OWLTHEMAD wrote: »

While I think templars have had farr too much given to their kit without nearly enough tradeoff baked in, i do not believe posting such an incredibly biased poll is the answer.

When trying to make a case for change or improvement to any system or object, demonstrating obvious and intense bias always hurts the credibility of not just you, but your argument as well.

Discussion should be started first.
Biased form or not, there is really no difference if issue exists.

I don't have a Templar main, in fact I don't like the playstyle of Templar but you give me no other choice in your poll.

I think Templars are right where they should be, I think some of the other classes should be buffed a little.

They are fine, just buff the other classes

edit: I choose the wrong answer XD it's late

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

JusticeSouldier wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

JusticeSouldier wrote: »

and why this thread exists, yes? just half of whole population of battlegrounds became templars with no reasons surely. It's just my imagination. templars are ok. no need to fix anything

@ZOS_BrianWheeler is this how it should be?

Just slot Major evasion. I noticed that at the moment templar sees shuffle or quick cloak he suddenly loses all the ferocity and starts acting cautiously looking how not to die instead of trying to burst you down. Some classes/specs doesn't have access to major evasion - true. But they are RANGED. Every time templar wants to push you he need gap closer or sprint, while you can dps him all the time. Jabplar is harmless at distance.

These numbers are too small for non-evasion build...That means It was always on.

but the main thing this screenshot tells is - 3 templars only in red team...and there were +2 in purple and 2 in green...what can say such ratio of them in match about class balance?

I can't see how group of 3-4 templars will be better then group of 3-4 different classes. People use magplars now like previously magsorcs were used - because it is currently the easiest class to play in pugs. I 100% agree that stamplar is easier to play then stamDK - from personal experience. And I stopped playing magplar after ZOS started buffing up them every patch because it just felt... plain. But here were are at U24 after warden received tremendous buff to netch, access to minor vulnerability, magsorc received unblockable stun + wild burst heal on bird and where stamcro is going to be dominating class. And where magcro synergies are exploding whole raids. In this conditions I don't see how nerfs to jabs or to ER will change anything.

You can't see how a purify synergy every 5-7 seconds and 3-4 extended rituals permanently healing 3-4 templars would be better than 3-4 of pretty much any other class? You can forget ever applying any dot or debuff to a group with 3-4 templars and having it last even half of it's duration, and trying to get kills through through the constant passive 3k+ HPS (it would be roughly equal to having a vigor on the entire group ticking permanently) from stacked Rituals would be next to impossible they even think about using any other heal on top of that.

Qbiken wrote: »

ecru wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

JusticeSouldier wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

JusticeSouldier wrote: »

and why this thread exists, yes? just half of whole population of battlegrounds became templars with no reasons surely. It's just my imagination. templars are ok. no need to fix anything

@ZOS_BrianWheeler is this how it should be?

Just slot Major evasion. I noticed that at the moment templar sees shuffle or quick cloak he suddenly loses all the ferocity and starts acting cautiously looking how not to die instead of trying to burst you down. Some classes/specs doesn't have access to major evasion - true. But they are RANGED. Every time templar wants to push you he need gap closer or sprint, while you can dps him all the time. Jabplar is harmless at distance.

These numbers are too small for non-evasion build...That means It was always on.

but the main thing this screenshot tells is - 3 templars only in red team...and there were +2 in purple and 2 in green...what can say such ratio of them in match about class balance?

I can't see how group of 3-4 templars will be better then group of 3-4 different classes. People use magplars now like previously magsorcs were used - because it is currently the easiest class to play in pugs. I 100% agree that stamplar is easier to play then stamDK - from personal experience. And I stopped playing magplar after ZOS started buffing up them every patch because it just felt... plain. But here were are at U24 after warden received tremendous buff to netch, access to minor vulnerability, magsorc received unblockable stun + wild burst heal on bird and where stamcro is going to be dominating class. And where magcro synergies are exploding whole raids. In this conditions I don't see how nerfs to jabs or to ER will change anything.

You can't see how a purify synergy every 5-7 seconds and 3-4 extended rituals permanently healing 3-4 templars would be better than 3-4 of pretty much any other class? You can forget ever applying any dot or debuff to a group with 3-4 templars and having it last even half of it's duration, and trying to get kills through through the constant passive 3k+ HPS (it would be roughly equal to having a vigor on the entire group ticking permanently) from stacked Rituals would be next to impossible they even think about using any other heal on top of that.

I'd rather face 3-4 magplars compared to 3-4 wardens (mag or stam), stamcros or magsorc (petsorcs). Stop acting like magplar is the godmode of this game, because it isn't.

yeah, good. ok.

Sanguinor2 wrote: »

ecru wrote: »

You can't see how a purify synergy every 5-7 seconds and 3-4 extended rituals permanently healing 3-4 templars would be better than 3-4 of pretty much any other class? You can forget ever applying any dot or debuff to a group with 3-4 templars and having it last even half of it's duration, and trying to get kills through through the constant passive 3k+ HPS (it would be roughly equal to having a vigor on the entire group ticking permanently) from stacked Rituals would be next to impossible they even think about using any other heal on top of that.

Purify Synergy every 5 to 7 seconds is not how this game works. Doesnt synergy cooldown appear on your spreadsheets?

I was talking about it in the sense that four people could be guaranteed to use the synergy every 20 seconds because every group member has three other people providing a Ritual to stand in.

Magplar's only problem (imo) is the impunity with which they can zerg w/ toppling charge and jabs. I only complain about jabs because it's a ton of burst aoe dmg, it heals the caster, AND it snares. Removing snares from aoes was an okay move (at the expense of a more unkillable block tank), but removing the snare from jabs would have been better imo. That snare + toppling charge spam when you're getting zerged is about the stupidest thing I have to deal with. Most of the time I just have to nuke the zergling. In 1 v 1 against a good plar, I have to hope to outnuke (which is possible, they're bursty, but not the top end burst) cause I won't outheal/outsustain for sure.

Basically I consider jabs to be an overloaded skill (in general the class is full of overloaded skills, but no snare on jabs would help significantly).

As a mediocre player, I do find templars the easiest class to play at a mediocre level (followed closely by Wardens). If you die to my mediocre Templar, you too are probably mediocre.

I imagine that "balance" changes as the skill level of the players changes. I.e. what is balanced for highly skilled players will not be balanced for mediocre players. Thus I can't comment on whether Templars are OP for high end players.

Moreover, the devs probably try to balance for the highest levels of skill, both in PvP and in PVE (vet trials). While ZOS will never get it perfect, the fact that the best players don't all play the same class is some indication that the devs aren't so far off that it is ruining the game.

<edited for clarity>

Iskiab wrote: »

JusticeSouldier wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

JusticeSouldier wrote: »

and why this thread exists, yes? just half of whole population of battlegrounds became templars with no reasons surely. It's just my imagination. templars are ok. no need to fix anything

@ZOS_BrianWheeler is this how it should be?

Just slot Major evasion. I noticed that at the moment templar sees shuffle or quick cloak he suddenly loses all the ferocity and starts acting cautiously looking how not to die instead of trying to burst you down. Some classes/specs doesn't have access to major evasion - true. But they are RANGED. Every time templar wants to push you he need gap closer or sprint, while you can dps him all the time. Jabplar is harmless at distance.

These numbers are too small for non-evasion build...That means It was always on.

but the main thing this screenshot tells is - 3 templars only in red team...and there were +2 in purple and 2 in green...what can say such ratio of them in match about class balance?

Are you saying Magplars are the most common class? I still see mostly DKs, Warden and Sorcs. I don’t know what game you’re playing.

Yes I say that in last 3 patches they are most or one of the most common classes in battlegrounds.
As it always happends with time when some class gets too many preferences so very many players migrates to that class.
And in next patch, after few patchnotes, I can say now for sure their number will grow in % much more than now...

Show me where the Templar hurt you :'(

TBH I have met much more strong Stamplars than Magplars. Everyone plays stamina these days for a reason.

Block is overpowered not templar itself.

MCBIZZLE300 wrote: »

Block is overpowered not templar itself.

And in what way it overpowered?:D

Iskiab wrote: »

They should add a separate stat to BGs called self healing. Having healing only be what healing you do on other people gives people a ridiculous perspective on what’s going on.

Templar and mag in general are moreso struggling with a perception issue. I’m getting a little tired of all these whiner threads.

and what such stat will do , like deny healing of teamates?:D
whats next, debuffing someone to make working only for u also? it's a deadly way.

RIght way for them is to always check of group utilities to keep balance in game...
Cooldowns for synergies are a good way for example.
Total overheal of whole group is a bad thing.

Every class in game struggle with a perception issue before testing, watching numbers, comparing...After that it's not "perception".