Shouldn't be able to kick people in dungeon finder pugs.

redmaxblower · August 2019

Been playing MMO's since Everquest. Literally a year played time in WoW.
Said this same thing on their forums years ago before I quit playing.

Stop letting people in dungeon finder kick other players. We all paid for the game we all have a right to be there.

As it is the system is used for griefing. None of the dungeons in this game, normal or vet, are so hard that one bad player can't be carried.
It's usually the opposite... the ones who want to be carried boot the lowest dps or the person who makes a minor mistake.

Two or three "friends" (and I use the term loosely because classless people like this don't know what friendship is)
will typically grab one more player from dungeon finder and use it as an excuse to grief/bully/harass the lone player.

Freetality even did a couple of videos recently on the *** behavior of "friends" in pugs:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6zzlE0fIt8c

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DX_8Pqn5IDk

And yes, I've been booted a couple of time from dungeons for reasons unknown, since I long ago turned off my chat window
in pugs and battelgrounds due to the obscene language and behavior of the players in this game.

I love the game, and enjoy playing in peace. But I'm tired of declining vote kicks and or randomly getting booted from a group for literally no reason.

Example:
A few days ago I logged into a pug for Vet March of Sacrifices which was in progress, and got booted before I even caught up to the group.
I assume it was because the power tripping friends didn't like the fact that I didn't respond to their chat.
But I don't play this game to chat. And I shouldn't have to pay respect to them.

And yes I can already hear the moans and wailing of those people who need their power trip...

"ZOMG but what if they are holding our group up? I shouldn't have to carry terribles"

No, you shouldn't. You can leave. There should be no penalty for leaving a pug. No 15-20 minute wait. Or at least one free "get out of bad pug" per hour or two.

I know nothing will change because excluding and blacklisting people is hard coded into internet culture, but I had to say my peace.

I will now flee from the forums and probably never return as the culture here is just as bad as everywhere else.

Ackwalan · August 2019

I stopped reading once you said you turn off chat in pugs. It is your fault, you should be kicked from group.

sidious00 · August 2019

While i agree that it is used for some bs sometimes I wouldn't remove it. There are times that people just need to go, why should you be asked to quit in the middle of your run just because someone else isnt doing what needs to be done. When you queue for a 4 man dungeon it is for 4 people, not just you.

Houshiki · August 2019

Turned off chat... in a pug dungeon... Please someone tell me I'm not the only one who sees a flaw in this.

Joxer61 · August 2019

Houshiki wrote: »

Turned off chat... in a pug dungeon... Please someone tell me I'm not the only one who sees a flaw in this.

would explain why no one ever says Hi back to me.....

mocap · August 2019

redmaxblower wrote: »

There should be no penalty for leaving a pug

and there isn't. It is a dungeon finder cooldown.

Kicking in ESO is a very variative part. Few days ago i was kicked cuz i hate speedrun "pull everything before tank" idiots.

Also vote to kick could be a technical part of PUG - offliners, too long AFKers, fake roles (sometimes not intentionally).

Runkorko · August 2019

Feel you but kick option stays.
I prefer to get kicked because someone not like me or whatever reason.
There are ppl who have no idea what they do, literaly.
Was on my alt last night/ leveling- around 30 lvl/ qued as dps because dont care que timer. After 1h and 40 minutes /i know right...../ got called in Arx Corinium. Hi, ***, and the dungeon start. We got dk destro staf tank but i dont care rolles on normal. We get it to the 1st boss (Fanged Menace). Usualy even on low levels if 2 of the ppl know what to do is enouh to compleat dungeon on normal. Usualy... We bring boss down to X% hp /our dps was ok/ and then tank and other mele guy didnt move from aoe, and voala- boss back to full hp. This happens like 5 times. Then i say in chat "guys move from red. it heals him when you stay in" No reaction. The other guy try to explain too. Crickets.... I even linked them "AOE Poison attack that absorbs health from those hit by it to the Boss. The red circle made underneat him while he curls up can damage heavily and also heal the boss." Nope, they continue to bash boss without care tacts or whatever. This continue for like 15 minutes and i leaved. And ofc tried to kick them/ voted both of them/ but ofc i fails because votes are 2-2.
Imagibe you get such stars in your vet grp. Brainless ppl, or kids let by their parents to have some fun with their acounts....
Kick options not just only need to stay, it needs to be improved.

danara · August 2019

Joxer61 wrote: »

Houshiki wrote: »

Turned off chat... in a pug dungeon... Please someone tell me I'm not the only one who sees a flaw in this.

would explain why no one ever says Hi back to me.....

First i was thinking that these players didnt have a keyboard Considering how bad they were playing and the silence coming from them... Now it makzs more senses ! 😂

Sharee · August 2019

Last time i was in a dungeon finder PUG we kicked the healer because he simply stayed AFK at the entrance and did absolutely nothing.

It is not as simple as "even bad players have the right to play". They do. Still, the ability to kick is important.

highkingnm · August 2019

No. I will explain mechanics and help out where I can, but if you turn off chat or aren’t willing to learn, I am not here to carry a dead weight. If you like doing your own thing in game, don’t make that own thing three other people’s problem.

I’ve had tanks who have only been able to hold a single taunt when there’s multiple heavy hitting adds who refuse to accept my advice (a former tank main with plenty of vet trial clears) or help. I’ve had DPS who screw up and get others killed. I am not there to carry them. If the dungeon is a piece of cake like FG1, I’ll carry so long as you aren’t being intentionally arsey. But in DLC content or the hard vet base game stuff, I’ll kick a dead weight. If three people agree then, short of the occasional system abuse, you probably were a carry not a teammate.

You have a right to enter the content, but you do so on the understanding that you should be aiming to clear and you are part of a team. That means you need to communicate. If your chat is off or you ignore people, you are not being a good groupmates and should not be grouping.

E: as to 2-3 people grouping together to be able to kick people, more often that’s guild groups looking for fills with plans to kick only if they get an inept player or a fake tank. Much more common are the people who queue in with a ‘shield’ to get a carry without the risk of a kick. At least when I carry my sister through group content it’s just me and her and I don’t expect others to carry her 2k DPS.

bmnoble · August 2019

No it is a tool that is needed in the game. Paying the subscription does not entitle you to carry through content, if your not at least working towards a clear with the rest of the group, you will get kicked especially if your a low damage DPS, a group can carry a bad healer or tank but if the damage dealers are crap it can make it near impossible to clear even a normal dungeon.

I only start a vote to kick if:

-Someone goes AFK without saying something in chat

-Someone disconnects for more than 10 minutes

-Extremely low DPS, to the point where the group can not finish a boss fight

(had a painfully slow clear of Direfrost keep on normal yesterday, I was tanking the two DPS did not seem to understand how to break free, causing the final boss to heal all the damage they managed to do, we eventually managed to kill the boss but the only reason I stuck with that group, was because I had forgotten I had already done the pledge in VET, queued without thinking, because I am a tank got in straight away, did not want to leave the group without a tank, I know how crap the queue times are for the other roles. The healer whispered me afterwards and thanked me for not leaving)

-Someone is not doing their role: healer not healing, tank with no taunt or fake DPS trying to queue faster in one of those roles.

-Player keeps getting killed by mechanics after they have been explained in chat at length

-Someone who yells and screams at the group if anything goes wrong.

But seriously use the chat window, its their for you to communicate with the group and the group to communicate with you, if your off on your own feel free to close it but if your in a group use it.

Sometimes people need to go AFK, for any reason from a bathroom break to a phone call or having to look after their kids, I have had all those reasons and more come up in chat before.

You get experienced players explaining mechanics, often the tank especially in DLC dungeons will give the group a basic heads up of the boss fight mechanics and if the group wipes usually a much more detailed version.

Once you hit CP160 you will notice a lot more people saying they are after certain set pieces, monster helms of certain weights on VET more than a few players are willing to tip.

I have experienced the above in chat far more often than any abusive or elitist drivel in chat.

If they take away the option to kick players from dungeons all that will happen is the group will dissolve as everyone else leaves instead. That still happens now when the crap player gets the crown, when that happens I just invite the good group members back and queue with them, no reason for them to be sent to the back of the queue.

commodore64 · August 2019

So we should carry another stamcro fake tank with 16k health and no taunt because you got kicked from a PUG?

No thanks. The kick option is there for a reason beyond your sensitive feelings.

EdoKeledus · August 2019

Turn off chat because a guy insults you randomly in a MMORPG and still care after playing Everquest and WoW.

You're complaining about rude behaviour but yours is not different especially in battlegrounds where players can establish a "strategy" before the start.

You should just play a solo game.

marius_buys · August 2019

A un-kickable player can turn a 15 minute normal dungeon into a 2 hour exercise in frustration, in the end everyone else will leave.

fetito666 · August 2019

My pug-group kicked an elitist CP 810 player with the name of Drizzt' girlfriend (won't mention her) for being elitist in a random normal dungeon like: "Why is your DPS just 10K? Why aren't you doing mechanics?"

Well, it's a random normal dungeon, not vet and random people that join are still learning mechanics.

I did not even get upset, it was just funny her attitude in a normal pug as if this was the end of the world. We could have beaten the dungeon while she was ranting and just standing around.

Ozby · August 2019

redmaxblower wrote: »

Been playing MMO's since Everquest. Literally a year played time in WoW.
Said this same thing on their forums years ago before I quit playing.

Stop letting people in dungeon finder kick other players. We all paid for the game we all have a right to be there.

As it is the system is used for griefing. None of the dungeons in this game, normal or vet, are so hard that one bad player can't be carried.
It's usually the opposite... the ones who want to be carried boot the lowest dps or the person who makes a minor mistake.

Two or three "friends" (and I use the term loosely because classless people like this don't know what friendship is)
will typically grab one more player from dungeon finder and use it as an excuse to grief/bully/harass the lone player.

Freetality even did a couple of videos recently on the *** behavior of "friends" in pugs:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6zzlE0fIt8c
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DX_8Pqn5IDk

And yes, I've been booted a couple of time from dungeons for reasons unknown, since I long ago turned off my chat window
in pugs and battelgrounds due to the obscene language and behavior of the players in this game.

I love the game, and enjoy playing in peace. But I'm tired of declining vote kicks and or randomly getting booted from a group for literally no reason.

Example:
A few days ago I logged into a pug for Vet March of Sacrifices which was in progress, and got booted before I even caught up to the group.
I assume it was because the power tripping friends didn't like the fact that I didn't respond to their chat.
But I don't play this game to chat. And I shouldn't have to pay respect to them.

And yes I can already hear the moans and wailing of those people who need their power trip...

"ZOMG but what if they are holding our group up? I shouldn't have to carry terribles"

No, you shouldn't. You can leave. There should be no penalty for leaving a pug. No 15-20 minute wait. Or at least one free "get out of bad pug" per hour or two.

I know nothing will change because excluding and blacklisting people is hard coded into internet culture, but I had to say my peace.

I will now flee from the forums and probably never return as the culture here is just as bad as everywhere else.

Pftt! aint carrying no one through Fang Lair Hard mode or scalecaller Hard mode so please stop whining. We are able to kick in case someone is not behaving themselves.

StormChaser3000 · August 2019

commodore64 wrote: »

So we should carry another stamcro fake tank with 16k health and no taunt because you got kicked from a PUG?

No thanks. The kick option is there for a reason beyond your sensitive feelings.

^ This.
Everything gets even worse if such "genius" starts trash talking. I got such aggressive potato once and it was an incredible satisfaction to kick them.

Runkorko · August 2019

fetito666 wrote: »

My pug-group kicked an elitist CP 810 player with the name of Drizzt' girlfriend (won't mention her) for being elitist in a random normal dungeon like: "Why is your DPS just 10K? Why aren't you doing mechanics?"

Well, it's a random normal dungeon, not vet and random people that join are still learning mechanics.

I did not even get upset, it was just funny her attitude in a normal pug as if this was the end of the world. We could have beaten the dungeon while she was ranting and just standing around.

Kicked ppl because they ask questions?
If its a no dlc normal then ok, and not so ok- read my previous post. But in normal dlc mechanics are must . most of the time.
Was her mistake to ask, i usualy leave and let such playets live with their uselesness...

And to ask you. If her questions make her elitist, what kicking her make you ? Right...

KerinKor · August 2019

redmaxblower wrote: »

Stop letting people in dungeon finder kick other players. We all paid for the game we all have a right to be there.

You DON'T have the right to foister your lack of play skill on other players .. 'you' is the generic 'you' not the personal 'you'm unless of course it fits.

You DO have the right to form your own group where YOU get to decide who joins and who doesn't.

Malyck · August 2019

While I can understand your points about some players abusing the vote kick mechanic, do you want to be a part of that group anyway? I would rather move on than deal with jerks. Perhaps this should be penalty-free, but honestly it is a short timer.

The part about not responding to chat is something I cannot agree with. When entering multi-player content that demands team work, I believe the ability to communicate is something that is mandatory. Sure, you can get through a lot of the lower end dungeons without collaborating, but there are situations where it is necessary to communicate. I think any player that is refusing to communicate or acknowledge the rest of the team should be kicked with a penalty.

fetito666 · August 2019

runkorkoeb17_ESO wrote: »

fetito666 wrote: »

My pug-group kicked an elitist CP 810 player with the name of Drizzt' girlfriend (won't mention her) for being elitist in a random normal dungeon like: "Why is your DPS just 10K? Why aren't you doing mechanics?"

Well, it's a random normal dungeon, not vet and random people that join are still learning mechanics.

I did not even get upset, it was just funny her attitude in a normal pug as if this was the end of the world. We could have beaten the dungeon while she was ranting and just standing around.

Kicked ppl because they ask questions?
If its a no dlc normal then ok, and not so ok- read my previous post. But in normal dlc mechanics are must . most of the time.
Was her mistake to ask, i usualy leave and let such playets live with their uselesness...

And to ask you. If her questions make her elitist, what kicking her make you ? Right...

She was commanding new players what to do RIGHT NOW, insulting and people got intimidated. It wasn't a very comfortable situation for two newbies that whispered for her removal.

In the end, we resolved the pledge dungeon without mayor issues.

Personally, her words did not affect me personally, but it became very toxic for the group as a whole. I don't even know the player behind that character. Probably he / she could be my best friend in real life!

redgreensunset · August 2019

While I have sympathy for those who get kicked for arbotrary reasons, any sympathy I had fpr OP went out the window when they said they had the chat window off at a time they were doing group content with a random group.
In fact, the reason they got kicked are likely rooted in that. Team tried to talk to them, they willfully did not respond (I say willful because removing the chat window leaving others unableto tcommunicate with you take a deliberate act) so they eventually got booted. I too have booted team mates who did not respond after several attemptsat talking to them when they were making stuff harder for the team. So OP, turn yout chat back on and read it when pugging and I think you may find yourself kicked a lot less often.

Vlad9425 · August 2019

There are players so bad who join those queues that they deserve to be kicked. I’ve stopped using the group finder thing because at times it’s just an exercise in frustration.

Sharee · August 2019

Vlad9425 wrote: »

There are players so bad who join those queues that they deserve to be kicked. I’ve stopped using the group finder thing because at times it’s just an exercise in frustration.

Never do a PUG queue for a dungeon you can't solo

Tommy_The_Gun · August 2019

Simple way to fix it is to just change how "kick" voting system works.

In 4 man dungeon, it only takes 2 votes. Since the person being vote-kicked is ignored it is 3 ppl left so only 2 votes is needed.
Just change it to 3 votes requirement (since the decision is final and irreversible).

Runkorko · August 2019

Sharee wrote: »

Vlad9425 wrote: »

There are players so bad who join those queues that they deserve to be kicked. I’ve stopped using the group finder thing because at times it’s just an exercise in frustration.

Never do a PUG queue for a dungeon you can't solo

Sorry but this is BS.
Direfrost Keep you cant solo even on normal.
All of my speed/no death runs i did with pugs - without voice even/ back in time. When ppl try hard. Lets say it, today players are spoiled bunch. Most of them, if not all.

Dubhliam · August 2019

You can't force people into carrying you.
They also paid for this game, same as you, and they also have a right to choose who they spend their time with.

I certainly wouldn't want to spend time with someone that can't be bothered to read chat.

Tommy_The_Gun · August 2019

runkorkoeb17_ESO wrote: »

Direfrost Keep you cant solo even on normal.

Shhh... you can... just google "How to solo farm Direfrost Keep | ESO | Homestead" and watch the vid. I can't say nothing more...

Runkorko · August 2019

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

Simple way to fix it is to just change how "kick" voting system works.

In 4 man dungeon, it only takes 2 votes. Since the person being vote-kicked is ignored it is 3 ppl left so only 2 votes is needed.
Just change it to 3 votes requirement (since the decision is final and irreversible).

And then trolls and " i dont give a f.ck about tactic, carry me PLS" ppl will start grp with a friend.
Not sure if i ignores someone do i can stil get him in my grp wjile using instance finder? If no, then is ok.
I get in grp with ..ts i leave. ignore them. and neve see them again.
Anyone knows how ignore work in eso?

p_tsakirisb16_ESO · August 2019

redmaxblower wrote: »

Been playing MMO's since Everquest. Literally a year played time in WoW.

Several here are from UO back in 1997 and never touched WoW as it was a pile of trash....

redmaxblower wrote: »

Stop letting people in dungeon finder kick other players. We all paid for the game we all have a right to be there.

As it is the system is used for griefing. None of the dungeons in this game, normal or vet, are so hard that one bad player can't be carried.
It's usually the opposite... the ones who want to be carried boot the lowest dps or the person who makes a minor mistake.

One of my ingame friends, she has issues with her hand ongoing operations for a year now. She knows she cannot do even a normal dungeon let alone a vet one because her dps or healing is sub par. However I have no issue to carry her in normal dungeon with my DD and in some non DLC dungeons in vet. However trying to do what with my tank, is a nightmare.

And whole group is a nightmare in normal when combined dps is 10,000 with the tank doing 4000. (real tank not the fake crap). Vet is impossible to complete.

redmaxblower wrote: »

And yes, I've been booted a couple of time from dungeons for reasons unknown,

You get booted for either doing nothing or people ask you if you know mechanics and you didn't respond.
Also if you tank, and you try to use the "kitting" tanking lately many WoW refugees are using, is annoying the DDs and the rest of the group. Because people doing "kitting" tanking, do not comprehend how the various skills and mechanics work in this game. By moving around DDs losing damage and burning faster their resources, so the fight drags longer than it should. And the healer needs to start burning magicka using BoL (if is templar otherwise good luck to survive) instead the AOE healing.

redmaxblower wrote: »

since I long ago turned off my chat window
in pugs and battelgrounds due to the obscene language and behavior of the players in this game.

I love the game, and enjoy playing in peace. But I'm tired of declining vote kicks and or randomly getting booted from a group for literally no reason.

Example:
A few days ago I logged into a pug forVet March of Sacrifices which was in progress, and got booted before I even caught up to the group.
I assume it was because the power tripping friends didn't like the fact that I didn't respond to their chat.
But I don't play this game to chat. And I shouldn't have to pay respect to them.

vMOS is one of the most demanding dungeons even during trash fights. And yes people becoming annoyed when they ask in chat "do you know the mechanics" and you are rude be remaining silent.
Don't expect the rest carry you in vMOS, they are not there to spend the next 2-3 hours trying at 3 team to pull you through.

Let alone if you are the tank, which abilities and knowledge of the mechanics are paramount.

So stop generalizing that all vet dungeons can be done. You are one of those people that annoy me as anything when I play with my tanks, hence both my tanks are only used in trials and pre-made groups.

Runkorko · August 2019

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

runkorkoeb17_ESO wrote: »

Direfrost Keep you cant solo even on normal.

Shhh... you can... just google "How to solo farm Direfrost Keep | ESO | Homestead" and watch the vid. I can't say nothing more...

Nope, without exploit /skip/ you cant.