Protective Trait is Overtuned
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Merlight✭✭✭✭✭Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »We literally have the same number of steps.
Mine-
2751/1.85= 1487. 1487*2= 2974
Yours
2752+2752= 5504. 5504/1.85= 2975.
How can you say mine is "more convoluted". Christ man.
This is what makes it kinda convoluted:Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »2752/1.85= 1487, which happens to be single set bonus of pen, and then that number is multiplied by 2 for some reason, probably to make up for the fact it is just spell or physical resist
Why even mention pen here? You're struggling to find a reason to multiply by 2, only to arrive at the wrong result 2974. The reason you needed to multiply by 2 is because you started off with half of Lady.Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: ». If by 6869 armor you mean 6869 physical resistance, then it makes sense. I read that as physical and spell resistance, that's what confused me.
I say both because the majority of five piece sets that give resistances, give both. And again, the majority of ways to get resistance in this game already come with both. And I already went though them in a previous post.
Then you're plain wrong. With 6869 both resistances, it would be 2.5x Lady, way out of line.
Amber Plasm is 1.05x (Atronach + Serpent).
Shacklebreaker is 0.99x (Mage + Tower).
Fortified Brass is 1.88x Lady.
Hunding's Rage is 1.26x Warrior.
Draugr Hulk is 1.25x Tower.
Spriggan's Thorns is 1.25x half-Lover.
Leviathan is 1.18x half-Thief.
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Why ESO needs a monthly subscription
When an MMO is designed around a revenue model rather than around fun, it doesn’t have a long-term future. ― Richard A. Bartle
Their idea of transparent, at least when it comes to communication, bears a striking resemblance to a block of coal. ― lordrichter
... in the balance of power between the accountants and marketing types against the artists, developers and those who generally want to build and run a good game then that balance needs to always be in favour of the latter - because the former will drag the game into the ground for every last bean they can squeeze out of it. ― Santie Claws1 -
Golden_Cat✭✭✭I can't see the point of this thread, OP wants to reduce the effectiveness of protective just because the build uses it doesn't give the exact number like another build?
With this logic there will be no room for diversity when most builds will be nerf because they have something that's "overtuned".1 -
Merlight✭✭✭✭✭Golden_Cat wrote: »I can't see the point of this thread, OP wants to reduce the effectiveness of protective just because the build uses it doesn't give the exact number like another build?
With this logic there will be no room for diversity when most builds will be nerf because they have something that's "overtuned".
When one alternative simply gives more raw stats, all else being equal, it doesn't really support diversity.
EU ‣ Wabbajack nostalgic ‣ Blackwater Blade defender ‣ Kyne wanderer
The offspring of the root of all evil in ESO by DeanTheCat
Why ESO needs a monthly subscription
When an MMO is designed around a revenue model rather than around fun, it doesn’t have a long-term future. ― Richard A. Bartle
Their idea of transparent, at least when it comes to communication, bears a striking resemblance to a block of coal. ― lordrichter
... in the balance of power between the accountants and marketing types against the artists, developers and those who generally want to build and run a good game then that balance needs to always be in favour of the latter - because the former will drag the game into the ground for every last bean they can squeeze out of it. ― Santie Claws0 -
Lightspeedflashb14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭. Why even mention pen here?
Do you even read my quotes?
Because of this-https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/365904/pc-mac-patch-notes-v3-1-5-horns-of-the-reachMundus Stone values and bonuses have been re-tuned with a focus on improving overall diversity. The Lady was upgraded to grant both Spell and Physical Resistance, and The Lover was completely redesigned to grant Spell and Physical Penetration to counteract The Lady and provide greater flexibility in stat choices
The lady and lover are meant to "counteract" each other. It stands to reason that the armor resist bonus is meant to "counteract" the penetration bonus.. Then you're plain wrong. With 6869 both resistances, it would be 2.5x Lady, way out of line.
Amber Plasm is 1.05x (Atronach + Serpent).
Shacklebreaker is 0.99x (Mage + Tower).
Fortified Brass is 1.88x Lady.
Hunding's Rage is 1.26x Warrior.
Draugr Hulk is 1.25x Tower.
Spriggan's Thorns is 1.25x half-Lover.
Leviathan is 1.18x half-Thief.
My God, you really do not read anything do you?.We’ve also standardized Mundus Stone values against other systems that grant similar bonuses, such as enchantments or Item Sets, so you can customize the stats you care about in each system without needing to worry about weighing the exact values against each other. Mundus Stones are now equivalent to 1.85x of an Item Set bonus.
This is true for the most part. Except for the lady, which is balanced against a weapon trait.. Similar to how Mundus Stones were changed, Weapon Trait values have also been rebalanced with a focus on improving overall diversity. Weapon Trait values have a 1:1 pairing with the effectiveness of Mundus Stones; this means if you want armor, you can get the Lady Mundus Stone or a Defending weapon and they will both give you 2752 armor.
Even then, the only thing stopping the resist set bonuses from being in line with this is the fact that they doubled the value after taking the 2752/1.85. again, probably because it was easier to code that then to add physical resistance to set bonuses that already had spell and Visa versa, as I have explained twice now.
For the 5 piece you so expertly misinterpreted, those are a set bonuses times 2.31. do the math and you will see all the one you messed you by using a freaking mundus as the starting point make sense.Edited by Lightspeedflashb14_ESO on May 26, 2019 3:46PM0 -
Merlight✭✭✭✭✭Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »For the 5 piece you so expertly misinterpreted, those are a set bonuses times 2.31. do the math and you will see all the one you messed you by using a freaking mundus as the starting point make sense.
You might want to edit that one, add some grammar for clarity. I have no idea what you're trying to convey.
You quoted several times that
andMundus Stones are now equivalent to 1.85x of an Item Set bonus.
Hence 5pc bonus should be approximately 2.31 / 1.85 = 1.25 of a mundus stone value.The bonus for having 5 pieces is approximately 2.31x the value of a one-piece bonus.
And then you keep arguing that Fortified Brass should be 2.5x the value of Lady mundus, because Lady is somehow special.
I give up. I've been off topic, anyway.
EU ‣ Wabbajack nostalgic ‣ Blackwater Blade defender ‣ Kyne wanderer
The offspring of the root of all evil in ESO by DeanTheCat
Why ESO needs a monthly subscription
When an MMO is designed around a revenue model rather than around fun, it doesn’t have a long-term future. ― Richard A. Bartle
Their idea of transparent, at least when it comes to communication, bears a striking resemblance to a block of coal. ― lordrichter
... in the balance of power between the accountants and marketing types against the artists, developers and those who generally want to build and run a good game then that balance needs to always be in favour of the latter - because the former will drag the game into the ground for every last bean they can squeeze out of it. ― Santie Claws0 -
Lightspeedflashb14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Hence 5pc bonus should be approximately 2.31 / 1.85 = 1.25 of a mundus stone value.
Now how is making it hard then it needs to be.
It is easy. A set bonus bis supposed to be the base for both a mundus and a 5 piece.
If a 5 piece. Use set bonus*2.31( or higher, they have said as much, up to a 25% bonus. Obviously there are exemptions to the rules.)
If a mundus, use set bonus*1.85.
Simple.
You just seem unable to understand this.
On topic. I have gave my thoughts. Make protective 990 resistances at gold. Then make a new jewelry glyph that gives 1980 resistance. This was you have to trade more for that resistance. Simple.Edited by Lightspeedflashb14_ESO on May 26, 2019 7:27PM1 -
CatchMeTrolling✭✭✭✭✭
✭Savos_Saren wrote: »So, tanky, magic-based characters who have been forced to wear heavy in the past (ie: magDKs, magPlars) relied on heavy armor to help them survive. Then, people complained about heavy armor being too strong. So, ZOS got rid of the passive that gave heavy armor wearers 200 weapon/spell damage.
To adapt, those magic-based "stand your ground" people had to swap to light armor and then start running protective traits... at the expense of losing their resources which contribute to their damage/survivability.
Now, that's not good enough, either? We've already go bleeds that ignore ALL physical resistances. Sloads/oblivion that is unmitigated by any armor. Why not introduce damage that ignores all spell resistances, too? Just make it a well-rounded *** up.
I guess people won't be happy until they can one-shot anyone.
To be fair light armor has been bis for magic builds since Morrowind, that’s way before protective was introduced. The only people that was running heavy was those that was behind the meta, especially with sets like wizards riposte being around.
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