Update 49 is now available for testing on the PTS! You can read the latest patch notes here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/categories/pts
Gold Buyers?
-
Tweek✭✭✭Etchesketch wrote: »Another roflol moment. If you are going to throw around stupid words like spurious, learn to read first. I never ever said gold buyers contribute to the community. I said they don't affect me like the sellers and botters do.
Some of you are funny.
They do affect you if you take part in the economy in any way, since an influx of currency into an economy always inflates prices. Makes it harder for non-gold buyers to purchase when the buyers are inflating prices.
This point is brilliant, and the reason a three strike system needs to happen...like right meow!!! plox!0 -
Requielle✭✭✭Etchesketch wrote: »I don't know what some folks are smoking but it's basic economics. These other games you mention that go F2P are doing it for a reason, it's because they can make more money by selling ingame stuff the the smaller community of players than trying to maintain the larger community of subscription based players.
You start banning subscribers for buying gold and you will quickly learn what F2P games are like, cause this game will do the same. It's business to them, not a game at all. The online gaming world is littered with subscription wannabe games, where are they now? Most never last a year on subscriptions.
If they cant stop the spam, they can't ban buyers. Period.
Lastly, I don't buy gold. As I stated.
And yet, CCP Games has managed to run a successful subscription-based game for a decade, while being known for having some of the least forgiving policies for in-game misdeeds. Yes, you can learn from the failures. You might also learn from the successes.0 -
YourNameHere✭✭✭Ban both.
And the buyers usually get shafted as well when their info and CC card number is stolen.
Just ... don't do it. Really. Report and hope Zenimax works on culling this down.NA Megaserver / RPer
Alinyssa Gaethar - AD || Raahni-do - AD || Wind-In-Tree's-Shadow - DC1 -
Etchesketch✭✭✭✭Been playing Eve since day one.The number one rule of online gaming is now and has always been, Never play on Patch Day.0
-
Tweek✭✭✭Etchesketch wrote: »I don't know what some folks are smoking but it's basic economics. These other games you mention that go F2P are doing it for a reason, it's because they can make more money by selling ingame stuff the the smaller community of players than trying to maintain the larger community of subscription based players.
You start banning subscribers for buying gold and you will quickly learn what F2P games are like, cause this game will do the same. It's business to them, not a game at all. The online gaming world is littered with subscription wannabe games, where are they now? Most never last a year on subscriptions.
If they cant stop the spam, they can't ban buyers. Period.
Lastly, I don't buy gold. As I stated.
And yet, CCP Games has managed to run a successful subscription-based game for a decade, while being known for having some of the least forgiving policies for in-game misdeeds. Yes, you can learn from the failures. You might also learn from the successes.
EVE Online - Player statistics, Server status.
Currently online: 26,152, Health: ok. Max (24h): 40,972 (2014-04-12 19:31:04)
Not really successful so much as..afloat...my friends won't play EVE online because of the harsh and unnecessary penalty's.Edited by Tweek on April 14, 2014 4:51PM0 -
Tweek✭✭✭Etchesketch wrote: »Been playing Eve since day one.
I played a few months after release
great game....quit a year ago though
Edited by Tweek on April 14, 2014 4:52PM0 -
AlliN✭✭✭Yeah...the meanie poo poo heads like you guys.
Yeah, we are bad, bad people for not wanting both sides of gold business to go away...
Also, the part I love - Your friends would quit if there would be gold buyers ban? Does it mean nothing to them that you play with them, honest, not gold-buying palyer? Oh, let me quote You:People like you make me wanna not live on this planet anymore. You cannot take a joke and don't understand the concept of friendship and fair treatment....
Your friends don't understand it either it seems...Edited by AlliN on April 14, 2014 4:53PM2 -
Tweek✭✭✭YourNameHere wrote: »Ban both.
And the buyers usually get shafted as well when their info and CC card number is stolen.
Just ... don't do it. Really. Report and hope Zenimax works on culling this down.
Three strikes buyers....ban sellers...please don't perma ban people that wanna play the game.
0 -
No warnings. No suspensions. Just Banned. Banned hard with no coming back on that account.
The ones that buy know they are cheating. They know they are showing how undeserving they are of the game. And if you are a buyer, please respond to this thread. It will help me locating you and finding a way to add you straight to my ignore list. A player like that (no matter how decent in real life) is not someone I want to associate with.6 -
Gold buyers should be banned maybe not perma banned but some kinda ban.
Gold buyers do hurt the game, if they are buying the gold the spammers have a reason to stay and keep spamming and botting.
Also most gold spammers anyhow lead you to sites with keyloggers or trick players into giving up their account info to them and they end up getting hacked ( you do not really think they are constantly paying for new games and accounts do you. )
So gold buyers are hurting the game, they are contributing to the spamming and gold botting because they are giving these people money for gold and since there are people buying they will end up staying. So most effective method is to make it clear that buyers and sellers will both be punished as well as the botters.
In the end you can argure this all you want and poke fun at my post but that dose not change the reasoning of buyers are just as destructive as the sellers and botters, they will be the reason they stick around if noone is buying they eventualy will leave because they will not want to spend money in a game they make no money from and also they would not get people to hack their accounts either.0 -
Tweek✭✭✭Yeah...the meanie poo poo heads like you guys.
Yeah, we are bad, bad people for not wanting both sides of gold business to go away...
Also, the part I love - Your friends would quit if there would be gold buyers ban? Does it mean nothing to them that you play with them, honest, not gold-buying palyer? Oh, let me quote You:People like you make me wanna not live on this planet anymore. You cannot take a joke and don't understand the concept of friendship and fair treatment....
Your friends don't understand it either it seems...
They didn't tell me to quit...I would do it because I don't wanna play without my old WoW guild in the game, and I am friends with these people. Believe it or not AlliN some people stand by their friends.Edited by Tweek on April 14, 2014 4:55PM0 -
Etchesketch✭✭✭✭I like Eve but it's a completely different model for business.
If you think ESO will be happy with the sub numbers for EVE you are mistaken.
I still have my AC account on Morninghthaw, but the sub numbers for that game are not going to trip any triggers either.
When you compare games, you need to compare apples with apples.The number one rule of online gaming is now and has always been, Never play on Patch Day.1 -
starkerealm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Etchesketch wrote: »Another roflol moment. If you are going to throw around stupid words like spurious, learn to read first. I never ever said gold buyers contribute to the community. I said they don't affect me like the sellers and botters do.
Some of you are funny.
Yeah, insomnia's a ***. I mixed your post over with Tweek's and someone else's. You can call it, "The price you pay for being deputized into someone else's argument against your will." But, on that subject, this bares no resemblance to the original post you made so... "some of you are funny."0 -
Tweek✭✭✭Etchesketch wrote: »I like Eve but it's a completely different model for business.
If you think ESO will be happy with the sub numbers for EVE you are mistaken.
I still have my AC account on Morninghthaw, but the sub numbers for that game are not going to trip any triggers either.
When you compare games, you need to compare apples with apples.
This.
Also I say again...if you perma ban buyers from this game...it will go FTP.Edited by Tweek on April 14, 2014 4:56PM1 -
starkerealm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭YourNameHere wrote: »Ban both.
And the buyers usually get shafted as well when their info and CC card number is stolen.
Just ... don't do it. Really. Report and hope Zenimax works on culling this down.
Three strikes buyers....ban sellers...please don't perma ban people that wanna play the game.
If they're buying gold then they don't want to play the game. They said as much when they asked someone else to do it for them.6 -
Endolith✭✭✭EVE Online - Player statistics, Server status.
Currently online: 26,152, Health: ok. Max (24h): 40,972 (2014-04-12 19:31:04)
Not really successful so much as..afloat...my friends won't play EVE online because of the harsh and unnecessary penalty's.
I don't know. In some ways, WoW has given people an unrealistic idea of what it means to be successful. It's like comparing every book's sales to Twilight or Harry Potter.
Looking at some stat sites, it says that Eve has 500K subscribers. If that's true and they're paying $14.95 a month, that's almost $7 1/2 million a month. That's a lot of money and plenty for any MMO to be successful. Even a fraction of that would be enough. Even 100K subscribers would be $1 1/2 million a month almost.
Sure, devs would like to hit WoW numbers, but you don't have to get anywhere near them to have a successful game.
2 -
Requielle✭✭✭
*blink* Wow, the last time someone came up with a retort that witty was ... my kindergarten-aged grandson. Bravo, sir?1 -
starkerealm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭EVE Online - Player statistics, Server status.
Currently online: 26,152, Health: ok. Max (24h): 40,972 (2014-04-12 19:31:04)
Not really successful so much as..afloat...my friends won't play EVE online because of the harsh and unnecessary penalty's.
I don't know. In some ways, WoW has given people an unrealistic idea of what it means to be successful. It's like comparing every book's sales to Twilight or Harry Potter.
Looking at some stat sites, it says that Eve has 500K subscribers. If that's true and they're paying $14.95 a month, that's almost $7 1/2 million a month. That's a lot of money and plenty for any MMO to be successful. Even a fraction of that would be enough. Even 100K subscribers would be $1 1/2 million a month almost.
Sure, devs would like to hit WoW numbers, but you don't have to get anywhere near them to have a successful game.
Also where TOR got into trouble. It managed to be both "the fastest selling MMO of all time" and "failed to meet sales expectations" at the same time. EA wanted it's own personal WoW dumping into it's pockets every month.
It got a massively successful MMO (by the numbers) that it was extremely disappointed by.Edited by starkerealm on April 14, 2014 5:02PM0 -
Etchesketch✭✭✭✭starkerealm wrote: »Etchesketch wrote: »Another roflol moment. If you are going to throw around stupid words like spurious, learn to read first. I never ever said gold buyers contribute to the community. I said they don't affect me like the sellers and botters do.
Some of you are funny.
Yeah, insomnia's a ***. I mixed your post over with Tweek's and someone else's. You can call it, "The price you pay for being deputized into someone else's argument against your will." But, on that subject, this bares no resemblance to the original post you made so... "some of you are funny."
Not sure what this means, but I will just say I stick by my first statement.
If casual gamers log into this game they are going to assume that buying gold from these guys is fine, since they are "allowed" to non stop spam it. Banning people for doing something you are allowing to take place in the game is a bad bad idea.
The number one rule of online gaming is now and has always been, Never play on Patch Day.0 -
AlliN✭✭✭He's a bit afraid about his account right now I guess, becase Zenimax could go for some drastic measures sorting gold problem and you know, you might or might not be around afterwards. I liked when he was calling me "not civil" and then started calling people "poo poo head meanies".Edited by AlliN on April 14, 2014 5:02PM0
-
Hyperventilate✭✭✭Is the only argument you have for your friends, "But, but... they're my friends! I'll stand by my friends!"
Cool, they're your friends. We can appreciate a good bromance.
But are you seriously so blind that you really can't acknowledge that your friends are the kind of people who exacerbate the cycle of gold sellers -> gold spam -> gold buyers?
Your friends are the problem. They bought gold. Once? Twice? Two hundred times? Doesn't matter. Gold sellers can't sell gold if there isn't a market to sell it to. Your buddies buying gold tells the gold sellers that if they hang around long enough, people will absolutely buy from them.
If your friends didn't want to run the risk of punishment (In what universe does any game dev advocate and give free passes to gold buyers?) they shouldn't have bought gold. I highly doubt your buddies regret what they did, and you yourself have probably profited from their gold buying.2 -
Tweek✭✭✭"Eve has 500K subscribers"EVE Online - Player statistics, Server status.
Currently online: 26,152, Health: ok. Max (24h): 40,972 (2014-04-12 19:31:04)
Not really successful so much as..afloat...my friends won't play EVE online because of the harsh and unnecessary penalty's.
I don't know. In some ways, WoW has given people an unrealistic idea of what it means to be successful. It's like comparing every book's sales to Twilight or Harry Potter.
Looking at some stat sites, it says that Eve has 500K subscribers. If that's true and they're paying $14.95 a month, that's almost $7 1/2 million a month. That's a lot of money and plenty for any MMO to be successful. Even a fraction of that would be enough. Even 100K subscribers would be $1 1/2 million a month almost.
Sure, devs would like to hit WoW numbers, but you don't have to get anywhere near them to have a successful game.
Eve doesn't have anywhere near 500K subs.....probably 50-80K, but I could see why you might think that.Edited by Tweek on April 14, 2014 5:04PM0 -
Endolith✭✭✭starkerealm wrote: »
Also where TOR got into trouble. It managed to be both "the fastest selling MMO of all time" and "failed to meet sales expectations" at the same time. EA wanted it's own personal WoW dumping into it's pockets every month.
Yep. WoW is an outlier. I'll be surprised if any other game hits those numbers, no matter how good. It came at the right time and provided the right product. Now there are a lot of options out there and a new game is going to have a hard time climbing to something like ten million.0 -
Tweek✭✭✭He's a bit afraid about his account right now I guess, becase Zenimax could go for some drastic measures sorting gold problem and you know, you might or might not be around afterwards. I liked when he was calling me "not civil" and then started calling people "poo poo head meanies".
I love you AlliN keep being an awesome person
Also as I said before I'm not worried about my account at all.0 -
Requielle✭✭✭Etchesketch wrote: »I don't know what some folks are smoking but it's basic economics. These other games you mention that go F2P are doing it for a reason, it's because they can make more money by selling ingame stuff the the smaller community of players than trying to maintain the larger community of subscription based players.
You start banning subscribers for buying gold and you will quickly learn what F2P games are like, cause this game will do the same. It's business to them, not a game at all. The online gaming world is littered with subscription wannabe games, where are they now? Most never last a year on subscriptions.
If they cant stop the spam, they can't ban buyers. Period.
Lastly, I don't buy gold. As I stated.
And yet, CCP Games has managed to run a successful subscription-based game for a decade, while being known for having some of the least forgiving policies for in-game misdeeds. Yes, you can learn from the failures. You might also learn from the successes.
EVE Online - Player statistics, Server status.
Currently online: 26,152, Health: ok. Max (24h): 40,972 (2014-04-12 19:31:04)
Not really successful so much as..afloat...my friends won't play EVE online because of the harsh and unnecessary penalty's.
1 - EVE has been growing, steadily as a subscription-based game for a decade. You can decide that qualifies as 'afloat', but constant growth qualifies in most views as 'success'.
2 - I am grateful beyond belief for direct confirmation that people who fear harsh penalties for misdeeds avoid EVE. I pay a subscription even when I am not actively playing EVE just to support them - partly because of things like this. Thank you for validating trust in CCP's decision.2 -
Tweek✭✭✭Hyperventilate wrote: »Is the only argument you have for your friends, "But, but... they're my friends! I'll stand by my friends!"
Cool, they're your friends. We can appreciate a good bromance.
But are you seriously so blind that you really can't acknowledge that your friends are the kind of people who exacerbate the cycle of gold sellers -> gold spam -> gold buyers?
Your friends are the problem. They bought gold. Once? Twice? Two hundred times? Doesn't matter. Gold sellers can't sell gold if there isn't a market to sell it to. Your buddies buying gold tells the gold sellers that if they hang around long enough, people will absolutely buy from them.
If your friends didn't want to run the risk of punishment (In what universe does any game dev advocate and give free passes to gold buyers?) they shouldn't have bought gold. I highly doubt your buddies regret what they did, and you yourself have probably profited from their gold buying.
Most of em that I have seen imo....
Edited by Tweek on April 14, 2014 5:05PM0 -
starkerealm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Etchesketch wrote: »starkerealm wrote: »Etchesketch wrote: »Another roflol moment. If you are going to throw around stupid words like spurious, learn to read first. I never ever said gold buyers contribute to the community. I said they don't affect me like the sellers and botters do.
Some of you are funny.
Yeah, insomnia's a ***. I mixed your post over with Tweek's and someone else's. You can call it, "The price you pay for being deputized into someone else's argument against your will." But, on that subject, this bares no resemblance to the original post you made so... "some of you are funny."
Not sure what this means, but I will just say I stick by my first statement.
If casual gamers log into this game they are going to assume that buying gold from these guys is fine, since they are "allowed" to non stop spam it. Banning people for doing something you are allowing to take place in the game is a bad bad idea.
Yeah, that wasn't well articulated in the specific post I read, but I agree.
And, Tweek... or at least Tweek's buddies, are a big part of the problem. You have people who view gold buying as normative, and get snotty when they're punished for breaking the rules, because they just want the advantage.
EDIT: And then you have Tweek coming on here and defending their behavior as okay.
It's actually worse for casual players, because you have the bots actively tightening the screws on them by snapping up the low level crafting nodes, pushing new players towards the vendors, and their prices that are unsustainable without the income from crafting or bosses. It's not intentional, but for the goldsellers it's convenient. Demand goes up, and they just keep doing what they're doing.Edited by starkerealm on April 14, 2014 5:10PM1 -
AlliN✭✭✭I like how you deflected all important arguments, and enboldened the least substantial one of Hyper's post. This is one solid denial shield you got there, Captain.Edited by AlliN on April 14, 2014 5:11PM1
-
Tweek✭✭✭starkerealm wrote: »Etchesketch wrote: »starkerealm wrote: »Etchesketch wrote: »Another roflol moment. If you are going to throw around stupid words like spurious, learn to read first. I never ever said gold buyers contribute to the community. I said they don't affect me like the sellers and botters do.
Some of you are funny.
Yeah, insomnia's a ***. I mixed your post over with Tweek's and someone else's. You can call it, "The price you pay for being deputized into someone else's argument against your will." But, on that subject, this bares no resemblance to the original post you made so... "some of you are funny."
Not sure what this means, but I will just say I stick by my first statement.
If casual gamers log into this game they are going to assume that buying gold from these guys is fine, since they are "allowed" to non stop spam it. Banning people for doing something you are allowing to take place in the game is a bad bad idea.
Yeah, that wasn't well articulated in the specific post I read, but I agree.
And, Tweek... or at least Tweek's buddies, are a big part of the problem. You have people who view gold buying as normative, and get snotty when they're punished for breaking the rules, because they just want the advantage.
It's actually worse for casual players, because you have the bots actively tightening the screws on them by snapping up the low level crafting nodes, pushing new players towards the vendors, and their prices that are unsustainable without the income from crafting or bosses. It's not intentional, but for the goldsellers it's convenient. Demand goes up, and they just keep doing what they're doing.
I'm not a gold buyer......already said I made this thread to find a solution to the problem.
Three strikes could solve this problem....along with public warnings on the launcher.0 -
Endolith✭✭✭2 - I am grateful beyond belief for direct confirmation that people who fear harsh penalties for misdeeds avoid EVE. I pay a subscription even when I am not actively playing EVE just to support them - partly because of things like this. Thank you for validating trust in CCP's decision.
I have to admit there's a logic here. If harsh policies against people who violate TOS or commit misdeeds in a game deters people who would commit misdeed from playing, then in a way it's mission accomplished.
I think a warning is nice. Many people, particularly those new to MMOs, may not even realize buying gold is an offense. But once they're aware of it and do it anyway, I can't find much sympathy.1