Do you think ZoS listens to its player base?

AefionBloodclaw · April 2019

Never

They definitely make a show of doing so, glorifying themselves saying we listened, but whenever they actually bring something out that the players were asking for (such as the outfit/dye station), it was pretty much for financial gain and not because the players were asking for it. On the PTS they actively ask for feedback, and then proceed to ignore all feedback, especially those asking for the game to be less grindy (as proven on the Summerset PTS for the Psijic grind.)

eso_lags · April 2019

Never

Oh ya they listen. Come try to pvp on console, in vivec, and then come back and tell me they listen. They dont give a ***.

barney2525 · April 2019

Sure, they listen.

The problem isn't listening. The problem is on the Player's side, not the companies side.

Player's are biased. Player's that actually go to the effort of writing things in Forums are zealous about their game.

Zos doesn't have that issue. Zos sees everything in the big picture. Zos does things For the big picture, and from a non-biased perspective. Sure, some players may THINK Zos is biased, but interestingly enough, the Only players that claim Zos has a bias are those who had their favorite character(s) nerfed.

There were people going crazy on these Forums over the change in Passives. PASSIVES! As if a change to a particular Passive could make ANY character completely Unplayable. That is just player bias.

Zos does not look at issues with that type of bias. They evaluate from a big picture point of view.

ArchMikem · April 2019

Yes, always.

Listening, and doing what you want are different things.

BomblePants · April 2019

More often than not.

They definitely listen.... the evidence is clear. Many things the player has been asking for have been added to the game.... It is in their interests to do so, the more players the longer the game ‘lives’....

VvardeFellow · April 2019

Yes, but.

They have grown so big, and there are so many aspects, with the same, albeit competent, community personnel, they have grown beyond their own control. The latest event for example, not to beat a dying horse and not to rant on PVP, but the outcry from the majority, which IS PVE, has been NO! No pvp in events! But they didn't adapt well from the last time.

themightyhades · April 2019

Some communities yes but others no.

Housing is the biggest in-game feature i can think of that is repeatedly ignored and yet some of the most expensive items ingame. Can you imagine how much people would spend on player homes with a bit of added care and attention.

Rylisin · April 2019

Never

As an oceanic player.... Nah, they don't. 23 pages on a forum post asking for answers with dead silence while seeing posts about motifs not dropping getting staff responses.... ZOS does what ZOS wants. They're very selective. They don't really care about the players, they just want our money

I went for the never option because that's what fits the most from my pov.

Elsonso · April 2019

Yes, always.

barney2525 wrote: »

Sure, they listen.

The problem isn't listening. The problem is on the Player's side, not the companies side.

Player's are biased. Player's that actually go to the effort of writing things in Forums are zealous about their game.

You envy my forum stars, don't you! Well, you can't have them! My precious! Mine!

barney2525 wrote: »

Zos doesn't have that issue. Zos sees everything in the big picture. Zos does things For the big picture, and from a non-biased perspective. Sure, some players may THINK Zos is biased, but interestingly enough, the Only players that claim Zos has a bias are those who had their favorite character(s) nerfed.

There were people going crazy on these Forums over the change in Passives. PASSIVES! As if a change to a particular Passive could make ANY character completely Unplayable. That is just player bias.

Zos does not look at issues with that type of bias. They evaluate from a big picture point of view.

I think this is true. This is represented by them whenever they make comments that they like to collect comments from all different types of players. The trick is getting all different types of players to provide feedback. With players in the forum, that isn't hard, but players that just play and don't participate in game-related social media are much harder.

JackDaniell · April 2019

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

They listen, but the communication is being interrupted by game monetisation.

^^^

ookami007 · April 2019

Infrequently

Mitrenga wrote: »

We have class reps and community ambassadors; not many games have that open communication with its player base. I'm not happy with some aspects of the game but I do not think ZoS is not listening. They listen, but implementation is kind of slow.

And much do either of those actually represent the community? I for one, have never spoken to either. For the most part, the ONLY interaction I see consistently is the closing of threads. At that, they excel tremendously! At LISTENING, I rank them up there with the IRS.

Elsonso · April 2019

Yes, always.

ookami007 wrote: »

Mitrenga wrote: »

We have class reps and community ambassadors; not many games have that open communication with its player base. I'm not happy with some aspects of the game but I do not think ZoS is not listening. They listen, but implementation is kind of slow.

And much do either of those actually represent the community? I for one, have never spoken to either. For the most part, the ONLY interaction I see consistently is the closing of threads. At that, they excel tremendously! At LISTENING, I rank them up there with the IRS.

I think that the class representative program is beneficial because it provides the ZOS game play designers with a sounding board, not because it is some congress that votes according to the whim of the forums. Public opinion is like a flock of birds. It is always changing direction. The players in the forum are never going to reach a consensus. Everything of importance is going to be a debate between people with different opinions.

I don't want class representatives that have to agree with me or are slaves to "what the forum says". I want class representatives that know the game well enough to give intelligent advice from a player perspective. If it ends up being advice I don't agree with, which happens, then I decide if it is important enough for me to comment as an individual.

As for the ambassador program, I don't think that ever really bore fruit. I might be wrong. Nice people, those I have interacted with, but some of them seem to be missing.

Imperial_Voice · April 2019

Some communities yes but others no.

lordrichter wrote: »

ookami007 wrote: »

Mitrenga wrote: »

We have class reps and community ambassadors; not many games have that open communication with its player base. I'm not happy with some aspects of the game but I do not think ZoS is not listening. They listen, but implementation is kind of slow.

And much do either of those actually represent the community? I for one, have never spoken to either. For the most part, the ONLY interaction I see consistently is the closing of threads. At that, they excel tremendously! At LISTENING, I rank them up there with the IRS.

I think that the class representative program is beneficial because it provides the ZOS game play designers with a sounding board, not because it is some congress that votes according to the whim of the forums. Public opinion is like a flock of birds. It is always changing direction. The players in the forum are never going to reach a consensus. Everything of importance is going to be a debate between people with different opinions.

I don't want class representatives that have to agree with me or are slaves to "what the forum says".

I think the class rep program is actually awesome. It certainly has some flaws but its good to see an MMO that takes steps to get feedback from representatives who actually play the class they represent, I also agree to tour statement about them noy being slaves to forum opinions. If the forums were to be believed than every class would be so woefully out of balance that half of them would be one hit kiling the other half who had no dps skills left and most of the PvE content would be unbearably easy.

It's good that they have people who can be at least somewhat objective about what a class needs.

DeadlyRecluse · April 2019

Other/you forgot one

I don't think they should.

There's rarely, if ever, a clear community consensus on anything. Asking them to "listen to the community" is almost inherently contradictory.

baltic1284 · April 2019

Never

I say never as if they did then they would A be active here on there main site they are not, B when suggestion come out they would test theme they don't that simple.

The_Lex · April 2019

It depends on how you define "listens."

As I said on another post regarding class reps:

The class rep program, in my opinion, is just a placebo for the masses. It gives the impression that ZOS is interested in feedback to the point that it takes said feedback seriously. Yes, ZOS hosts the rep meetings. Yes, ZOS listens to the reps. But, much of the advice given by the reps is not implemented. ZOS is gonna do what ZOS is gonna do. It's their game, I guess.

VvardeFellow · April 2019

lordrichter wrote: »

ookami007 wrote: »

Mitrenga wrote: »

We have class reps and community ambassadors; not many games have that open communication with its player base. I'm not happy with some aspects of the game but I do not think ZoS is not listening. They listen, but implementation is kind of slow.

And much do either of those actually represent the community? I for one, have never spoken to either. For the most part, the ONLY interaction I see consistently is the closing of threads. At that, they excel tremendously! At LISTENING, I rank them up there with the IRS.

I think that the class representative program is beneficial because it provides the ZOS game play designers with a sounding board, not because it is some congress that votes according to the whim of the forums. Public opinion is like a flock of birds. It is always changing direction. The players in the forum are never going to reach a consensus. Everything of importance is going to be a debate between people with different opinions.

I don't want class representatives that have to agree with me or are slaves to "what the forum says". I want class representatives that know the game well enough to give intelligent advice from a player perspective. If it ends up being advice I don't agree with, which happens, then I decide if it is important enough for me to comment as an individual.

As for the ambassador program, I don't think that ever really bore fruit. I might be wrong. Nice people, those I have interacted with, but some of them seem to be missing.

I mostly agree, except for the "flock of birds". PVP is a good example, what with the posts this week. There were more than plenty, from both sides (although I choke on calling PVP'ers a side) to send a clear message that there is a deep seated issue here or there.

Class ambassador? Good idea. But I agree, the fruit of "here's post or thread from xyz ambassador" pales against the thousands of howls about nerfs, passives, what have you. Everyone listens in every business, and loudly say so. But is there activity that shows they are, like concrete changes (or fixes)?

Mettaricana · April 2019

Never

No i feel they largely ignore all playerbase and just humor us pretend to listen then go forward with harsh nerfs and content directions...

Wifeaggro13 · April 2019

Other/you forgot one

thedude33 wrote: »

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

bigelle.x3_ESO wrote: »

No game dev should listen to its playerbase. Always remember people are idiots and the dunning Kruger effect is constantly in motion. The devs should balance based off data with suggestions from top players who know the ins and outs of game mechanics, though with a grain of salt because everybody has their class biases as well as their suggestions catering only to the top level of play.

MMOs are no longer made for the players they are made for CEOs. unfortunately the genre is in sad shape.

BS

Bad game = no players = unhappy CEO

This isn't real life where you are forced to pay taxes in an unfair system. The genre has evolved over the years to adapt to what the players want. A classic game like Everquest, which kickstarted this whole genre, would not survive if released today.

Sure the CEO wants to make money. Why would they make a game that didn't make money? Still, it has to be a game that people play for that to happen

Its not a bad game its a single player game with MMO options. your point of Everquest not surviving if released today is ridiculous. of course it wouldnt their has been almost 20 years of inovation. thats like saying the Apple 2 would not sell if released today ,of course it wouldnt. But to your point Everquest is still alive and people playing it same with eq 2. you cant say the same for many MMO s released in the last 10 years.

yes plenty of people play this game it has frequent content updates, and they have monitized base game features along with the addition of sub option, and gambling they are very profitable. but their is very little permanent community here its a constant rotating churn population. Zos figured out a formula to make money of shorter interval s of play. where is old school buisness plan was to keep them playing as long as possible so you continue to get their subscription.

Salvas_Aren · April 2019

Yes, always.

Listen: Yes

Do what we want: No

Do what benefits the game: Rarely

Tia413 · April 2019

Some communities yes but others no.

efster wrote: »

They only listen to class reps, and the people who have big followings on Twitch/Youtube etc. Everyone else might as well not exist.

This^

Tigerseye · April 2019

Sometimes.

Cadbury · April 2019

At the end of the day, ZOS is gonna ZOS.

And nothing we say or do will change that.

NeillMcAttack · April 2019

lordrichter wrote: »

Listen =/= Obey

This really is about as well as it could be put, and honestly about as well as one should expect.

I mean, dragons and necro’s!! While I personally wasn’t very hung up on these, anyone who has spent a considerable amount of time here over the past 5 years will know for certain that these were heavily sought after.

Tan9oSuccka · April 2019

Yes, always.

I believe they listen, but they don’t base decisions on just community feedback. (Thankfully)

Pops_ND_Irish · April 2019

I think they do. But its like hearing your kids whine all day on some things, you just ignore them.
It's called "selective hearing".

Elsonso · April 2019

Yes, always.

VvardeFellow wrote: »

Everyone listens in every business, and loudly say so. But is there activity that shows they are, like concrete changes (or fixes)?

Yes, actually. However, @anitajoneb17_ESO cleverly sums up how players perceive this.

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

If players ask for something I agree with, and ZOS does it, I feel that ZOS listens.
If players ask for something I don't agree with and ZOS does it, I feel that ZOS listens but shouldn't.
If players ask for something I agree with and ZOS doesn't do it, I feel ZOS doesn't listen.
If players ask for something I don't agree with and ZOS doesn't do it, I feel that ZOS is right for not listening.

The above is an adaptation of a universal truth of the internet.

VvardeFellow wrote: »

I mostly agree, except for the "flock of birds".

Most social human interaction seems to follow the basic idea of flocking, and that is amplified by the internet considerably.

Imperial_Voice · April 2019

Some communities yes but others no.

As much as I enjoy the level of pseudo science were now putting in to pretending ZoS is a model company I feel its gone a bit far. ZoS is far from perfecf.

DenMoria · April 2019

Imperial_Voice wrote: »

As much as I enjoy the level of pseudo science were now putting in to pretending ZoS is a model company I feel its gone a bit far. ZoS is far from perfecf.

They are a model company.

I think they're a model of something from the Chatulu (sic) mythos, but a model nonetheless.

p00tx · April 2019

Yes, always.

Based on their comments and efforts to create avenues of communication for us, I believe they do actively listen to us. The problem is, then then make their final decisions based on their understanding of how the game works, but none of them actually plays the game enough to see how their decisions will actually affect the game. Sometimes they hit the nail right on the head, and they do great things. Sometimes though, they make mistakes, which we can clearly see documented on the forums in the form of huge, long, angry posts made by players. This is why it's so crucial that more players actually take the time and make the effort to get on the PTS and test these changes, then accurately, objectively, maturely, and professionally share their findings with Zos on the forums or in the player Discord.