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How to make PvP more friendly and inviting to PvErs?
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Daedric_NB_187✭✭✭✭✭xeha_arwen11 wrote: »So you want to extend an olive branch to PvErs and you start by insulting them in passive agressive way? XD
This. The OP is expressing typical PvP attitude. They seem to think that people need to be incorrigible, vicious terrible people in order to "make it" in the PvP world. This is ludicrous.
ZOS needs to get some game masters or someone over there. It's truly disgusting. Today alone I was in IC, and in a short space I heard multiple, "your mother's a ****", and I saw people typing graphic awful things that I cannot repeat here; they were making fun of homosexuals, trans persons, women, minorities, etc. Really messed up stuff. And of course the teabagging, and they talked about sexually assaulting and WORSE. This is not acceptable. Not in the least. People who PvP need to learn how to act like decent human beings. Then maybe regular PvE'ers will want to join. Mind you, there's a considerable amount of PvE'ers who are terrible and rude, but it is just so much worse in PvP.
Soooooo..... You've never been in Mournhold and Craglorn zone chat huh?2 -
amir412✭✭✭✭✭
✭The question is, not how to make PVP friendly to PVERS, but how to make all the casuals (which looks like its 95% of the community) to become decent at the game.
I swear, roaming in IC and slaying these pugs is not even fun, 95% of the players i met couldnt even do basic stuff, such as break free, etc..(Most were high CP lvl)
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Agenericname✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭The question is, not how to make PVP friendly to PVERS, but how to make all the casuals (which looks like its 95% of the community) to become decent at the game.
I swear, roaming in IC and slaying these pugs is not even fun, 95% of the players i met couldnt even do basic stuff, such as break free, etc..(Most were high CP lvl)
I'm sure that's a possibility, but I've also gone from 100% to a full death recap in less than a second.
I probably should have broken free, except I didn't know I was taking damage.
They're probably better off trying it when there isn't an event. The spawn camping will turn more away than it will bring in.6 -
Ozazz✭✭✭✭Zos has already done evrything under the sun to make pvp more inviting to casual's. Every patch they encroach on traditional pvper's in trying to dumb pvp down. This has been the case for literally 2 years!0 -
Ozazz✭✭✭✭DeadlyRecluse wrote: »I don't really accept that "making pvp friendly and inviting to pvers" is a worthy goal.
If you get connected to a good community, it is already friendly and inviting. If you spend some time understanding how to play and build, it's already pretty beginner-friendly, especially if you pick your battles.
I don't think there's a magical solution to make PvP fun for folks unwilling to do either the social work of connecting to a solid PvP community or invest the time and effort to be effective on their own (and those options already exist). YMMV.
That couldn't be more true!
You either have to put in the time,
or still put in the time but with a little help/ from a good community.
this is how i learned on launch.
This should remain the standard.
Not compensating over the Top etc
No dot meta, buffed light attacks, sloads, buffed wearwolf, persecute animation canceling, Class homogenization etc the list goes on!1 -
Rave the Histborn✭✭✭✭✭
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It's obviously supposed to be a 100% safe zone - gapcloser use is "suppressed" in the room where the platform is located.Rave the Histborn wrote: »It isnt a safe zone, if it was you'd either be invincible or there would be an instakill for the opposing side. It's safer sure but it's not meant to be a no kill zone.
You can clearly see the "anti gapcloser buffs" in any buff tracker.
The lack of a killbox up on the platform, then, is presumably a design oversight - no one expected that any enemies can get up there while their gapclosers are disabled!
But with the recent changes to how gapclosers work, clearly there are still some ways to get up on the platforms.
Besides, every other elevated platform after a door transition in the IC is a safe zone which grants the Sanctuary effect.
This includes the district plaftorms accessible via ladders in the sewer base.
You are conflating the current state of things (clearly suffering from a design oversight) with the design intent for how IC loadscreen transitions function, which is evident by looking at all the other door transitions as described above.
And finally - design oversight or not, camping players who are not in control of their character (because of the game's technical limitations) cannot even remotely be considered as PvP, in fact it's called "being a massive jerk".
Edit: and inb4 "but you can get around the campers by going through the districts" - yes you can, but that's beside the point.
The point here is that the loadscreen camping is something that should never be happening in the first place, enforced by appropriate zone design.
This is "merely" a "minor" problem here, because there are alternate paths around these morons.
But in Cyrodiil there are NO alternate paths into the quest giver houses, which were subject to the same kind of griefing during the last event.
It isn't supposed to be anything besides a platform. If it was a safe zone they would have made it safe like the safe zones in the city districts. It isn't safe because it isn't meant to be. The lack of a kill box is BY DESIGN.
"But with the recent changes to how gapclosers work, clearly there are still some ways to get up on the platforms."
What are you even talking about? You used to be able to leap or gap close onto walls on keeps, that was changed because the developers didn't want keeps to be so easily captured when attacking/defending. This isn't the same for IC, you're meant to be in pvp combat with other players.
"Besides, every other elevated platform after a door transition in the IC is a safe zone which grants the Sanctuary effect.
This includes the district plaftorms accessible via ladders in the sewer base."
If they all have platforms already designed to grant a safe zone, but the place you're talking about doesn't do you think maybe, just maybe, that's how it was designed and how it is intended?
"You are conflating the current state of things (clearly suffering from a design oversight) with the design intent for how IC loadscreen transitions function, which is evident by looking at all the other door transitions as described above."
The design intent is pretty clear and if they haven't changed the "current state of things" it is because the "current state of things" is by design.
"And finally - design oversight or not, camping players who are not in control of their character (because of the game's technical limitations) cannot even remotely be considered as PvP, in fact it's called "being a massive jerk"."
What do you mean the game's technical limitations? This is on your computer lol I don't have loadscreens long enough to surpass the timed invincibility that people get. You could change it so you lose your invulnerability as soon as you move though, that is understandable.
"Edit: and inb4 "but you can get around the campers by going through the districts" - yes you can, but that's beside the point.
The point here is that the loadscreen camping is something that should never be happening in the first place, enforced by appropriate zone design."
So you know and acknowledge that you don't have to get farmed by these people, you can form a group and coordinate, you could bypass them all together by using the ladders, but no, you choose not to. The point here is if you're getting loadscreen camped, you're doing something wrong. There's plenty of ways around it and in the end it has nothing to do with game design, if it was we would all have the same issues, and these are ones I don't encounter.0 -
amir412✭✭✭✭✭
✭Agenericname wrote: »The question is, not how to make PVP friendly to PVERS, but how to make all the casuals (which looks like its 95% of the community) to become decent at the game.
I swear, roaming in IC and slaying these pugs is not even fun, 95% of the players i met couldnt even do basic stuff, such as break free, etc..(Most were high CP lvl)
I'm sure that's a possibility, but I've also gone from 100% to a full death recap in less than a second.
I probably should have broken free, except I didn't know I was taking damage.
They're probably better off trying it when there isn't an event. The spawn camping will turn more away than it will bring in.
What you describe is ganking, and if u got one-shotted before being able to break free (In ur case, before even knowing what's happening), That's on u for not running a decent build that can survive gankers.
Like i said, Decent players.
You can't complain about dying when running naked into a sword fight. soz.Edited by amir412 on September 15, 2019 8:00AM0 -
Rave the Histborn✭✭✭✭✭
✭TheRealPotoroo wrote: »Rave the Histborn wrote: »No pve means less players coming in to get killed for the pvp population
There's tons of posts about sewer gankers at base and bemoaning getting farmedRave the Histborn wrote: »Let people have fun, you're just miserable about it for no reason.
Utterly, utterly clueless.
LOL 3 out of context quotes.
If you come to a pvp zone you are going to have to pvp, I know this is shocking, and hurts you inside but there's a reason for it. It is used to control the amount of Tel Var in the economy.
"There's tons of posts about sewer gankers at base and bemoaning getting farmed"
Let me put this simply. If you are getting farmed or you are posting about getting farmed at the sewer base you have no one to blame but yourself. There's 6 other exits to the sewers that you can use to bypass the entrance. You can also form a group to kill the gankers. This doesn't happen, you go out one by one and die and have no idea why.
"Let people have fun, you're just miserable about it for no reason"
Yes, some people like IC, some like to gank, some even like the risk of being ganked. The thrill of making it all the way back to your base after farming all the way to center is an example. Just because some people aren't capable of competing doesn't mean others aren't.0 -
Major_Lag✭✭✭✭✭
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Yes, the design intent is crystal clear:Rave the Histborn wrote: »The design intent is pretty clear and if they haven't changed the "current state of things" it is because the "current state of things" is by design.
Players are not meant to be able to use gapclosers to get up on those platforms.
The gapcloser prevention (de)buffs in that room are proof of that - which you chose to conveniently ignore, because it suits your misguided notion that those platforms are valid areas for PvP combat (they are not).
A working means of spawn camping protection is one of the most basic gameplay features expected of any PvP game released in the last decade or so.
Unfortunately, due to what appears to have been a lack of foresight, the ESO developers have omitted to extend such protection to ALL possible loadscreen transitions (doors) - which our "PvP" "friends" have now "kindly pointed out" by exploiting that design flaw.
Edit:
And in case the above still doesn't sound convincing enough, here's one more thing to consider:
If the sewer entry platforms were meant to allow legitimate PvP combat, they would have been accessible from below. Via a ramp/stairs, or even just a pile of boxes/barrels that can be jumped on.
Almost every single door/ladder in the IC (and the town transitus shrines in Cyrodiil) place the player on a platform which is inaccessible from below, and grants the Sanctuary effect as well?
Now, why is that the case? Think about it.
Hint: it's not because of the pretty glowy effect of the Sanctuary buff
The big doors between districts do place the player at ground level (not on a platform) - but they also grant a rather long Sanctuary effect, so still preventing players from getting attacked before they are in control of their character.Edited by Major_Lag on September 15, 2019 8:35AM3 -
Rave the Histborn✭✭✭✭✭
✭Rave the Histborn wrote: »Rave the Histborn wrote: »Umm hate to break it to you champ but this dlc is 5 years old. They've already made their money on it but I'lf they can get people to participate in the event it is a success [/b]because those people will keep playing and might branch over to pvp. The event is a marketing strategy[/b] so if they can pull people into an under populated dlc for 2 weeks that is a success because those people might pay for eso+ to do more, they could come back from the game after a break, anything really. I know your scope of success is very narrow minded but if ZOS's intention was to get IC repopulated permanently it wouldn't just be an event. They wanted people playing and that's what they got.
You appear to be changing your tune a little.
Lol @Mr._Walker, man when your arguments are such *** you have to see a little hope anywhere you can. Sorry Walker, you're still wrong as much as you keep trying.
Your initial criteria for success was "there are lots of people in there right now - success!". You have subsequently added additional criteria and conditions. Let me know when your "argument" has fully evolved and I'll address it.
And just out of curiosity, you keep making comment on 'what I want'. What is it you think I want?
Have you ever been to a social event? You want people to come and the more that do the more successful it is. This isn't rocket science here bud.
LOL oh jesus, we're on page 9 and I elaborated more in depth on other points all of which can be summed up with "there's lots of people in there right now-success". I am such a monster, why would I want to point out additional information that helps my point. That's not how this works at all. Let me try your way.
Duh durrrrrr people that aren't good at a game type they don't wan't to put effort in. Durrrrr it makes them sad and they think the whole world should be changed because no one could be good at it. Duhh did you make more then one point? That's changing your tune durrrrr.
I'm also not sure what you want honestly as you've yet to take a consistent position. Even your initial post you chastise the OP for "Well, opie, you started off by insulting PvE players, so bravo.... a guaranteed way to get people on side."
Then you go and do the same thing to PVP players
"1. The idiots who spawn camp? Ignore them. They're generally the lowest form of PvPers. The type of goose you see gone dark around the back of flagged keeps leeching ticks. They run at the first sign of real resistance. Either that or they're just plain garden variety fools. Either way, they are atypical of PvPers."
I 100 agree with you on this point but again, "you started off by insulting PvP players, so bravo.... a guaranteed way to get people on side. So you're not going to make many friends""
"Most of the big mouth idiots have plenty of time because they're dark at a keep waiting for a tick. The others are proud owners of acquired brain injuries."
"6. If you do enjoy it, and get good at it, be respectful. Everyone was new once. "
You tell people to be respectful after you insult the playerbase. You also seem to forget that everyone was new once and all the PVP players have long dealt with all these "broken" mechanics. In your own words we were new, which means we were also successful in learning how to pvp in Cyro/IC with the current mechanics in place. If the pvp population for the last 5 years has done it, I don't see why people currently now can't. But that's my problem here, your lack of any consistency. You want to say I'm changing my tune "a little" which god if that isn't grabbing at straws I don't know what is but I've been very consistent with the "the servers were full - success" argument because that's what it is, a success. You on the other hand don't have a tune, you say you love Cyro and you hate IC, then you're going to wait to do the quest lines if it gets done, then you've actually got about a hundred hours in IC from when it was part of Cyro and a few hours in the new campaign. You know all about the event and what people are going through with sewer platforms but you're avoiding this event at the same time.
My argument evolved, because that's how arguments work, yours hasn't because you don't have one.0 -
Major_Lag✭✭✭✭✭
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I'm avoiding the event because I don't care about the rewards and it's a complete waste of my time.Rave the Histborn wrote: »You on the other hand don't have a tune, you say you love Cyro and you hate IC, then you're going to wait to do the quest lines if it gets done, then you've actually got about a hundred hours in IC from when it was part of Cyro and a few hours in the new campaign. You know all about the event and what people are going through with sewer platforms but you're avoiding this event at the same time.
True, I've only visited IC quite sporadically during this event (as I outlined earlier) - but loadscreen camping of players is nothing new, and the exact same thing was happening during the 5th anniversary event, which I did participate in during the PvP week.
We're getting increasingly off track here, so let's bring things back in line:
The OP's point was how PvP can be made more friendly to newcomers.
My point is that when a new player goes through the sewer door and loads in dead on the opposite side, that sends a very specific kind of message.
The exact kind of message that you do NOT want to be sending to new PvPers, if you want to encourage them to stay and enjoy actual PvP.
Your point that there are alternate paths through the districts is technically valid, but not relevant to the discussion.
The fact remains, that there are exploiters who are engaging in a form of behavior which is extremely destructive to ESO's PvP community in the long term.
And the fact that you are effectively defending the exploiters by trying to handwave the problem away and claiming that "hurr durr it's legit PvP", makes me begin to wonder if you are not actually one of those players.0 -
Major_Lag✭✭✭✭✭
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Or even better: rework Impen trait to make PvE gear actually usable in PvP.Make switching gear and skills easier and i will play pvp more.
Make Impen work similarly to how Reinforced works now: armor gives you some base crit resist, and Impen boosts that by ~30%.
Then set up the scaling so that using 7x impen results in the same crit resist as it does now.1 -
Kadoin✭✭✭✭✭
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Or even better: rework Impen trait to make PvE gear actually usable in PvP.Make switching gear and skills easier and i will play pvp more.
Make Impen work similarly to how Reinforced works now: armor gives you some base crit resist, and Impen boosts that by ~30%.
Then set up the scaling so that using 7x impen results in the same crit resist as it does now.
lol, no.1 -
Jaimeh✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭You don't have to do anything special, just show some basic decency, and don't camp the base entrance to jump people as soon as they come out. Don't kill players right when they kill the boss so they can't even loot the tickets. Stuff like that, you know, show some class, and allow people who are clearly not into PvP get over with the tedious part of aquiring their tickets. Just like PvE-ers have to put up with PvPers in dungeons in other events.4 -
jainiadral✭✭✭✭✭
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ESO was designed to have a lot of depth which the devs have had to walk-back over the years by reducing difficulty because the game never really found the audience it was originally designed for -- which was 2007ish PVE and PVP MMO enthusiasts. It was supposed to be a PVP and PVE raid heavy game with robust trading and crafting.jainiadral wrote: »Thanks for the advice
It meshes with what I've come to expect of this game as a whole. If you're casual, you've got overland and delves, maybe public dungeons and WBs if you haven't been too nerfed. Otherwise, you need to step into the social realm and get really serious. Trading, dungeons, PvP... they're all kind of the same that way. Overland masks how hardcore this game can really be and how much commitment the devs seem to want everyone to make.
I cant speak to those games, but it's important to remember that PVP in ESO wasn't designed to be an accessory to PVE. It was supposed to stand on its own as a robust PVP game. The PVE elements in Cyrodiil were included so PVP focused players could level entirely in Cyrodiil if they wanted. ESO PVP was supposed to have minimal PVE requirements.jainiadral wrote: »I think the motivation thing is the hurdle I can't personally get past. I'm a dabbler by nature and a total lone wolf. The investment is huge here, while other games I've played have a much lower bar to pass to just have fun. SWTOR, especially, used to have a great casual-friendly setup for warzones. You'd get enough commendations to get recommended moddable armor sets with a few matches. Then your stats would at least be competitive and bolster properly. Not sure if that's still the case for lowbie and midbies. GW2 has a pretty respectable setup for sPvP.
Thanks for the background I'm pretty new to the game compared to a lot of people on the forums. Trying to wrap my brain around how this game can be simultaneously hardcore and super-casual breaks me sometimes 
I"m not surprised that ZOS has had to backtrack a lot from its initial goals. Looking at the demographics and how the MMO marketplace has changed through the years, a lot of former raiders and hardcore players are getting older. They have more demanding jobs, kids, etc. Then you look at the newer audiences: retirees, older players, women, solo players. The audience is a lot more diverse than it was in 2007.
PvP as a separate independent game mode isn't anything new: GW2's sPvP and WvW are completely independent of base game PvE leveling. WvW maps there have separate skillpoint equivalents, probably similar to Cyrodiil's skyshards. It's probably the only game where the devs haven't totally borked up gating PvP and/or PvE content behind each others' walls. SWTOR used to have a dedicated PvP-only population too, until the devs started gating endgame PvP behind the PvE gear grind.
Honestly, I like the modes to be separate with their own systems. It's a lot easier to dive in if you can just jettison the other mode and start totally fresh. Or jump in and jump out as the whim takes you. I wish ZOS could do something to simplify the transition.1 -
Iskiab✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Make a mundus stone that gives 1800 crit resists. That way pve players can pvp by just changing their mundus.
Edited by Iskiab on September 15, 2019 11:03AMLooking for any guildies I used to play with:
Havoc Warhammer - Alair
LoC EQ2 - Mayi and Iskiab
PRX and Tabula Rasa - Rift - Iskiab
Or anyone else I used to play games with in guilds I’ve forgotten1 -
HowlKimchi✭✭✭✭✭
✭Make a mundus stone that gives 1800 crit resists. That way pve players can pvp by just changing their mundus.
Then PvP players will stack crit resist using that mundus and herald in a new era of no-one-dies-ever pvp.4 -
Iskiab✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭PvE players hate pvp because they intuitively feel like they’re playing at a disadvantage... and they are.
When I switched from pve to pvp in this game I didn’t have all impen and just got destroyed repeatedly. It takes a long long long time to get the transmutation stones to retrait gear in pve. It’s faster in pvp but by the time your average player has the stones they’re sick of it.
The only reason I kept playing pvp was because I have a pvp background. I can guarantee you most would have given up.
Maybe the best solution would be to get rid of the impenetrable trait altogether and have 1805 impen on battle spirit. Change impen to something not great but not useless and pvpers will change traits eventually.Edited by Iskiab on September 15, 2019 11:24AMLooking for any guildies I used to play with:
Havoc Warhammer - Alair
LoC EQ2 - Mayi and Iskiab
PRX and Tabula Rasa - Rift - Iskiab
Or anyone else I used to play games with in guilds I’ve forgotten2 -
HowlKimchi✭✭✭✭✭
✭PvE players hate pvp because they intuitively feel like they’re playing at a disadvantage... and they are.
When I switched from pve to pvp in this game I didn’t have all impen and just got destroyed repeatedly. It takes a long long long time to get the transmutation stones to retract gear in pve. It’s faster in pvp but by the time your average player has the stones they’re sick of it.
The only reason I kept playing pvp was because I have a pvp background. I can guarantee you most would have given up.
You dont have to use transmute crystals just to start PVP, especially if the person has been playing PVE for a while. There are lots of viable craftable and overland sets that already come in impen that's very easy to get...3 -
Reistr_the_Unbroken✭✭✭✭✭
✭Rave the Histborn wrote: »
My argument evolved, because that's how arguments work, yours hasn't because you don't have one.Rave the Histborn wrote: »Rave the Histborn wrote: »Umm hate to break it to you champ but this dlc is 5 years old. They've already made their money on it but I'lf they can get people to participate in the event it is a success [/b]because those people will keep playing and might branch over to pvp. The event is a marketing strategy[/b] so if they can pull people into an under populated dlc for 2 weeks that is a success because those people might pay for eso+ to do more, they could come back from the game after a break, anything really. I know your scope of success is very narrow minded but if ZOS's intention was to get IC repopulated permanently it wouldn't just be an event. They wanted people playing and that's what they got.
You appear to be changing your tune a little.
Lol @Mr._Walker, man when your arguments are such *** you have to see a little hope anywhere you can. Sorry Walker, you're still wrong as much as you keep trying.
Your initial criteria for success was "there are lots of people in there right now - success!". You have subsequently added additional criteria and conditions. Let me know when your "argument" has fully evolved and I'll address it.
And just out of curiosity, you keep making comment on 'what I want'. What is it you think I want?
Did they though? Because I’ve been reading this thread and those ‘arguments’ came off as a broken record, while other people were literally proving you why you were wrong, multiple times.6 -
Wandering_Immigrant✭✭✭✭Agenericname wrote: »jainiadral wrote: »RPGplayer13579 wrote: »If you want PvEers to join campaigns in Cyrodiil then give us a story to follow.
Yeah, that's a big nope for me. I like my PvE and storytelling to be stress and interruption-free. I'd probably check out IC once or twice if there were no PvE whatsoever.
I don't mind. It's about the only place where I can quest and there is a threat of dying. That being said, every time I go it's like "squirrel!" and I run off to kill or be killed. Outside of Cyrodiil I have less than 30 skill points to obtain, I think 17 to be exact. IC may be the last one I get to.
It may not be interruption free, but it is stress free. They're only soul gems and pixels.
So much this. I came to IC for my first time during the event and I've been doing the questline in-between getting my tickets. And I love it, it's my favorite questline just because of that sense of danger. But every time I see an enemy player on my way to my next quest marker I'm like "who's that. What are they doing in my zone. OMG did they just hide, must be up to no good. Must investigate." Next thing I know, dead or alive, I'm on the other side of the map like "sh*t I was supposed to go that way. Oh well what's over here?"
I like that though, it stretches out the content in an organic way, so I feel like I'm doing more than just running from point A to point B over and over again.3 -
Bobby_V_Rockit✭✭✭✭✭
✭PvE players hate pvp because they intuitively feel like they’re playing at a disadvantage... and they are.
When I switched from pve to pvp in this game I didn’t have all impen and just got destroyed repeatedly. It takes a long long long time to get the transmutation stones to retract gear in pve. It’s faster in pvp but by the time your average player has the stones they’re sick of it.
The only reason I kept playing pvp was because I have a pvp background. I can guarantee you most would have given up.
You dont have to use transmute crystals just to start PVP, especially if the person has been playing PVE for a while. There are lots of viable craftable and overland sets that already come in impen that's very easy to get...
Can someone who is new to PvP reeeally expect to do well with 3x agility jewels, an asylum greatsword and a crafted set though?2 -
labambao✭✭✭✭Add REAL END GAME trials with bis gear not in pve locations, but in cyro.
Block enter to it with few restrictions:
1. Your alliance may have emp right now, or you can't enter.
2. Your character may have 50k+ ap farmed this day to enter.
Mmorpg is about playing with people, not quests or lore, and this will make people play together and coop.0 -
Iskiab✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Add REAL END GAME trials with bis gear not in pve locations, but in cyro.
Block enter to it with few restrictions:
1. Your alliance may have emp right now, or you can't enter.
2. Your character may have 50k+ ap farmed this day to enter.
Mmorpg is about playing with people, not quests or lore, and this will make people play together and coop.
MMOs are about allowing people to play together but not forcing them. People will hate your suggestion.Looking for any guildies I used to play with:
Havoc Warhammer - Alair
LoC EQ2 - Mayi and Iskiab
PRX and Tabula Rasa - Rift - Iskiab
Or anyone else I used to play games with in guilds I’ve forgotten9 -
VaranisArano✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Bobby_V_Rockit wrote: »PvE players hate pvp because they intuitively feel like they’re playing at a disadvantage... and they are.
When I switched from pve to pvp in this game I didn’t have all impen and just got destroyed repeatedly. It takes a long long long time to get the transmutation stones to retract gear in pve. It’s faster in pvp but by the time your average player has the stones they’re sick of it.
The only reason I kept playing pvp was because I have a pvp background. I can guarantee you most would have given up.
You dont have to use transmute crystals just to start PVP, especially if the person has been playing PVE for a while. There are lots of viable craftable and overland sets that already come in impen that's very easy to get...
Can someone who is new to PvP reeeally expect to do well with 3x agility jewels, an asylum greatsword and a crafted set though?
Someone who is new to PVP is going to struggle no matter their gear. That's like asking "Will a newbie in meta DPS gear expect to do well in a trial?"
No. It takes practice.
What impen gear does, even a cheap overland set, is make it so you don't die the second a player hits you with a solid critical attack.
Gear won't carry anyone in PVP - I say this from my own experience with completely sucking on a then-meta, OP, the-forums-were-ranting-about-it build. Bringing the proper gear - Impen trait, decent sustain for No CP, good resistances, etc. CAN make for a better PVP experience. Certainly better than going in without preparing.1 -
HowlKimchi✭✭✭✭✭
✭Bobby_V_Rockit wrote: »PvE players hate pvp because they intuitively feel like they’re playing at a disadvantage... and they are.
When I switched from pve to pvp in this game I didn’t have all impen and just got destroyed repeatedly. It takes a long long long time to get the transmutation stones to retract gear in pve. It’s faster in pvp but by the time your average player has the stones they’re sick of it.
The only reason I kept playing pvp was because I have a pvp background. I can guarantee you most would have given up.
You dont have to use transmute crystals just to start PVP, especially if the person has been playing PVE for a while. There are lots of viable craftable and overland sets that already come in impen that's very easy to get...
Can someone who is new to PvP reeeally expect to do well with 3x agility jewels, an asylum greatsword and a crafted set though?
Someone who is new to PvP wont really do well even with "meta" PvP sets though. Having gear doesn't magically make you do well in PvP. You really have to learn the mechanics and the matchups. Best thing to start PvP is to get easy viable pvp gear, go to cyro/bgs, then learn. No secret shortcut for success.
Not to mention that the sets you listed are way worse than spriggans + shacklebreaker + monster set which are very simple to obtain.3 -
labambao✭✭✭✭Add REAL END GAME trials with bis gear not in pve locations, but in cyro.
Block enter to it with few restrictions:
1. Your alliance may have emp right now, or you can't enter.
2. Your character may have 50k+ ap farmed this day to enter.
Mmorpg is about playing with people, not quests or lore, and this will make people play together and coop.
MMOs are about allowing people to play together but not forcing them. People will hate your suggestion.
i said mmorpg, not mmos. its diff genres
but eso more like mmos for sure.0
