a werewolf.
Same as the vampire abilities are a criminal act, not because of the abilities themselves but because they show you are a vampire.[Lie] Of course! I don't even worship Daedra!1 -
Tessitura✭✭✭✭✭Thevampirenight wrote: ».Thevampirenight wrote: »There is another reason for this the lore.
They are breaking the lore on this, The Vampiric Drain and Brain Drain are a form of Absorption spells and anyone can use such magic its not vampire exclusive as these types of spells are part of the Restoration/Mysticism schools. Also known as vampiric spell effects that means anyone and I mean anyone can use these types of spells. Even Weapons can be enchanted with them.
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Notes_On_The_Lunar_Forge
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Absorb_Health
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Absorb_Health
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Absorb_Magicka
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Absorb_Fatigue
Example Morrowind Vampire ability. Vampire Touch spell, which Absorbs Health 10-30 points on touch. It will always have a 100% success rate.
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Morrowind:Absorb_Health
So that is another reason why Vampiric Drain shouldn't be a crime how is it any different from a absorb health spell? Let me tell you something it isn't.
All it is restoration/mysticism some vampire strains can have the power along with invisibility and both are not vampire exclusive abilties.
Even Priests in Oblivion sold these types of Absorb Spells. So your local priest of Arkay could be using such a spell and it would look similar or even exactly the same as the Vampires ability.
The lore is very flexible but there is only so much flexibility. For Vampiric Drain to be criminal would mean all forms of absorption magic would be as well since technically there would be no distinction between the two. Since it uses the same effects and it is good reason why they should change this.
You are twisting things where. This has to do with the vampire itself casting the drain and not the basis of the spell itself. You are attempting to craft a case to support your incorrect conclusion.
Doesn't matter what is casting it, its just a absorb spell not a vampire spell. So how would if say a vampire didn't look so pale and using a skin would a guard know a vampire was using it? No that is immersion breaking and thus I feel is lore breaking plus immersion breaking unless they make all absorb magic spells a crime.
It was not a crime in Morrowind it was not a crime in Oblivon and it was not a crime in Skyrim to use absorb Health. Including vampire versions of the absorb health spell and if its a crime in Eso it should and rightfully so be a crime for all versions including the nightblade. Otherwise I call lore break/immersion breaking and for very good reason and I do feel I should call them out on that one and hope they change it because it is.
All they have to do is switch the criminal act part with Hypnotic gaze and then the Skill line would look just fine with the Justice system.
This is video from Oblivon if you mind the swearing in the start of it of it you can see what Absorb Health can do only one I can find though. Also the person isn't a vampire. So any mage can do this if they have the knowledge to use a spell like vampiric drain, so its a mage spell as much as it is a vampire one. So how can a spell any mage can do be criminal? A pale stranger casts strife doesn't get a bounty and suddenly gets a bounty from using vampiric drain I don't think so. Since they are both Absorb Health effects. The same type of magic basically.
I'm fine with them making vampire skills criminal but not that one and for the reasons I've listed.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ciAfVhdzdvE
Yeah but in skyrim they set a new precedent for a vampire exclusive magic ability that drains life, and in ESO they made it physically pull blood from you, now they have a standard for vampiric magic set in the world, Blood Magic, and Night Magic and the vampire's drain is clearly a blood magic, and as such, can be reasonably assumed to be unique to a vampire.1 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭NotaDaedraWorshipper wrote: »NotaDaedraWorshipper wrote: »Thevampirenight wrote: »NotaDaedraWorshipper wrote: »TheShadowScout wrote: »IF anything, then you could make a case for all transformed werewolves to be "kill on sight" as well, saying the guards get itching to try out their newly issues anti-lycanthrope silver dagger or something...
@TheShadowScout I heard that transforming into a werewolf will be a criminal act aswell. Not 100% sure though.
Its 100% it was confirmed in the german life stream and shown to be the case in a video except every werewolf abiltiy will be a crime.
Ah, good. Then I remembered correctly. And of course all the abilities are going to be a criminal act when transforming is one, since you are a werewolf.
For similar reasons all but one vampire skill will be a criminal act but the logic is different. Using one makes it obvious you are a vampire. Not sure why Bloody Mess is not a criminal act. Maybe that will be changed.
That's what I said. It's obvious you are a werewolf when you're using them, so it's a criminal act, because you are a werewolf.
Same as the vampire abilities are a criminal act, not because of the abilities themselves but because they show you are a vampire.
Basically, I was agreeing with you. Did not intend to ruffly feathers. Sorry.0 -
NotaDaedraWorshipper✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭NotaDaedraWorshipper wrote: »NotaDaedraWorshipper wrote: »Thevampirenight wrote: »NotaDaedraWorshipper wrote: »TheShadowScout wrote: »IF anything, then you could make a case for all transformed werewolves to be "kill on sight" as well, saying the guards get itching to try out their newly issues anti-lycanthrope silver dagger or something...
@TheShadowScout I heard that transforming into a werewolf will be a criminal act aswell. Not 100% sure though.
Its 100% it was confirmed in the german life stream and shown to be the case in a video except every werewolf abiltiy will be a crime.
Ah, good. Then I remembered correctly. And of course all the abilities are going to be a criminal act when transforming is one, since you are a werewolf.
For similar reasons all but one vampire skill will be a criminal act but the logic is different. Using one makes it obvious you are a vampire. Not sure why Bloody Mess is not a criminal act. Maybe that will be changed.
That's what I said. It's obvious you are a werewolf when you're using them, so it's a criminal act, because you are a werewolf.
Same as the vampire abilities are a criminal act, not because of the abilities themselves but because they show you are a vampire.
Basically, I was agreeing with you. Did not intend to ruffly feathers. Sorry.
Ah, sounded a bit like you thought I meant something else. Might just be me being tired from avoiding sick people all day. And no worries about my feathers, they are even less ruffled than Mara’s Spring Chicken![Lie] Of course! I don't even worship Daedra!0 -
Thevampirenight✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Thevampirenight wrote: ».Thevampirenight wrote: »There is another reason for this the lore.
They are breaking the lore on this, The Vampiric Drain and Brain Drain are a form of Absorption spells and anyone can use such magic its not vampire exclusive as these types of spells are part of the Restoration/Mysticism schools. Also known as vampiric spell effects that means anyone and I mean anyone can use these types of spells. Even Weapons can be enchanted with them.
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Notes_On_The_Lunar_Forge
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Absorb_Health
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Absorb_Health
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Absorb_Magicka
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Absorb_Fatigue
Example Morrowind Vampire ability. Vampire Touch spell, which Absorbs Health 10-30 points on touch. It will always have a 100% success rate.
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Morrowind:Absorb_Health
So that is another reason why Vampiric Drain shouldn't be a crime how is it any different from a absorb health spell? Let me tell you something it isn't.
All it is restoration/mysticism some vampire strains can have the power along with invisibility and both are not vampire exclusive abilties.
Even Priests in Oblivion sold these types of Absorb Spells. So your local priest of Arkay could be using such a spell and it would look similar or even exactly the same as the Vampires ability.
The lore is very flexible but there is only so much flexibility. For Vampiric Drain to be criminal would mean all forms of absorption magic would be as well since technically there would be no distinction between the two. Since it uses the same effects and it is good reason why they should change this.
You are twisting things where. This has to do with the vampire itself casting the drain and not the basis of the spell itself. You are attempting to craft a case to support your incorrect conclusion.
Doesn't matter what is casting it, its just a absorb spell not a vampire spell. So how would if say a vampire didn't look so pale and using a skin would a guard know a vampire was using it? No that is immersion breaking and thus I feel is lore breaking plus immersion breaking unless they make all absorb magic spells a crime.
It was not a crime in Morrowind it was not a crime in Oblivon and it was not a crime in Skyrim to use absorb Health. Including vampire versions of the absorb health spell and if its a crime in Eso it should and rightfully so be a crime for all versions including the nightblade. Otherwise I call lore break/immersion breaking and for very good reason and I do feel I should call them out on that one and hope they change it because it is.
All they have to do is switch the criminal act part with Hypnotic gaze and then the Skill line would look just fine with the Justice system.
This is video from Oblivon if you mind the swearing in the start of it of it you can see what Absorb Health can do only one I can find though. Also the person isn't a vampire. So any mage can do this if they have the knowledge to use a spell like vampiric drain, so its a mage spell as much as it is a vampire one. So how can a spell any mage can do be criminal? A pale stranger casts strife doesn't get a bounty and suddenly gets a bounty from using vampiric drain I don't think so. Since they are both Absorb Health effects. The same type of magic basically.
I'm fine with them making vampire skills criminal but not that one and for the reasons I've listed.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ciAfVhdzdvE
Yeah but in skyrim they set a new precedent for a vampire exclusive magic ability that drains life, and in ESO they made it physically pull blood from you, now they have a standard for vampiric magic set in the world, Blood Magic, and Night Magic and the vampire's drain is clearly a blood magic, and as such, can be reasonably assumed to be unique to a vampire.
Morrowind had something like it as well.
Oblivion didn't.
PC NA
Please add Fangs to Vampires.0 -
TheShadowScout✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
Ah, good. Seems that changed from the last time I played my part-time furry alt then.NotaDaedraWorshipper wrote: »I heard that transforming into a werewolf will be a criminal act aswell...
Rightfully so!
Exactly!For similar reasons all but one vampire skill will be a criminal act but the logic is different. Using one makes it obvious you are a vampire...
Like I kept saying, that is the whole point!
And I totally approve this direction, I long have lamented that vampires in ESO felt less like the lore treats them, and more like... just having an extra skill line. So, yeah, I want everything that outs a player character as bloodsucking fiend to be a criminal act, no matter how much more difficult it makes things for my vampire alt as well - because that's how it ought to be!
0 -
Nerouyn✭✭✭✭✭
✭Thevampirenight wrote: »The reasoning is quite simple vampires are not the only skill line to have siphoning effects.
I laughed out loud.
Truly.
In all of the single player games, vampires are attacked on sight by guards and vampirism can't be hidden by any means short of a daedric artifact like the Masque of Clavicus Vile.
That vampires can walk around freely in towns in ESO makes no sense at all. Especially somewhere like Summerset.
Vampiric attacks being treated as criminal is a weak arse nod to how vampires should be treated, according to canon.2 -
NotaDaedraWorshipper✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭TheShadowScout wrote: »And I totally approve this direction, I long have lamented that vampires in ESO felt less like the lore treats them, and more like... just having an extra skill line. So, yeah, I want everything that outs a player character as bloodsucking fiend to be a criminal act, no matter how much more difficult it makes things for my vampire alt as well - because that's how it ought to be!
Same. Vampires and werewolves are murdering monsters to the population of Tamriel, and they aren't going to go "Oh you're vampire? How interesting, I'm just a blacksmith myself. So did you want anything else repaired?". It doesn't matter that you (That's a general you) and a few other vampires/werewolves are rather decent, because they are expections. The majority of vampires and werewolves are bloodthirsty killers, that's what matter to the people of Tamriel.[Lie] Of course! I don't even worship Daedra!1 -
Tessitura✭✭✭✭✭Thevampirenight wrote: »Thevampirenight wrote: ».Thevampirenight wrote: »There is another reason for this the lore.
They are breaking the lore on this, The Vampiric Drain and Brain Drain are a form of Absorption spells and anyone can use such magic its not vampire exclusive as these types of spells are part of the Restoration/Mysticism schools. Also known as vampiric spell effects that means anyone and I mean anyone can use these types of spells. Even Weapons can be enchanted with them.
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Notes_On_The_Lunar_Forge
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Absorb_Health
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Absorb_Health
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Absorb_Magicka
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Absorb_Fatigue
Example Morrowind Vampire ability. Vampire Touch spell, which Absorbs Health 10-30 points on touch. It will always have a 100% success rate.
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Morrowind:Absorb_Health
So that is another reason why Vampiric Drain shouldn't be a crime how is it any different from a absorb health spell? Let me tell you something it isn't.
All it is restoration/mysticism some vampire strains can have the power along with invisibility and both are not vampire exclusive abilties.
Even Priests in Oblivion sold these types of Absorb Spells. So your local priest of Arkay could be using such a spell and it would look similar or even exactly the same as the Vampires ability.
The lore is very flexible but there is only so much flexibility. For Vampiric Drain to be criminal would mean all forms of absorption magic would be as well since technically there would be no distinction between the two. Since it uses the same effects and it is good reason why they should change this.
You are twisting things where. This has to do with the vampire itself casting the drain and not the basis of the spell itself. You are attempting to craft a case to support your incorrect conclusion.
Doesn't matter what is casting it, its just a absorb spell not a vampire spell. So how would if say a vampire didn't look so pale and using a skin would a guard know a vampire was using it? No that is immersion breaking and thus I feel is lore breaking plus immersion breaking unless they make all absorb magic spells a crime.
It was not a crime in Morrowind it was not a crime in Oblivon and it was not a crime in Skyrim to use absorb Health. Including vampire versions of the absorb health spell and if its a crime in Eso it should and rightfully so be a crime for all versions including the nightblade. Otherwise I call lore break/immersion breaking and for very good reason and I do feel I should call them out on that one and hope they change it because it is.
All they have to do is switch the criminal act part with Hypnotic gaze and then the Skill line would look just fine with the Justice system.
This is video from Oblivon if you mind the swearing in the start of it of it you can see what Absorb Health can do only one I can find though. Also the person isn't a vampire. So any mage can do this if they have the knowledge to use a spell like vampiric drain, so its a mage spell as much as it is a vampire one. So how can a spell any mage can do be criminal? A pale stranger casts strife doesn't get a bounty and suddenly gets a bounty from using vampiric drain I don't think so. Since they are both Absorb Health effects. The same type of magic basically.
I'm fine with them making vampire skills criminal but not that one and for the reasons I've listed.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ciAfVhdzdvE
Yeah but in skyrim they set a new precedent for a vampire exclusive magic ability that drains life, and in ESO they made it physically pull blood from you, now they have a standard for vampiric magic set in the world, Blood Magic, and Night Magic and the vampire's drain is clearly a blood magic, and as such, can be reasonably assumed to be unique to a vampire.
Morrowind had something like it as well.
Oblivion didn't.
It does not matter what other games had, it only matters what has been set up for the future, the drain spell has become THE iconic vampire ability, and will most likely stay that way for a long time. It being illegal makes sense enough.0
