bol wrote: »

I personally like the weaving aspect. It makes a bigger difference between the best and the rest. But what I don't like is its implementation. Since I move around different countries I have parsed on exact same PC (my laptop) in different locations that have different latency. What I can tell you from testing is that going from avg 160ms to avg 70ms ping (what is shown in game) is around 7% boost of DPS on the trial dummy.
Basically the game favours heavily those living near the servers, which is not so good imho. And I would be glad if something was done to ease the issue. For example the whole weaving aspect could be handled by the client-side and as such not be impacted by the latency.

Iskiab wrote: »

Well I think most people came to the same conclusion that I did, pve raiding in this game is terrible.

In other games I’ve played I was the highest parsing character for my class, or close to the highest. In ESO, not even close. I figured out the light attack weaving but lag makes me uncompetitive. Maybe I’m getting old, but watching videos of the speed others can activate abilities and weave I don’t think so.

I can do dungeons and vet trials without issue, but vet trial HM score runs and whatnot... no way. That community will always be restricted to who has the best internet connection.

PvP’s fun, most of the time it’s similar to regular connection times for me unless there’s a ball group around. I think light attack weaving and mechanics requiring a good internet connection is why for most people pvp is ESO’s endgame rather then pve. ESO from the ground up hasn’t been designed to be a good pve game.

Xvorg wrote: »

p00tx wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Well I think most people came to the same conclusion that I did, pve raiding in this game is terrible.

In other games I’ve played I was the highest parsing character for my class, or close to the highest. In ESO, not even close. I figured out the light attack weaving but lag makes me uncompetitive. Maybe I’m getting old, but watching videos of the speed others can activate abilities and weave I don’t think so.

I can do dungeons and vet trials without issue, but vet trial HM score runs and whatnot... no way. That community will always be restricted to who has the best internet connection.

PvP’s fun, most of the time it’s similar to regular connection times for me unless there’s a ball group around. I think light attack weaving and mechanics requiring a good internet connection is why for most people pvp is ESO’s endgame rather then pve. ESO from the ground up hasn’t been designed to be a good pve game.

I live on the other side of a large country from the servers and play on console where lag is embedded in the fiber of the game. I main an army of healers and PvP characters, and just keep my DPS as a side hustle so I can run 4 person content or have some variety in raids. I can still parse 80k on the trial dummy on mag (52k on the 3m). The server issue does affect your success to a very small degree, but not enough to make it impossible to hit significant damage numbers. People just have to be willing to work at it and quit stubbornly clinging to mechanics from irrelevant games. Change is good for you.

Disagree. With a good connection you could do much better, and parses are by no way a valid meassure on both PvP or PvE. With bad connection you can get high numbers on a dummy but that means nothing when you are going o a Trial, or when you are in BGs.
Of course, you can work around the problem, but saying it affects you playing style in a small degree... sorry. That's why most streamers in this game are from only one country

p00tx wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Well I think most people came to the same conclusion that I did, pve raiding in this game is terrible.

In other games I’ve played I was the highest parsing character for my class, or close to the highest. In ESO, not even close. I figured out the light attack weaving but lag makes me uncompetitive. Maybe I’m getting old, but watching videos of the speed others can activate abilities and weave I don’t think so.

I can do dungeons and vet trials without issue, but vet trial HM score runs and whatnot... no way. That community will always be restricted to who has the best internet connection.

PvP’s fun, most of the time it’s similar to regular connection times for me unless there’s a ball group around. I think light attack weaving and mechanics requiring a good internet connection is why for most people pvp is ESO’s endgame rather then pve. ESO from the ground up hasn’t been designed to be a good pve game.

I live on the other side of a large country from the servers and play on console where lag is embedded in the fiber of the game. I main an army of healers and PvP characters, and just keep my DPS as a side hustle so I can run 4 person content or have some variety in raids. I can still parse 80k on the trial dummy on mag (52k on the 3m). The server issue does affect your success to a very small degree, but not enough to make it impossible to hit significant damage numbers. People just have to be willing to work at it and quit stubbornly clinging to mechanics from irrelevant games. Change is good for you.

Rungar wrote: »

worst design ever.

between this and the traders im not sure how much more anti player you can get.

people literally flee this game to ffix because of these two grotesque abominations.

lol

Faulgor wrote: »

Say what you will, I miss having heavy attack rotations as an option. It added more variety.

Maybe with the increased uptime of off-balance next patch it will be a bit better. I'll certainly give it another try.

f047ys3v3n wrote: »

For what is is worth, my internet / my server connection is not currently good enough for light attacks in actual raid situations. It did a bit better in the past though it was never great and currently I get something like 250 of what you might call medium attacks for around 20 light attacks in an actual fight. It doesn't matter how quickly and lightly I tap the key the attacks will register as "heavy". This is a pretty common problem for players to have though the ratio I get is a bit worse than most. The issue is that the window for a "light" is super small, .2 seconds charge time. Of course, when the game was designed this did not matter as attacks charged more powerfully bit by bit. Now you get a huge drop after the light though. This drop exists all the way until you get to the full heavy where you get resources. Ironically, you then get a damage jump as well as a resource return. This is because of how ZOS has mucked about in the code from the original attack scaling. They:

1) First shortened full heavy attacks but did not decrease their power. This created a bump in the otherwise linear charge time / power relationship.

2) Next wanted to add resource return but only at fully charged time. They actually created a new type of attack for this, the fully charged heavy. It shows up as a heavy in your add ons but the server registers it as a different kind of attack. This was when they changed all the heavy attack proc sets to only proc on fully heavy, the new and different type of attack.

3) Last was the real fun. They wanted to boost LA attack damage probably for reasons of ceiling floor issues and decided to nerf HA damage to "compensate" for the resource return but more likely to address the perceived problem of heavy attack builds being perceived as too powerful for how easy they were to play. Evidently, this was not the same group of devs that had done the other changes because they only nerfed medium attack damage and not the new, fully HA category they had created and which actually gave resources back. This left this big trough of crappy medium attacks that do less damage and also return no resources. These comprise the vast majority of all possible attack durations .2-1.7 seconds on a flame staff. Do to ping issues and server lag probably most folks attacks fall in this range. Ironically, this exacerbated rather than helped the floor / ceiling issues. It also encouraged macro use as many have had better luck macroing a LA to each skill cast rather than trying to feather the buttons. No one is really sure why this works. You would think the server would see things you did by hand the same as those done with a macro but it is not actually so either in this case or in the case of many of those PVP burst builds you encounter.

I should also note that any channeling weapons (resto and shock staffs) actually have a gap between .2 and .4 seconds where they play the animation of an attack but do 0 damage leading players to think they have attacked when they have not. Most players should never use these weapons as offensive weapons as they will loose a ton of damage from this bug. Pointing out this bug to ZOS years ago has not prompted any fix.

So yea, their basic LA, HA, FHA system is totally broken and has been for years. I always hope for a fix, and never get one. I am foolish enough to hope this is one of the things they intend to fix with their upcoming focus on basic underlying game systems. It remains #2 behind addressing cheating when it comes to my list of wishes.