Private Delves?

bmnoble · May 2019

To be honest I am lazy, quite happy when other players kill all the ads on the way to the boss.

Nothing like a nice stroll, to the Skyshard then, head to the boss location and wait for the boss to respawn, kill it then teleport out.

That said a lot of high level players will just run past the ads kill the boss and leave.

But I have seen quite a few low level players who were doing the delves a little bit too early(lacking basic skills) struggling to clear the ads or even defeat the boss at the end, without the assistance of random strangers many of those players would not even finish the delve.

I have had to teleport to a few friends from time to time to help them with either overland content or delves and even quest bosses.

mague · May 2019

Peaches0w0 wrote: »

Sorry I know this has probably been brought up but I'd like to give some feedback regarding delves being a single instance (excluding pvp delves, and public dungeons). I understand dungeons and trials having parties and the like but I've always liked doing delves solo since their small and manageable.

However what I don't enjoy is walking into a delve to see all of the npc's slaughtered and a bunch of high leveled players tearing through everything before I can eve cast a spell. It's honestly super immersion breaking and not fun at all.

I feel it would be nice to have an option to make delves solo for players who enjoy taking their time

To late. They once have been solo delves, just as the main stories have been instanced. It changed with One Tamriel. We asked many times, but they wont bring it back. They have been rather difficult but fun.

Some delves are on the Undaunted daily list and you will never find them empty. Best are off-peak times for some dungeon crawling. Usually the vet players only collect the shard or the daily. If you have time hide in a corner till they are gone and then continue the delve.

sionIV · May 2019

I happen to like sharing delves with other people. It's MORE immersive for me, because it wouldn't make sense that I was the only adventurer in Tamriel.

Example: It's early in the morning (5:00ish), I couldn't sleep and decided to quest a bit on one of my alts (Dunmer DK), I enter a delve and I see a Breton Templar (low level) fight a group of enemies. She is struggling to kill the group, and I jump in to help her. After that we stick together and slowly clear the delve. During this time, we meet another group of two people who are are leaving the dungeon, and when we reach the boss at the end of the delve, an Argonian Nightblade is sitting and waiting, so we join up with him and kill the boss.

If that had been a private delve, I would just have ran to the boss, killed the boss and then left the delve. Every single delve would have been the same, and nothing new would have happened. The fact that the delve is public, means that with every delve (even the ones I repeat) I enter, the experience is unique.

This is not a single player game, and it shouldn't be a single player game.

MikaHR · May 2019

Jeirno wrote: »

It's an MMO. Deal with it

Its not a MMO, in fact ZOS explicitly said that it is not a MMO. Deal with it.

sionIV wrote: »

I happen to like sharing delves with other people. It's MORE immersive for me, because it wouldn't make sense that I was the only adventurer in Tamriel.

Example: It's early in the morning (5:00ish), I couldn't sleep and decided to quest a bit on one of my alts (Dunmer DK), I enter a delve and I see a Breton Templar (low level) fight a group of enemies. She is struggling to kill the group, and I jump in to help her. After that we stick together and slowly clear the delve. During this time, we meet another group of two people who are are leaving the dungeon, and when we reach the boss at the end of the delve, an Argonian Nightblade is sitting and waiting, so we join up with him and kill the boss.

If that had been a private delve, I would just have ran to the boss, killed the boss and then left the delve. Every single delve would have been the same, and nothing new would have happened. The fact that the delve is public, means that with every delve (even the ones I repeat) I enter, the experience is unique.

This is not a single player game, and it shouldn't be a single player game.

Yeeeeeah, because finding some random guy oneshotting everything or running straight t the boss and pulliing everything with him is sooooooooooo "immersive".

Its not a MMO, deal with it.

Darkstorne · May 2019

zvavi wrote: »

IT IS AN MMO. DEAL WITH IT.

The worst argument you can ever make. “15 year old MMOs were designed this way, so all games in the genre have to be designed this way forever!”

Think objectively about it. Solo dungeons already exist, so the game can do it. Analyze every part of the game that isn’t solo and think “What value do other players bring here?” For dolmens, that’s obvious. World bosses too. Group and public dungeons - definitely makes sense to want other players joining you. But normal quest-heavy dungeons? Where NPCs typically act like you’re the only person here? Literally some dungeon NPCs are ghosts claiming you’re the first person they’ve seen in over a thousand years (while other players sprint/jump past you animation-cancelling their way to victory).

I feel like the design of this game shifted with One Tamriel, away from being an MMO first and TES game second, to a TES game first and MMO second. And while many positive changes were made that dismissed MMO tropes (level gated zones for example) some parts of ESO were too much work to change, and dungeons/overland design were one of them. I’m hopeful that a sequel to ESO one day gets this right from day one, and recognizes the benefit of solo dungeons like a normal TES game - NPCs wouldn’t need to respawn, so you could take time to read those notes a bandit group was standing over before you killed them, instead of thinking “Can’t read it. They’ll respawn when I’m half way through.” You could admire the boss room environment design and search for treasure after defeating it instead of thinking “Can’t stop here, boss will respawn in 30 seconds. Gotta go fast!”

Cities and group content (dolmens, world bosses, group designed dungeons etc) make sense to be public. But overland content and standard dungeons would be vastly improved by being solo only in a sequel (unless of course you group up with a friend), because the game design can then avoid MMO tropes of constant respawns and neccessities like mobs spaced every 30 yards in the open world standing around like EXP piñatas just so there’s enough for everyone, rather than a believable number being designed with immersive AI packages for a solo player. You could take your time in a dungeon, stealthing your way through and eliminating well-placed NPCs, rather than sprinting through the same generic clusters of NPC groups to the boss room, hoping to get there before another player kills the boss before you can tag it.

Yes, that would challenge the definition of MMO, and players like @zvavi risk having their brains imploding at the thought of MMO design tropes being challenged

But it would be a better game for it, regardless of whether it’s still considered a “true” MMO. You don’t see Destiny and the Division suffering as a result of pushing the MMO genre in new directions.

barney2525 · May 2019

They respawn in a about 2 minutes. If you see they were wiped, just wait a couple minutes. They will all be back.

Ei8htba11 · May 2019

I have met and befriended many players in open delves, some who have helped my character, others I have helped. Some enjoyed the experience enough to join the guild I am in. We now do trials and dungeons together and with the guild. Without that random interaction, this wouldn't have happened. What you are proposing would remove some of the social aspect from what is a multiplayer game.

I understand where you are coming from (often I've gottent to the delve boss only to find a corpse), but I have to disagree. The mobs respawn quite quickly, so it's usually only minor.

JamieAubrey · May 2019

It makes my job easier collecting that shard

zvavi · May 2019

@Darkstorne your long text is very attractive and everything, but you literally ignored my argument, and called my PoV argument. The argument was, that the servers cant create enough instances. If you are playing on eu, you should know what i am talking about. I am sorry that wanting my game to actually work means my brain is imploding.
Now to my "it is an mmo deal with it". I understand that making the idea work is nice and everything, but as you know, creating it will cost man power, and tons of server powers. Which, i would much prefer invested in the game in other ways. Come back when you can make proper discussion about things instead of attacking people's line of though, which you actually know nothing about.

(Yes, "it is an mmo deal with it" showed my point of view, not even my argument. "risk having their brains imploding at the thought of MMO design tropes being challenged" is attacking people, and not being constructive it is neither an argument, nor a point of view, i expect an apology post with me tagged in it, after you do that, we can continue to proper discussion, and i will post arguments against the other parts of your wall of text).

Ildun · May 2019

bmnoble wrote: »

To be honest I am lazy, quite happy when other players kill all the ads on the way to the boss.

Nothing like a nice stroll, to the Skyshard then, head to the boss location and wait for the boss to respawn, kill it then teleport out.

Agree. Most delve don't have story or not much story, slowly I see the redundant pattern and feel bored and now I just care for skyshard and boss or daily delve objective, I'm glad someone else clear the path.

MikaHR · May 2019

barney2525 wrote: »

They respawn in a about 2 minutes. If you see they were wiped, just wait a couple minutes. They will all be back.

Unless someone else comes along to one shot everything/run through pulling everything in his race to the boss.

kypranb14_ESO · May 2019

Peaches0w0 wrote: »

Sorry I know this has probably been brought up but I'd like to give some feedback regarding delves being a single instance (excluding pvp delves, and public dungeons). I understand dungeons and trials having parties and the like but I've always liked doing delves solo since their small and manageable.

However what I don't enjoy is walking into a delve to see all of the npc's slaughtered and a bunch of high leveled players tearing through everything before I can eve cast a spell. It's honestly super immersion breaking and not fun at all.

I feel it would be nice to have an option to make delves solo for players who enjoy taking their time

If I'm not mistaken, allowing every single player to have access to solo delves would cost a lot in the way of server space. If this is something they could implement without effecting their budget, I'd so go for it. No reason not to do something nice for the players.

However, if it would end up costing them money.. I'd say no. I want ESO to live a long and prosperous life. I'd love to see ESO outlive Runescape. (lol)

MikaHR · May 2019

Well, nice thing would be a small menu when entering delve to choose between private/public delve.

AlnilamE · May 2019

OP, have you considered the instanced delves in Craglorn when you are in need of some solitude? They are the ones with a + on their symbol.

Darkstorne wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

IT IS AN MMO. DEAL WITH IT.

The worst argument you can ever make. “15 year old MMOs were designed this way, so all games in the genre have to be designed this way forever!”

Think objectively about it. Solo dungeons already exist, so the game can do it. Analyze every part of the game that isn’t solo and think “What value do other players bring here?” For dolmens, that’s obvious. World bosses too. Group and public dungeons - definitely makes sense to want other players joining you. But normal quest-heavy dungeons? Where NPCs typically act like you’re the only person here? Literally some dungeon NPCs are ghosts claiming you’re the first person they’ve seen in over a thousand years (while other players sprint/jump past you animation-cancelling their way to victory).

I think that is subjective. Dolmens are easily soloable by many players, so the value other players bring is company, just like everywhere else. They are just as much group content as the delves are.

- NPCs wouldn’t need to respawn, so you could take time to read those notes a bandit group was standing over before you killed them, instead of thinking “Can’t read it. They’ll respawn when I’m half way through.” You could admire the boss room environment design and search for treasure after defeating it instead of thinking “Can’t stop here, boss will respawn in 30 seconds. Gotta go fast!”

That's your hurry, not anyone else's. If you want to read texts and mobs respawn, you can just kill them and keep reading. Same with enjoying the scenery and looking for chests. There is enough time to admire things and take screenshots between respawns.

Cities and group content (dolmens, world bosses, group designed dungeons etc) make sense to be public. But overland content and standard dungeons would be vastly improved by being solo only in a sequel (unless of course you group up with a friend), because the game design can then avoid MMO tropes of constant respawns and neccessities like mobs spaced every 30 yards in the open world standing around like EXP piñatas just so there’s enough for everyone, rather than a believable number being designed with immersive AI packages for a solo player. You could take your time in a dungeon, stealthing your way through and eliminating well-placed NPCs, rather than sprinting through the same generic clusters of NPC groups to the boss room, hoping to get there before another player kills the boss before you can tag it.

Yes, that would challenge the definition of MMO, and players like @zvavi risk having their brains imploding at the thought of MMO design tropes being challenged But it would be a better game for it, regardless of whether it’s still considered a “true” MMO. You don’t see Destiny and the Division suffering as a result of pushing the MMO genre in new directions.

So you want to turn MMOs into single-player games? Or are you thinking of something like Diablo 3, which has limited amount of content and is based on grinding solo or with friends?

EDIT: Messed up a quote.

Salvas_Aren · May 2019

Peaches0w0 wrote: »

Salvas_Aren wrote: »

Peaches0w0 wrote: »

Jeirno wrote: »

It's an MMO. Deal with it

Or perhaps let people enjoy the game in different ways? It's not harming your experience in any way if this request was considered. I don't understand why people are even becoming hostile towards requests that don't hinder their experience in any way.

Sure. It's not like we all would not appreciate another decrease in overall server performance.

I understand that there is a mechanical aspect to this however I doubt that vague and insulting replies help in others understanding why something isn't feasible. Kindly state the specific server limitations that would result in allowing private delve instances.

Many see content such as instanced housing as evidence that it a reasonable request. If you do not have the specified information on why it's not reasonable please don't promote an argument based on assumptions.

You assume that more private instances would not have impact on general gameplay. I will kindly stop my argumentation based on assumptions if you do too.