Daddysadface wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Daddysadface wrote: »

Why don't question me on why we don't cut food with spoons.. I mean, spoons are able to cut food too... I don't understand why we need knives is what you are saying to me... That is the logic I am getting from you.

No, that's a strawman fallacy.

It's different. Please try to stay on topic.

Its actually called an "analogy", it's for explanation purposes. Your welcome.

Don't quit your day job.

Let me give you an "Analogy", please try to remember that word.

I can carry all my food around in a market, I have the ability to do that. But, It would be more "Efficient" if I used a cart that is intended to not take away my ability, but to be more "Efficient" then my "Ability" to manually carry my food.

A "Strawman" Argument would be, I have had bad experiences in PUGs, so an option to select the pool of players that I am willing to play with is a bad idea..

Or, I am an 810+ player, and I don't know mechanics, so giving players the ability to chose a player pool is pointless.

Alienoutlaw wrote: »

Not all of us Veterans enjoy having to teach mechanics and even simple game play in dungeons

your running round in circles, your original argument was because you didnt want to waste time teaching new/low level players. this has nothing to do with efficiency.

Daddysadface wrote: »

Not all of us Veterans enjoy having to teach mechanics and even simple game play in dungeons that we have done hundreds or even thousands of times. Some of us do...

You should actually not try to twist my words. I will respond and correct you.

Thank you for a good example of a "Strawman".

I will grant you that based on my experience, odds of getting decent players are better at CP cap rather than somewhere lower, but that doesn't even remotely address problem you have. What you will do is just separate playerbase in dungeons based on *mostly* irrelevant metric. You will still not get skilled players in CP capped queue as CP doesn't correlate all that well with player skill. It might make your experience a bit less miserable on average, but you will still have trash groups. What you want is to make is dungeon finder MMR system like we have in BG, with separate queue, but method of climbing that ladder would be % of total achievement points that can be gathered in dungeons. This guarantees you to play with players in your relative skill bracket if you can finish some HM, no death runs etc. New players wouldn't get excluded from playing with more experienced players because ESO is very alt heavy game unlike FF XIV for example and there'd still be *anything goes* group finder. It would give some safe heaven to people's main characters where they are usually hunting for achievements and they would get to play with more experienced people. But system has flaw of high MMR syndrome and needing separate queue for dungeons.

Ultimately this entire thread is farting in the wind because you know ZoS won't do anything. It's fine to open this thread now, before implementation of new dungeon finder, but as many told you it's best that you start forming groups in zone chat with standards you set yourself. It's only thing that will make actual improvements to your dungeon experience unlike the entirety of this thread.

ZonasArch wrote: »

Daddysadface wrote: »

Allow me to help you.

A straw man is a form of argument and an informal fallacy based on giving the impression of refuting an opponent's argument, while actually refuting an argument that was not presented by that opponent. One who engages in this fallacy is said to be "attacking a straw man".

-Source: Wikki

Analogy vs Fallacy or "Strawman". I was pointing out, Ability is not the same as Efficiency. Hence a 160cp has less efficiency potential in a group then an 810+. How I have to explain that slowly to people that should be able to perceive 810 is a larger number then 160 is so beyond my patience level I can almost not stand it. Though, I suppose if I show the ability to identify number values, that would make me an "Elitist".

What makes you elitist is your arrogant attitude, not the higher CP numbers or your desire to select the group you wanna run your dungeons.

When you say "i'm not (insert bad thing here). but...", anything you say after "but" will make you a (insert bad thing here)... and that's precisely what you've done this whole thread.

I know i was making fun of your tone deaf, blindly elitist attitude, but honestly now... re-evaluate your attitude if you wanna be taken seriously, at least by most people. No one likes arrogance. You come off really arrogant.

I'm through with this one. In the words of one Phillip DeFranco: Have a great f**king day!

This post has gone so far off topic, sad really. So, if I don't allow people to twist my words, create strawman arguments to confuse the less informed, give bad information, use their experience as what to expect from groups, make bold and absurd claims, assume my position of things outside of the topic and basically just try to demote any and all defense I have given for my position and point of view, then I am being elitist and arrogant?

Or, maybe I became arrogant with a touch of salt, after the realization that for the most part, the people who commented are willing to say anything they can to distract from the topic at hand and the original intention of the post and the reasoning behind it...

Daddysadface wrote: »

ZonasArch wrote: »

Daddysadface wrote: »

Allow me to help you.

A straw man is a form of argument and an informal fallacy based on giving the impression of refuting an opponent's argument, while actually refuting an argument that was not presented by that opponent. One who engages in this fallacy is said to be "attacking a straw man".

-Source: Wikki

Analogy vs Fallacy or "Strawman". I was pointing out, Ability is not the same as Efficiency. Hence a 160cp has less efficiency potential in a group then an 810+. How I have to explain that slowly to people that should be able to perceive 810 is a larger number then 160 is so beyond my patience level I can almost not stand it. Though, I suppose if I show the ability to identify number values, that would make me an "Elitist".

What makes you elitist is your arrogant attitude, not the higher CP numbers or your desire to select the group you wanna run your dungeons.

When you say "i'm not (insert bad thing here). but...", anything you say after "but" will make you a (insert bad thing here)... and that's precisely what you've done this whole thread.

I know i was making fun of your tone deaf, blindly elitist attitude, but honestly now... re-evaluate your attitude if you wanna be taken seriously, at least by most people. No one likes arrogance. You come off really arrogant.

I'm through with this one. In the words of one Phillip DeFranco: Have a great f**king day!

This post has gone so far off topic, sad really. So, if I don't allow people to twist my words, create strawman arguments to confuse the less informed, give bad information, use their experience as what to expect from groups, make bold and absurd claims, assume my position of things outside of the topic and basically just try to demote any and all defense I have given for my position and point of view, then I am being elitist and arrogant?

Or, maybe I became arrogant with a touch of salt, after the realization that for the most part, the people who commented are willing to say anything they can to distract from the topic at hand and the original intention of the post and the reasoning behind it...

Topic: introduction of an option to que ONLY with 810 players to improve dungeon runs and not have to be slowed down by low level players

Response: cp does not equate to skill

every thread other than yours has stated the same answer and because it NOT the answer you wanted you dont like it
you come across as arrogant and ill informed and closed off to anything other than your point of view.

im done going round in circles with this thread

Daddysadface wrote: »

I am suggesting an Idea that would actually entice players that normally would never "PUG" to once again give Group Finder a go on slow and boring days, or just to meet other end game players.

I don't know about other 810 good PVE players but when it seems slow and boring...I don't queue and not because of WHO I end up with, it's the fact I am doing the same content over and over again. I know I can solo most normal dungeons (can't solo direfrost on normal because of the pressure plates) so when I am bored but want to get a dungeon done, I PUG it because at least that's extra damage and makes the painful experience less painful by being done faster.

So yeah, I fail to see this as a good reason from my end.

Daddysadface wrote: »

Alienoutlaw wrote: »

Daddysadface wrote: »

Alienoutlaw wrote: »

Not all of us Veterans enjoy having to teach mechanics and even simple game play in dungeons

your running round in circles, your original argument was because you didnt want to waste time teaching new/low level players. this has nothing to do with efficiency.

Daddysadface wrote: »

Not all of us Veterans enjoy having to teach mechanics and even simple game play in dungeons that we have done hundreds or even thousands of times. Some of us do...

You should actually not try to twist my words. I will respond and correct you.

Thank you for a good example of a "Strawman".

how have i twisted your words? you wrote them

I just want to say, that I love your Sig. I can identify with it.

Have a good day!

everyday is good for me:)