The Amount of CC in this game removes most of the skill factor from the game in non cp pvp.

Illuvatarr · June 2019

The amount of CC in this game and the ability for anyone with a pulse in a crowd to spam it over and over again is what has removed the skill quotient from the game.

The CP system is most probably the reason from a development standpoint that all of this CC was introduced to so many classes and on so many skills so that you could actually kill people using the broken item sets, broken abilities and broken mechanics introduced by the developers themselves.

The fact that roots and stuns are on the same timer make it nearly impossible for any player to do anything against a crowd but die because they just need to run you out of stamina by spamming it to kill you. This is why you have stamina toons with speed buffs running around in towers building ultimate so they can kill people. It is silly and stupid.

Its broken on a core and fundamental level. I hope they change alot of this with the passing of the CP system.

GeorgeBlack · June 2019

I agree. It wont change tho.
Ive come to peace with what ESO is.
A casual experience to play PvE with many alts.

A boring BG experience for PvP in which you either play as ganger, SnB, or pew pew with healers in your group.

The game is based on rotation as opposed to being a skilled fighter

Sanctum74 · June 2019

Changing CP isn't going to teach people stamina management and break free and cc immunity is just broken. They need to make an honest effort to fix their game, but based on my 5 years of experience they are sadly not going to do that.

EtTuBrutus · June 2019

Play stam in bgs. Or sorc. A lot easier.

Digiman · June 2019

ZoS listened to whiners and broke the game.... why should they listen to this whiner and kill off the game instead?

CP is fine, fun and rewarding. Sick of people bitching about a system designed for strengthening a person who does quests and plays the game while learning their class...

What gets me is if Illuvatarr got their wish and it was removed she then still *** about skill in this game... So no, there is no satisfying these forum posters ZoS... Wish they would just shut it leave the game then.

Jeremy · June 2019

Illuvatarr wrote: »

The amount of CC in this game and the ability for anyone with a pulse in a crowd to spam it over and over again is what has removed the skill quotient from the game.

The CP system is most probably the reason from a development standpoint that all of this CC was introduced to so many classes and on so many skills so that you could actually kill people using the broken item sets, broken abilities and broken mechanics introduced by the developers themselves.

The fact that roots and stuns are on the same timer make it nearly impossible for any player to do anything against a crowd but die because they just need to run you out of stamina by spamming it to kill you. This is why you have stamina toons with speed buffs running around in towers building ultimate so they can kill people. It is silly and stupid.

Its broken on a core and fundamental level. I hope they change alot of this with the passing of the CP system.

Yeah I agree with you. The CC on this game is out of control - especially when they stack snares and stuns on you. Magicka classes just don't have enough stamina to counter it. If it wasn't for mist form I would never get to move on this game. And standing still on this game's PvP pretty much = death since players love to stack ground effects and chain ultimates.

Originally magicka classes had the option to use unstoppable - which enabled them to preemptively use their stamina to ward off CC effects. They should have never changed that.

Illuvatarr · June 2019

Digiman wrote: »

ZoS listened to whiners and broke the game.... why should they listen to this whiner and kill off the game instead?

CP is fine, fun and rewarding. Sick of people bitching about a system designed for strengthening a person who does quests and plays the game while learning their class...

What gets me is if Illuvatarr got their wish and it was removed she then still *** about skill in this game... So no, there is no satisfying these forum posters ZoS... Wish they would just shut it leave the game then.

Not complaining about the CP. ZOS has already indicated they are looking into ways to remove it.

What we need are fluid fights...not someone relying on spamming fossilize/destructive touch/root etc every 6 seconds until the other person runs out of resources. Those skills should be able to be used for a killing combo and the incentive to use them should be only in that situation. Not to spam on someone every 6 seconds, have them heal through your dps just in time for you to spam it again. There is no skill in this type of play and class skills have been introduced to promote it for what appears to be a class design creativity void to make up for a lackluster skill set with one op crutch ability.

killimandrosb16_ESO · June 2019

CC in eso is ridiculous. Theres no other game where you can spam CC and the 10th will be as powerful as the first one. cc immunity for the few seconda after break free is no where enough. There MUST be a diminishing returns on cc, so the 4-5th time you get cc'd by one ability youre immune to it. Make players USE THEIR BRAINS.

exeeter702 · June 2019

killimandrosb16_ESO wrote: »

CC in eso is ridiculous. Theres no other game where you can spam CC and the 10th will be as powerful as the first one. cc immunity for the few seconda after break free is no where enough. There MUST be a diminishing returns on cc, so the 4-5th time you get cc'd by one ability youre immune to it. Make players USE THEIR BRAINS.

Unfortunately that is an issue deeply rooted in ESOs combat design. Hard CCs (along with all abilities) are simply restricted to your available resource pool to cast them and CC break + immunity is tied to stamina instead of any cooldown. Diminishing returns on hard CC would only kind of solve the issue but only for magicka builds and it would greatly empower stamina builds who can largely afford to break free more often.

Eso is never going to have strict CDs on its abilities and break free, therefore it will never have a skillfull dynamic in the CC strategic use department of knowing when to use stuns and when to break them or eat them. It will always just be a resource sustain arms race since if you are out of resources you are generally dead anyways regardless if you get stunned or not.

idk · June 2019

I would say it is a combination of CC and TTK since TTK is pretty short in this game, especially when you have the additional reaction of breaking CC. Not to mention CC immunity is not always reliable.

But it is what it is. I do not expect Zos to do much with it.

ChunkyCat · June 2019

GeorgeBlack wrote: »

The game is based on rotation as opposed to being a skilled fighter

It’s a video game, bro. Not the UFC.

leepalmer95 · June 2019

Doesn't help zos seem to want to force pretty much most magicka builds into using a cc, spam dmg ability.

SidraWillowsky · June 2019

IRA. I ventured into CP-endabled PvP for the first time this week and the difference in how people play is like night and day. There's actual SKILL involved! I'm not constantly fighting the snare -> Dawnbreaker spam that seems to be the meta in non-CP PvP. It's a lot more enjoyable to spar with someone and feel like we're both having to use skills/tactics vs. mindless spamming of snares.

This is just IC though; maybe things are worse in the Cp Cyro instances.

moosegod · June 2019

Tip: if you hate cc, wear the Reactive set!

Xvorg · June 2019

moosegod wrote: »

Tip: if you hate cc, wear the Reactive set!

which can be translated into: If you hate CC, use a set that does all the work for you...

Anti_Virus · June 2019

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Doesn't help zos seem to want to force pretty much most magicka builds into using a cc, spam dmg ability.

Master staff magicka builds are the best example of this.

SilverPaws · June 2019

You have no idea what you talk about. L2P issue here.

frostz417 · June 2019

Anti_Virus wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Doesn't help zos seem to want to force pretty much most magicka builds into using a cc, spam dmg ability.

Master staff magicka builds are the best example of this.

I agree with you. I play mostly mag and you’re forced to use a master staff for almost all mag classes. Magsorcs, magnecros, magdens, and even Magplars use it. It’s ridiculous how all of our spammables/CC’s are utter dog crap.
Magplar is now the exception actually because toppling charge change is actually good so it’s a very viable cc.
But magsorcs, magnecros, and magdens almost need to run vdsa destro, especially magdens. They literally have a trash class stun, birds is such an unreliable and atrocious spammable so the only good magdens are master destro ones.
Magnecros don’t even have a *** class cc. What a joke.

Insco851 · June 2019

frostz417 wrote: »

Anti_Virus wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Doesn't help zos seem to want to force pretty much most magicka builds into using a cc, spam dmg ability.

Master staff magicka builds are the best example of this.

I agree with you. I play mostly mag and you’re forced to use a master staff for almost all mag classes. Magsorcs, magnecros, magdens, and even Magplars use it. It’s ridiculous how all of our spammables/CC’s are utter dog crap.
Magplar is now the exception actually because toppling charge change is actually good so it’s a very viable cc.
But magsorcs, magnecros, and magdens almost need to run vdsa destro, especially magdens. They literally have a trash class stun, birds is such an unreliable and atrocious spammable so the only good magdens are master destro ones.
Magnecros don’t even have a *** class cc. What a joke.

Necro got that trash fear totem actually.

KillsAllElves · June 2019

ESO - E L D E R S N A R E S O N L I N E

Im not sure which is worse, players constantly trying to snare/stun other players or NPCs throwing stuns/stuns at a player.

Either way it offers lame *** game play.

khajiitNPC · June 2019

Sorry these are L2P issues. I play in high MMRs in BG. Sounds like you’re building for a one trick pony and not smart. Or you’re looking for an “I win” button that doesn’t exist. Build smarter.

Anti_Virus · June 2019

khajiitNPC wrote: »

Sorry these are L2P issues. I play in high MMRs in BG. Sounds like you’re building for a one trick pony and not smart. Or you’re looking for an “I win” button that doesn’t exist. Build smarter.

What?

disintegr8 · June 2019

khajiitNPC wrote: »

Sorry these are L2P issues. I play in high MMRs in BG. Sounds like you’re building for a one trick pony and not smart. Or you’re looking for an “I win” button that doesn’t exist. Build smarter.

Sounds like a typical PVPer. Even in PVE, nearly every enemy applies CC in nearly every fight - half your fight time is spent breaking free.

Rikumaru · June 2019

Are we just going to go around in circles nerfing everything until the world burns? I fail to see how CC is an issue, if you are running out of resources (yes in no CP too) because of CC's then you aren't building your character or / and aren't sustaining effectively. Every magicka class has access to a snare removal now (race against time + class based ones) alongside snare nerfs (please also nerf heroic snare thx). As for stamina classes they have always had access to snare removals. There really isn't any excuse anymore.

Heimpai · June 2019

When you get zerg’d down and they spam cc, I’ve lost interest in this game

fyi some of our pings make snare removal pointless, not to mention the constant bug where abilities don’t work (you’re right that‘s l2p)

I’ll just learn to play another game that actually functions properly

wormfudge · June 2019

You could always group up and sync your groups strategy. That's why we have guilds and zonechat and all these forms of communication. To tell your crew or alliance "Yo guys, these guys are zerging heavy and the hardest hitters are blasting me with ice damage." Not just "GUYS THEYRE ZERGIN," which is really the knowledge being shared 90% of the time.

Craft new sets. Use that gold to make new sets that you can switch out on the fly:

Example:
Zerg 1 using a lot of ICE AoE. Well I'm going to gold out some ICE resist enchants on either random gear, or if you have enough cash just make new purples frequently.
-
Zerg 2 using like.. Spin-to-win plus just bashing... Well I'm going to need me some physical resist... This is where having alt sets comes into play.
--
The dreaded, sometimes laggy, Zerg-cluster... Well I got me some good AoE defense, I got me a tad bit of physical and some ice. Maybe I've invested into fire-resist. Lightning clearly a huge AoE factor. Decrease my damage output for pure resist. Because if I don't rely on my team also doing this in a zerg fight, Ima get wiped. If I'm jumping into zergs solo, I'm gonna get wiped. If I'm trying to bomb like 3 years ago, I'm going to get wiped.
---
The reason bombing solo builds worked three years ago was because you have one guy carrying these groups in a very low-player-knowledge atmosphere back then. There's so much more variety now, really there is, that this stuff is not going to work. What works on one guy, may not on another. Same applies to a zerg.

Get some more sets and combo variations. It's a hassle, but it ain't easy being the best, bromelio. I got hope though, you got it!

Illuvatarr · June 2019

Rikumaru wrote: »

Are we just going to go around in circles nerfing everything until the world burns? I fail to see how CC is an issue, if you are running out of resources (yes in no CP too) because of CC's then you aren't building your character or / and aren't sustaining effectively. Every magicka class has access to a snare removal now (race against time + class based ones) alongside snare nerfs (please also nerf heroic snare thx). As for stamina classes they have always had access to snare removals. There really isn't any excuse anymore.

I think you and some other posters are missing the point or I didn’t communicate it effectively. The fact the developers are forcing players to constantly break from cc as a balancing mechanism is extremely poor balancing. It is more annoying than anything else and the pve player above hit the nail on the head. It’s just as silly in pve. The amount of cc and the mechanic to have to break free every....six....seconds or more isn’t fun. It’s silly and sloppy.

disintegr8 · June 2019

Yep, you're losing health, can't heal because you're snared and it takes 3 attempts for break free to actually work (PS4 here) and you die - got nothing to do with L2P or resource management.

wormfudge · June 2019

Illuvatarr wrote: »

Rikumaru wrote: »

Are we just going to go around in circles nerfing everything until the world burns? I fail to see how CC is an issue, if you are running out of resources (yes in no CP too) because of CC's then you aren't building your character or / and aren't sustaining effectively. Every magicka class has access to a snare removal now (race against time + class based ones) alongside snare nerfs (please also nerf heroic snare thx). As for stamina classes they have always had access to snare removals. There really isn't any excuse anymore.

I think you and some other posters are missing the point or I didn’t communicate it effectively. The fact the developers are forcing players to constantly break from cc as a balancing mechanism is extremely poor balancing. It is more annoying than anything else and the pve player above hit the nail on the head. It’s just as silly in pve. The amount of cc and the mechanic to have to break free every....six....seconds or more isn’t fun. It’s silly and sloppy.

Yeah, that point did sorta fly over my cranium.

CC pots and poisons? Or sets that provide buffs to you when snarred or CC'd? They have put effort into providing counters to these mechanics

Dusk_Coven · June 2019

CC, combined with surprise/initiative, is king in every MMO's PvP.

Part of the reason is that "mobs" in PvP (i.e., player characters) don't have 35k - 100k - 1.8M+ HP so they don't have any real ability to survive it.
In PvE against NPCs and monsters you don't even need any CC because you can burn down those numbers fast enough. It's no wonder why CC helps players burst down other players with little resistance from them when players have less HP than most of the weakest monsters -- and why people want to use it.

And if you change this, there will be a lot of whining from people who have already followed an online guide to making a PvP clone that uses CC.
Unless you have a magical way to actually make PvP interesting, complaining about CC just isn't going to get anywhere. Even if it gets nerfed/ reduced/removed, that'll just get people pointing to how it exists in other games.

Because -- ULTIMATELY -- what PvP is really about, is players wanting to kill other players with no resistance like bullies beating on a baby. And if you even suggest taking anything away from their ability to gank like that, they whine. Their wet dream is to be able to use the Blade of Woe on other players.

Illuvatarr · June 2019

How about cc skills that work effectively in burst combos or don’t work at all if not used in a burst combo forcing strategic play and thoughtful resource management/ability use. Or, how about longer timers on cc immunity but make the cc abilities hit harder or last longer? Or how about making cc abilities not be able to be spammed or scale up like bolt escape does? Or good lord how about anything else besides the crazy annoying garbage we have now.

I challenge you or anyone else to go fight the resource guards at any of the keeps in Cyrodiil as a mag class. Every...six....seconds you are stunned/have to break free from total dark or have negate thrown on you. It’s not challenging or makes the resource more difficult. It’s annoying, stops game play and is stupid.