I would like to see legitimate 30k DoT tooltip. Even with 35k max mag and 4k spell damage, soul trap hits about 20k on my mag DK. This is with 12% magic damage and 15% DoT damage in CPs.

I feel like people are considering cheese tooltips that are specifically for mentioned DoTs. 20k damage tooltip over 10s fits other DoTs with the new standards. That 20k would be 10k in PVP, which would probably be mitigated by about 20%, bringing it to 800 damage per tick without crits. DoTs are still meant for pressure, not outright killing.

Iskiab wrote: »

Nerftheforums wrote: »

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

Vapirko wrote: »

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

My tooltip on live server: 12,4k
Tooltip on pts: 10,7k

Glad to see that medium armor got compensated for the nerf to Rally... oh wait...

Meanwhile dots are in the 30k tooltip territory

Yeah this is crazy @ZOS_GinaBruno can we get some kinda dev statement on this? Normal builds are showing at best about a 6% increase in healing. Something really isn’t right. Medium armor is going to be trashed even more than it is now?

Well, I guess Gilliam decided to eliminate not only magicka rivals to stamblade but stamina ones as well
I mean if you approach in cloak those dots is not a big issue and then some combo with onslaught (surprise, stamblade has best ST direct damage abilities to synergize with new onslaught) and withdraw to shade while opponents have both nerfed defenses and heals. Oh and revealing flare got 3x cost increase, just saying. And camouflaged hunter is guaranteed proc from cloak still. And mutagen removed, while rapid regen will hardly help against burst from cloak. And healing ward nerfed back. And shields nerfed. And bleeds arguably nerfed. And WW nerfed.

Don't worry about stam Nbs, I main one and I did already perform better on classes which I don't play on live server before the Vigor nerf. Good luck fighting against a magplar/magdk with Nb now.

Templar's LD is simply hard counter to direct damage so this has nothing to do with nerf of vigor. I think it's quite obvious that when protection and heals are nerfed best way to mitigate damage is to avoid it completely via cloak. Yeah once detected, NB will be vulnerable, but I doubt you will have problem bursting down people with onslaught combo in few GCD and then just press one button to go back to shade and roll dodge into cloak.
Compare it to what other stamina classes will face, when all mages will instantly lash you with new dots on sight...

Stam Nb is better than the other classes in med armor for sure but nowhere close to where magplar and magdk is right now (which nothing is after the PTS changes). I don't want magplar/magdk see nerfed, I want the rest buffed actually. This patch is just outright horrible, especially for solo pvp.

What patch hasn't made the situation worse for soloers from morrowind to today? Honestly the only patch I remeber that I felt the situation improved for us was cwc, and that's only because of the nerf to proc sets. As far as I can remeber, every patch they added/removed a little soemthing that resulted in a worse solo player experience.

What are you talking about.

If you’re purely solo echoing vigor heals for more on PTS then live. Solo players have nothing to complain about.

Go look at the tooltips of the dots that are now available to all magicka and get back to me. there are three of them, one of them is aoe, and their tooltips are gigantic. As someone who plays a dot based melee build with dots that do about the same damage but require me to get into melee to apply, the idea of giving dots this powerful to every single magicka build in existence while nerfing stamina heals (rally hot is gone) is completely insane. There is no ranged dot based class like has been present in other MMOs, so in ESO you've generally always been able to at least use line of sight to stop incoming damage from magicka as melee, but that will no longer be the case. In a BG you'll have a few sets of soul trap and entropy on you the instant you pop out from behind a wall or pillar. Magicka actually has access to counters to this (purge, their own outgoing ranged pressure), and although I don't expect everyone to slot purge and don't think they should have to, stam doesn't have any counters like this at all. Protective was also nerfed, which a lot of people are using on live, which will mean more incoming damage for just about everyone.

On top of this, rapid regen/mutagen are both healing for much more than vigor on PTS, so slotting a resto staff as mag (which isn't a big deal) will result in substantially more self healing than stam has access to, on top of mag being able to heal their own teammates much better with either ability. Mag will absolutely *** all over stam this patch, especially in BG type situations.

BlackMadara wrote: »

I would like to see legitimate 30k DoT tooltip. Even with 35k max mag and 4k spell damage, soul trap hits about 20k on my mag DK. This is with 12% magic damage and 15% DoT damage in CPs.

I feel like people are considering cheese tooltips that are specifically for mentioned DoTs. 20k damage tooltip over 10s fits other DoTs with the new standards. That 20k would be 10k in PVP, which would probably be mitigated by about 20%, bringing it to 800 damage per tick without crits. DoTs are still meant for pressure, not outright killing.

With major sorcery and the shadow (crit) mundus, my mag necro on pts has tooltips of around 26k on most of these dots. I could cheese tooltips and get a good deal higher. They do a ton of damage, and they're easily stacked. A combination of destructive reach, entropy, and soul trap is a good amount of incoming pressure for one target to deal with, but what if you have multiple sets of those dots on you? Since soul trap is aoe (albeit small), you will absolutely have multiple sets of it on you in BG type situations, and if you ever 1vX, you'll have multiple sets of those dots on you no matter what. You can't LOS them, you can't purge them (as stam), there's no real good counter for these at all.

I play a stamdk dot based build with master dw/deadly strike and I have dots with about the same tooltips. When I started using this build a few months ago everyone's response to the build was to talk about how high the dot pressure was and how hard it was to deal with the constant pressure from those dots, forcing them mostly on the defensive if I had a full dot stack (rending/claw/breath/carve, plus two axe bleeds, and even rend at times just for fun), and this was as nord wearing 3 protective jewelry. Applying that same kind of constant pressure from range against squishier targets (protective is nerfed, rally nerfed) seems incredibly OP to me. Something other people aren't mentioning either is the increased pen magicka gets from the light armor passives, which will mean even more of that juicy tooltip damage than you'll get as stam. This next patch won't be good for anyone IMO, but it's gonna be *** for stam.

ecru wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Nerftheforums wrote: »

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

Vapirko wrote: »

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

My tooltip on live server: 12,4k
Tooltip on pts: 10,7k

Glad to see that medium armor got compensated for the nerf to Rally... oh wait...

Meanwhile dots are in the 30k tooltip territory

Yeah this is crazy @ZOS_GinaBruno can we get some kinda dev statement on this? Normal builds are showing at best about a 6% increase in healing. Something really isn’t right. Medium armor is going to be trashed even more than it is now?

Well, I guess Gilliam decided to eliminate not only magicka rivals to stamblade but stamina ones as well
I mean if you approach in cloak those dots is not a big issue and then some combo with onslaught (surprise, stamblade has best ST direct damage abilities to synergize with new onslaught) and withdraw to shade while opponents have both nerfed defenses and heals. Oh and revealing flare got 3x cost increase, just saying. And camouflaged hunter is guaranteed proc from cloak still. And mutagen removed, while rapid regen will hardly help against burst from cloak. And healing ward nerfed back. And shields nerfed. And bleeds arguably nerfed. And WW nerfed.

Don't worry about stam Nbs, I main one and I did already perform better on classes which I don't play on live server before the Vigor nerf. Good luck fighting against a magplar/magdk with Nb now.

Templar's LD is simply hard counter to direct damage so this has nothing to do with nerf of vigor. I think it's quite obvious that when protection and heals are nerfed best way to mitigate damage is to avoid it completely via cloak. Yeah once detected, NB will be vulnerable, but I doubt you will have problem bursting down people with onslaught combo in few GCD and then just press one button to go back to shade and roll dodge into cloak.
Compare it to what other stamina classes will face, when all mages will instantly lash you with new dots on sight...

Stam Nb is better than the other classes in med armor for sure but nowhere close to where magplar and magdk is right now (which nothing is after the PTS changes). I don't want magplar/magdk see nerfed, I want the rest buffed actually. This patch is just outright horrible, especially for solo pvp.

What patch hasn't made the situation worse for soloers from morrowind to today? Honestly the only patch I remeber that I felt the situation improved for us was cwc, and that's only because of the nerf to proc sets. As far as I can remeber, every patch they added/removed a little soemthing that resulted in a worse solo player experience.

What are you talking about.

If you’re purely solo echoing vigor heals for more on PTS then live. Solo players have nothing to complain about.

Go look at the tooltips of the dots that are now available to all magicka and get back to me. there are three of them, one of them is aoe, and their tooltips are gigantic. As someone who plays a dot based melee build with dots that do about the same damage but require me to get into melee to apply, the idea of giving dots this powerful to every single magicka build in existence while nerfing stamina heals (rally hot is gone) is completely insane. There is no ranged dot based class like has been present in other MMOs, so in ESO you've generally always been able to at least use line of sight to stop incoming damage from magicka as melee, but that will no longer be the case. In a BG you'll have a few sets of soul trap and entropy on you the instant you pop out from behind a wall or pillar. Magicka actually has access to counters to this (purge, their own outgoing ranged pressure), and although I don't expect everyone to slot purge and don't think they should have to, stam doesn't have any counters like this at all. Protective was also nerfed, which a lot of people are using on live, which will mean more incoming damage for just about everyone.

On top of this, rapid regen/mutagen are both healing for much more than vigor on PTS, so slotting a resto staff as mag (which isn't a big deal) will result in substantially more self healing than stam has access to, on top of mag being able to heal their own teammates much better with either ability. Mag will absolutely *** all over stam this patch, especially in BG type situations.

BlackMadara wrote: »

I would like to see legitimate 30k DoT tooltip. Even with 35k max mag and 4k spell damage, soul trap hits about 20k on my mag DK. This is with 12% magic damage and 15% DoT damage in CPs.

I feel like people are considering cheese tooltips that are specifically for mentioned DoTs. 20k damage tooltip over 10s fits other DoTs with the new standards. That 20k would be 10k in PVP, which would probably be mitigated by about 20%, bringing it to 800 damage per tick without crits. DoTs are still meant for pressure, not outright killing.

With major sorcery and the shadow (crit) mundus, my mag necro on pts has tooltips of around 26k on most of these dots. I could cheese tooltips and get a good deal higher. They do a ton of damage, and they're easily stacked. A combination of destructive reach, entropy, and soul trap is a good amount of incoming pressure for one target to deal with, but what if you have multiple sets of those dots on you? Since soul trap is aoe (albeit small), you will absolutely have multiple sets of it on you in BG type situations, and if you ever 1vX, you'll have multiple sets of those dots on you no matter what. You can't LOS them, you can't purge them (as stam), there's no real good counter for these at all.

I play a stamdk dot based build with master dw/deadly strike and I have dots with about the same tooltips. When I started using this build a few months ago everyone's response to the build was to talk about how high the dot pressure was and how hard it was to deal with the constant pressure from those dots, forcing them mostly on the defensive if I had a full dot stack (rending/claw/breath/carve, plus two axe bleeds, and even rend at times just for fun), and this was as nord wearing 3 protective jewelry. Applying that same kind of constant pressure from range against squishier targets (protective is nerfed, rally nerfed) seems incredibly OP to me. Something other people aren't mentioning either is the increased pen magicka gets from the light armor passives, which will mean even more of that juicy tooltip damage than you'll get as stam. This next patch won't be good for anyone IMO, but it's gonna be *** for stam.

Yup, that dot/bleed meta has been a long standing issue honestly. Fighting someone built like that starts out slow and then all of a sudden you can’t keep up enough heal spam to survive. Double dots, masters, axes, various dots... add in a dawny...

BUT... at least the top meta builds there required master axes to be achieved. Not every pleb was running around with em. Next patch any and all can bring that overbearing heat without any special weapons.

BlackMadara wrote: »

I would like to see legitimate 30k DoT tooltip. Even with 35k max mag and 4k spell damage, soul trap hits about 20k on my mag DK. This is with 12% magic damage and 15% DoT damage in CPs.

I feel like people are considering cheese tooltips that are specifically for mentioned DoTs. 20k damage tooltip over 10s fits other DoTs with the new standards. That 20k would be 10k in PVP, which would probably be mitigated by about 20%, bringing it to 800 damage per tick without crits. DoTs are still meant for pressure, not outright killing.

Wut? I have 27k on Entropy and 30k+ on Vampires Bane while wearing Spinner and Spell Strat which both do not boost tooltips?

BlackMadara wrote: »

ecru wrote: »

Here's a quick build I put together on PTS that should be at least a little viable in pvp. First Screenshot/tooltips are mostly cheese (apprentice mundus, nirn staff, divines gear, mag glyphs), second is all impen, atronarch mundus, prismatic glyphs, skoria instead of grothdarr, etc.

cheese:



(could have been a bit higher with mara instead of witchmothers)

mostly viable:



both are with buffs up/pet out for necropotence buff. this was really easy to do, this gear is really accessible, etc. this is close to what you'll be up against as stam in pvp. also, i could have pushed my max mag higher with inner light on my bar but i thought that was a bit much.

That is a high damage pvp build with 15% increased DoT damage from necro and 66 into thaum. So a build focusing on ranged DoTs that has high DoT damage, with low mitigation.

Also, here are some calcs of the damage these would do vs my mag DK in CP pvp. CPs are 20% less DoT damage and 7% less magic damage. 2975 crit resists (45% crit reduction) and 34.5 spell resistance (light armor, breton, blood spawn proc.) These are averages based on crit rate.

Flame Reach: 581 dps
Entropy: 707 dps
Soul Trap: 727 dps

Against a medium armor target with 17204 spell resistances. Same CP and crit resists.

Flame Reach: 842 dps
Entropy: 1023 dps
Soul Trap: 1052 dps

For comparison to Ele Weapon, a direct damage ability. 10517 tooltip (very similar effective spell damage as referenced build) 20% less direct damage CPs

Mag Dk: 2490
Med armor: 3606

So these DoTs deal at least 3 times less damage per second than the generic spammable. Focusing on DoTs allows an high pressure build that shouldn't be ignored, but these changes do not make them overbearing. Any mechanic, in this game, that is stacked/coordinated by a group is overbearing against a single player.

The only issue I can see is that entropy and soul trap can't seem to be dodged and can be cast at range. Perhaps the damage standards should be adjusted based on range and ease of use, but that is up to ZoS.

PS. Rapid regen should be nerfed and Vigor buffed to some type if happy middle. Resolving should probably heal more than the 7% increase compared to live and rapid just seems out of line with magicka builds having access to burst heals and shields.

3k dps on most medium targets (17k seems about right, average is probably mid 20s minus passive pen from cp/passives), but what if you add in a few more from a few other players? 6k dps? 7k? that you can't LOS? what do you do then, die behind a wall because you were in range of the enemy team for 5 seconds?

SilverPaws wrote: »

@Ragnaroek93 don't bother with @LoreToo... He is zergling that got 2vX by me often No game knowledge there.

I would like to add some salty coment about useless smallscalers, but i guess its agains rules. You know your path.

@ecru give us nice screenshots, so lets take a look. Tooltip is around 30k, with some points in taum i guess. So you will get sround 8,5-9k dps with 3 dots by tooltip. In pvp scenario with medium armor, resists and ofc you lovely protective trait(imho its useless in terms of damage loss) you will get near 23-25k resists. Lets add some minor protection, cp reduction, may be bloodspawn proc. So the rral dot dps will be abround 2,8k-3,3k, similar to some proc sets in cp-pvp. Its less then any spamable (such as ele weapon/force pulse/bone skull) and way less then any proc skill(say hello to 9k frag and 7k bow)
Next: vigor healing. I think you should invest some points into quick recovery(30-37 may be?) so you can get 1300hps per second+trollking(+-700hps)+my lovely stamsorc surge(+1200hps with hight crit chance)+pots with major vitality (oh god bless). Looks like you can overheal dots right?
Upd: if you still think that smth is wrong you can check out this damage thread and make you own calculation with all you prefereble sources of mitigation: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/279426/damage-mitigation-explanation-updated-15-07-2019/p1

Nerftheforums wrote: »

LoreToo wrote: »

SilverPaws wrote: »

@Ragnaroek93 don't bother with @LoreToo... He is zergling that got 2vX by me often No game knowledge there.

I would like to add some salty coment about useless smallscalers, but i guess its agains rules. You know your path.

@ecru give us nice screenshots, so lets take a look. Tooltip is around 30k, with some points in taum i guess. So you will get sround 8,5-9k dps with 3 dots by tooltip. In pvp scenario with medium armor, resists and ofc you lovely protective trait(imho its useless in terms of damage loss) you will get near 23-25k resists. Lets add some minor protection, cp reduction, may be bloodspawn proc. So the rral dot dps will be abround 2,8k-3,3k, similar to some proc sets in cp-pvp. Its less then any spamable (such as ele weapon/force pulse/bone skull) and way less then any proc skill(say hello to 9k frag and 7k bow)
Next: vigor healing. I think you should invest some points into quick recovery(30-37 may be?) so you can get 1300hps per second+trollking(+-700hps)+my lovely stamsorc surge(+1200hps with hight crit chance)+pots with major vitality (oh god bless). Looks like you can overheal dots right?
Upd: if you still think that smth is wrong you can check out this damage thread and make you own calculation with all you prefereble sources of mitigation: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/279426/damage-mitigation-explanation-updated-15-07-2019/p1

OMG are you for real? Troll king, minor protect, surge AND vitality (for 15s btw) lingers just to survive dots? *** me, at this point lets just slot heavy, impreg and brass because otherwise if they look at me I melt. Btw protective got nerfed, you get only 3.6k resistances from it, which means that your medium stamsorc sits at barely 22k resistances. Moreover, since we're at it, you are saying that the dot deals less damage than a spammable (duh). The only issue that your overly biased comments ignores, is that those dots will tick while someone is hitting you with both spammable, light attacks, bashes and ults. How the *** do you survive that in medium? By praying? Cuz your 12k vigor tt will surely not do the trick, trust me

Ppl that force themselves into dotbuilds will lose standart spamable skills.
Lets calculate your "30k tooltip OP DoT" dps(lets say you are nb sitting at 22k resists)-we will add minor maim from shadow(0,85), 12% from relentless focus(0,88), cp dot dmg reduction(lets say 20% so modifier 0,8), magica dmg reduction(10%, so 0,9 modifier) and 22k resists(0,67 modifier):
30.000*0,85*0,88*0,8*0,9*0,67=10825,056dmg=1086dps. Single dot that stays on you 10 seconds. 3 dots, if im correct will be 3247dps.
Single target spamable(lets say tooltip is 11.000) with absolutly same calculation is 3969dmg=dps.
Now healing: vigor tooltip is 10.000, last for 4 seconds. Lets + 3% for example from siphoning. 10300/2=5150=1287hps.
1287hps+30% pots+9% quick recovery+trollking(700)+leeching strikes(727)=3251hps potentionaly.
3241dot dps<3251 hps.
This just conferms that:
a)dotbuild is still not OP
b)stamnb has enough healing
c)nerf is ok and its MORE then balanced.
d)medium armor is totaly fine.
e)devs idea was to force you use healing from different sources snd not from 1 buttom
Sry, but tears around "vigor is not 25k" is smth that shows 99% ppl doesnt know how the game works

LoreToo wrote: »

Nerftheforums wrote: »

LoreToo wrote: »

SilverPaws wrote: »

@Ragnaroek93 don't bother with @LoreToo... He is zergling that got 2vX by me often No game knowledge there.

I would like to add some salty coment about useless smallscalers, but i guess its agains rules. You know your path.

@ecru give us nice screenshots, so lets take a look. Tooltip is around 30k, with some points in taum i guess. So you will get sround 8,5-9k dps with 3 dots by tooltip. In pvp scenario with medium armor, resists and ofc you lovely protective trait(imho its useless in terms of damage loss) you will get near 23-25k resists. Lets add some minor protection, cp reduction, may be bloodspawn proc. So the rral dot dps will be abround 2,8k-3,3k, similar to some proc sets in cp-pvp. Its less then any spamable (such as ele weapon/force pulse/bone skull) and way less then any proc skill(say hello to 9k frag and 7k bow)
Next: vigor healing. I think you should invest some points into quick recovery(30-37 may be?) so you can get 1300hps per second+trollking(+-700hps)+my lovely stamsorc surge(+1200hps with hight crit chance)+pots with major vitality (oh god bless). Looks like you can overheal dots right?
Upd: if you still think that smth is wrong you can check out this damage thread and make you own calculation with all you prefereble sources of mitigation: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/279426/damage-mitigation-explanation-updated-15-07-2019/p1

OMG are you for real? Troll king, minor protect, surge AND vitality (for 15s btw) lingers just to survive dots? *** me, at this point lets just slot heavy, impreg and brass because otherwise if they look at me I melt. Btw protective got nerfed, you get only 3.6k resistances from it, which means that your medium stamsorc sits at barely 22k resistances. Moreover, since we're at it, you are saying that the dot deals less damage than a spammable (duh). The only issue that your overly biased comments ignores, is that those dots will tick while someone is hitting you with both spammable, light attacks, bashes and ults. How the *** do you survive that in medium? By praying? Cuz your 12k vigor tt will surely not do the trick, trust me

Ppl that force themselves into dotbuilds will lose standart spamable skills.
Lets calculate your "30k tooltip OP DoT" dps(lets say you are nb sitting at 22k resists)-we will add minor maim from shadow(0,85), 12% from relentless focus(0,88), cp dot dmg reduction(lets say 20% so modifier 0,8), magica dmg reduction(10%, so 0,9 modifier) and 22k resists(0,67 modifier):
30.000*0,85*0,88*0,8*0,9*0,67=10825,056dmg=1086dps. Single dot that stays on you 10 seconds. 3 dots, if im correct will be 3247dps.
Single target spamable(lets say tooltip is 11.000) with absolutly same calculation is 3969dmg=dps.
Now healing: vigor tooltip is 10.000, last for 4 seconds. Lets + 3% for example from siphoning. 10300/2=5150=1287hps.
1287hps+30% pots+9% quick recovery+trollking(700)+leeching strikes(727)=3251hps potentionaly.
3241dot dps<3251 hps.
This just conferms that:
a)dotbuild is still not OP
b)stamnb has enough healing
c)nerf is ok and its MORE then balanced.
d)medium armor is totaly fine.
Sry, but tears around "vigor is not 25k" is smth that shows 99% ppl doesnt know how the game works

You do realise that 3k dps alone in PvP is more than most PvP builds do have on live server right? Try to play med armor on live server, unslot Rally and fight a petsorc. That's how medium armor feels on PTS. But whatever, why do I even reply to this, your not interested in balance in the slightest. See ya when the stuff that you're playing is getting ZOS'd.

I would love to see how this very skilled theorycrafter faces a masters dw stamplar properly built :') 37k bloodcraze tooltip in your face but hey, he has 22k res. He will be fine, innit?

LoreToo wrote: »

SilverPaws wrote: »

@Ragnaroek93 don't bother with @LoreToo... He is zergling that got 2vX by me often No game knowledge there.

I would like to add some salty coment about useless smallscalers, but i guess its agains rules. You know your path.

@ecru give us nice screenshots, so lets take a look. Tooltip is around 30k, with some points in taum i guess. So you will get sround 8,5-9k dps with 3 dots by tooltip.

I logged in my necro on pts for a min, and checked. of the 3 dots, one had 30k tooltip, one 25k, and 3rd 20k. So it is not 3x30k.

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

Vapirko wrote: »

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

My tooltip on live server: 12,4k
Tooltip on pts: 10,7k

Glad to see that medium armor got compensated for the nerf to Rally... oh wait...

Meanwhile dots are in the 30k tooltip territory

Yeah this is crazy @ZOS_GinaBruno can we get some kinda dev statement on this? Normal builds are showing at best about a 6% increase in healing. Something really isn’t right. Medium armor is going to be trashed even more than it is now?

This happens when you listen to some crybabies who cheese tooltips with Cyro keep buff, Mending, Vitality etc but never show up to test their actual trash builds in a realistic environment. Medium armor was far away from being op before the vigor nerf already but whatever...

Word.

LoreToo wrote: »

Ppl that force themselves into dotbuilds will lose standart spamable skills.
Lets calculate your "30k tooltip OP DoT" dps(lets say you are nb sitting at 22k resists)-we will add minor maim from shadow(0,85), 12% from relentless focus(0,88), cp dot dmg reduction(lets say 20% so modifier 0,8), magica dmg reduction(10%, so 0,9 modifier) and 22k resists(0,67 modifier):
30.000*0,85*0,88*0,8*0,9*0,67=10825,056dmg=1086dps. Single dot that stays on you 10 seconds. 3 dots, if im correct will be 3247dps.
Single target spamable(lets say tooltip is 11.000) with absolutly same calculation is 3969dmg=dps.
Now healing: vigor tooltip is 10.000, last for 4 seconds. Lets + 3% for example from siphoning. 10300/2=5150=1287hps.
1287hps+30% pots+9% quick recovery+trollking(700)+leeching strikes(727)=3251hps potentionaly.
3241dot dps<3251 hps.
This just conferms that:
a)dotbuild is still not OP
b)stamnb has enough healing
c)nerf is ok and its MORE then balanced.
d)medium armor is totaly fine.
e)devs idea was to force you use healing from different sources snd not from 1 buttom
Sry, but tears around "vigor is not 25k" is smth that shows 99% ppl doesnt know how the game works

And Magicka Builds have no penetration, No minor vulnarbility, etc.?
They can krit too!
An all class have minor maim and rentless?
Yes, you can outheal dots. But you can't go offensiv!

Sharee wrote: »

LoreToo wrote: »

I logged in my necro on pts for a min, and checked. of the 3 dots, one had 30k tooltip, one 25k, and 3rd 20k. So it is not 3x30k.

idk what is your necro build but here is magblade in alfiq and necro on pts right now with just major sorcery and shadow image out:

LoreToo wrote: »

Nerftheforums wrote: »

LoreToo wrote: »

SilverPaws wrote: »

@Ragnaroek93 don't bother with @LoreToo... He is zergling that got 2vX by me often No game knowledge there.

I would like to add some salty coment about useless smallscalers, but i guess its agains rules. You know your path.

@ecru give us nice screenshots, so lets take a look. Tooltip is around 30k, with some points in taum i guess. So you will get sround 8,5-9k dps with 3 dots by tooltip. In pvp scenario with medium armor, resists and ofc you lovely protective trait(imho its useless in terms of damage loss) you will get near 23-25k resists. Lets add some minor protection, cp reduction, may be bloodspawn proc. So the rral dot dps will be abround 2,8k-3,3k, similar to some proc sets in cp-pvp. Its less then any spamable (such as ele weapon/force pulse/bone skull) and way less then any proc skill(say hello to 9k frag and 7k bow)
Next: vigor healing. I think you should invest some points into quick recovery(30-37 may be?) so you can get 1300hps per second+trollking(+-700hps)+my lovely stamsorc surge(+1200hps with hight crit chance)+pots with major vitality (oh god bless). Looks like you can overheal dots right?
Upd: if you still think that smth is wrong you can check out this damage thread and make you own calculation with all you prefereble sources of mitigation: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/279426/damage-mitigation-explanation-updated-15-07-2019/p1

OMG are you for real? Troll king, minor protect, surge AND vitality (for 15s btw) lingers just to survive dots? *** me, at this point lets just slot heavy, impreg and brass because otherwise if they look at me I melt. Btw protective got nerfed, you get only 3.6k resistances from it, which means that your medium stamsorc sits at barely 22k resistances. Moreover, since we're at it, you are saying that the dot deals less damage than a spammable (duh). The only issue that your overly biased comments ignores, is that those dots will tick while someone is hitting you with both spammable, light attacks, bashes and ults. How the *** do you survive that in medium? By praying? Cuz your 12k vigor tt will surely not do the trick, trust me

Ppl that force themselves into dotbuilds will lose standart spamable skills.
Lets calculate your "30k tooltip OP DoT" dps(lets say you are nb sitting at 22k resists)-we will add minor maim from shadow(0,85), 12% from relentless focus(0,88), cp dot dmg reduction(lets say 20% so modifier 0,8), magica dmg reduction(10%, so 0,9 modifier) and 22k resists(0,67 modifier):
30.000*0,85*0,88*0,8*0,9*0,67=10825,056dmg=1086dps. Single dot that stays on you 10 seconds. 3 dots, if im correct will be 3247dps.
Single target spamable(lets say tooltip is 11.000) with absolutly same calculation is 3969dmg=dps.
Now healing: vigor tooltip is 10.000, last for 4 seconds. Lets + 3% for example from siphoning. 10300/2=5150=1287hps.
1287hps+30% pots+9% quick recovery+trollking(700)+leeching strikes(727)=3251hps potentionaly.
3241dot dps<3251 hps.
This just conferms that:
a)dotbuild is still not OP
b)stamnb has enough healing
c)nerf is ok and its MORE then balanced.
d)medium armor is totaly fine.
e)devs idea was to force you use healing from different sources snd not from 1 buttom
Sry, but tears around "vigor is not 25k" is smth that shows 99% ppl doesnt know how the game works

Are you actually posting this crap.. let me enlighten you.

Stam Dot Build.
There are some crazy tool tips in here also.. not even going magicka right now...

1. Noxious Breath with debuff high damage
2. Claw high damage
3. Blood craze / master weapon insane damage
4. Carve high damage
5. Viper
6. Sloads.
7. Poisons (2)
8. Armor dot and damage return
9. Basically stay poisoned in this build its low damage
10. Deadly cloak
11. Don't forget Skoria will be proving on cool down with this.. 12k tool tip
11. Leap. 20 k tool tip or two handed that strips armor.
12. Execute the new 400%

Vigor tool tip 15k in 4 secs

3 dots you seriously think 3 dots are a legitimate dot build. Try 8 to 11 ..

Redo math please