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Cast time on ultimates feels awful
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kojou✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Weave in a light attack before you bar-swap after an ultimate.Playing since beta...0 -
Lord_Eomer✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Ragnaroek93 wrote: »The combat feel on PTS is absolutely awful. Weapon swap doesn't work, cast time on ultimates doesn't help either to make the combat feel smooth. Please just revert this...
If they remove small cast time then it will take probably damage nerf
We are having cast time on mertorer from long time.
So better lets have this way only!Edited by Lord_Eomer on July 9, 2019 2:17PM1 -
Vortigaunt✭✭✭I agree.
@ZOS_Gilliam you’ve played this game, you know very well what bandaid fixed do to the game in the long run (see shieldbreaker). This does NOTHING except lower the ceiling for good players who know how to animation cancel. Bad players will be none the wiser. I thought we all agreed that cast times were bad for this game. We do not need this in the game, especially with how ridiculously laggy it is.
I agree that if we had a perfect game then maybe this would’ve worked, but please do not make the gameplay experience even worse than what it already is.3 -
sweatapodimas✭✭✭It definitely affects burst, seems server-ping now has more control over your effectiveness. Higher ping seems to mask the delay for me (combat dummy). Checked with a bad VPN connection.Edited by sweatapodimas on July 9, 2019 2:33PM"Jazz isn't dead, it just smells funny" - Frank Zappa0
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Insco851✭✭✭✭✭
✭If they all have cast times- they all need to be undodgeable. or Did they intentionally give dodge roll a buggy ass delay as well?0 -
Vortigaunt✭✭✭sweatapodimas wrote: »It definitely affects burst, seems server-ping now has more control over your effectiveness. Higher ping seems to mask the delay for me (combat dummy). Checked with a bad VPN connection.
Exactly! It would be fine if zos could guarantee good servers, but they can’t.
@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_Gilliam0 -
Davadin✭✭✭✭✭
✭Ragnaroek93 wrote: »The combat feel on PTS is absolutely awful. Weapon swap doesn't work, cast time on ultimates doesn't help either to make the combat feel smooth. Please just revert this...Not being able to swap / block / roll cancel ultimates is a mistake.Murador178 wrote: »Ragnaroek93 wrote: »The combat feel on PTS is absolutely awful. Weapon swap doesn't work, cast time on ultimates doesn't help either to make the combat feel smooth. Please just revert this...
Most of the times my ults are light attack bash/block atm not going off
Maybe they specifically intended this?yeah it sucks people being able to see and react to ults. . .
This could be the reason?
Hey guys... 😂😂 What if... 😂😂 ZOS finally removed anim canceling and weaving the way we know it as a whole 😂😂😂😂
If they would remove this the game will loose 80% of its endgame Community.
....which is, 10% of the whole player base?
im jk, im jk relax lol....
....or am i?
August Palatine Davadin Bloodstrake - Nord Dragon Knight - PC NA - Gray Host
Greymoor 6.0.7 PvP : Medium 2H/SnB The Destroyer
Dragonhold 5.2.11 PvE : Medium DW/2H The Blood Furnace
March 2021 (too lazy to add CP) PvP: Medium DW/Bow The Stabber2 -
sweatapodimas✭✭✭If you want it to work normally in Cyrodiil then just get near an "EP-gravitationally-collapsed-ballzerg-singularity" and, through time dilation, your ping will be >300 ms...PROBLEM SOLVED cast time gone "Jazz isn't dead, it just smells funny" - Frank Zappa5
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Vortigaunt✭✭✭^ hilarious since during prime time you actually get a higher ping than the actual cast time2
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Drakostax✭✭Double-edged sword imo.
On one hand, it entirely makes sense to see abilities go off; the animations exist for a reason and being able to actually see your opponent telegraphing an attack is healthier for PvP counter-play.
On the other hand, ZOS has been actively pushing the 'fast-paced gameplay' aspect for a while, something that half-second cast times do nothing but hinder.
The unfortunate reality is that the main reason high-end combat can be so skill-based in ESO is because of animation-cancelling, which, by all rights, is a bug in the combat system. ZOS has acknowledged this in the past and even supported / attempted to improve animation cancelling in favour of the community's views on it.
It's a messy subject with no real answer. I'm not a fan of cast times being added (horridly clunky as many have said, this is the same thing that plagued the Merciless proc for a very long time before it was removed), but if ZOS deems it necessary to make combat more 'fair', then who am I to judge. PvE will be mostly (not entirely) unaffected so it's up to you die-hard PvPers to complain about not being able to insta-nuke with your Smiting Dawnbreakers anymore.
Alternatively, ZOS could just embrace ani-cancelling and write it into the game as an actual mechanic? Might solve more issues than they'd expect lol.
@Drakostax - PC/NA
Smooth sailing with dat 280ms Aussie latency.4 -
Mayrael✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Why I am not surprised? Crap at its best.Say no to Toxic Casuals!
I am doing my best, but I am not a native speaker, sorry.
"Difficulty scaling is desperately needed. 9 years. 6 paid expansions. 24 DLCs. 40 game changing updates including A Realm Reborn-tier overhaul of the game including a permanent CP160 gear cap and ridiculous power creep thereafter. I'm sick and tired of hearing about Cadwell Silver&Gold as a "you think you do but you don't"-tier deflection to any criticism regarding the lack of overland difficulty in the game." - @AlexanderDeLarge2 -
Vortigaunt✭✭✭Double-edged sword imo.
On one hand, it entirely makes sense to see abilities go off; the animations exist for a reason and being able to actually see your opponent telegraphing an attack is healthier for PvP counter-play.
On the other hand, ZOS has been actively pushing the 'fast-paced gameplay' aspect for a while, something that half-second cast times do nothing but hinder.
The unfortunate reality is that the main reason high-end combat can be so skill-based in ESO is because of animation-cancelling, which, by all rights, is a bug in the combat system. ZOS has acknowledged this in the past and even supported / attempted to improve animation cancelling in favour of the community's views on it.
It's a messy subject with no real answer. I'm not a fan of cast times being added (horridly clunky as many have said, this is the same thing that plagued the Merciless proc for a very long time before it was removed), but if ZOS deems it necessary to make combat more 'fair', then who am I to judge. PvE will be mostly (not entirely) unaffected so it's up to you die-hard PvPers to complain about not being able to insta-nuke with your Smiting Dawnbreakers anymore.
Alternatively, ZOS could just embrace ani-cancelling and write it into the game as an actual mechanic? Might solve more issues than they'd expect lol.
It’s not even about animation cancelling. Fine, remove it for all I care. But UNTIL THEY GET BETTER SERVERS OR ASSURE US THAT WE DONT GET 300 PING WHEN NEAR MORE THAN 5 PEOPLE this has no place in eso. Cast times and cyrodiil don’t work together because the server is trash.
And please zos, no “we will improve servers after we put this into the game”. No. You put this into the game AFTER you improve the servers.
It’s time to stop thinking about balance changes in a vacuum and think of what implications these changes have...Edited by Vortigaunt on July 9, 2019 2:50PM1 -
sweatapodimas✭✭✭I thought the Merciless proc is 400 ms now. Can't remember if they reverted or reduced it."Jazz isn't dead, it just smells funny" - Frank Zappa0
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Insco851✭✭✭✭✭
✭sweatapodimas wrote: »I thought the Merciless proc is 400 ms now. Can't remember if they reverted or reduced it.sweatapodimas wrote: »I thought the Merciless proc is 400 ms now. Can't remember if they reverted or reduced it.
200. And it feels decent~1 -
Kolzki✭✭✭✭✭The cast time really does feel clunky and it’s stopping us from weapon swapping. Is it possible to make it play the full animation of the ultimate rather than the bar swap animation, while maintaining the same speed of swapping? I couldn’t care less whether someone has just bar swapped, I want to see that they casting dawnbreaker on me. It’s just prioritising playing the wrong animation.
Same swap speed, prioritise the ultimate animation over the swap animation . Remove the cast time.1 -
Vortigaunt✭✭✭The cast time really does feel clunky and it’s stopping us from weapon swapping. Is it possible to make it play the full animation of the ultimate rather than the bar swap animation, while maintaining the same speed of swapping? I couldn’t care less whether someone has just bar swapped, I want to see that they casting dawnbreaker on me. It’s just prioritising playing the wrong animation.
Same swap speed, prioritise the ultimate animation over the swap animation . Remove the cast time.
This works, as long as there’s no cast time.0 -
MehrunesFlagon✭✭✭✭✭
✭How many times do I have to say this.People can still hear it.You need really need no otehr indicator.1 -
sweatapodimas✭✭✭The cast time really does feel clunky and it’s stopping us from weapon swapping. Is it possible to make it play the full animation of the ultimate rather than the bar swap animation, while maintaining the same speed of swapping? I couldn’t care less whether someone has just bar swapped, I want to see that they casting dawnbreaker on me. It’s just prioritising playing the wrong animation.
Same swap speed, prioritise the ultimate animation over the swap animation . Remove the cast time.
Again, they are claiming that it is to sync the animation and proc, why not speed the animations and drop the delay.
Also was wondering if "Instant" casts actually have regulated cast-times or are they just limited by lag/ping/whatever IT jargon?"Jazz isn't dead, it just smells funny" - Frank Zappa0 -
Solariken✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭So on the one hand Dizzying Swing has a cast time and is hands down the most fun, visceral, and satisfying skill in the game. I don't mind cast times in general if there is something really potent on the end of it.
I do worry that it will be much harder to land an ult after a D-Swing though due to how fast players can break free and how many HOTs most people have ticking...1 -
sweatapodimas✭✭✭So on the one hand Dizzying Swing has a cast time and is hands down the most fun, visceral, and satisfying skill in the game. I don't mind cast times in general if there is something really potent on the end of it.
I do worry that it will be much harder to land an ult after a D-Swing though due to how fast players can break free and how many HOTs most people have ticking...
You will feel the delay with any dawnbreaker combo, at least animation cancel or LA weave. DB and deathstroke suffer the most with animation canceling."Jazz isn't dead, it just smells funny" - Frank Zappa0 -
Insco851✭✭✭✭✭
✭So on the one hand Dizzying Swing has a cast time and is hands down the most fun, visceral, and satisfying skill in the game. I don't mind cast times in general if there is something really potent on the end of it.
I do worry that it will be much harder to land an ult after a D-Swing though due to how fast players can break free and how many HOTs most people have ticking...
Yea In the current meta- a clean rotation with an animation canceled ulti could clear a target... a rough rotation with a sloppy ani cancel.. and the guy is healing thru the burst... something has to give.Edited by Insco851 on July 9, 2019 3:14PM0 -
Zatox✭✭✭✭So now we can see, react and block incoming dawnbreaker, instead of getting instahit by white cloud? Good0 -
React✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭This change is actually a joke, and anyone defending it doesn't actually play PVP at a high level or have in depth experience with ESO's combat system.
On console, this change is going to destroy the viability of these ultimates. The lag combined with general performance issues creates massive targeting inconsistencies, to the point where these ults ALREADY miss or straight up don't fire when they should. If you've ever used the unmorphed dawnbreaker, which has a cast time on live, you'd understand why this change cannot go live.
Needs to be reverted.@ReactSlower - PC/NA - 2000+ CP
React Faster - XB/NA - 1500+ CP
ContentTwitch.tv/reactfaster
Youtube.com/@ReactFaster4 -
Myux✭✭✭i thought it was agreed everyone hated cast times and they should only be implemented if the balance of the skill is entirely based around it
like, didnt zos say something like that after the shield cast time fiasco too? did they just forget? whats the point of deleting animation cancelling? making the game feel clunkier is the last thing i'd ever want.0 -
Insco851✭✭✭✭✭
✭Remember when Merciless bow proc had a 400ms cast time and EVERYONE could dodge it? Thumbless
Now it’s on a bunch of ultis... stun>break>dodge roll is MUCH QUICKER THAN 400ms. Ask any mnb that’s played in the last 6 months.0 -
GloryClass RepresentativeHaving watched someone test multiple cast timed ultimates, my thoughts:- the cast time makes gameplay feel less fluid
- I foresee a lot of issues where people try to cast, but lag cancels it
- still, I like the intention of making ultimates more noticeable for PvP
I think it would be interesting to try to keep the ability to react to ultimates, but remove the cast time:- remove single target cast times, but improve the indication someone has cast it on you (in hectic fights you can miss that Incap)
- remove AoE cast times, BUT make it have a short telegraph i.e. like Selene's AoE cone. This way, you can animation cancel the ultimates, but enemies still have that 400-500ms to react
mDK will rise again.
Rebuild Necromancer pet AI.
@Glorious since I have too many characters to list
Ádamant
Strongly against Faction Lock0 -
Vortigaunt✭✭✭i thought it was agreed everyone hated cast times and they should only be implemented if the balance of the skill is entirely based around it
like, didnt zos say something like that after the shield cast time fiasco too? did they just forget? whats the point of deleting animation cancelling? making the game feel clunkier is the last thing i'd ever want.
Exactly. Even zos realized everyone hated cast times, yet somehow they decided to ignore that?0
