Best glyph and trait for Maelstrom lightning staff when only using 1-bar

  • Naftal
    Naftal
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    malistorr wrote: »
    I don't know if this can even be tested on a dummy, which I don't like to test on anyway since it doesn't seem to provide real-world/game dps.
    I'll have to test on overland mobs.

    Well they provide much more realistic dps than overland mobs will do.
  • malistorr
    malistorr
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    Why do you say that? Can you even test off-balance and therefore the heavy attack 170% bonus on dummies? (I honestly don't know) Also, mobs are what people are fighting 90% of the game, not bosses, so why wouldn't it be better reflective of a real game experience?
  • Joosef_Kivikilpi
    Joosef_Kivikilpi
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    malistorr wrote: »
    Joosef_Kivikilpi, I need mostly light armor since I'm a mag sorc. So I will use 5 light armor body pieces of IM/IE (whatever the F it's called , why does it have 2 names?!)
    2 medium armor from Undaunted Infiltrator head and shoulders (also using UI jewels)
    So yes, I don't have a heavy armor piece for that extra undaunted passive bonus but it's something I have to sacrifice just like not having a monster set in favor of that 3rd very large buff to my staff heavy attacks. I hope to be able to get the staff soon and test this and I'll know if it's worth keeping or if some other setup might be better for my play style. So far nothing I've tested comes close which agrees with why Zynode suggested a similar setup to begin with. Although he's using Grothdar (which I am now) instead of going with 1-bar without the monster set.

    I just don't want to have to bar swap and honestly don't need to use more skills than the 6 I have on my 1-bar. If I can pass all content in the game playing the way I want to than I'll be happy. I know some people just can't comprehend that a player wouldn't spend all night and day squeezing every last ounce of possible dps from their build, but yes, some people just like to relax and enjoy their games instead of turning in into a job. I'm quite confident that once I finish transmuting everything and get the staff that I'll be very happy with the results.

    Back to the topic I asked about. I've used a charged staff before, but right now my UI staff is sharpened. I'll have to get the Maelstrom staff and change it to charged ASAP.

    And for a stamina ability to use as a Sorcerer, you can use Dark Deal, Bound Armor, or Rearming Trap to have both sets going. Also... Overload Heavy attacks will be crazy with everything proc'd.
  • Naftal
    Naftal
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    malistorr wrote: »
    Why do you say that? Can you even test off-balance and therefore the heavy attack 170% bonus on dummies? (I honestly don't know) Also, mobs are what people are fighting 90% of the game, not bosses, so why wouldn't it be better reflective of a real game experience?

    Overland mobs don't have enough hp for any optimization changes to your build changing the time to kill.
  • malistorr
    malistorr
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    Josef, I don't know what you mean about using stamina skills to have "both sets going". Please explain.
    I have 64-points in magic and use only a few skills, all magic I believe. I use none of the skills that you mentioned.
  • Joosef_Kivikilpi
    Joosef_Kivikilpi
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    malistorr wrote: »
    Josef, I don't know what you mean about using stamina skills to have "both sets going". Please explain.
    I have 64-points in magic and use only a few skills, all magic I believe. I use none of the skills that you mentioned.

    Undaunted Unweaver requires a stamina ability use to proc the damage buff and Undaunted Infiltrator requires a magic ability use to proc.
  • malistorr
    malistorr
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    I think you have sets confused. I'm using UI. Undaunted Infiltrator. And just for the big bonus to heavy attack. The extra 2k+ magic is just a bonus. And yes, the 4th slot bonus is wasted on me, I don't care. The set is worth it for my build/play style anyway.
    Edited by malistorr on July 31, 2019 6:01PM
  • malistorr
    malistorr
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    Naftal, That's not exactly true. But you won't change the time by much just tweaking 1 or 2 minor things, agreed. But that's not relevant to the DPS discussion. We're trying to determine DPS parse, not time to kill. Whether you're killing some enemies in mobs in 2.7-seconds, or 2.8-seconds, the add-ons should still show you your increased DPS regardless.

    Honestly, I'm doing so well that people are asking me in dungeon groups now what sets I'm using and what my DPS is because they're really impressed with how fast I'm killing things and cruising through dungeons or even trials. I'm sure these are some lower or mid-level players, but they also go into these groups with high-level stam players as well. Apparently I keep up with or do better than just about all those.

    My AOE is apparently really noticeable and I think so much so, that I heard some of my skills are getting big nerfs in the upcoming update. (I haven't read all the details yet but I'm confident I'll be able to adapt quickly, or may not even need to)

    And best of all, the super high heavy attack that's easy to use (even for people who are older or have disabilities, or just plain don't want to bar swap, weave, or have complicated rotations because they think that play style is not fun (like me))

    My build is not the best, never said it was, but I have fun playing every night and do really really well, so mission accomplished. And I guess I'll just have to test the enchant and trait on the lightning staff after the update. It's coming soon I think so I won't bother testing now. I'm not even sure I'll test then since it takes a lot of time and effort. If I'm still crushing dungeons and trials then I'll just keep playing and having fun and let others treat the game like it's a lab experiment. If the damage doesn't vary by more than a percent or so regardless of enchant and trait, then I won't even really care about the answer to my original question. I only asked in case the enchant and trait actually made a significant difference.
  • ATreeGnome
    ATreeGnome
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    If your goal is to focus on AoE damage, which is what I've gathered from this thread, then charged + shock might not be the way to go. The shock enchant can only hit 1 enemy per proc, even from an AoE ability. An infused berserk enchant will give you a bunch of spell damage and can be kept up 100% of the time.

    That said, I think you would notice a pretty big boost if you used a 2nd bar just for the maelstrom staff and only use wall of elements on that bar. Then you could use a charged shock on one bar and infused berserker on the other, and still use a monster set.

    In the end, do what you want, I don't think there's going to be a massive difference between infused berserker vs charged shock for the content that interests you.
  • malistorr
    malistorr
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    I'm thinking there will be a big difference. I need charged to be able to proc concussion 80+% of the time. WOE then makes them off-balanced and then I get the 170% heavy attack bonus. Since my gear is all designed for max heavy attacks then I do crazy damage. And from what I just read in the update 23 change notes, the only thing that will really be nerfed is a bit of the damage from a couple of the AOE skils that I use. But they are being improved in other ways also, which makes the damage decrease not as hard to adapt to. I saw that off-balance will last 2-seconds longer as well, which should make this strategy even more viable (Since it's built on max heavy attack and I'll have an extra 2-seconds to do 170% more damage from an already very powerful attack). I get that I can keep the monster set if I back-bar the maelstrom staff, and some day I may decide to do that. For now I have never bar-swapped and the idea of playing that way doesn't appeal to me.

    I see that glyph of shock just adds x damage with no timer. And glyph of weapon damage increases your spell damage for 5-seconds. But I don't understand how often it can fire, if there's a cooldown etc. Is it up 100% of the time? If not, what determines how often it can fire, what makes it fire, etc.? Without knowing that I have no idea how useful it can really be. If it's only active 25% of the time then it sounds like glyph of shock would be much more useful as its bonus is up 100% of the time.

    If I single-bar maelstrom staff it founds like glyph of shock charged is the way to go.
    If I double-bar then probably back bar maelstrom lightning staff with glyph of shock charged and front bar UI lightning staff with glyph of shock infused. If anyone disagrees please let me know why. Again this is to maximize concussion/off-balance/heavy attack damage.
  • Destruent
    Destruent
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    infused weapon damage glyph has an uptime of nearly 100%. without infused it's around 50%.
    Noobplar
  • ATreeGnome
    ATreeGnome
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    malistorr wrote: »
    I'm thinking there will be a big difference. I need charged to be able to proc concussion 80+% of the time. WOE then makes them off-balanced and then I get the 170% heavy attack bonus. Since my gear is all designed for max heavy attacks then I do crazy damage. And from what I just read in the update 23 change notes, the only thing that will really be nerfed is a bit of the damage from a couple of the AOE skils that I use. But they are being improved in other ways also, which makes the damage decrease not as hard to adapt to. I saw that off-balance will last 2-seconds longer as well, which should make this strategy even more viable (Since it's built on max heavy attack and I'll have an extra 2-seconds to do 170% more damage from an already very powerful attack). I get that I can keep the monster set if I back-bar the maelstrom staff, and some day I may decide to do that. For now I have never bar-swapped and the idea of playing that way doesn't appeal to me.

    I see that glyph of shock just adds x damage with no timer. And glyph of weapon damage increases your spell damage for 5-seconds. But I don't understand how often it can fire, if there's a cooldown etc. Is it up 100% of the time? If not, what determines how often it can fire, what makes it fire, etc.? Without knowing that I have no idea how useful it can really be. If it's only active 25% of the time then it sounds like glyph of shock would be much more useful as its bonus is up 100% of the time.

    If I single-bar maelstrom staff it founds like glyph of shock charged is the way to go.
    If I double-bar then probably back bar maelstrom lightning staff with glyph of shock charged and front bar UI lightning staff with glyph of shock infused. If anyone disagrees please let me know why. Again this is to maximize concussion/off-balance/heavy attack damage.

    All weapon enchantments have a cooldown period. For infused berserker it's 5 seconds, so you can get 100% uptime. For charged shock I believe it would be 10 seconds (can't remember for sure off the top of my head). So you wouldn't be proccing the shock enchantment constantly, only 1 time per cooldown.
  • zvavi
    zvavi
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    ATreeGnome wrote: »
    malistorr wrote: »
    I'm thinking there will be a big difference. I need charged to be able to proc concussion 80+% of the time. WOE then makes them off-balanced and then I get the 170% heavy attack bonus. Since my gear is all designed for max heavy attacks then I do crazy damage. And from what I just read in the update 23 change notes, the only thing that will really be nerfed is a bit of the damage from a couple of the AOE skils that I use. But they are being improved in other ways also, which makes the damage decrease not as hard to adapt to. I saw that off-balance will last 2-seconds longer as well, which should make this strategy even more viable (Since it's built on max heavy attack and I'll have an extra 2-seconds to do 170% more damage from an already very powerful attack). I get that I can keep the monster set if I back-bar the maelstrom staff, and some day I may decide to do that. For now I have never bar-swapped and the idea of playing that way doesn't appeal to me.

    I see that glyph of shock just adds x damage with no timer. And glyph of weapon damage increases your spell damage for 5-seconds. But I don't understand how often it can fire, if there's a cooldown etc. Is it up 100% of the time? If not, what determines how often it can fire, what makes it fire, etc.? Without knowing that I have no idea how useful it can really be. If it's only active 25% of the time then it sounds like glyph of shock would be much more useful as its bonus is up 100% of the time.

    If I single-bar maelstrom staff it founds like glyph of shock charged is the way to go.
    If I double-bar then probably back bar maelstrom lightning staff with glyph of shock charged and front bar UI lightning staff with glyph of shock infused. If anyone disagrees please let me know why. Again this is to maximize concussion/off-balance/heavy attack damage.

    All weapon enchantments have a cooldown period. For infused berserker it's 5 seconds, so you can get 100% uptime. For charged shock I believe it would be 10 seconds (can't remember for sure off the top of my head). So you wouldn't be proccing the shock enchantment constantly, only 1 time per cooldown.

    4 seconds, damage glyphs have 4 seconds cooldown, 2 with infused. Note that it doesn't mean it will proc every two seconds (much like eledrain)
  • malistorr
    malistorr
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    Just found this, anyone know if it's still accurate? As this post is from 2-years ago or so.

    "The information is very simple.
    Increase Weapon and spell damage (self buff)
    Decrease weapon and spell damage (enemy debuff)
    Both have 10 second cool down, and 5 second duration

    Everything else, all direct damage (fire, frost, shock, disease, poison...) and glyphs like shielding, absurd health, stam, mag.
    EVERYTHING else, has a cool down of 4 seconds.

    The confusion here is due mostly to confusion of terms, people using terms like "uptime" interchangeably with "cooldown".

    Let me explain in detail to resolve any confusion;
    The Increase Weapon and Spell Damage glyph can be made to have 100% uptime, which is what people were incorrectly and confusingly calling "no cooldown".
    With the Infused weapon trait, the 10 second cooldown (which starts the moment the glyph is triggered) can be reduced to 5 seconds - the exact length of time the buff is active - allowing it to be triggered again basically right as the effect ends.
    To put it another way, if you stand in front of a target dummy and just light attack over and over:
    Without infused, the buff will be active 50% of the time. 5 seconds on, 5 seconds off.
    With infused, it will be up 100% of the time.
    The same goes for the decrease glyph, the debuff on your enemy, but of course that only applies to one target at a time.

    The REST of the glyphs, with infused, go down to about 2 seconds.
    I say "about" because it's not always in synch with your weapon swings, but if you average it out over like say, 60 seconds, the enchant will trigger about 15 times without infused, and about 30 times with infused."
    Edited by malistorr on July 31, 2019 10:01PM
  • malistorr
    malistorr
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    Anyway I've still heard nothing to make me think that maelstrom lightning staff shock glyph charged for single bar wouldn't be best since I'm trying to cause concussion/off-balanced as much as possible.

    For 2-bar setup with the same goal, back bar maelstrom lightning staff shock glyph charged. Use a skill that does lightning damage (or heavy attack since the splash damage can proc.) to proc. concussion and WOE to send them off-balance. Then swap to front bar, with in my case Undaunted Infiltrator lightning staff with weapon damage or shock glyph (not sure, I'd have to test which is best) infused to do max damage from heavy attack while the enemy is off-balance (soon to be 2-seconds longer duration after update 23)

    Then swap bars and start all over. I'll have to compare the above scenario with going shock glyph and charged on both staffs if that will keep up the concussion/off-balance just about 100% of the time. It could do more damage than infused front bar I guess since 170% buff to heavy attack damage when enemy off-balance.
    Edited by malistorr on July 31, 2019 11:11PM
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