A request for ZOS to review Pirate Skeleton

PureEnvelope35 · July 2019

I think people defending these broken sets every patch on forums for the past 4/5 years gave me erectile dysfunction, someone send help please ;_;

brandonv516 · July 2019

PureEnvelope35 wrote: »

I think people defending these broken sets every patch on forums for the past 4/5 years gave me erectile dysfunction, someone send help please ;_;

The Lusty Argonian Maid should help with that.

Trian94 · July 2019

Lord-Otto wrote: »

Trian94 wrote: »

Lord-Otto wrote: »

templesus wrote: »

Emma_Overload wrote: »

templesus wrote: »

I also wear it on everything, and can confirm, this set needs to be outright removed from the game it’s so broken.

Wait... is the SET broken, or is Major Protection broken? Because nerfing this set just to leave Major Protection in the hands of a few favored builds doesn't seem like a very good or balanced solution.

What if Major Protection was only 20%, would this set still be a problem?

Major protection from any source is broken. There exists only one source of Major Protection’s counter in the game, Major Vulnerability, and it lies behind a pay wall and 225 ultimate. This is not what you call balance, every source of Major Protection should have exactly one counter source of Vulnerability and vice versa. The reason it’s EXTREMELY broken on pirate is the high uptime as well as the fact that you are only sacrificing a 2pc, not an entire 5pc set.

The 3k of each resistances is icing on the cake.

That's why the Minor Defile is there.

Are you that clueless Otto? Minor defile can be bypassed with cp and major mending/vitality which you can get super easily. Also a class with good healing abilities and minor mending (aka magplar) can ignore the minor defile. Not even gonna talk about magblades.

You can not bypass Minor Defile with CP. You can only pump your healing so it's sufficient enough, but it is still weaker than without the defile.
Major Mending and Vitality are not easy to come by for every class. And again, your healing is even better without the defile on you when you have vitality and mending up.
No, I'm not clueless. I'm pointing out the flawed details in your argumentation you'd like to sweep under the rug.

If you're defending pirate skeleton claiming it's not overpowered, you're probably clueless at this game

Glory · July 2019

Reminder to do our best to discuss the set without resorting to insults

Trian94 · July 2019

Glory wrote: »

Reminder to do our best to discuss the set without resorting to insults

Oh I didn't mean to insult anyone. Being a noob isn't bad.

But people shouldn't defend op sets just because they make their class overperform. They should look to fight for appropriate class balance than defend a game breaking, crutch set.

Yiko · July 2019

Liam12548 wrote: »

Totally agree this set needs to be adjusted. The healing debuff is not at all in line with the amount of mitigation this set provides, especially on classes that rely less on healing and more on damage shields for survivability. Classes like magblade, magplar, and magnecro become flat out unkillable in 1v1s with ease will wearing this set. It basically converts any build into a full on tank.

Absolutely agree. The 30% Major Protection from the 2 piece is worth around... 19k-20k resists? There's no way that the Minor Defile is enough of an impairment to balance this level of mitigation, especially considering how much you can boost your healing with passives + CP and how much surplus healing builds have modernly.

I tried this set for the first time a couple of weeks back and was absolutely disgusted in how effective it was defensively, particularly when paired with shields like Healing Ward. If I had vBRP resto staff, too.. Yeah, I feel like it's safe to say that this set is overperforming.

Major Protection itself might need a reduction.
The Pirate Skeleton effect isn't clear in PVP environments due to Costumes/Disguises.
Uptime is probably too high.

templesus · July 2019

Nerf it into the ground. Plz and ty.

evoniee · July 2019

rarely see this set in pc eu, more like everyone that beat me never use this set

Cinbri · July 2019

Set has ~80% uptime of strongest major buff in pvp unlike Daedric Trickery and has most universal proc condition of proc from all sources of damage, dont have "range" restriction to be proced like Malubeth; can be proced passively unlike Hero. With drawback of having debuff that will be on you in most of serious fights anyway and since minor defiles cant stack - allowing to ignore enemy debuff.
It like old OP Malubeth combined with Hero + Daedric Trickery.

brandonv516 · July 2019

The set is fine for now.

I see a lot of people who call themselves solo and small scale players who want this nerfed, yet this set is one of the reasons magicka players can compete in those venues.

Those players have an agenda and my opinion is that theirs is of a stamina-leaning mindset. That's why you need people to have their own agenda favoring the opposition.

The ball groups and zergs benefit least from this set because it's selfish and doesn't promote group play.

If anything create more sources of Major Protection as they are doing with such buffs like Major Evasion and Major Expedition.

templesus · July 2019

brandonv516 wrote: »

The set is fine for now.

I see a lot of people who call themselves solo and small scale players who want this nerfed, yet this set is one of the reasons magicka players can compete in those venues.

Those players have an agenda and my opinion is that theirs is of a stamina-leaning mindset. That's why you need people to have their own agenda favoring the opposition.

The ball groups and zergs benefit least from this set because it's selfish and doesn't promote group play.

If anything create more sources of Major Protection as they are doing with such buffs like Major Evasion and Major Expedition.

Lol seriously? Where are these people coming from?

maxjapank · July 2019

templesus wrote: »

brandonv516 wrote: »

The set is fine for now.

I see a lot of people who call themselves solo and small scale players who want this nerfed, yet this set is one of the reasons magicka players can compete in those venues.

Those players have an agenda and my opinion is that theirs is of a stamina-leaning mindset. That's why you need people to have their own agenda favoring the opposition.

The ball groups and zergs benefit least from this set because it's selfish and doesn't promote group play.

If anything create more sources of Major Protection as they are doing with such buffs like Major Evasion and Major Expedition.

Lol seriously? Where are these people coming from?

Nothing wrong with the set. Was already nerfed twice, once making the defile unpurgeable and then again by only activating on dmg so shield users couldn’t get an extraordinary powerful shield. Monster sets are supposed to be powerful and unique. Rather than asking for nerfs, you should be asking for buffs on unused monster sets. Asking for nerfs is so silly. All your doing is channeling everyone into using Bloodspawn basically. Or a 2 piece separate mitigation set just taking advantage of one piece bonuses. And speaking of Bloodspawn, one could argue that the Ulti return is too much. So....let’s ask for more variety from monster sets rather than nerfing the already valuable ones.

Wihuri · July 2019

maxjapank wrote: »

Nothing wrong with the set. Was already nerfed twice, once making the defile unpurgeable and then again by only activating on dmg so shield users couldn’t get an extraordinary powerful shield. Monster sets are supposed to be powerful and unique. Rather than asking for nerfs, you should be asking for buffs on unused monster sets. Asking for nerfs is so silly. All your doing is channeling everyone into using Bloodspawn basically. Or a 2 piece separate mitigation set just taking advantage of one piece bonuses. And speaking of Bloodspawn, one could argue that the Ulti return is too much. So....let’s ask for more variety from monster sets rather than nerfing the already valuable ones.

When comparing pirate skeleton to bloodspawn, you are comparing increased resistances to major protection. Thing is you can bypass/decrease resistances, but major protection you cannot except for oblivion damage as far as I understand. So pirate skeleton provides way more defense than bloodspawn by just investing in a 2-piece set. I do agree with you that bloodspawn ultimate generation is a bit too strong. That or the resistance amount. I think overall stacking resistances is too easy. Anyhow combined proc effect is very strong.

killingspreeb16_ESO · July 2019

brandonv516 wrote: »

The set is fine for now.

I see a lot of people who call themselves solo and small scale players who want this nerfed, yet this set is one of the reasons magicka players can compete in those venues.

Those players have an agenda and my opinion is that theirs is of a stamina-leaning mindset. That's why you need people to have their own agenda favoring the opposition.

The ball groups and zergs benefit least from this set because it's selfish and doesn't promote group play.

If anything create more sources of Major Protection as they are doing with such buffs like Major Evasion and Major Expedition.

So first we complain about tank meta and then we ask for more source of major protection?one of the strongest buff?

maxjapank · July 2019

Wihuri wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

Nothing wrong with the set. Was already nerfed twice, once making the defile unpurgeable and then again by only activating on dmg so shield users couldn’t get an extraordinary powerful shield. Monster sets are supposed to be powerful and unique. Rather than asking for nerfs, you should be asking for buffs on unused monster sets. Asking for nerfs is so silly. All your doing is channeling everyone into using Bloodspawn basically. Or a 2 piece separate mitigation set just taking advantage of one piece bonuses. And speaking of Bloodspawn, one could argue that the Ulti return is too much. So....let’s ask for more variety from monster sets rather than nerfing the already valuable ones.

When comparing pirate skeleton to bloodspawn, you are comparing increased resistances to major protection. Thing is you can bypass/decrease resistances, but major protection you cannot except for oblivion damage as far as I understand. So pirate skeleton provides way more defense than bloodspawn by just investing in a 2-piece set. I do agree with you that bloodspawn ultimate generation is a bit too strong. That or the resistance amount. I think overall stacking resistances is too easy. Anyhow combined proc effect is very strong.

It does look stronger. But one guy said mathematically, Bloodspawn beats Pirate. I suck at math so I can’t back that up. Maybe you know the math? Anyways, Pirate does have the minor defile and while you could purge other sources of minor defile, you cannot Purge this. It is on you the full duration, which many tend to overlook. But as I said, let’s work on buffing other monster sets rather than nerfing the few that are actually useful.

Massacre_Wurm · July 2019

Sure. Who cares about minor/major protection being the only way to make somewhat tanky build in non-cp environment ?
Lets neft it for convenience of cp players.

UndeniablyAVG · July 2019

Using this set without the disguise is terrible. It causes terrible bar swap lag which makes me to die more often than if I didn't have the set on! I wear the disguise to combat that, not to hide the proc from you.

If they are going to stop the disguises hiding the proc then they need to fix the lag caused by the transformation.

I do agree that this set is overperforming, but I'm selfish and hope it stays that way.

Sharee · July 2019

UndeniablyAVG wrote: »

Using this set without the disguise is terrible. It causes terrible bar swap lag which makes me to die more often than if I didn't have the set on! I wear the disguise to combat that, not to hide the proc from you.

If they are going to stop the disguises hiding the proc then they need to fix the lag caused by the transformation.

I do agree that this set is overperforming, but I'm selfish and hope it stays that way.

Funny fact: the skeleton disguise does not actually hide the proc.

My necromancer is a khajiit, and whenever PS procs, the skeleton grows a tail

leepalmer95 · July 2019

Massacre_Wurm wrote: »

Sure. Who cares about minor/major protection being the only way to make somewhat tanky build in non-cp environment ?
Lets neft it for convenience of cp players.

Well in non cp pirate is a set that lets you build quite tanky and still do good dmg/ heals. Which shouldn't be a thing.

If anything its a enabler to cp like broken builds.

If you want to build a tank in non cp you can, just don't expect to turn around and ult dump ppl after it and wipe everything.

Qbiken · July 2019

Massacre_Wurm wrote: »

Sure. Who cares about minor/major protection being the only way to make somewhat tanky build in non-cp environment ?
Lets neft it for convenience of cp players.

If you're a magbuild with pirate skeleton + blackrose resto in a no-cp environment, you're basically roleplaying cp levels of survivability.

Pirate Skeleton (and blackrose resto) needs to be gutted completely.

Massacre_Wurm · July 2019

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Massacre_Wurm wrote: »

Sure. Who cares about minor/major protection being the only way to make somewhat tanky build in non-cp environment ?
Lets neft it for convenience of cp players.

Well in non cp pirate is a set that lets you build quite tanky and still do good dmg/ heals. Which shouldn't be a thing.

If anything its a enabler to cp like broken builds.

If you want to build a tank in non cp you can, just don't expect to turn around and ult dump ppl after it and wipe everything.

Which shouldn't be a thing ? Are you serious ? Why do you even want to do this if you cant offer healing/control/utility/decent damage to the group ? Just build tanky for the sake of being tanky ? And then what ?

Peekachu99 · July 2019

If the argument is that we start removing tanky sets from the game—which most opposed to PS seem to be making—then we’re left with a very boring “who shoots first” glass cannon meta. I’d rather not, thanks. The only way sets like this should be tuned is if we severely nerf the damage output to compensate for overall defensive capabilities being lessened. But I guarantee most of the anti-PS brigade don’t want that. You have to remember that there are so many people who play this game and not all—or even many—want what you want in this rather small echo-chamber.

I quite like the diversity that tankiness and sustain builds bring to the game. I’d rather they add or enhance other sets before going the nerf route, which usually leaves sets overly-stripped and relegated to gathering dust.

Massacre_Wurm · July 2019

Qbiken wrote: »

Massacre_Wurm wrote: »

Sure. Who cares about minor/major protection being the only way to make somewhat tanky build in non-cp environment ?
Lets neft it for convenience of cp players.

If you're a magbuild with pirate skeleton + blackrose resto in a no-cp environment, you're basically roleplaying cp levels of survivability.

Pirate Skeleton (and blackrose resto) needs to be gutted completely.

Sure, together with proc damage sets roleplaying cp level of damage.

Ivan04 · July 2019

I'm here to agree that PS needs to be addressed, plus I'd vouch to review all of the monster sets and bring up weaker ones (particularly Domihaus, Nerieneth, Sellistrix and Spawn of Mephala).

wheem_ESO · July 2019

UndeniablyAVG wrote: »

Using this set without the disguise is terrible. It causes terrible bar swap lag which makes me to die more often than if I didn't have the set on! I wear the disguise to combat that, not to hide the proc from you.

If they are going to stop the disguises hiding the proc then they need to fix the lag caused by the transformation.

I do agree that this set is overperforming, but I'm selfish and hope it stays that way.

Yea, the bar swap failures caused by the Pirate Skeleton proc are by far my #1 source of nerd rage in ESO. But without that set, it feels like many magicka builds just don't have the survivability necessary to be competitive in no-CP. You have to be tanky when mobility/damage avoidance isn't a realistic option, and Pirate Skeleton is the best way to get some durability while also having enough damage (and hopefully sustain) to not be worthless.

Like I said before, I'm fine with Pirate Skeleton being nerfed, but not before there are other improvements for survivability available to some magicka builds. They could even leave Pirate Skeleton in to fill that void, as long as it's done right (ie, not simply gutting the uptime on Major Protection, but changing it to something else instead).

brandonv516 · July 2019

templesus wrote: »

brandonv516 wrote: »

The set is fine for now.

I see a lot of people who call themselves solo and small scale players who want this nerfed, yet this set is one of the reasons magicka players can compete in those venues.

Those players have an agenda and my opinion is that theirs is of a stamina-leaning mindset. That's why you need people to have their own agenda favoring the opposition.

The ball groups and zergs benefit least from this set because it's selfish and doesn't promote group play.

If anything create more sources of Major Protection as they are doing with such buffs like Major Evasion and Major Expedition.

Lol seriously? Where are these people coming from?

Pirate Skeleton is fine.

Ethardt · July 2019

Unbalanced. Please rework.
(less uptime or minor protec,...)

Derra · July 2019

Qbiken wrote: »

Massacre_Wurm wrote: »

Sure. Who cares about minor/major protection being the only way to make somewhat tanky build in non-cp environment ?
Lets neft it for convenience of cp players.

If you're a magbuild with pirate skeleton + blackrose resto in a no-cp environment, you're basically roleplaying cp levels of survivability.

Pirate Skeleton (and blackrose resto) needs to be gutted completely.

Blackrose DW is totally fine though. Nothing to see there. Completely balanced. One might even say irrelevant. Move on people.

Sharee · July 2019

Ethardt wrote: »

Unbalanced. Please rework.
(less uptime or minor protec,...)

So youll get a set that reduces incoming damage by 15% at the cost of reducing incoming healing by 15%. At this point, you might as well save yourself the trouble and not wear anything.

Strider__Roshin · July 2019

Emma_Overload wrote: »

There are other sources of Major Protection that are even more reliable than this set. Why are so many people hellbent on nerfing it? If it is so good, why aren't YOU using it?

OP said they are....