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PvE Tanks are looking good this patch, if nothing else
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Vicarra✭✭✭✭✭I think it's fair to say that stamDKs are going to remain the undisputed kings of tanking, with every other class being far less desirable and competitive. Mag tanks are being especially crippled by these upcoming changes.
My "dark paladin" magnecro tank will be eviscerated by the triple whammy of nerfed healing, nerfed orbs, and increased magicka skill costs because sustaining is already a struggle in longer fights. I will be forced to make sure there is always a templar in the group with me. With the reduction in DPS across the board, fights will become even longer and there will be more pressure on tanks to provide more utility debuffs to help boost DPS. I don't think most tanks will be able to realistically keep up orbs like they used to back in the day. We're going to have to run "selfish" sets and stack shields...or all just run stamDKs. Yay diversity.
Edited by Vicarra on July 8, 2019 12:40PMPAWS - Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff!
Haakon Stormblade - Nord Illusionist, Dwemer scholar, Horse Whisperer, Bringer of Storms2 -
Pallio✭✭✭✭✭
✭Tanks will have to be VERY good this patch, healing will be slower/harder and sustain will be a problem, fights will be longer as DPS will be lower and also have sustain issues. Pugs will be ridiculously hard, as will anything below ELITE raiding groups, which will continue to do anything.2 -
msalvia✭✭✭✭Good points all. While tanking a role is gonna be easier, everything around it is gonna suck: worse healing, worse dps, worse overland content (for those masochists who do that). And yeah, my pug patience threshold is gonna have to go up to account for the across-the-board decrease in group quality.
0 -
Eraldus✭✭✭✭PSA: Many people seem to think play as you want means you get an "I win" button however you choose to play the game. Play as you want doesn't mean sword and board has to be competitive for DPS. You have options. Do less damage, or switch to another weapon and maybe even put on medium armour when not actually tanking.
And that has nothing to do with what I said, nor is what I advocated in this thread... I'm starting to think you people have trouble reading, or are feigning ignorance to cause pointless discussions.
Sorry, but that's what it feels like from reading posts like this.Edited by Eraldus on July 8, 2019 3:23PM3 -
daemonios✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭PSA: Many people seem to think play as you want means you get an "I win" button however you choose to play the game. Play as you want doesn't mean sword and board has to be competitive for DPS. You have options. Do less damage, or switch to another weapon and maybe even put on medium armour when not actually tanking.
And that has nothing to do with what I said, nor is what I advocated in this thread... I'm starting to think you people have trouble reading, or are feigning ignorance for the sake of trolling.
I never quoted anyone directly in my post, but clearly you felt targeted. I'll bite.
You literally stated earlier in this thread:
What does it matter that sword and board damage is nerfed for PvE? It was never meant to be a damage toolset. Not ever. It has always been a slow grind to kill anything stronger than those 1-shot critters with a sword and shield. In the mean time, you have options. Go medium armour and bow, or dual wield, or 2h, if you want to do overland content quickly. You don't even need to respec, that gear alone will give you more than enough damage. On the other hand, reduced s/b damage will probably help with the damage tank meta in PvP. In the end, how is diversity affected? You can still be a slow killer in PvE if you choose to be one, and in PvP people should be moving away from the one cookie-cutter build.Tanks will now take more time to kill stuff, because their already average damage got reduced even further for no reason. SnB got two skills heavily nerfed, while we got a single damage based shield skill and we can now spam our skills longer, since everything will take longer to kill!
GREAT CHANGES INDEED! YAY FOR DIVERSITY!1 -
Agenericname✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Unless I'm reading it wrong, chains (silver leash) have been removed, so DKs are the only tank with that ability now. In dungeons that may hurt a little, but I think that other issues will be much bigger.
The majority of the content that I do, both tanking and DPSing, are the vet DLCs. In that content tanks need solid DDs and support to be successful. The changes in the current patch notes will reduce the effectiveness of both.
Contrary to popular belief I have met some really cool people PUGing those. Often if you have a strong damage dealer and a good tank, you don't always have to worry about the other person's DPS quite as much. That line just shifted.
The people that are pushing higher numbers will press on with life. The fights will last a little longer, such is life. The people who were barely getting by or weren't quite there yet could find themselves less welcomed there.
I can see PUGs becoming less tolerant of low DPS or newer player. I can also see the "tank shortage" becoming worse.
As with most changes, we adapt. Some will by growing stronger, others will by avoiding the content. I feel like a change this drastic, whether or not it was called for, will be a source of frustration strong enough to see more people avoiding it simply because it was all dumped on us at one time.
1 -
paulsimonps✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Agenericname wrote: »Unless I'm reading it wrong, chains (silver leash) have been removed, so DKs are the only tank with that ability now. In dungeons that may hurt a little, but I think that other issues will be much bigger.
The majority of the content that I do, both tanking and DPSing, are the vet DLCs. In that content tanks need solid DDs and support to be successful. The changes in the current patch notes will reduce the effectiveness of both.
Contrary to popular belief I have met some really cool people PUGing those. Often if you have a strong damage dealer and a good tank, you don't always have to worry about the other person's DPS quite as much. That line just shifted.
The people that are pushing higher numbers will press on with life. The fights will last a little longer, such is life. The people who were barely getting by or weren't quite there yet could find themselves less welcomed there.
I can see PUGs becoming less tolerant of low DPS or newer player. I can also see the "tank shortage" becoming worse.
As with most changes, we adapt. Some will by growing stronger, others will by avoiding the content. I feel like a change this drastic, whether or not it was called for, will be a source of frustration strong enough to see more people avoiding it simply because it was all dumped on us at one time.
@Agenericname
Silver Leash is still the same they just increased the cost and reduced snare and damage.0 -
actosh✭✭✭✭✭I´m not overly concerned with the patch and i play most of the time my nb tank (yeah did it even when we had no silverleash and healed with the 15000 hots we have).
Constincrease on Shards, well ok, just have to deal with it, the increase isnt that big.
Path heal is doubled, so now it doesnt *** matter if i use path or circle from FG, will use none, just stick with cloak.
Power Extraction "could" be fun in pve, but need to do some trials on pts to see if it has any noticeable effect outside trashgroups.
Grim Focus Nerf: not concerning, used it just with elsweyr for a few weeks, and then used the spot for something more valueable.
Think ill go once again on backbar for destrostaff, cause the ammount of stam costing skills is ripping me apart ^^.0 -
BlueRaven✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭PSA: Many people seem to think play as you want means you get an "I win" button however you choose to play the game. Play as you want doesn't mean sword and board has to be competitive for DPS. You have options. Do less damage, or switch to another weapon and maybe even put on medium armour when not actually tanking.
And that has nothing to do with what I said, nor is what I advocated in this thread... I'm starting to think you people have trouble reading, or are feigning ignorance for the sake of trolling.
I never quoted anyone directly in my post, but clearly you felt targeted. I'll bite.
You literally stated earlier in this thread:
What does it matter that sword and board damage is nerfed for PvE? It was never meant to be a damage toolset. Not ever. It has always been a slow grind to kill anything stronger than those 1-shot critters with a sword and shield. In the mean time, you have options. Go medium armour and bow, or dual wield, or 2h, if you want to do overland content quickly. You don't even need to respec, that gear alone will give you more than enough damage. On the other hand, reduced s/b damage will probably help with the damage tank meta in PvP. In the end, how is diversity affected? You can still be a slow killer in PvE if you choose to be one, and in PvP people should be moving away from the one cookie-cutter build.Tanks will now take more time to kill stuff, because their already average damage got reduced even further for no reason. SnB got two skills heavily nerfed, while we got a single damage based shield skill and we can now spam our skills longer, since everything will take longer to kill!
GREAT CHANGES INDEED! YAY FOR DIVERSITY!
Yeah who cares about tank quality of life right? Doing quests, dailies, etc. They need to spend massive gold respeccing and getting new armor just to do a simple elsweyr quest. They should be doing hardly any damage as it is their punishment for being tanks./sarcasm
No one in PvE cared about tank damage. No one.
You know what happened in another game called World of Warcraft when they did this? They nerfed tanks like this and the result was longer waits for random dungeons because no one wanted to be a tank anymore. But who cares about stuff like that right?
And this is a double whammy because all of those tanks who were NOT DKS will be out of the pool as well.
YAY! More PvP balance •••• that negatively effects PvE. That is a song we keep hearing, right?6 -
DreadDaedroth✭✭✭✭✭
✭I agree, they made questing and all overland content from dolmens to dailies slower and slower and more boring for tanks only to appease PvP. (and it's silly to think sword and board it's only a defensive skill)0 -
MattT1988✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭But yeah, overland stuff is gonna be even more tedious as a tank, that's for sure.paulsimonps wrote: »Tanks will now take more time to kill stuff, because their already average damage got reduced even further for no reason. SnB got two skills heavily nerfed, while we got a single damage based shield skill and we can now spam our skills longer, since everything will take longer to kill!
GREAT CHANGES INDEED! YAY FOR DIVERSITY!
I mean I don't think they intend for people to do overworld content as a tank....PSA: Many people seem to think play as you want means you get an "I win" button however you choose to play the game. Play as you want doesn't mean sword and board has to be competitive for DPS. You have options. Do less damage, or switch to another weapon and maybe even put on medium armour when not actually tanking.
And that has nothing to do with what I said, nor is what I advocated in this thread... I'm starting to think you people have trouble reading, or are feigning ignorance for the sake of trolling.
I never quoted anyone directly in my post, but clearly you felt targeted. I'll bite.
You literally stated earlier in this thread:
What does it matter that sword and board damage is nerfed for PvE? It was never meant to be a damage toolset. Not ever. It has always been a slow grind to kill anything stronger than those 1-shot critters with a sword and shield. In the mean time, you have options. Go medium armour and bow, or dual wield, or 2h, if you want to do overland content quickly. You don't even need to respec, that gear alone will give you more than enough damage. On the other hand, reduced s/b damage will probably help with the damage tank meta in PvP. In the end, how is diversity affected? You can still be a slow killer in PvE if you choose to be one, and in PvP people should be moving away from the one cookie-cutter build.Tanks will now take more time to kill stuff, because their already average damage got reduced even further for no reason. SnB got two skills heavily nerfed, while we got a single damage based shield skill and we can now spam our skills longer, since everything will take longer to kill!
GREAT CHANGES INDEED! YAY FOR DIVERSITY!
Yeah who cares about tank quality of life right? Doing quests, dailies, etc. They need to spend massive gold respeccing and getting new armor just to do a simple elsweyr quest. They should be doing hardly any damage as it is their punishment for being tanks./sarcasm
No one in PvE cared about tank damage. No one.
You know what happened in another game called World of Warcraft when they did this? They nerfed tanks like this and the result was longer waits for random dungeons because no one wanted to be a tank anymore. But who cares about stuff like that right?
And this is a double whammy because all of those tanks who were NOT DKS will be out of the pool as well.
YAY! More PvP balance •••• that negatively effects PvE. That is a song we keep hearing, right?
I don’t know why people are doing overland in tank sets. Ridiculous. Just keep some Hundrings body pieces, some NMG weapons with green/blue NMG jewellery and Kra’ghs in your tanks inventory and switch to it when your questing. Don’t even need to change CP and your still overpowered for questing. Easy peasy.Edited by MattT1988 on July 20, 2019 8:37AM7 -
zaria✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
True, I just to put on some medium armor, set tank up so armor give health and a bit magic. in medium tank is pretty much an stamina build with high health. Yes low cp as cp is set up for tanking but works more than well enough for overland.paulsimonps wrote: »Tanks will now take more time to kill stuff, because their already average damage got reduced even further for no reason. SnB got two skills heavily nerfed, while we got a single damage based shield skill and we can now spam our skills longer, since everything will take longer to kill!
GREAT CHANGES INDEED! YAY FOR DIVERSITY!
I mean I don't think they intend for people to do overworld content as a tank....
Grinding just make you go in circles.
Asking ZoS for nerfs is as stupid as asking for close air support from the death star.0 -
BlueRaven✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭But yeah, overland stuff is gonna be even more tedious as a tank, that's for sure.paulsimonps wrote: »Tanks will now take more time to kill stuff, because their already average damage got reduced even further for no reason. SnB got two skills heavily nerfed, while we got a single damage based shield skill and we can now spam our skills longer, since everything will take longer to kill!
GREAT CHANGES INDEED! YAY FOR DIVERSITY!
I mean I don't think they intend for people to do overworld content as a tank....PSA: Many people seem to think play as you want means you get an "I win" button however you choose to play the game. Play as you want doesn't mean sword and board has to be competitive for DPS. You have options. Do less damage, or switch to another weapon and maybe even put on medium armour when not actually tanking.
And that has nothing to do with what I said, nor is what I advocated in this thread... I'm starting to think you people have trouble reading, or are feigning ignorance for the sake of trolling.
I never quoted anyone directly in my post, but clearly you felt targeted. I'll bite.
You literally stated earlier in this thread:
What does it matter that sword and board damage is nerfed for PvE? It was never meant to be a damage toolset. Not ever. It has always been a slow grind to kill anything stronger than those 1-shot critters with a sword and shield. In the mean time, you have options. Go medium armour and bow, or dual wield, or 2h, if you want to do overland content quickly. You don't even need to respec, that gear alone will give you more than enough damage. On the other hand, reduced s/b damage will probably help with the damage tank meta in PvP. In the end, how is diversity affected? You can still be a slow killer in PvE if you choose to be one, and in PvP people should be moving away from the one cookie-cutter build.Tanks will now take more time to kill stuff, because their already average damage got reduced even further for no reason. SnB got two skills heavily nerfed, while we got a single damage based shield skill and we can now spam our skills longer, since everything will take longer to kill!
GREAT CHANGES INDEED! YAY FOR DIVERSITY!
Yeah who cares about tank quality of life right? Doing quests, dailies, etc. They need to spend massive gold respeccing and getting new armor just to do a simple elsweyr quest. They should be doing hardly any damage as it is their punishment for being tanks./sarcasm
No one in PvE cared about tank damage. No one.
You know what happened in another game called World of Warcraft when they did this? They nerfed tanks like this and the result was longer waits for random dungeons because no one wanted to be a tank anymore. But who cares about stuff like that right?
And this is a double whammy because all of those tanks who were NOT DKS will be out of the pool as well.
YAY! More PvP balance •••• that negatively effects PvE. That is a song we keep hearing, right?
I don’t know why people are doing overland in tank sets. Ridiculous. Just keep some Hundrings body pieces, some NMG weapons with green/blue NMG jewellery and Kra’ghs in your tanks inventory and switch to it when your questing. Don’t even need to change CP and your still overpowered for questing. Easy peasy.
You should put that in the new player leveling guide.
“Here is the crazy amount of stuff you need to keep in your bags at all times. And keep in mind there is no mechanism for swapping armor and weapons automatically, so you will have to do so manually each time you want to do some actual tanking. Oh! And you will have to swap out you skills constantly too.... Or you can be a dps and do none of that.”
Hmmm, I wonder what players would choose?
All because some PvP players did not want to change a skill or two on their bar to act as a counter to a tank build. Wow, this is such a better solution!Edited by BlueRaven on July 20, 2019 11:04AM3 -
MattT1988✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭But yeah, overland stuff is gonna be even more tedious as a tank, that's for sure.paulsimonps wrote: »Tanks will now take more time to kill stuff, because their already average damage got reduced even further for no reason. SnB got two skills heavily nerfed, while we got a single damage based shield skill and we can now spam our skills longer, since everything will take longer to kill!
GREAT CHANGES INDEED! YAY FOR DIVERSITY!
I mean I don't think they intend for people to do overworld content as a tank....PSA: Many people seem to think play as you want means you get an "I win" button however you choose to play the game. Play as you want doesn't mean sword and board has to be competitive for DPS. You have options. Do less damage, or switch to another weapon and maybe even put on medium armour when not actually tanking.
And that has nothing to do with what I said, nor is what I advocated in this thread... I'm starting to think you people have trouble reading, or are feigning ignorance for the sake of trolling.
I never quoted anyone directly in my post, but clearly you felt targeted. I'll bite.
You literally stated earlier in this thread:
What does it matter that sword and board damage is nerfed for PvE? It was never meant to be a damage toolset. Not ever. It has always been a slow grind to kill anything stronger than those 1-shot critters with a sword and shield. In the mean time, you have options. Go medium armour and bow, or dual wield, or 2h, if you want to do overland content quickly. You don't even need to respec, that gear alone will give you more than enough damage. On the other hand, reduced s/b damage will probably help with the damage tank meta in PvP. In the end, how is diversity affected? You can still be a slow killer in PvE if you choose to be one, and in PvP people should be moving away from the one cookie-cutter build.Tanks will now take more time to kill stuff, because their already average damage got reduced even further for no reason. SnB got two skills heavily nerfed, while we got a single damage based shield skill and we can now spam our skills longer, since everything will take longer to kill!
GREAT CHANGES INDEED! YAY FOR DIVERSITY!
Yeah who cares about tank quality of life right? Doing quests, dailies, etc. They need to spend massive gold respeccing and getting new armor just to do a simple elsweyr quest. They should be doing hardly any damage as it is their punishment for being tanks./sarcasm
No one in PvE cared about tank damage. No one.
You know what happened in another game called World of Warcraft when they did this? They nerfed tanks like this and the result was longer waits for random dungeons because no one wanted to be a tank anymore. But who cares about stuff like that right?
And this is a double whammy because all of those tanks who were NOT DKS will be out of the pool as well.
YAY! More PvP balance •••• that negatively effects PvE. That is a song we keep hearing, right?
I don’t know why people are doing overland in tank sets. Ridiculous. Just keep some Hundrings body pieces, some NMG weapons with green/blue NMG jewellery and Kra’ghs in your tanks inventory and switch to it when your questing. Don’t even need to change CP and your still overpowered for questing. Easy peasy.
You should put that in the new player leveling guide.
“Here is the crazy amount of stuff you need to keep in your bags at all times. And keep in mind there is no mechanism for swapping armor and weapons automatically, so you will have to do so manually each time you want to do some actual tanking. Oh! And you will have to swap out you skills constantly too.... Or you can be a dps and do none of that.”
Hmmm, I wonder what players would choose?
All because some PvP players did not want to change a skill or two on their bar to act as a counter to a tank build. Wow, this is such a better solution!
It takes literally two minutes to switch it all around, and I’m on console. I think it’s even less for PC as they’ve got an add on for it. Also how often is a new player going to switch between the two? You quest in large chunks and if your doing more dungeons then your random normal and your pledges, you tend to do them back to back. Your excuse is a cop out.Edited by MattT1988 on July 20, 2019 11:25AM3 -
Skorro✭✭✭✭✭Tanks will now take more time to kill stuff, because their already average damage got reduced even further for no reason. SnB got two skills heavily nerfed, while we got a single damage based shield skill and we can now spam our skills longer, since everything will take longer to kill!
GREAT CHANGES INDEED! YAY FOR DIVERSITY!
Get the dressing room add-on for overland, can gear and skill swap with one button to get more damage to make it less tedious
1 -
BlueRaven✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭But yeah, overland stuff is gonna be even more tedious as a tank, that's for sure.paulsimonps wrote: »Tanks will now take more time to kill stuff, because their already average damage got reduced even further for no reason. SnB got two skills heavily nerfed, while we got a single damage based shield skill and we can now spam our skills longer, since everything will take longer to kill!
GREAT CHANGES INDEED! YAY FOR DIVERSITY!
I mean I don't think they intend for people to do overworld content as a tank....PSA: Many people seem to think play as you want means you get an "I win" button however you choose to play the game. Play as you want doesn't mean sword and board has to be competitive for DPS. You have options. Do less damage, or switch to another weapon and maybe even put on medium armour when not actually tanking.
And that has nothing to do with what I said, nor is what I advocated in this thread... I'm starting to think you people have trouble reading, or are feigning ignorance for the sake of trolling.
I never quoted anyone directly in my post, but clearly you felt targeted. I'll bite.
You literally stated earlier in this thread:
What does it matter that sword and board damage is nerfed for PvE? It was never meant to be a damage toolset. Not ever. It has always been a slow grind to kill anything stronger than those 1-shot critters with a sword and shield. In the mean time, you have options. Go medium armour and bow, or dual wield, or 2h, if you want to do overland content quickly. You don't even need to respec, that gear alone will give you more than enough damage. On the other hand, reduced s/b damage will probably help with the damage tank meta in PvP. In the end, how is diversity affected? You can still be a slow killer in PvE if you choose to be one, and in PvP people should be moving away from the one cookie-cutter build.Tanks will now take more time to kill stuff, because their already average damage got reduced even further for no reason. SnB got two skills heavily nerfed, while we got a single damage based shield skill and we can now spam our skills longer, since everything will take longer to kill!
GREAT CHANGES INDEED! YAY FOR DIVERSITY!
Yeah who cares about tank quality of life right? Doing quests, dailies, etc. They need to spend massive gold respeccing and getting new armor just to do a simple elsweyr quest. They should be doing hardly any damage as it is their punishment for being tanks./sarcasm
No one in PvE cared about tank damage. No one.
You know what happened in another game called World of Warcraft when they did this? They nerfed tanks like this and the result was longer waits for random dungeons because no one wanted to be a tank anymore. But who cares about stuff like that right?
And this is a double whammy because all of those tanks who were NOT DKS will be out of the pool as well.
YAY! More PvP balance •••• that negatively effects PvE. That is a song we keep hearing, right?
I don’t know why people are doing overland in tank sets. Ridiculous. Just keep some Hundrings body pieces, some NMG weapons with green/blue NMG jewellery and Kra’ghs in your tanks inventory and switch to it when your questing. Don’t even need to change CP and your still overpowered for questing. Easy peasy.
You should put that in the new player leveling guide.
“Here is the crazy amount of stuff you need to keep in your bags at all times. And keep in mind there is no mechanism for swapping armor and weapons automatically, so you will have to do so manually each time you want to do some actual tanking. Oh! And you will have to swap out you skills constantly too.... Or you can be a dps and do none of that.”
Hmmm, I wonder what players would choose?
All because some PvP players did not want to change a skill or two on their bar to act as a counter to a tank build. Wow, this is such a better solution!
It takes literally two minutes to switch it all around, and I’m on console. I think it’s even less for PC as they’ve got an add on for it. Also how often is a new player going to switch between the two? You quest in large chunks and if your doing more dungeons then your random normal and your pledges, you tend to do them back to back. Your excuse is a cop out.
Oh yeah. I can see it now all that inconvenience will be a real draw to playing tanks in the future.
What the real cop out is PvP players not putting counters on their bars. So instead they call for nerfs, not caring that they ruin the enjoyment of large swaths of other people.3 -
MattT1988✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭But yeah, overland stuff is gonna be even more tedious as a tank, that's for sure.paulsimonps wrote: »Tanks will now take more time to kill stuff, because their already average damage got reduced even further for no reason. SnB got two skills heavily nerfed, while we got a single damage based shield skill and we can now spam our skills longer, since everything will take longer to kill!
GREAT CHANGES INDEED! YAY FOR DIVERSITY!
I mean I don't think they intend for people to do overworld content as a tank....PSA: Many people seem to think play as you want means you get an "I win" button however you choose to play the game. Play as you want doesn't mean sword and board has to be competitive for DPS. You have options. Do less damage, or switch to another weapon and maybe even put on medium armour when not actually tanking.
And that has nothing to do with what I said, nor is what I advocated in this thread... I'm starting to think you people have trouble reading, or are feigning ignorance for the sake of trolling.
I never quoted anyone directly in my post, but clearly you felt targeted. I'll bite.
You literally stated earlier in this thread:
What does it matter that sword and board damage is nerfed for PvE? It was never meant to be a damage toolset. Not ever. It has always been a slow grind to kill anything stronger than those 1-shot critters with a sword and shield. In the mean time, you have options. Go medium armour and bow, or dual wield, or 2h, if you want to do overland content quickly. You don't even need to respec, that gear alone will give you more than enough damage. On the other hand, reduced s/b damage will probably help with the damage tank meta in PvP. In the end, how is diversity affected? You can still be a slow killer in PvE if you choose to be one, and in PvP people should be moving away from the one cookie-cutter build.Tanks will now take more time to kill stuff, because their already average damage got reduced even further for no reason. SnB got two skills heavily nerfed, while we got a single damage based shield skill and we can now spam our skills longer, since everything will take longer to kill!
GREAT CHANGES INDEED! YAY FOR DIVERSITY!
Yeah who cares about tank quality of life right? Doing quests, dailies, etc. They need to spend massive gold respeccing and getting new armor just to do a simple elsweyr quest. They should be doing hardly any damage as it is their punishment for being tanks./sarcasm
No one in PvE cared about tank damage. No one.
You know what happened in another game called World of Warcraft when they did this? They nerfed tanks like this and the result was longer waits for random dungeons because no one wanted to be a tank anymore. But who cares about stuff like that right?
And this is a double whammy because all of those tanks who were NOT DKS will be out of the pool as well.
YAY! More PvP balance •••• that negatively effects PvE. That is a song we keep hearing, right?
I don’t know why people are doing overland in tank sets. Ridiculous. Just keep some Hundrings body pieces, some NMG weapons with green/blue NMG jewellery and Kra’ghs in your tanks inventory and switch to it when your questing. Don’t even need to change CP and your still overpowered for questing. Easy peasy.
You should put that in the new player leveling guide.
“Here is the crazy amount of stuff you need to keep in your bags at all times. And keep in mind there is no mechanism for swapping armor and weapons automatically, so you will have to do so manually each time you want to do some actual tanking. Oh! And you will have to swap out you skills constantly too.... Or you can be a dps and do none of that.”
Hmmm, I wonder what players would choose?
All because some PvP players did not want to change a skill or two on their bar to act as a counter to a tank build. Wow, this is such a better solution!
It takes literally two minutes to switch it all around, and I’m on console. I think it’s even less for PC as they’ve got an add on for it. Also how often is a new player going to switch between the two? You quest in large chunks and if your doing more dungeons then your random normal and your pledges, you tend to do them back to back. Your excuse is a cop out.
Oh yeah. I can see it now all that inconvenience will be a real draw to playing tanks in the future.
What the real cop out is PvP players not putting counters on their bars. So instead they call for nerfs, not caring that they ruin the enjoyment of large swaths of other people.
If players aren’t willing to spend probably not even two minutes to switch some gear and skills around to make their hour or so of questing a lot easier then they’re just lazy and we shouldn’t cater to the lazy.
I can’t speak for the PvP side of things as I don’t PvP.3 -
BlueRaven✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭But yeah, overland stuff is gonna be even more tedious as a tank, that's for sure.paulsimonps wrote: »Tanks will now take more time to kill stuff, because their already average damage got reduced even further for no reason. SnB got two skills heavily nerfed, while we got a single damage based shield skill and we can now spam our skills longer, since everything will take longer to kill!
GREAT CHANGES INDEED! YAY FOR DIVERSITY!
I mean I don't think they intend for people to do overworld content as a tank....PSA: Many people seem to think play as you want means you get an "I win" button however you choose to play the game. Play as you want doesn't mean sword and board has to be competitive for DPS. You have options. Do less damage, or switch to another weapon and maybe even put on medium armour when not actually tanking.
And that has nothing to do with what I said, nor is what I advocated in this thread... I'm starting to think you people have trouble reading, or are feigning ignorance for the sake of trolling.
I never quoted anyone directly in my post, but clearly you felt targeted. I'll bite.
You literally stated earlier in this thread:
What does it matter that sword and board damage is nerfed for PvE? It was never meant to be a damage toolset. Not ever. It has always been a slow grind to kill anything stronger than those 1-shot critters with a sword and shield. In the mean time, you have options. Go medium armour and bow, or dual wield, or 2h, if you want to do overland content quickly. You don't even need to respec, that gear alone will give you more than enough damage. On the other hand, reduced s/b damage will probably help with the damage tank meta in PvP. In the end, how is diversity affected? You can still be a slow killer in PvE if you choose to be one, and in PvP people should be moving away from the one cookie-cutter build.Tanks will now take more time to kill stuff, because their already average damage got reduced even further for no reason. SnB got two skills heavily nerfed, while we got a single damage based shield skill and we can now spam our skills longer, since everything will take longer to kill!
GREAT CHANGES INDEED! YAY FOR DIVERSITY!
Yeah who cares about tank quality of life right? Doing quests, dailies, etc. They need to spend massive gold respeccing and getting new armor just to do a simple elsweyr quest. They should be doing hardly any damage as it is their punishment for being tanks./sarcasm
No one in PvE cared about tank damage. No one.
You know what happened in another game called World of Warcraft when they did this? They nerfed tanks like this and the result was longer waits for random dungeons because no one wanted to be a tank anymore. But who cares about stuff like that right?
And this is a double whammy because all of those tanks who were NOT DKS will be out of the pool as well.
YAY! More PvP balance •••• that negatively effects PvE. That is a song we keep hearing, right?
I don’t know why people are doing overland in tank sets. Ridiculous. Just keep some Hundrings body pieces, some NMG weapons with green/blue NMG jewellery and Kra’ghs in your tanks inventory and switch to it when your questing. Don’t even need to change CP and your still overpowered for questing. Easy peasy.
You should put that in the new player leveling guide.
“Here is the crazy amount of stuff you need to keep in your bags at all times. And keep in mind there is no mechanism for swapping armor and weapons automatically, so you will have to do so manually each time you want to do some actual tanking. Oh! And you will have to swap out you skills constantly too.... Or you can be a dps and do none of that.”
Hmmm, I wonder what players would choose?
All because some PvP players did not want to change a skill or two on their bar to act as a counter to a tank build. Wow, this is such a better solution!
It takes literally two minutes to switch it all around, and I’m on console. I think it’s even less for PC as they’ve got an add on for it. Also how often is a new player going to switch between the two? You quest in large chunks and if your doing more dungeons then your random normal and your pledges, you tend to do them back to back. Your excuse is a cop out.
Oh yeah. I can see it now all that inconvenience will be a real draw to playing tanks in the future.
What the real cop out is PvP players not putting counters on their bars. So instead they call for nerfs, not caring that they ruin the enjoyment of large swaths of other people.
If players aren’t willing to spend probably not even two minutes to switch some gear and skills around to make their hour or so of questing a lot easier then they’re just lazy and we shouldn’t cater to the lazy.
I can’t speak for the PvP side of things as I don’t PvP.
Oh yeah, asking for the same conveniences as everyone else is being TOTALLY lazy.
Oh and did tanks running around doing quests ruin your immersion?
Well, there will be less tanks now, so enjoy your super long wait times for dungeons! And remember, you wanted it!
Edit:I’ll support anything that makes ganking harder, so leave it as is please.
Spoken as a true non PvP player, I guess?Edited by BlueRaven on July 20, 2019 11:56AM0 -
MattT1988✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭But yeah, overland stuff is gonna be even more tedious as a tank, that's for sure.paulsimonps wrote: »Tanks will now take more time to kill stuff, because their already average damage got reduced even further for no reason. SnB got two skills heavily nerfed, while we got a single damage based shield skill and we can now spam our skills longer, since everything will take longer to kill!
GREAT CHANGES INDEED! YAY FOR DIVERSITY!
I mean I don't think they intend for people to do overworld content as a tank....PSA: Many people seem to think play as you want means you get an "I win" button however you choose to play the game. Play as you want doesn't mean sword and board has to be competitive for DPS. You have options. Do less damage, or switch to another weapon and maybe even put on medium armour when not actually tanking.
And that has nothing to do with what I said, nor is what I advocated in this thread... I'm starting to think you people have trouble reading, or are feigning ignorance for the sake of trolling.
I never quoted anyone directly in my post, but clearly you felt targeted. I'll bite.
You literally stated earlier in this thread:
What does it matter that sword and board damage is nerfed for PvE? It was never meant to be a damage toolset. Not ever. It has always been a slow grind to kill anything stronger than those 1-shot critters with a sword and shield. In the mean time, you have options. Go medium armour and bow, or dual wield, or 2h, if you want to do overland content quickly. You don't even need to respec, that gear alone will give you more than enough damage. On the other hand, reduced s/b damage will probably help with the damage tank meta in PvP. In the end, how is diversity affected? You can still be a slow killer in PvE if you choose to be one, and in PvP people should be moving away from the one cookie-cutter build.Tanks will now take more time to kill stuff, because their already average damage got reduced even further for no reason. SnB got two skills heavily nerfed, while we got a single damage based shield skill and we can now spam our skills longer, since everything will take longer to kill!
GREAT CHANGES INDEED! YAY FOR DIVERSITY!
Yeah who cares about tank quality of life right? Doing quests, dailies, etc. They need to spend massive gold respeccing and getting new armor just to do a simple elsweyr quest. They should be doing hardly any damage as it is their punishment for being tanks./sarcasm
No one in PvE cared about tank damage. No one.
You know what happened in another game called World of Warcraft when they did this? They nerfed tanks like this and the result was longer waits for random dungeons because no one wanted to be a tank anymore. But who cares about stuff like that right?
And this is a double whammy because all of those tanks who were NOT DKS will be out of the pool as well.
YAY! More PvP balance •••• that negatively effects PvE. That is a song we keep hearing, right?
I don’t know why people are doing overland in tank sets. Ridiculous. Just keep some Hundrings body pieces, some NMG weapons with green/blue NMG jewellery and Kra’ghs in your tanks inventory and switch to it when your questing. Don’t even need to change CP and your still overpowered for questing. Easy peasy.
You should put that in the new player leveling guide.
“Here is the crazy amount of stuff you need to keep in your bags at all times. And keep in mind there is no mechanism for swapping armor and weapons automatically, so you will have to do so manually each time you want to do some actual tanking. Oh! And you will have to swap out you skills constantly too.... Or you can be a dps and do none of that.”
Hmmm, I wonder what players would choose?
All because some PvP players did not want to change a skill or two on their bar to act as a counter to a tank build. Wow, this is such a better solution!
It takes literally two minutes to switch it all around, and I’m on console. I think it’s even less for PC as they’ve got an add on for it. Also how often is a new player going to switch between the two? You quest in large chunks and if your doing more dungeons then your random normal and your pledges, you tend to do them back to back. Your excuse is a cop out.
Oh yeah. I can see it now all that inconvenience will be a real draw to playing tanks in the future.
What the real cop out is PvP players not putting counters on their bars. So instead they call for nerfs, not caring that they ruin the enjoyment of large swaths of other people.
If players aren’t willing to spend probably not even two minutes to switch some gear and skills around to make their hour or so of questing a lot easier then they’re just lazy and we shouldn’t cater to the lazy.
I can’t speak for the PvP side of things as I don’t PvP.
Oh yeah, asking for the same conveniences as everyone else is being TOTALLY lazy.
Oh and did tanks running around doing quests ruin your immersion?
Well, there will be less tanks now, so enjoy your super long wait times for dungeons! And remember, you wanted it!
Edit:I’ll support anything that makes ganking harder, so leave it as is please.
Spoken as a true non PvP player, I guess?
LOL my main is a tank you potato.
Your acting like taking two minutes to switch gear and skills for a solid hour or so of questing is a game breaking inconvenience to people that will permanently put them off tanking? Dramatic much there drama queen?
As for the ganking post, I guess you missed the winky face? Tongue was firmly in cheek for that post. Besides, even non PvP players have to occasionally step into Cyrodiil or Battlegrounds to follow a zerg, repair walls or go 0 and 12 to get Vigor, Caltrops, Warhorn and Barrier. Nice try though champ.1 -
BlueRaven✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭But yeah, overland stuff is gonna be even more tedious as a tank, that's for sure.paulsimonps wrote: »Tanks will now take more time to kill stuff, because their already average damage got reduced even further for no reason. SnB got two skills heavily nerfed, while we got a single damage based shield skill and we can now spam our skills longer, since everything will take longer to kill!
GREAT CHANGES INDEED! YAY FOR DIVERSITY!
I mean I don't think they intend for people to do overworld content as a tank....PSA: Many people seem to think play as you want means you get an "I win" button however you choose to play the game. Play as you want doesn't mean sword and board has to be competitive for DPS. You have options. Do less damage, or switch to another weapon and maybe even put on medium armour when not actually tanking.
And that has nothing to do with what I said, nor is what I advocated in this thread... I'm starting to think you people have trouble reading, or are feigning ignorance for the sake of trolling.
I never quoted anyone directly in my post, but clearly you felt targeted. I'll bite.
You literally stated earlier in this thread:
What does it matter that sword and board damage is nerfed for PvE? It was never meant to be a damage toolset. Not ever. It has always been a slow grind to kill anything stronger than those 1-shot critters with a sword and shield. In the mean time, you have options. Go medium armour and bow, or dual wield, or 2h, if you want to do overland content quickly. You don't even need to respec, that gear alone will give you more than enough damage. On the other hand, reduced s/b damage will probably help with the damage tank meta in PvP. In the end, how is diversity affected? You can still be a slow killer in PvE if you choose to be one, and in PvP people should be moving away from the one cookie-cutter build.Tanks will now take more time to kill stuff, because their already average damage got reduced even further for no reason. SnB got two skills heavily nerfed, while we got a single damage based shield skill and we can now spam our skills longer, since everything will take longer to kill!
GREAT CHANGES INDEED! YAY FOR DIVERSITY!
Yeah who cares about tank quality of life right? Doing quests, dailies, etc. They need to spend massive gold respeccing and getting new armor just to do a simple elsweyr quest. They should be doing hardly any damage as it is their punishment for being tanks./sarcasm
No one in PvE cared about tank damage. No one.
You know what happened in another game called World of Warcraft when they did this? They nerfed tanks like this and the result was longer waits for random dungeons because no one wanted to be a tank anymore. But who cares about stuff like that right?
And this is a double whammy because all of those tanks who were NOT DKS will be out of the pool as well.
YAY! More PvP balance •••• that negatively effects PvE. That is a song we keep hearing, right?
I don’t know why people are doing overland in tank sets. Ridiculous. Just keep some Hundrings body pieces, some NMG weapons with green/blue NMG jewellery and Kra’ghs in your tanks inventory and switch to it when your questing. Don’t even need to change CP and your still overpowered for questing. Easy peasy.
You should put that in the new player leveling guide.
“Here is the crazy amount of stuff you need to keep in your bags at all times. And keep in mind there is no mechanism for swapping armor and weapons automatically, so you will have to do so manually each time you want to do some actual tanking. Oh! And you will have to swap out you skills constantly too.... Or you can be a dps and do none of that.”
Hmmm, I wonder what players would choose?
All because some PvP players did not want to change a skill or two on their bar to act as a counter to a tank build. Wow, this is such a better solution!
It takes literally two minutes to switch it all around, and I’m on console. I think it’s even less for PC as they’ve got an add on for it. Also how often is a new player going to switch between the two? You quest in large chunks and if your doing more dungeons then your random normal and your pledges, you tend to do them back to back. Your excuse is a cop out.
Oh yeah. I can see it now all that inconvenience will be a real draw to playing tanks in the future.
What the real cop out is PvP players not putting counters on their bars. So instead they call for nerfs, not caring that they ruin the enjoyment of large swaths of other people.
If players aren’t willing to spend probably not even two minutes to switch some gear and skills around to make their hour or so of questing a lot easier then they’re just lazy and we shouldn’t cater to the lazy.
I can’t speak for the PvP side of things as I don’t PvP.
Oh yeah, asking for the same conveniences as everyone else is being TOTALLY lazy.
Oh and did tanks running around doing quests ruin your immersion?
Well, there will be less tanks now, so enjoy your super long wait times for dungeons! And remember, you wanted it!
Edit:I’ll support anything that makes ganking harder, so leave it as is please.
Spoken as a true non PvP player, I guess?
LOL my main is a tank you potato.
Your acting like taking two minutes to switch gear and skills for a solid hour or so of questing is a game breaking inconvenience to people that will permanently put them off tanking? Dramatic much there drama queen?
As for the ganking post, I guess you missed the winky face? Tongue was firmly in cheek for that post. Besides, even non PvP players have to occasionally step into Cyrodiil or Battlegrounds to follow a zerg, repair walls or go 0 and 12 to get Vigor, Caltrops, Warhorn and Barrier. Nice try though champ.
Have fun in Helra as you do less damage to the welwas on the second boss, and have less aoes to help you out. And less heals.0 -
MattT1988✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭But yeah, overland stuff is gonna be even more tedious as a tank, that's for sure.paulsimonps wrote: »Tanks will now take more time to kill stuff, because their already average damage got reduced even further for no reason. SnB got two skills heavily nerfed, while we got a single damage based shield skill and we can now spam our skills longer, since everything will take longer to kill!
GREAT CHANGES INDEED! YAY FOR DIVERSITY!
I mean I don't think they intend for people to do overworld content as a tank....PSA: Many people seem to think play as you want means you get an "I win" button however you choose to play the game. Play as you want doesn't mean sword and board has to be competitive for DPS. You have options. Do less damage, or switch to another weapon and maybe even put on medium armour when not actually tanking.
And that has nothing to do with what I said, nor is what I advocated in this thread... I'm starting to think you people have trouble reading, or are feigning ignorance for the sake of trolling.
I never quoted anyone directly in my post, but clearly you felt targeted. I'll bite.
You literally stated earlier in this thread:
What does it matter that sword and board damage is nerfed for PvE? It was never meant to be a damage toolset. Not ever. It has always been a slow grind to kill anything stronger than those 1-shot critters with a sword and shield. In the mean time, you have options. Go medium armour and bow, or dual wield, or 2h, if you want to do overland content quickly. You don't even need to respec, that gear alone will give you more than enough damage. On the other hand, reduced s/b damage will probably help with the damage tank meta in PvP. In the end, how is diversity affected? You can still be a slow killer in PvE if you choose to be one, and in PvP people should be moving away from the one cookie-cutter build.Tanks will now take more time to kill stuff, because their already average damage got reduced even further for no reason. SnB got two skills heavily nerfed, while we got a single damage based shield skill and we can now spam our skills longer, since everything will take longer to kill!
GREAT CHANGES INDEED! YAY FOR DIVERSITY!
Yeah who cares about tank quality of life right? Doing quests, dailies, etc. They need to spend massive gold respeccing and getting new armor just to do a simple elsweyr quest. They should be doing hardly any damage as it is their punishment for being tanks./sarcasm
No one in PvE cared about tank damage. No one.
You know what happened in another game called World of Warcraft when they did this? They nerfed tanks like this and the result was longer waits for random dungeons because no one wanted to be a tank anymore. But who cares about stuff like that right?
And this is a double whammy because all of those tanks who were NOT DKS will be out of the pool as well.
YAY! More PvP balance •••• that negatively effects PvE. That is a song we keep hearing, right?
I don’t know why people are doing overland in tank sets. Ridiculous. Just keep some Hundrings body pieces, some NMG weapons with green/blue NMG jewellery and Kra’ghs in your tanks inventory and switch to it when your questing. Don’t even need to change CP and your still overpowered for questing. Easy peasy.
You should put that in the new player leveling guide.
“Here is the crazy amount of stuff you need to keep in your bags at all times. And keep in mind there is no mechanism for swapping armor and weapons automatically, so you will have to do so manually each time you want to do some actual tanking. Oh! And you will have to swap out you skills constantly too.... Or you can be a dps and do none of that.”
Hmmm, I wonder what players would choose?
All because some PvP players did not want to change a skill or two on their bar to act as a counter to a tank build. Wow, this is such a better solution!
It takes literally two minutes to switch it all around, and I’m on console. I think it’s even less for PC as they’ve got an add on for it. Also how often is a new player going to switch between the two? You quest in large chunks and if your doing more dungeons then your random normal and your pledges, you tend to do them back to back. Your excuse is a cop out.
Oh yeah. I can see it now all that inconvenience will be a real draw to playing tanks in the future.
What the real cop out is PvP players not putting counters on their bars. So instead they call for nerfs, not caring that they ruin the enjoyment of large swaths of other people.
If players aren’t willing to spend probably not even two minutes to switch some gear and skills around to make their hour or so of questing a lot easier then they’re just lazy and we shouldn’t cater to the lazy.
I can’t speak for the PvP side of things as I don’t PvP.
Oh yeah, asking for the same conveniences as everyone else is being TOTALLY lazy.
Oh and did tanks running around doing quests ruin your immersion?
Well, there will be less tanks now, so enjoy your super long wait times for dungeons! And remember, you wanted it!
Edit:I’ll support anything that makes ganking harder, so leave it as is please.
Spoken as a true non PvP player, I guess?
LOL my main is a tank you potato.
Your acting like taking two minutes to switch gear and skills for a solid hour or so of questing is a game breaking inconvenience to people that will permanently put them off tanking? Dramatic much there drama queen?
As for the ganking post, I guess you missed the winky face? Tongue was firmly in cheek for that post. Besides, even non PvP players have to occasionally step into Cyrodiil or Battlegrounds to follow a zerg, repair walls or go 0 and 12 to get Vigor, Caltrops, Warhorn and Barrier. Nice try though champ.
Have fun in Helra as you do less damage to the welwas on the second boss, and have less aoes to help you out. And less heals.
Won’t even be noticeable in Hel Ra LOL.0 -
The_Old_Goat✭✭✭✭✭
✭I'm not sure why everyone keeps saying dps is getting nerfed when we're seeing parses in the mid to high 90k range.3 -
Wifeaggro13✭✭✭✭✭
✭paulsimonps wrote: »Tanks will now take more time to kill stuff, because their already average damage got reduced even further for no reason. SnB got two skills heavily nerfed, while we got a single damage based shield skill and we can now spam our skills longer, since everything will take longer to kill!
GREAT CHANGES INDEED! YAY FOR DIVERSITY!
I mean I don't think they intend for people to do overworld content as a tank....
No they intend the whole game to be done as dps. The only variable is how good you are and how well you can exploit a bug the turned into a feature. Eso has never been a very good MMO it's a fairly decent action rpg.0
