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Evasion (base morph of Shuffle) - 5.1.0 - Major Expedition Too Much
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templesus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yeah, direct AOE damage sounds good to me. I felt bad dueling a Stam Sorc on PTS and having perma-mobility. Although this would still be a form of passive mobility which you’ve stated you don’t think should exist, so in that case, I’d say Expedition on cast.Edited by templesus on July 11, 2019 1:53AM0 -
Abhaya✭✭✭✭JusticeSouldier wrote: »I think having it only proc on direct AOE and not ground based or DOT AOE is a good suggestion. That or have it proc on something else that isn’t just laying around all over the battlefield in pretty much every PVP scenario. If they want it to have a proc condition rather than on cast there are a ton of options. Proc on breaking out of CC. Proc on removing / dodging out of an immobilize. Proc on actively using the skill when a snare is already applied to you. Proc on receiving a certain amount or % of damage in a small window. Proc on getting hit by more than one enemy within a window. I could keep going on. That being said evasion desperately needed a buff and the days of permanent snare templar and warden balls in battlegrounds is soon to be over. *laughs in stam sorc*
It should. not. proc. expedition at all. in any fkking scenario.
Medium gives very nice mobility with passives.
Immunity to snares gives u a counter to all roots and snares.
Major Evasion gives u really huge aoe mitigation.
Overenouch af
Fkk expedition.
And 5-7 seconds immunity is too much also.
Max immunity time should not be more than 4 seconds.
We already had 8 seconds Forward momentum...Only thing which saved gameplay was - only Wardens had alternative to Rally as a burst heal with a general much less healing potential at all stamina classes than now. Before buffs.
I wish that Zenimax team member who is responsible for this to join Wrobel's new job place.
The mobility that you say medium has doesn’t currently exist. The only thing it has is sprint speed which is only useful for running away and has zero impact on actual combat. If the major expedition has to go then it needs to keep the snare immunity and the other morph needs something else. Casting shuffle every 3 seconds in it’s current version isn’t viable.Abhaya - PC NA - Ebonheart Pact
Stam Sorc 2-Hand / Bow Build: https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=1691032 -
ZarkingFrued✭✭✭✭✭
✭From a PVP perspective, I am very happy in general with this PTS' patch notes. ZOS is pushing the game back in the direction of active gameplay rather than passive gameplay, taking significant strides to widen the gap between the skill floor and skill ceiling for the first time in a years. There are some lingering concerns (pun intended), such as healing and mitigation remaining too impactful, but the concern I want to touch on here is Evasion's Major Expedition.
Changes are as follows:Evasion: Reduced the base cost of this ability to 3213 from 3672. Also added a new function if you are hit with an Area of Effect attack while the ability is active, you gain Major Expedition for 2 seconds.
Elude (morph): Each piece of Medium Armor now increases the duration of the Major Evasion by 2 seconds, up from 1 second. Elude also increases the duration of the Major Expedition, but only by 1 second per piece of Medium Armor.
Shuffle (morph): Increased the snare and immobilization immunity granted per piece of Medium Armor worn to 1 second from 0.5 seconds.
Reducing the cost of the ability and doubling the effectiveness of the snare/root immunity was a massive buff and much needed for the underrepresented Medium Armor users. However, the Major Expedition for 2 seconds (on Shuffle; 7-9 seconds on Elude) on taking Area of Effect damage is superfluous, its implementation will be awkward, and by design it is not in the spirit of this patch's overarching changes emphasizing active gameplay.
Imagine a Templar wanting to use Jabs on someone who has recently used Shuffle. Not only does your AoE damage from Jabs get reduced.. not only do you NOT snare the target.. you actually BUFF your target with Major Expedition for 2 seconds. A Sorc using Hurricane on top of someone using Shuffle? Perma-Major Expedition. Proc sets like Grothdarr or Auroran? Major Expedition. Do YOU want Major Expedition? Run through some Caltrops! Awkward and counterintuitive design. This game is littered with AOE in the current meta, and as a result, uptime on Major Expedition will predictably be ridiculous. The fact that it's triggered passively is not in line with the thoughtful, active gameplay that the rest of this patch's changes are attempting to encourage. It is too powerful a buff to be given out for basically free. That is why it has been made so scarce in the recent past. Medium Armor users should not be rewarded with a powerful mobility (and therefore survivability) buff UNCONSCIOUSLY when they are hit by opponents who are using their kits/builds as designed.
If there is to be any uncontrolled movement speed at all, one solution could be that the movement speed is reduced and given a longer duration, like how the Wood Elf passive was treated (it was changed from 20% move speed to 10% move speed increase with an extended duration). For example, on taking AoE damage, Evasion and morphs could give Minor Expedition (or an unnamed 10% move speed buff) for 6 seconds. This reduces the potency of what would amount to absurd passive mobility while still granting value to Medium Armor users spread out over a longer duration. On top of that, this will allow Medium Armor users who have OTHER (read: active) sources of Major Expedition an opportunity to further specialize in their niche of mobility. This would result in more thoughtful, active gameplay from Medium Armor users and would also be less awkward and frustrating to play against for many opponents of said Medium Armor users.
What are your thoughts?
Good changes. If everyone wears heavy, give an actual real reason to go medium in pvp3 -
WreckfulAbandon✭✭✭✭✭
✭If Jabs are going to provide Major Expedition to medium builds then the least ZOS can do is have the single target damage component of the skill not be effected by Major Evasion.PC NA
All my comments are regarding PvP1 -
akray21✭✭✭✭✭Yeah, direct AOE damage sounds good to me. I felt bad dueling a Stam Sorc on PTS and having perma-mobility. Although this would still be a form of passive mobility which you’ve stated you don’t think should exist, so in that case, I’d say Expedition on cast.
This is a big indirect nerf to stamsorc when fighting anyone in medium armor, which will now be meta for stamina. Good luck running 2H/dizzy on stamsorc when you are giving every stam player major expedition while they are in your hurricane. Hurricane was meant to give stamsorc greater mobility, but now it's a buff for the enemy.
If the evasion change stays and gives major expedition then hurricane needs a buff. They could have hurricane grant major expedition (on top of minor expedition) for 2 seconds when the ability hits an enemy to offset the enemy expedition.
@ZOS_GilliamEdited by akray21 on July 11, 2019 5:10PM0 -
Abhaya✭✭✭✭Yeah, direct AOE damage sounds good to me. I felt bad dueling a Stam Sorc on PTS and having perma-mobility. Although this would still be a form of passive mobility which you’ve stated you don’t think should exist, so in that case, I’d say Expedition on cast.
It would be the same since hurricane is considered direct damage for some reason.
Abhaya - PC NA - Ebonheart Pact
Stam Sorc 2-Hand / Bow Build: https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=1691032 -
universal_wrath✭✭✭✭✭Me: use hurricane.
Enemy: use shuffle.
Me: oh boy, try to run away from in other direction.
Enemy: gets hit by hurricane.
Me: starts sprinting, hurricane gets bigger"fear intensify"
Enemy: get hit by hurricane "starts laugh"
Me: oh no... hurricane gets bigger again"fear intensify"
Enemy: preping for excuate "laugh intensify"
Me: Dead
Enemy: T-bag3 -
JusticeSouldier✭✭✭✭
The mobility that you say medium has doesn’t currently exist. The only thing it has is sprint speed which is only useful for running away and has zero impact on actual combat. If the major expedition has to go then it needs to keep the snare immunity and the other morph needs something else. Casting shuffle every 3 seconds in it’s current version isn’t viable.
it's your l2p issue.
in reality medium gives cool mobility.
And on PTS immunity is too long - expedition on the top makes this skill absolutly stupidly overpowered.Edited by JusticeSouldier on July 11, 2019 5:28PMall classes. pc platform, dissapointed.1 -
akray21✭✭✭✭✭JusticeSouldier wrote: »
The mobility that you say medium has doesn’t currently exist. The only thing it has is sprint speed which is only useful for running away and has zero impact on actual combat. If the major expedition has to go then it needs to keep the snare immunity and the other morph needs something else. Casting shuffle every 3 seconds in it’s current version isn’t viable.
it's your l2p issue.
in reality medium gives cool mobility.
And on PTS immunity is too long - expedition on the top makes this skill absolutly stupidly overpowered.
The immunity is fine, the major expedition is not. IMO.0 -
JusticeSouldier✭✭✭✭JusticeSouldier wrote: »
The mobility that you say medium has doesn’t currently exist. The only thing it has is sprint speed which is only useful for running away and has zero impact on actual combat. If the major expedition has to go then it needs to keep the snare immunity and the other morph needs something else. Casting shuffle every 3 seconds in it’s current version isn’t viable.
it's your l2p issue.
in reality medium gives cool mobility.
And on PTS immunity is too long - expedition on the top makes this skill absolutly stupidly overpowered.
The immunity is fine, the major expedition is not. IMO.
its a big question for who it's fine.
if u play only stamina in medium - ofc fine, for u subjective like.
but when u changed build to heavy or will play in light or heavy on another class - u will say "wtf, why whole part of the game mechanics doesn't touch these guys? why it cost so cheap in trade for endless duration? what for snares and roots exist in this game iif u can't use them at all?"
Think perspective.
P.s: I'm stamina fun personally. And mostly in medium even now. And these changes make Shuffle too OP.Edited by JusticeSouldier on July 11, 2019 5:38PMall classes. pc platform, dissapointed.0 -
Abhaya✭✭✭✭JusticeSouldier wrote: »
The mobility that you say medium has doesn’t currently exist. The only thing it has is sprint speed which is only useful for running away and has zero impact on actual combat. If the major expedition has to go then it needs to keep the snare immunity and the other morph needs something else. Casting shuffle every 3 seconds in it’s current version isn’t viable.
it's your l2p issue.
in reality medium gives cool mobility.
And on PTS immunity is too long - expedition on the top makes this skill absolutly stupidly overpowered.
In reality "cool" isn't quantifiable. In reality sprint speed doesn't provide anything for combat capability other than running away to LOS in which case it just sounds like you are the kind of person that chases squirrels halfway across the map to get killed next to a tree. I'll wait for another example that actually provides evidence of this mobility you speak of. I'm not saying 100% major expedition uptime isn't OP just that the snare immunity needs to stay.Abhaya - PC NA - Ebonheart Pact
Stam Sorc 2-Hand / Bow Build: https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=1691030 -
Yiko✭✭✭✭✭
Yeah, I figure Major Expedition on cast is off the table for Evasion, though. @Abhaya is also saying that Hurricane is classified as Direct Damage, so that wouldn't work either. And I don't recall for sure, but the first tick of Jabs might be classified as Direct Damage.Yeah, direct AOE damage sounds good to me. I felt bad dueling a Stam Sorc on PTS and having perma-mobility. Although this would still be a form of passive mobility which you’ve stated you don’t think should exist, so in that case, I’d say Expedition on cast.
Oh, so it doesn't have reduced roll dodge cost or increased stamina recovery to improve mobility/survivability/agency? Sprint can be extremely useful in actual combat. It doesn't have to be explicitly used for running away. There are absolutely clever and practical sprint mechanics in the game. If you're not taking advantage of them, then that's on you.The mobility that you say medium has doesn’t currently exist. The only thing it has is sprint speed which is only useful for running away and has zero impact on actual combat. If the major expedition has to go then it needs to keep the snare immunity and the other morph needs something else. Casting shuffle every 3 seconds in it’s current version isn’t viable.
THIS I did not know, so Direct Damage would not be a good compromise/solution. I assume sets like Grothdarr, redone Overwhelming Surge, and Thunderbug's Carapace would be classified in a similar manner?It would be the same since hurricane is considered direct damage for some reason.
Also do you know whether or not any part of Templar's Jabs is classified as Direct Damage?
Edited by Yiko on July 11, 2019 6:18PM1 -
Scamh✭✭✭JusticeSouldier wrote: »
The mobility that you say medium has doesn’t currently exist. The only thing it has is sprint speed which is only useful for running away and has zero impact on actual combat. If the major expedition has to go then it needs to keep the snare immunity and the other morph needs something else. Casting shuffle every 3 seconds in it’s current version isn’t viable.
it's your l2p issue.
in reality medium gives cool mobility.
And on PTS immunity is too long - expedition on the top makes this skill absolutly stupidly overpowered.
In reality "cool" isn't quantifiable. In reality sprint speed doesn't provide anything for combat capability other than running away to LOS in which case it just sounds like you are the kind of person that chases squirrels halfway across the map to get killed next to a tree. I'll wait for another example that actually provides evidence of this mobility you speak of. I'm not saying 100% major expedition uptime isn't OP just that the snare immunity needs to stay.
Are we even playing the same game or living in the same reality (serious question). Sprinting "just right" is actually glorious. I'm not going to elaborate on the details, cause I do enjoy killing people next to trees and it's much easier when they are out of stamina.Oh, so it doesn't have reduced roll dodge cost or increased stamina recovery to improve mobility/survivability/agency? Sprint can be extremely useful in actual combat. It doesn't have to be explicitly used for running away. There are absolutely clever and practical sprint mechanics in the game. If you're not taking advantage of them, then that's on you.
Yeah that "sprint is useless" comment hit us both right in the feelers.
The Upside Down (Stamplar) - Osaka Sewers X (Stamblade) - A Scanner Darkly (Magblade) - Taylor Swiftborn (Stam sorc)1 -
Abhaya✭✭✭✭@Yiko You are correct about medium mobility I was just being dramatic. For those sets and jabs I have no idea. General rule is to look at the in game damage numbers and if the number is white it is direct damage and if the number is orange it is damage over time but even then some abilities behave strangely.Abhaya - PC NA - Ebonheart Pact
Stam Sorc 2-Hand / Bow Build: https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=1691030 -
Abhaya✭✭✭✭@Yiko A thought I just had would be to have it only proc or only be active while currently in a ground based AOE. That way people aren’t running all over the place with crazy uptime on major expedition but it would still help the caster’s mobility when fighting in ritual or other abilities that are able to lock down large areas with snares.Abhaya - PC NA - Ebonheart Pact
Stam Sorc 2-Hand / Bow Build: https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=1691030 -
akray21✭✭✭✭✭JusticeSouldier wrote: »JusticeSouldier wrote: »
The mobility that you say medium has doesn’t currently exist. The only thing it has is sprint speed which is only useful for running away and has zero impact on actual combat. If the major expedition has to go then it needs to keep the snare immunity and the other morph needs something else. Casting shuffle every 3 seconds in it’s current version isn’t viable.
it's your l2p issue.
in reality medium gives cool mobility.
And on PTS immunity is too long - expedition on the top makes this skill absolutly stupidly overpowered.
The immunity is fine, the major expedition is not. IMO.
its a big question for who it's fine.
if u play only stamina in medium - ofc fine, for u subjective like.
but when u changed build to heavy or will play in light or heavy on another class - u will say "wtf, why whole part of the game mechanics doesn't touch these guys? why it cost so cheap in trade for endless duration? what for snares and roots exist in this game iif u can't use them at all?"
Think perspective.
P.s: I'm stamina fun personally. And mostly in medium even now. And these changes make Shuffle too OP.
In it's current state on live evasion doesn't see play because the snare immunity duration is useless when snares get thrown out like candy on Halloween. The snare immunity duration is what will make medium armor playable again without having to rely on forward momentum.2 -
Davadin✭✭✭✭✭
✭JusticeSouldier wrote: »JusticeSouldier wrote: »
The mobility that you say medium has doesn’t currently exist. The only thing it has is sprint speed which is only useful for running away and has zero impact on actual combat. If the major expedition has to go then it needs to keep the snare immunity and the other morph needs something else. Casting shuffle every 3 seconds in it’s current version isn’t viable.
it's your l2p issue.
in reality medium gives cool mobility.
And on PTS immunity is too long - expedition on the top makes this skill absolutly stupidly overpowered.
The immunity is fine, the major expedition is not. IMO.
its a big question for who it's fine.
if u play only stamina in medium - ofc fine, for u subjective like.
but when u changed build to heavy or will play in light or heavy on another class - u will say "wtf, why whole part of the game mechanics doesn't touch these guys? why it cost so cheap in trade for endless duration? what for snares and roots exist in this game iif u can't use them at all?"
Think perspective.
P.s: I'm stamina fun personally. And mostly in medium even now. And these changes make Shuffle too OP.
In it's current state on live evasion doesn't see play because the snare immunity duration is useless when snares get thrown out like candy on Halloween. The snare immunity duration is what will make medium armor playable again without having to rely on forward momentum.
man, all those immovable pots i've been selling like hot cakes....
THINK OF THE ALCHEMISTS, ZOS!August Palatine Davadin Bloodstrake - Nord Dragon Knight - PC NA - Gray Host
Greymoor 6.0.7 PvP : Medium 2H/SnB The Destroyer
Dragonhold 5.2.11 PvE : Medium DW/2H The Blood Furnace
March 2021 (too lazy to add CP) PvP: Medium DW/Bow The Stabber0 -
JusticeSouldier✭✭✭✭In reality "cool" isn't quantifiable. In reality sprint speed doesn't provide anything for combat capability other than running away to LOS in which case it just sounds like you are the kind of person that chases squirrels halfway across the map to get killed next to a tree. I'll wait for another example that actually provides evidence of this mobility you speak of. I'm not saying 100% major expedition uptime isn't OP just that the snare immunity needs to stay.
learn to play!Edited by JusticeSouldier on July 11, 2019 7:53PMall classes. pc platform, dissapointed.0 -
Yiko✭✭✭✭✭
Honestly, at that point, the Major Expedition mechanic would be kind of fringe, and it'd be better for all Medium Armor users to have the value distributed in another way. Also, I'm still of the opinion that the design should be made more active.@Yiko A thought I just had would be to have it only proc or only be active while currently in a ground based AOE. That way people aren’t running all over the place with crazy uptime on major expedition but it would still help the caster’s mobility when fighting in ritual or other abilities that are able to lock down large areas with snares.
YOU WILL NEVER GET THIS, YOU WILL NEVER GET THIS~ProzTh3Almighty wrote: »
AFAIK, when Shuffle is used "competitively," it is predominantly on Stamblades and Stamplars who are using Rally. The immunity change, as you said, should make Medium Armor more playable.In it's current state on live evasion doesn't see play because the snare immunity duration is useless when snares get thrown out like candy on Halloween. The snare immunity duration is what will make medium armor playable again without having to rely on forward momentum.
Regarding Forward Momentum and Rally: the builds that used Rally in open world also generally used Shuffle, making the new Major Evasion on Rally redundant. The builds that used Forward Momentum were Heavy Armor builds that didn't have access to Shuffle, but now those Heavy Armor builds will gain Major Evasion through Forward Momentum when they realistically did not need more mitigation. That said, Medium Armor users can now use Forward Momentum and gain that extra mitigation from Major Evasion while gaining a flex slot, but those that were using Rally/Shuffle previously have really only lost value on Rally. Does Major Evasion need to be addressed at all?Edited by Yiko on July 11, 2019 8:38PM1 -
ProzTh3Almighty✭✭✭Yea they should not put major evasion on FM or Rally.
#KeepMajorEvasionFromTheHeavies .com3 -
universal_wrath✭✭✭✭✭JusticeSouldier wrote: »
The mobility that you say medium has doesn’t currently exist. The only thing it has is sprint speed which is only useful for running away and has zero impact on actual combat. If the major expedition has to go then it needs to keep the snare immunity and the other morph needs something else. Casting shuffle every 3 seconds in it’s current version isn’t viable.
it's your l2p issue.
in reality medium gives cool mobility.
And on PTS immunity is too long - expedition on the top makes this skill absolutly stupidly overpowered.
In reality "cool" isn't quantifiable. In reality sprint speed doesn't provide anything for combat capability other than running away to LOS in which case it just sounds like you are the kind of person that chases squirrels halfway across the map to get killed next to a tree. I'll wait for another example that actually provides evidence of this mobility you speak of. I'm not saying 100% major expedition uptime isn't OP just that the snare immunity needs to stay.
I personally play full medium armor glass canon on my stam sorc, utilizing channeled accelration, o boy does that girl run fast? I play mostly BG, rarly open world, and for me works perfectly in terms of LOS. I mainly hit and run type of guy since not much defense to offer on medium stam sorc or heavy. If nobody uses snares in a match, i'm usually highest kills/lowest death rate, if other teams started using snares, I'm basically meat bad. New changes will definetly help me survive a bit more and I like them a lot, 1 skill works as snare removal and magor expedition is great. I hated race against time when they removed the 50%cost reduction to sprint and changed it to 2 secs of immunity, what a joke. Also 2 hand is slow in my opinion, I could never land a proper DS or excuate since everyone dodge roll. I play daul wield/bow, and next patch I will have better uptime on major expedition and snare removal, as well a a new spammable and gap closer. Very exciting0 -
templesus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
Honestly, at that point, the Major Expedition mechanic would be kind of fringe, and it'd be better for all Medium Armor users to have the value distributed in another way. Also, I'm still of the opinion that the design should be made more active.@Yiko A thought I just had would be to have it only proc or only be active while currently in a ground based AOE. That way people aren’t running all over the place with crazy uptime on major expedition but it would still help the caster’s mobility when fighting in ritual or other abilities that are able to lock down large areas with snares.
YOU WILL NEVER GET THIS, YOU WILL NEVER GET THIS~ProzTh3Almighty wrote: »
AFAIK, when Shuffle is used "competitively," it is predominantly on Stamblades and Stamplars who are using Rally. The immunity change, as you said, should make Medium Armor more playable.In it's current state on live evasion doesn't see play because the snare immunity duration is useless when snares get thrown out like candy on Halloween. The snare immunity duration is what will make medium armor playable again without having to rely on forward momentum.
Regarding Forward Momentum and Rally: the builds that used Rally in open world also generally used Shuffle, making the new Major Evasion on Rally redundant. The builds that used Forward Momentum were Heavy Armor builds that didn't have access to Shuffle, but now those Heavy Armor builds will gain Major Evasion through Forward Momentum when they realistically did not need more mitigation. That said, Medium Armor users can now use Forward Momentum and gain that extra mitigation from Major Evasion while gaining a flex slot, but those that were using Rally/Shuffle previously have really only lost value on Rally. Does Major Evasion need to be addressed at all?
Lol we Templars have been saying Major Evasion needs addressing since it was first changed to AOE damage. And we’ve been vocal. You can see the countless posts that have been made, myself included, in past PTS patches. It’s safe to say at this point in time that mechanic is not going to get touched.
As for major expedition, after further testing on PTS, I can comfortably say that if shuffle were to lose the major expedition heavy will still be the meta. With the addition of major evasion to Forward momentum, multiple new flex abilities for every class, as well as seventh legion emerging as one of the top stamina sets on PTS, I cannot see real reasoning to run medium over heavy without the major expedition on shuffle.Edited by templesus on July 12, 2019 6:00AM3 -
ProzTh3Almighty✭✭✭Yep i though heavy would be poop shooted too but i reacted instead of researched. Heavy is still in the game boys...so keep your heads on!
Move quickly(unless in medium and perma-snared), strike deftly(unless in medium and lacking good weapon dmg sets), and die well with sword in hand and your enemies zerg desecrating your corpse.0 -
Rikumaru✭✭✭✭✭
✭^^ Heavy is still strong. If shuffle is nerfed then what the hell is the point of running medium? Only class which will probably do it would be stamina nightblade which already does so still on live.Overload rework. Power Overload now does physical damage and grants you the power of a tornado: You throw a brick at the target with a light attack, and you hammer your head into that brick with every heavy attack. We have decreased its Ultimate cost, but increased the chance that you get stuck in the animation.1 -
Aedrion✭✭✭✭✭On Stamsorc, this will permanently give Evade users major expedition because of hurricane. What are we supposed to do? Unslot the one damage skill our class has for DPS?
On Warden, hitting shalks will give your enemies major expedition. Good job, you lined up your shot, your reward is that your enemy gets away from any consecutive damage.
On Templar, any hit with jabs will make them fly away at max speed before you even finish the attack.
Caltrops and Ice Wall - as annoying as they are - will actually help medium users rush at you. Snared by 30%? No no speedbuff for 30%! Because I have 5 seconds of movement and 2 secs of expedition while I run over your AoE
From it's design - look at Elude and its morph - it's clear ZoS assumes this will only proc every now and then. They completely forgot that in many cases, it's proc constantly, permanently.
This skill needs a change.
It needs to have either an internal CD of 10-12 seconds so it helps people escape once every 8 or 10 seconds and not constantly or it needs to only proc from ground-based AoE skills that don't move.2 -
Sacredx✭✭✭So there's definitely NOT a general consensus about whether or not Major Expedition itself is too much utility on Shuffle. That's okay.
People have said things like, "Major Expedition is fine" but haven't elaborated on whether or not the current implementation of that buff is fine, and if it is, why it's fine.
Is there anyone who wants to EXPLICITLY defend the design choice of Major Expedition proccing on any and all AOE damage?PvP wise the proposed evasion changes are imo perfectly fine. Medium armor users using evasion will still get knocked/stunned/disoriented/silenced/feared/pulled. They will still take full direct damage regardless of evasion, and even more compared to say a heavy build. Giving them some extra mobility is a good way to encourage the use of this skill, but for reasons above it is certainly not op.PC NA PvP Oceanic
The Kelly Gang [TKG]
Highest kill streak: https://i.imgur.com/V6jJhoy.png
KB sample: https://i.imgur.com/n7TFyZr.png
TKG raid sample: https://youtube.com/watch?v=RkrsHg3T7pc0 -
akray21✭✭✭✭✭On Stamsorc, this will permanently give Evade users major expedition because of hurricane. What are we supposed to do? Unslot the one damage skill our class has for DPS?
On Warden, hitting shalks will give your enemies major expedition. Good job, you lined up your shot, your reward is that your enemy gets away from any consecutive damage.
On Templar, any hit with jabs will make them fly away at max speed before you even finish the attack.
Caltrops and Ice Wall - as annoying as they are - will actually help medium users rush at you. Snared by 30%? No no speedbuff for 30%! Because I have 5 seconds of movement and 2 secs of expedition while I run over your AoE
From it's design - look at Elude and its morph - it's clear ZoS assumes this will only proc every now and then. They completely forgot that in many cases, it's proc constantly, permanently.
This skill needs a change.
It needs to have either an internal CD of 10-12 seconds so it helps people escape once every 8 or 10 seconds and not constantly or it needs to only proc from ground-based AoE skills that don't move.
Hurricane has become nearly useless. The damage and speed are barley noticeable, and now it buffs enemies wearing medium armor. Time to drop one of the last two skills that provide any class identity and slot Mighty Chudan. Though even that further reduces the usefulness of crit surge...Edited by akray21 on July 12, 2019 2:08PM0
