Nightblades have had enough.

Langeston · March 2020

fastolfv_ESO wrote: »

nightblades still have the highest burst in both solo and group play so what exactly do people want? other than going after the heavy meta (which they should) nothing can be done without making the class bonkers OP

This is absurd. My magsorc can nuke someone in 1 GCD if timed right — that's literally impossible on a magblade. I don't know what the heck you are talking about.

Anyron · March 2020

Shadowasrial wrote: »

If they buffed the base stealth mechanics nb would be pretty decent but they refuse to so they need to buff our core skills to hit much harder. And for the love of god remove the bloody cast times

No matter what they do, buffing nightblade is direct buff to gank playstyle too - and thats what they wanna get rid of. Your main source of problem is cloak.

I could say that 100% critical chance is issue there. Noone likes to get hit by 20k snipe while that nightblade is safely 40m away. (there is reason why 99% of all gankers are nightblades)

They could change it to be good while not owerpowered. Make it unbreakable - no enemy aoes can pull you out of cloak, detect potions are removed from game, with same duration as it is now. Supress all dots on you but you cannot heal while cloak is up.

Just give nightblade reliable skill for survivability which cannot be abused by gankers.

Anyron · March 2020

Shadowasrial wrote: »

TelvanniWizard wrote: »

NBs are op gankers, they need a nerf

I hate to break it to you but we are hardly op. My nb has 5700 weapon damage and 17k penetration 30k stam and 60% crit and yet all of that is meaningless compared to the heavy armor 30k+ health meta. And yet these heavy armor players are zipping around with damn near the same weapon damage and if you wear light or medium armor you get slapped. On top of that blocking with sword and board gives them damn near 100% damage mitigation so while your attacking them draining all your resources they block it all until your drained and defenseless.(all the while being super defensive themselves.

Whole idea about making heavy armor sets with insane ammount of weapon damage on it was wrong and thats reason why most of players (stam) are using heavy now.
(heavy armor should make you move slower and to fastly drain your resources in exchange for superior damage mitigation. But it doesnt slow anyone and it gives you 378 magicka and stamina regen)
There are no really good heavy sets with spell damage on it, thats why magicka still runs in light (new moon is another recent mistake)

sproattt · March 2020

These guys at ZoS will nerf before any buffs.

Think it's time to come to the conclusion there's no love coming Nightblades way anytime soon. These fools are more like to nerf cloak than buff any skills or passives we have.

Either remove cast time on cap and keep silence or remove silence and keep the cast time. As once I hit 120 Ult I won't use incap as the animation is absurd and silence is useless in most scenarios plus it's so obvious and easy to block/dodge n roll around so Cap/Bow will never hit.

Mass Hysteria, a MASSIVE shadow of its former self; needs maim and it's snare back for it to be somewhat useable. I don't use fear anymore as it sucks, costs a fair amount of magicka when you can use the Turn evil? Makes no sense. Why BUFF the fear so targets don't move upon fear then NERF it later? It's absurd.

Why Nightblades ultimates have cast times and others don't is mental. In this state, I can't take this game seriously anymore. No one fights in PvP, everyone's zerging capturing empty keeps/resources and when you do somehow manage to get a fight there group shows up and ruins the fun, fighting outnumbered is fun; but that fun stops when all you do is get Xd or hunted down by a group when you play solo. Being rooted, snared and stunned by 4+ constantly isn't what I call fun, especially when your class is a nerfed, watered down waste of oxygen.

sproattt · March 2020

Here's one way to NERF snipe gank. I think if the games performance and servers were okay I think snipe desync would be more easier to defend and counter. Anyway see below if you want nerfs.

' Using snipe takes you out of stealth during the animation of snipe'

As once you go down this road of speaking of the crit from stealth it will get nerfed, then we will see that Camo hunter will get nerfed due to outcry that will lead to the loss of Min Berserk and the reduction of crit from major savagery.

Trust me, I've seen the nerfs in the past and these nonces at

jhnartb14_ESO · March 2020

Am i missing something? I have no problem with my NB in pvp, either CP or nonCP. Are we comparing it to how it was to now, or how it is now period? Not trolling, a serious question, because i have no problem bursting down a tank, kiting a templar or sorc, hunting other NB whether i am playing brawler or gank. I dont have 100% survival rate when i play because i am asleep at the wheel or i get outplayed by a build that is meant to kill my class, but rock-paper-scissors-shoe means i will have that. What are these posts looking for to happen?

Vercingetorix · March 2020

NIghtblade will never be balanced among other classes because it has the most overpowered ability solely in its toolkit - invisibility. Being able to manipulate aggro on a whim will always draw attention for re-balancing. Yes, it may not work that well right now but a few years ago Nightblades were the most dominant class in the game and that of course is going to warrant nerfs.

To some degree, Nightblades are still overpowered compared to other classes.- Nightblade class passives are all powerful and useful, each of them provides something the class needs - other classes have at least one or more useless passives. Nightblades don't have to make sacrifices with their passives - they get burst, sustain, and higher max resources - literally everything - just for slotting their strongest abilities.

thankyourat · March 2020

Iskiab wrote: »

thankyourat wrote: »

Gatdangmayne wrote: »

thankyourat wrote: »

Gatdangmayne wrote: »

@iskiab I agree Re: Boring combat and classes being too similar, but outside of the similarities between sorc and nightblade, the classes are distinct enough IMO.

Removing the invis mechanic doesn't have to kill the assassin fantasy, I would suggest playing up the "illusionist" aspect.

Maybe keep the crit buff from cloak but change it to the old dodge chance from evasion or something crazy like illusory copies of you that take damage, are targetable and not easily seen as the "fakes"?

Maybe adding a stam morph on funnel health/swallow soul, playing inthe whole siphoner aspect?

Idk, but removing the invisibility would open up a world of possibilities.

Removing stealth wouldn’t open up more possibilities. It’s also not the reason that Nightblades were nerfed. The most complained about Nightblades were heavy armor stamblades using dark cloak and bleeds and 60k+ magicka stacking magicka Nightblades using 14k damage shields while having almost 30k spectral bow tooltips. Neither of those builds used invisibility at all.

Where did I say anything about why nightblades were nerfed? Nice strawman argument though

You were implying that Nightblades won’t receive buffs due to cloak when cloak has nothing to due with Nightblades being in the position that they’re in.

It isn’t? I always assume it must be, like the devs but a value on cloak and then undertune other abilities. If not then a lot must be pretty clueless.

How else can being able to kill people with 2 damage abilities (dizzy + executioner) be justified when it’d be impossible with two others (swallow soul and impale). It can’t be the healing on swallow soul either, concealed is equally futile.

You could weave dizzy + executioner with no Ult and get lots of kills in pvp, with swallow soul and impale you could weave those for days and not kill anyone.

So I’ve been playing magblade for 5 years and it’s had good patches and terrible patches. What happens in ESO is that ZoS buffs underperforming classes and buffs overperfoming classes at the same time. When they should only do one or the other. This greatly changes the overall balance of the game every couple of patches. Just look at magdk it went from being probably the best class to one of the worse classes in a span of 6 months.

Stamblade has only been bad for 1 or 2 patches now and it’s main problems are that it lacks a form of defile and the bow is as slow as pond water. Soon ZoS will buff stamblade and nerf all the other stamina classes and stamblade will be close to the top again.

Magblade ZoS doesn’t know what to do with but that’s due to end game PvE. if magblade is top PvE DPS then trials will just have all magblade DDs because their self healing while doing damage would be too high. Magblade has also spent more time being terrible while really only having a few good patches since I’ve been playing.

Overall it’s just stamblades “turn” to be the worse stamina class. Nightblade has never really been good for group play either so players who enjoy grouping have always preferred playing with more group oriented classes.

Langeston · March 2020

Vercingetorix wrote: »

NIghtblade will never be balanced among other classes because it has the most overpowered ability solely in its toolkit - invisibility. Being able to manipulate aggro on a whim will always draw attention for re-balancing. Yes, it may not work that well right now but a few years ago Nightblades were the most dominant class in the game and that of course is going to warrant nerfs.

To some degree, Nightblades are still overpowered compared to other classes.- Nightblade class passives are all powerful and useful, each of them provides something the class needs - other classes have at least one or more useless passives. Nightblades don't have to make sacrifices with their passives - they get burst, sustain, and higher max resources - literally everything - just for slotting their strongest abilities.

Almost none of what you just said is true. You start off by saying that cloak is the "most overpowered ability" and then immediately contradict yourself in the next sentence when you admit that "yes, it may not work that well right now." Then you start talking about how strong NBs used to be, lol. In case you haven't noticed, this thread is about how weak NBs are — and I can tell you don't seriously play one because nearly all of your second paragraph is just flat out wrong.

Emmagoldman · March 2020

So is there going to be a new post every two days?

Iskiab · March 2020

thankyourat wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

thankyourat wrote: »

Gatdangmayne wrote: »

thankyourat wrote: »

Gatdangmayne wrote: »

@iskiab I agree Re: Boring combat and classes being too similar, but outside of the similarities between sorc and nightblade, the classes are distinct enough IMO.

Removing the invis mechanic doesn't have to kill the assassin fantasy, I would suggest playing up the "illusionist" aspect.

Maybe keep the crit buff from cloak but change it to the old dodge chance from evasion or something crazy like illusory copies of you that take damage, are targetable and not easily seen as the "fakes"?

Maybe adding a stam morph on funnel health/swallow soul, playing inthe whole siphoner aspect?

Idk, but removing the invisibility would open up a world of possibilities.

Removing stealth wouldn’t open up more possibilities. It’s also not the reason that Nightblades were nerfed. The most complained about Nightblades were heavy armor stamblades using dark cloak and bleeds and 60k+ magicka stacking magicka Nightblades using 14k damage shields while having almost 30k spectral bow tooltips. Neither of those builds used invisibility at all.

Where did I say anything about why nightblades were nerfed? Nice strawman argument though

You were implying that Nightblades won’t receive buffs due to cloak when cloak has nothing to due with Nightblades being in the position that they’re in.

It isn’t? I always assume it must be, like the devs but a value on cloak and then undertune other abilities. If not then a lot must be pretty clueless.

How else can being able to kill people with 2 damage abilities (dizzy + executioner) be justified when it’d be impossible with two others (swallow soul and impale). It can’t be the healing on swallow soul either, concealed is equally futile.

You could weave dizzy + executioner with no Ult and get lots of kills in pvp, with swallow soul and impale you could weave those for days and not kill anyone.

So I’ve been playing magblade for 5 years and it’s had good patches and terrible patches. What happens in ESO is that ZoS buffs underperforming classes and buffs overperfoming classes at the same time. When they should only do one or the other. This greatly changes the overall balance of the game every couple of patches. Just look at magdk it went from being probably the best class to one of the worse classes in a span of 6 months.

Stamblade has only been bad for 1 or 2 patches now and it’s main problems are that it lacks a form of defile and the bow is as slow as pond water. Soon ZoS will buff stamblade and nerf all the other stamina classes and stamblade will be close to the top again.

Magblade ZoS doesn’t know what to do with but that’s due to end game PvE. if magblade is top PvE DPS then trials will just have all magblade DDs because their self healing while doing damage would be too high. Magblade has also spent more time being terrible while really only having a few good patches since I’ve been playing.

Overall it’s just stamblades “turn” to be the worse stamina class. Nightblade has never really been good for group play either so players who enjoy grouping have always preferred playing with more group oriented classes.

That’s interesting, well for magblade there’s quite a bit they could do to help pvp and not touch pve.

The whole light attack to get a benefit helps pve and not really pvp. PvE bosses stand still and getting the benefit of light attacks is almost granteed, pvp doesn’t work like that.

They could also untie the healing from swallow soul being based on damage done. That’s what makes it heal for a crap load in pve but be really weak in pvp, treat it like javelin and ignore pen. Refreshing path they could make the hot linger as long as the expedition, that would make the healing amount equal to combat prayer at min.

There’s lots they could do, right now magblade favours pve in its mechanics. That shouldn’t be very hard to change. I like the tap theme, tweaking it a bit would solve a lot of those issues though.

Spearpoint · March 2020

Taktak wrote: »

tbh i dont see any problem in NB class in pvp, the only thing that need buff is "Aspect of Terror" which is feel not that special
NB clock still op and it should be change

NB cloak not op, and shouldn't change. It's a fitting class speciality.

TheHsN · March 2020

I canceled my 6 month Eso PLUS...delete the game. Waiting for next year...and i am happy... When i see that they make their promises i will come buy my Eso plus and keep playing from where i was...

Other way i feel like i am an idiot paying money and giving time for empty promises

Vercingetorix · March 2020

Langeston wrote: »

Vercingetorix wrote: »

NIghtblade will never be balanced among other classes because it has the most overpowered ability solely in its toolkit - invisibility. Being able to manipulate aggro on a whim will always draw attention for re-balancing. Yes, it may not work that well right now but a few years ago Nightblades were the most dominant class in the game and that of course is going to warrant nerfs.

To some degree, Nightblades are still overpowered compared to other classes.- Nightblade class passives are all powerful and useful, each of them provides something the class needs - other classes have at least one or more useless passives. Nightblades don't have to make sacrifices with their passives - they get burst, sustain, and higher max resources - literally everything - just for slotting their strongest abilities.

Almost none of what you just said is true. You start off by saying that cloak is the "most overpowered ability" and then immediately contradict yourself in the next sentence when you admit that "yes, it may not work that well right now." Then you start talking about how strong NBs used to be, lol. In case you haven't noticed, this thread is about how weak NBs are — and I can tell you don't seriously play one because nearly all of your second paragraph is just flat out wrong.

Wrong, I do play Nightblade and know the toolkit quite well. It's still overpowered, despite the bugs. Invisibility will ALWAYS be overpowered - there's no getting past that fact. Manipulating aggro is quite literally god mode in any game with combat and it's always felt that way when I've played on my Nightblade. Just because there's bugs and issues with the cloak spell right now doesn't warrant buffs to the class. What it DOES warrant is fixes to those issues, but that's it.

Langeston · March 2020

Vercingetorix wrote: »

Langeston wrote: »

Vercingetorix wrote: »

NIghtblade will never be balanced among other classes because it has the most overpowered ability solely in its toolkit - invisibility. Being able to manipulate aggro on a whim will always draw attention for re-balancing. Yes, it may not work that well right now but a few years ago Nightblades were the most dominant class in the game and that of course is going to warrant nerfs.

To some degree, Nightblades are still overpowered compared to other classes.- Nightblade class passives are all powerful and useful, each of them provides something the class needs - other classes have at least one or more useless passives. Nightblades don't have to make sacrifices with their passives - they get burst, sustain, and higher max resources - literally everything - just for slotting their strongest abilities.

Almost none of what you just said is true. You start off by saying that cloak is the "most overpowered ability" and then immediately contradict yourself in the next sentence when you admit that "yes, it may not work that well right now." Then you start talking about how strong NBs used to be, lol. In case you haven't noticed, this thread is about how weak NBs are — and I can tell you don't seriously play one because nearly all of your second paragraph is just flat out wrong.

Wrong, I do play Nightblade and know the toolkit quite well. It's still overpowered, despite the bugs. Invisibility will ALWAYS be overpowered - there's no getting past that fact. Manipulating aggro is quite literally god mode in any game with combat and it's always felt that way when I've played on my Nightblade. Just because there's bugs and issues with the cloak spell right now doesn't warrant buffs to the class. What it DOES warrant is fixes to those issues, but that's it.

Yeah, sorry, I don't believe you. Sure you might have leveled a NB, and you might even play it from time to time — but I don't believe you play it seriously. (Especially not a magblade. Those are only "God mode" against potatoes.) Either that, or you've never set foot inside of a high MMR BG.

dazee · March 2020

Cloak is super easy to balance, just change it to cost Magicka based on max magicka. It's already balanced or even underpowered on stam builds. Just equalize that with mag builds.

Nyladreas · March 2020

olsborg wrote: »

Gatdangmayne wrote: »

As long as bad nightblades cry anytime changing cloak is mentioned, nightblade will be what it is.

Having the ability to repeatedly disappear at will has no place in pvp, and as long as you can do that, there will be no buffs.

Nightblade is weak compared to the meta specs, but the difference isnt nearly as bad as most say. If you actually L2P and don't crutch on stealth you'll be better and have more fun.

I havent used shadowy disguise in 2 years or so, and im playing medium armor stamblade, the reason I cant rly compete well with meta on that char is because A: I dont have any healbuffs, mending etc, B: I dont have any skills that will reliably hit someone when used in a combo(dodged), C: I dont have any healdebuffs like Defile, D: I dont have any reliable class heals. And im 99% sure dark cloaks minor protection currently isnt working.

Very well explained!

Langeston · March 2020

dazee wrote: »

Cloak is super easy to balance, just change it to cost Magicka based on max magicka. It's already balanced or even underpowered on stam builds. Just equalize that with mag builds.

Seriously?
Let's say a stamblade gets 4 or 5 casts of cloak — you want cloak to also cost 1/4 or 1/5 of a magblade's magicka pool? So if a magblade has 50k magicka, you'd want it to cost 10k or 12.5k per cast? lol

Cloak is already "balanced." Everything in the game is a hard counter to it & there are potions that literally turn it off for a quarter of a ******* minute. This cannot be said about ANY other defensive ability in the game.

Stebarnz · March 2020

nb wont get balanced properly until invis is changed for something else just as class defining and that works.

Change invis to a memento so you can still rp with it, buff nb properly with a different class defineing skill. More effective in pvp more effective in pve, more fun to play, even more class identity.

Alternatively stick with current lack luster performance.

dazee · March 2020

Langeston wrote: »

dazee wrote: »

Cloak is super easy to balance, just change it to cost Magicka based on max magicka. It's already balanced or even underpowered on stam builds. Just equalize that with mag builds.

Seriously?
Let's say a stamblade gets 4 or 5 casts of cloak — you want cloak to also cost 1/4 or 1/5 of a magblade's magicka pool? So if a magblade has 50k magicka, you'd want it to cost 10k or 12.5k per cast? lol

Cloak is already "balanced." Everything in the game is a hard counter to it & there are potions that literally turn it off for a quarter of a ******* minute. This cannot be said about ANY other defensive ability in the game.

You make an excellent point. Cloak probably doesn't actually need any changes. to be honest the last time I was ganked in pvp from someone in stealth was over a year ago. there are SO MANY counters now.

So yeah I agree with you. the whiners should be 100% ignored by ZOS since theyre crybabies who wont learn counterplay.

justaquickword · March 2020

Those poor poor nightblades..
Next time I'm trying to cross a bridge in Cyrodiil and from nowhere get blasted 8m backwards into the water I'll try and be more sympathetic towards them. 😏

Ackwalan · March 2020

justaquickword wrote: »

Those poor poor nightblades..
Next time I'm trying to cross a bridge in Cyrodiil and from nowhere get blasted 8m backwards into the water I'll try and be more sympathetic towards them. 😏

Everybody has the bow skill line and can sit in stealth waiting for someone to cross the bridge.

justaquickword · March 2020

Ackwalan wrote: »

justaquickword wrote: »

Those poor poor nightblades..
Next time I'm trying to cross a bridge in Cyrodiil and from nowhere get blasted 8m backwards into the water I'll try and be more sympathetic towards them. 😏

Everybody has the bow skill line and can sit in stealth waiting for someone to cross the bridge.

Yes, they can. But they tend not to.

Langeston · March 2020

justaquickword wrote: »

Those poor poor nightblades..
Next time I'm trying to cross a bridge in Cyrodiil and from nowhere get blasted 8m backwards into the water I'll try and be more sympathetic towards them. 😏

I've actually noticed something interesting lately. I'll be on my magblade in a BG and when I hear that "sssst" from Snipe I usually assume it's a NB. But when I peel off from the group to go pick them off real quick, I'm surprised at how often it turns out to be a DK or Necro. I don't know if it's just the MMR reset or what, but it seems to happen a lot nowadays.

I actually get mad at the Snipe bowtards myself — not because they kill me, (they usually don't) but they give my class a bad name. And it's very frustrating that my favorite class now has a weak incoherent mess of a toolkit, due in large part to them & the ganktards that post up in Vlastrus to kill people just trying to do quests.

Bobby_V_Rockit · March 2020

Nerf jabs

DUTCH_REAPER · March 2020

#JUSTICE4NBs

Make Ganking Great Again!!!!

IVoo · March 2020

Emmagoldman wrote: »

So is there going to be a new post every two days?

If there's not, then there should be.

Donny_Vito · March 2020

My NB still dominates the Tel-Var farming scene in IC, but yeah you're seeing less and less vet core groups wanting MagNBs in their group compared to MagDKs and the obvious golden-child MagCro.

Raudgrani · March 2020

8000 hours and $10 000 on Nightblades? You really must be into NB business. I can see that they need to stop the eternal extreme "balance changes", you simply can't get away with removing buffs altogether, decreasing healing/damage by 40-70% on skills, making old sets useless (Earthgore being a perfect example). Not only ONCE, but doing this back and forth all the time - forcing people to make new builds every 3 months, and adapt to a different playstyle and so on.

But this my friend, this isn't a "Nightblade issue". It's an ESO issue. This affects everyone, and it's equally frustrating to have your MagDK ruined by ZOS, as it is having your Magblade or Stamblade destroyed. "Nightblades" haven't had it enough more than all of us have, NB's or not.

Katahdin · March 2020

Vercingetorix wrote: »

Langeston wrote: »

Vercingetorix wrote: »

NIghtblade will never be balanced among other classes because it has the most overpowered ability solely in its toolkit - invisibility. Being able to manipulate aggro on a whim will always draw attention for re-balancing. Yes, it may not work that well right now but a few years ago Nightblades were the most dominant class in the game and that of course is going to warrant nerfs.

To some degree, Nightblades are still overpowered compared to other classes.- Nightblade class passives are all powerful and useful, each of them provides something the class needs - other classes have at least one or more useless passives. Nightblades don't have to make sacrifices with their passives - they get burst, sustain, and higher max resources - literally everything - just for slotting their strongest abilities.

Almost none of what you just said is true. You start off by saying that cloak is the "most overpowered ability" and then immediately contradict yourself in the next sentence when you admit that "yes, it may not work that well right now." Then you start talking about how strong NBs used to be, lol. In case you haven't noticed, this thread is about how weak NBs are — and I can tell you don't seriously play one because nearly all of your second paragraph is just flat out wrong.

Wrong, I do play Nightblade and know the toolkit quite well. It's still overpowered, despite the bugs. Invisibility will ALWAYS be overpowered - there's no getting past that fact. Manipulating aggro is quite literally god mode in any game with combat and it's always felt that way when I've played on my Nightblade. Just because there's bugs and issues with the cloak spell right now doesn't warrant buffs to the class. What it DOES warrant is fixes to those issues, but that's it.

If cloak is OP, then every other defensive ability is also OP

Streak
Shields
Both of which allow you to manipulate aggro
Any healing ability or skill that gives healing also allows for a partial reset.

Cloak is literally the only thing a med or light armor NB can do defensively and even then there are 7 or 8 different things that counter cloak.

NB are literally outclassed by almost every other spec played by a player of equal skill.