Shock Clench should keep its stun

LeHarrt91 · July 2019

Again, Arctic Blast heal buffed. No additional cost reduction, no damage, still blockable, still dodgeable.

josh.lackey_ESO · July 2019

I agree, shock clench should keep the stun.

DisgracefulMind · July 2019

Still waiting for an answer from ZoS as to why magden is so got-damn ignored.

Can we get a decent stun and our spammable fixed so we can combo it properly again?

Thanks.

Or don't take shock clench from us and leave us with no options. But whatever.

Ulfgarde · July 2019

Mojomonkeyman wrote: »

Ulfgarde wrote: »

Agreed. The direct damage reduction and DoT removal was an okay nerf, but PTS shock clench will be dead in small-scale without a CC. It won't be great for a structured group either since pulsar is far more superior damage-wise (and was buffed even in comparison).

Magden lacks a strong CC that synergizes with their high burst potential. Magnecro's CC is weak against ranged classes since it can be easily avoided. Using fire clench just lowers your overall damage even more after the direct damage nerf.

Also the new fire clench CC is pretty ridiculous. Knockback itself is such an insanely frustrating and clunky CC to deal with since it ruins your positioning, and an 8m knockback is going to be very prevelant in PvP since half the magicka classes are going to be forced to run force clench now. Plus the CC seems to have been reworked and has a weird 2-part CC effect like draining shot.

Mojomonkeyman wrote: »

Muskrap wrote: »

The bigger your group size the less you need a stun. In solo and small scale as well as BGs and duels its absolutely necessary. Especially since out best alternative is what, vamp drain? I shouldnt have to explain why thats an issue

I play on top MMR PC EU with 5 different characters, solo and premade. I play solo Cyro A LOT, two years on magicka warden and now 6 weeks on magicka necro - all of this not using clench a single minute of gameplay.

So yeah, I have to disagree. Not on the fact that a proper cc would be much, much better, but on your claim that alternative playstyles are DOA.

Never heard of you in BGs before. Just because you aren't using something doesn't mean other people aren't, and it just so happens that shock clench magden was the "bread and butter" of the class. And even then, if you ran bird/ele weapon, you NEEDED a CC, and shock reach isn't an option next patch. So I wouldn't be so dismissive of the nerf since you mentioned yourself you have no experience playing with it.

That's because you have never played BGs in high MMR. I never said I have no experience using clench. I said I didnt crutch on it on the classes that people claim would be useless without. Can't expect people who can't even read properly to l2p their class, I guess.

>"Not using clench in a single minute of gameplay"
I feel like you could learn reading comprehension yourself. Who knows though when you get rolled in BGs and then go on the forums bragging about being high MMR. Ironically you're not very good so maybe you should chill out with your ego.

I never said magden was going to be useless without it either. WIth fire clench it'll be fine, but it lacks the AOE and damage it had before. It just homogenizes the choices further. I'm not sure how shock clench is a crutch because it has limited range and the damage is way less than that of single target spammables. I don't use it as a spammable but I'm just giving justifications.

Just because an ability is strong doesn't make it a crutch. Resto ult + defensive ult spam is a crutch for survival, for example. Or the fact that magnecro cant burst without colossus forces it to crutch on colossus. I just fail to see if you know what you're talking about, lmao.

Joy_Division · July 2019

I disagree because the problem here is some classes have terrible stuns, poor damaging options, and are only "good with groups," which is a euphemism apologists use for the class sucks on its own.

master_vanargand · July 2019

You can use Inferno Staff.

Vortigaunt · July 2019

master_vanargand wrote: »

You can use Inferno Staff.

And you can use a lightning destro staff on a stamina Nightblade, your point being?

Delparis · July 2019

They nerfed that but kept Scatter Shot untouched.
Another Nightblade buff so they do perform better against sorcs.
GG Gillam

DisgracefulMind · July 2019

Joy_Division wrote: »

I disagree because the problem here is some classes have terrible stuns, poor damaging options, and are only "good with groups," which is a euphemism apologists use for the class sucks on its own.

I do agree, actually. I would LOVE if they actually improved magicka warden, gave us a reliable stun (like why not put stun back on Deep Fissure now that the skill is blockable, so if someone doesn't block it, they get stunned), and fix our spammable to be actually usable.

But what I don't agree with is stripped magden and magcro from lightning staff stun and then leaving us with nothing else and not any improvements to our class.

Muskrap · July 2019

master_vanargand wrote: »

You can use Inferno Staff.

Use the 8m knockback that can knock people out of shalks/sleet storm and our damage is nerfed by 8% on top of the percentage drop from animal companions and rising popularity of shuffle

LeHarrt91 · July 2019

Muskrap wrote: »

master_vanargand wrote: »

You can use Inferno Staff.

Use the 8m knockback that can knock people out of shalks/sleet storm and our damage is nerfed by 8% on top of the percentage drop from animal companions and rising popularity of shuffle

Yeah, the impact it had on other skills was important. I would be ok if they halved or removed the initial damage on Shock Clench/ Reach, as long as it kept the stun.

and it bears repeating, improved class stuns.

wheem_ESO · July 2019

LeHarrt91 wrote: »

Muskrap wrote: »

master_vanargand wrote: »

You can use Inferno Staff.

Use the 8m knockback that can knock people out of shalks/sleet storm and our damage is nerfed by 8% on top of the percentage drop from animal companions and rising popularity of shuffle

Yeah, the impact it had on other skills was important. I would be ok if they halved or removed the initial damage on Shock Clench/ Reach, as long as it kept the stun.

and it bears repeating, improved class stuns.

I think Magicka Warden would end up better off with a decent class-based stun + the option of Shock Reach as a DOT, than they were/are with the live version of Shock Clench/Reach. If you're not using a Master Staff, Shock Clench/Reach isn't anything special, and if you are using a Master Staff...time to adjust, since that was a terrible "meta" anyway (and not just for Wardens), and I'm glad to see it go away.

ZOS seems to be listening to the idea that Arctic Blast is a bit of a pain point for Wardens, but they haven't gotten the changes where they need to be yet. Hopefully that will change, and it'll eventually be something competitive with other class' options. In the meantime, I'll be over here on my Magicka Necromancer with Vamp Drain, since the Totem (and other Necromancer issues) get no attention whatsoever.

LeHarrt91 · July 2019

wheem_ESO wrote: »

LeHarrt91 wrote: »

Muskrap wrote: »

master_vanargand wrote: »

You can use Inferno Staff.

Use the 8m knockback that can knock people out of shalks/sleet storm and our damage is nerfed by 8% on top of the percentage drop from animal companions and rising popularity of shuffle

Yeah, the impact it had on other skills was important. I would be ok if they halved or removed the initial damage on Shock Clench/ Reach, as long as it kept the stun.

and it bears repeating, improved class stuns.

I think Magicka Warden would end up better off with a decent class-based stun + the option of Shock Reach as a DOT, than they were/are with the live version of Shock Clench/Reach. If you're not using a Master Staff, Shock Clench/Reach isn't anything special, and if you are using a Master Staff...time to adjust, since that was a terrible "meta" anyway (and not just for Wardens), and I'm glad to see it go away.

ZOS seems to be listening to the idea that Arctic Blast is a bit of a pain point for Wardens, but they haven't gotten the changes where they need to be yet. Hopefully that will change, and it'll eventually be something competitive with other class' options. In the meantime, I'll be over here on my Magicka Necromancer with Vamp Drain, since the Totem (and other Necromancer issues) get no attention whatsoever.

I have tried the Master Staff setup but i didnt feel the hype so i switched it out. The main thing about Shock was that it stunned them on the spot, rather than a knockback. And i would love nothing more that for Warden and Necro to get good class stuns. When arctic blast was first changed, i wanted it to be like the skill used in the Morrowind Trailer.

Skander · July 2019

Just remove the direct damage on the stun and make it Damage over time.