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Introduce 810CP Group Finder option
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anitajoneb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I have over 1300CP and don't know anything about the strategies and mechanics of the newer dungeons and trials. A >810 requirement wouldn't help much with people like me (and there are quite a few of us around).
Most of "us" don't PUG, but some do. That's life.
May I kindly remind people that the BEST, most accurate, perfectly tailored group finder you can ever use is YOURSELF ?
Edited by anitajoneb17_ESO on October 7, 2019 12:22PM1 -
starkerealm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Daddysadface wrote: »starkerealm wrote: »Daddysadface wrote: »Why don't question me on why we don't cut food with spoons.. I mean, spoons are able to cut food too... I don't understand why we need knives is what you are saying to me... That is the logic I am getting from you.
No, that's a strawman fallacy.
It's different. Please try to stay on topic.
Its actually called an "analogy", it's for explanation purposes. Your welcome.
Don't quit your day job.1 -
Daddysadface✭✭✭Allow me to help you.
A straw man is a form of argument and an informal fallacy based on giving the impression of refuting an opponent's argument, while actually refuting an argument that was not presented by that opponent. One who engages in this fallacy is said to be "attacking a straw man".
-Source: Wikki
Analogy vs Fallacy or "Strawman". I was pointing out, Ability is not the same as Efficiency. Hence a 160cp has less efficiency potential in a group then an 810+. How I have to explain that slowly to people that should be able to perceive 810 is a larger number then 160 is so beyond my patience level I can almost not stand it. Though, I suppose if I show the ability to identify number values, that would make me an "Elitist".0 -
Daddysadface✭✭✭Let me give you an "Analogy", please try to remember that word.
I can carry all my food around in a market, I have the ability to do that. But, It would be more "Efficient" if I used a cart that is intended to not take away my ability, but to be more "Efficient" then my "Ability" to manually carry my food.
A "Strawman" Argument would be, I have had bad experiences in PUGs, so an option to select the pool of players that I am willing to play with is a bad idea..
Or, I am an 810+ player, and I don't know mechanics, so giving players the ability to chose a player pool is pointless.
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Alienoutlaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Not all of us Veterans enjoy having to teach mechanics and even simple game play in dungeons
your running round in circles, your original argument was because you didnt want to waste time teaching new/low level players. this has nothing to do with efficiency.0 -
Daddysadface✭✭✭Alienoutlaw wrote: »Not all of us Veterans enjoy having to teach mechanics and even simple game play in dungeons
your running round in circles, your original argument was because you didnt want to waste time teaching new/low level players. this has nothing to do with efficiency.Daddysadface wrote: »Not all of us Veterans enjoy having to teach mechanics and even simple game play in dungeons that we have done hundreds or even thousands of times. Some of us do...
You should actually not try to twist my words. I will respond and correct you.
Thank you for a good example of a "Strawman".Edited by Daddysadface on October 7, 2019 1:17PM1 -
ZonasArch✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Daddysadface wrote: »Allow me to help you.
A straw man is a form of argument and an informal fallacy based on giving the impression of refuting an opponent's argument, while actually refuting an argument that was not presented by that opponent. One who engages in this fallacy is said to be "attacking a straw man".
-Source: Wikki
Analogy vs Fallacy or "Strawman". I was pointing out, Ability is not the same as Efficiency. Hence a 160cp has less efficiency potential in a group then an 810+. How I have to explain that slowly to people that should be able to perceive 810 is a larger number then 160 is so beyond my patience level I can almost not stand it. Though, I suppose if I show the ability to identify number values, that would make me an "Elitist".
What makes you elitist is your arrogant attitude, not the higher CP numbers or your desire to select the group you wanna run your dungeons.
When you say "i'm not (insert bad thing here). but...", anything you say after "but" will make you a (insert bad thing here)... and that's precisely what you've done this whole thread.
I know i was making fun of your tone deaf, blindly elitist attitude, but honestly now... re-evaluate your attitude if you wanna be taken seriously, at least by most people. No one likes arrogance. You come off really arrogant.
I'm through with this one. In the words of one Phillip DeFranco: Have a great f**king day!1 -
frozzzen101✭✭✭✭I will grant you that based on my experience, odds of getting decent players are better at CP cap rather than somewhere lower, but that doesn't even remotely address problem you have. What you will do is just separate playerbase in dungeons based on *mostly* irrelevant metric. You will still not get skilled players in CP capped queue as CP doesn't correlate all that well with player skill. It might make your experience a bit less miserable on average, but you will still have trash groups. What you want is to make is dungeon finder MMR system like we have in BG, with separate queue, but method of climbing that ladder would be % of total achievement points that can be gathered in dungeons. This guarantees you to play with players in your relative skill bracket if you can finish some HM, no death runs etc. New players wouldn't get excluded from playing with more experienced players because ESO is very alt heavy game unlike FF XIV for example and there'd still be *anything goes* group finder. It would give some safe heaven to people's main characters where they are usually hunting for achievements and they would get to play with more experienced people. But system has flaw of high MMR syndrome and needing separate queue for dungeons.
Ultimately this entire thread is farting in the wind because you know ZoS won't do anything. It's fine to open this thread now, before implementation of new dungeon finder, but as many told you it's best that you start forming groups in zone chat with standards you set yourself. It's only thing that will make actual improvements to your dungeon experience unlike the entirety of this thread.0 -
Alienoutlaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Daddysadface wrote: »Alienoutlaw wrote: »Not all of us Veterans enjoy having to teach mechanics and even simple game play in dungeons
your running round in circles, your original argument was because you didnt want to waste time teaching new/low level players. this has nothing to do with efficiency.Daddysadface wrote: »Not all of us Veterans enjoy having to teach mechanics and even simple game play in dungeons that we have done hundreds or even thousands of times. Some of us do...
You should actually not try to twist my words. I will respond and correct you.
Thank you for a good example of a "Strawman".
how have i twisted your words? you wrote them0 -
Daddysadface✭✭✭Daddysadface wrote: »Allow me to help you.
A straw man is a form of argument and an informal fallacy based on giving the impression of refuting an opponent's argument, while actually refuting an argument that was not presented by that opponent. One who engages in this fallacy is said to be "attacking a straw man".
-Source: Wikki
Analogy vs Fallacy or "Strawman". I was pointing out, Ability is not the same as Efficiency. Hence a 160cp has less efficiency potential in a group then an 810+. How I have to explain that slowly to people that should be able to perceive 810 is a larger number then 160 is so beyond my patience level I can almost not stand it. Though, I suppose if I show the ability to identify number values, that would make me an "Elitist".
What makes you elitist is your arrogant attitude, not the higher CP numbers or your desire to select the group you wanna run your dungeons.
When you say "i'm not (insert bad thing here). but...", anything you say after "but" will make you a (insert bad thing here)... and that's precisely what you've done this whole thread.
I know i was making fun of your tone deaf, blindly elitist attitude, but honestly now... re-evaluate your attitude if you wanna be taken seriously, at least by most people. No one likes arrogance. You come off really arrogant.
I'm through with this one. In the words of one Phillip DeFranco: Have a great f**king day!
This post has gone so far off topic, sad really. So, if I don't allow people to twist my words, create strawman arguments to confuse the less informed, give bad information, use their experience as what to expect from groups, make bold and absurd claims, assume my position of things outside of the topic and basically just try to demote any and all defense I have given for my position and point of view, then I am being elitist and arrogant?
Or, maybe I became arrogant with a touch of salt, after the realization that for the most part, the people who commented are willing to say anything they can to distract from the topic at hand and the original intention of the post and the reasoning behind it...0 -
Alienoutlaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Daddysadface wrote: »Daddysadface wrote: »Allow me to help you.
A straw man is a form of argument and an informal fallacy based on giving the impression of refuting an opponent's argument, while actually refuting an argument that was not presented by that opponent. One who engages in this fallacy is said to be "attacking a straw man".
-Source: Wikki
Analogy vs Fallacy or "Strawman". I was pointing out, Ability is not the same as Efficiency. Hence a 160cp has less efficiency potential in a group then an 810+. How I have to explain that slowly to people that should be able to perceive 810 is a larger number then 160 is so beyond my patience level I can almost not stand it. Though, I suppose if I show the ability to identify number values, that would make me an "Elitist".
What makes you elitist is your arrogant attitude, not the higher CP numbers or your desire to select the group you wanna run your dungeons.
When you say "i'm not (insert bad thing here). but...", anything you say after "but" will make you a (insert bad thing here)... and that's precisely what you've done this whole thread.
I know i was making fun of your tone deaf, blindly elitist attitude, but honestly now... re-evaluate your attitude if you wanna be taken seriously, at least by most people. No one likes arrogance. You come off really arrogant.
I'm through with this one. In the words of one Phillip DeFranco: Have a great f**king day!
This post has gone so far off topic, sad really. So, if I don't allow people to twist my words, create strawman arguments to confuse the less informed, give bad information, use their experience as what to expect from groups, make bold and absurd claims, assume my position of things outside of the topic and basically just try to demote any and all defense I have given for my position and point of view, then I am being elitist and arrogant?
Or, maybe I became arrogant with a touch of salt, after the realization that for the most part, the people who commented are willing to say anything they can to distract from the topic at hand and the original intention of the post and the reasoning behind it...
Topic: introduction of an option to que ONLY with 810 players to improve dungeon runs and not have to be slowed down by low level players
Response: cp does not equate to skill
every thread other than yours has stated the same answer and because it NOT the answer you wanted you dont like it
you come across as arrogant and ill informed and closed off to anything other than your point of view.
im done going round in circles with this thread1 -
Daddysadface✭✭✭Alienoutlaw wrote: »Daddysadface wrote: »Alienoutlaw wrote: »Not all of us Veterans enjoy having to teach mechanics and even simple game play in dungeons
your running round in circles, your original argument was because you didnt want to waste time teaching new/low level players. this has nothing to do with efficiency.Daddysadface wrote: »Not all of us Veterans enjoy having to teach mechanics and even simple game play in dungeons that we have done hundreds or even thousands of times. Some of us do...
You should actually not try to twist my words. I will respond and correct you.
Thank you for a good example of a "Strawman".
how have i twisted your words? you wrote them
I just want to say, that I love your Sig. I can identify with it.
Have a good day!0 -
Kuramas9tails✭✭✭✭✭
✭
I don't know about other 810 good PVE players but when it seems slow and boring...I don't queue and not because of WHO I end up with, it's the fact I am doing the same content over and over again. I know I can solo most normal dungeons (can't solo direfrost on normal because of the pressure plates) so when I am bored but want to get a dungeon done, I PUG it because at least that's extra damage and makes the painful experience less painful by being done faster.Daddysadface wrote: »I am suggesting an Idea that would actually entice players that normally would never "PUG" to once again give Group Finder a go on slow and boring days, or just to meet other end game players.
So yeah, I fail to see this as a good reason from my end.Your friendly neighborhood crazy cat lady of ESO
New PSN name: SundariTheLast. Proud seller in RedEye Empire, PURPLE GANG and Backalley Trading.
AD High Elf Mageblade DPS (General)(Former Empress) -- Stormproof/VMOL, VHOF, VDSA completion
AD Khajiit Mageblade DPS -- Flawless Conquerer
FOR THE QUEEN!
PS4/NA1 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Daddysadface wrote: »Daddysadface wrote: »You want a specific group, form your own. People have brought complaints against the group finder for years. Most solutions suggested will some stratify the players in group Finder which will just increase que times.You want a specific group, form your own. People have brought complaints against the group finder for years. Most solutions suggested will some stratify the players in group Finder which will just increase que times.
Maybe there are some of us that would love to use it more, but /facepalm at the thought of having to pug Randoms from a pool of 300 all the way up to 810+ and just decide to await friends or more people to log on. I love how people act as if this game is loaded with people who always want to farm, teach, do specific dungeons or even have the patience to try to pug a potential nightmare of a player that just hit 300 and still doesn't understand what a "LA weave" is, or says "I play as I want" as if its justification for being stubborn to learn how the combat works.
I read this and go back to why you question where the elitist vibe is coming from.
The reality is this game is loaded with players who are into farming gear. The game is loaded with players willing to help players learn the game and content. The game is loaded with players interested in doing specific dungeons.
Now the thought that a CP player that just hit 300 and does not know how to LA weave yet some they miraculously learned it by the CP cap is really absurd as I have seen so many CP capped players that were pathetically bad. That sentence made me laugh. It totally trashes your justification and demonstrates why this is such a poor idea. Really now.
BTW, if you are that solid of a player where someone who does not know how to weave LAs is beneath you then you should be able to easily join a solid raiding guild which is great source for forming dungeons groups. Odd that such an amazing player as yourself does not have that solution available to you.
Nice speculation and opinion. So what is your argument for or against a check box added to the group finder that will allow 810+ cp players to choose the group finder to only pull players from a 810+ pool or uncheck it to have it pull from a pool of players that are appropriate for the selected activity.
LOL, Beyond your elitist position (statement supported by your own comments) on the idea is Zos already determined the minimum requirements for each dungeon and gives us the choice to form our own group if we want different requirements. That is a fact you have been choosing to ignore.
What is funny is you have yet to state anything that truly suggests this would be an improvement as your comments about CP 300 players pretty much sum up many of the CP capped players that use the GF. Your idea would only slow down the queue as skilled players tend to form up from their guilds as I pointed out before. I keep wondering why you are not in a decent guild if you are such a solid player.Daddysadface wrote: »vMA is a solo instance. Point? Your argument is so broad it could encompass any cp that has the potential of doing vMA. What about all the 300's that cant even complete vMA, what about all the 160, 161, 162.. cmon… Obviously the 810+ would have a greater chance of success based upon available CP over the same exact skilled player at 160. Not sure what your point is, nor am I sure you understand what this post is telling others about your logic or even knowledge of what CP is.
And these are the people that I have to run dungeons and trials with.. really..... really zos.... are you kidding me?
Oh no. vMA shows the player have a certain level of skill whereas being at the CP cap does nothing to demonstrate skill. That also means your comment about CP 300 player is pointless. Stick to meaningful information.Edited by idk on October 7, 2019 1:52PM0 -
Alienoutlaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Daddysadface wrote: »Alienoutlaw wrote: »Daddysadface wrote: »Alienoutlaw wrote: »Not all of us Veterans enjoy having to teach mechanics and even simple game play in dungeons
your running round in circles, your original argument was because you didnt want to waste time teaching new/low level players. this has nothing to do with efficiency.Daddysadface wrote: »Not all of us Veterans enjoy having to teach mechanics and even simple game play in dungeons that we have done hundreds or even thousands of times. Some of us do...
You should actually not try to twist my words. I will respond and correct you.
Thank you for a good example of a "Strawman".
how have i twisted your words? you wrote them
I just want to say, that I love your Sig. I can identify with it.
Have a good day!
everyday is good for me:)0 -
Sandman929✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I'm sure ZOS will get right on board with implementing a way to exclude new players/customers.3 -
dtsharples✭✭✭✭✭I think its a great idea.
Yes we already have the option to form a group prior to 'queuing' but that isn't what the OP asked for is it?
He asked for the option to join the queue alone and the resulting group all to be CP810+ (which is perfectly fair and reasonable).
Also, I don't think he / she mentioned anything about Normal dungeons, so not sure why people are commenting about carrying others through a normal dungeon?0 -
ZOS_JesCadminGreetings, we've removed a handful of nonconstructive and baiting comments. Since this thread has derailed, we've decided to close it.The Elder Scrolls Online: Tamriel Unlimited - ZeniMax Online Studios
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