Why is it THE minion class...has no real minion?
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Mitrenga✭✭✭✭✭Who needs minions when you have spooky scary skeletons and diseases/poisons at your command?1 -
StormeReigns✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
Ah, finally there are those who do say it here, nice to see people invalidate their argument by using it, only a fool would think its cleaver.I was very disapointed, too.
Actually Eso´s Necromancer isnt a Necromancer. Point. You cant argue with "we dont need another sorc". People were asking for a Necromancer class and the ones who asked for that are now disapointed.
All the others just like to be fanboys like: "Oh this necromancer is so different, this is so cool" no its not....
And since when is warden a pet class? because of one (ONE) bear as an ultimate which basically sucks in every game content compared to other ult skills? lol....
Also, those look like some very heavy straws you're reaching for.2 -
ZonasArch✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I was very disapointed, too.
Actually Eso´s Necromancer isnt a Necromancer. Point. You cant argue with "we dont need another sorc". People were asking for a Necromancer class and the ones who asked for that are now disapointed.
All the others just like to be fanboys like: "Oh this necromancer is so different, this is so cool" no its not....
And since when is warden a pet class? because of one (ONE) bear as an ultimate which basically sucks in every game content compared to other ult skills? lol....
Can you point me to your very definitive definition of necromancer? Because I'm sure it's not based on any real stuff... and as a fictional creation, a necro is as broad as it gets, as far as they are handling undead by raise corpses. Anything you say will me just your precious little snowflake understanding of it. Either because you read on a book or another game. Lores are different, you see? This is TES lore, and you should never, if you have reasoning capabilities, compare fictional works as you compare real stuff.
How can you say, after all, that ESO necron isn't necro? Show hard evidence, I'm open to these. Thanks.
Edit here: necromancy is a. Greek/Latin origin word, means dark/black/dead divination. That's literally what the word means... Anything that's not divination through corpses, is already a deviation from it's true meaning. What I mean by this is, you are right when you say ESO necro isn't a necro. No game has a real necro. Ever. That alsoeans your definition of it is wrong. Whatever you have in your head for a necro, you're wrong.Edited by ZonasArch on April 2, 2019 8:28PM6 -
Cloudless✭✭✭✭✭First it was the "Elsweyr's dragons are wyverns" bunch, now it's these guys. Sheesh.6 -
exeeter702✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Would you be so kind as to point me to where elder scrolls online necromancer was classified as a minion class?5 -
max_only✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭You must be new.
I’ve said it once I’ll say it again. These people order a cheeseburger and ask for the cheese and the burger to be removed.
They didn’t like Sorc pets. They hate the warden pet and got it nerfed. Now they convinced Zos to make Necromancer without pets. This community hates pets. What can I tell you? I mean, they could just play any other class but no, they have to force their hatred of pet classes on everyone. Some of it is warranted because of the way Zos has coded the pet system, but some of it is just obstinacy.#FiteForYourRite Bosmer = Stealth
#OppositeResourceSiphoningAttacks
|| CP 1000+ || PC/NA || GUILDS: LWH; IA; CH; XA
""All gods' creatures (you lot) are equal when covered in A1 sauce"" -- Old Bosmeri Wisdom1 -
ZonasArch✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭You must be new.
I’ve said it once I’ll say it again. These people order a cheeseburger and ask for the cheese and the burger to be removed.
They didn’t like Sorc pets. They hate the warden pet and got it nerfed. Now they convinced Zos to make Necromancer without pets. This community hates pets. What can I tell you? I mean, they could just play any other class but no, they have to force their hatred of pet classes on everyone. Some of it is warranted because of the way Zos has coded the pet system, but some of it is just obstinacy.
They have pets though... What's your point?6 -
max_only✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭You must be new.
I’ve said it once I’ll say it again. These people order a cheeseburger and ask for the cheese and the burger to be removed.
They didn’t like Sorc pets. They hate the warden pet and got it nerfed. Now they convinced Zos to make Necromancer without pets. This community hates pets. What can I tell you? I mean, they could just play any other class but no, they have to force their hatred of pet classes on everyone. Some of it is warranted because of the way Zos has coded the pet system, but some of it is just obstinacy.
They have pets though... What's your point?
Thanks for being facetious. You know “pets” = permanent summons, like a warden or a sorcerer has.#FiteForYourRite Bosmer = Stealth
#OppositeResourceSiphoningAttacks
|| CP 1000+ || PC/NA || GUILDS: LWH; IA; CH; XA
""All gods' creatures (you lot) are equal when covered in A1 sauce"" -- Old Bosmeri Wisdom0 -
ZonasArch✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭You must be new.
I’ve said it once I’ll say it again. These people order a cheeseburger and ask for the cheese and the burger to be removed.
They didn’t like Sorc pets. They hate the warden pet and got it nerfed. Now they convinced Zos to make Necromancer without pets. This community hates pets. What can I tell you? I mean, they could just play any other class but no, they have to force their hatred of pet classes on everyone. Some of it is warranted because of the way Zos has coded the pet system, but some of it is just obstinacy.
They have pets though... What's your point?
Thanks for being facetious. You know “pets” = permanent summons, like a warden or a sorcerer has.
Hm... Not really what I call pets, but ok. "Pets" for me would take into account anything you summon during battles or otherwise. And if the community didn't like them, you wouldn't see so many of them going around. Jussayin. Remember you won't necessarily want to have the necro ones in the vicinity of a guard... Having them as temps is actually good.
Also lore friendly AF since it takes a lot from the summoner to keep corpses alive. Permanent pets is just for those with the largest of the erm... Skills. Not for regular players, but god-like NPCs/Story characters.
Expecting anything that wasn't what is coming would be wishful thinking. And mind you.. I wanted it too, deep down, but it makes no sense whatsoever in any way imaginable. So going back to the topic in hand, being surprised or upset with temp minions is, simply put, nothing more than whining. The usual forum stuff, which means I shouldn't be surprised with people whining either, ironically enough.0 -
billp_ESO✭✭✭✭The solution is to forget that the new class is called the Necromancer. ESO wants all classes to be able to do all things: heal, magic DPS, stamina tank, etc. Classes have little meaning in ESO.
A stamina tank Necro is really the opposite of what everybody thinks Necromancers are, but I bet ESO will have them.
So just think of it as "Class X".0 -
ZonasArch✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭The solution is to forget that the new class is called the Necromancer. ESO wants all classes to be able to do all things: heal, magic DPS, stamina tank, etc. Classes have little meaning in ESO.
A stamina tank Necro is really the opposite of what everybody thinks Necromancers are, but I bet ESO will have them.
So just think of it as "Class X".
Classes are more a style than anything.
And necromancing, as I said before, is divination with corpses. Anything that involves the game is already a distant echo of what necromancing is, so there's that. Whether it's by being a tank or a healer, what's the difference? Wrong, or very wrong, both are still not right.
Also, as a last comment, tanking with skellies is as necromancy as healing with dark magic and blood through sacrifices. Many cultures actually do this with healers in their tribes.1 -
Wifeaggro13✭✭✭✭✭
✭You guys are....Nevermind.
You realize your arguments are basically like saying. "We can't have a sorcerer with magic! That would be boring! Besides, we have other classes with magic so we can't do that. We can just have the sorcerer face tank instead."
It makes no sense. The necromancer is a raiser of the dead. That is THE SINGLE MOST ICONIC THING ABOUT THEM. You take that away and they are not a necromancer anymore. I don't care that other classes can have a summon. That just means that Necros need the option to have more summons.
Sigh.
If anything, they have to rename this class to a warlock, because it is NOT a necromancer the way that it stands.
Its called lazy development.1 -
StormeReigns✭✭✭✭✭
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Necromancy is more of a personal idea versus set in stone archetype.The solution is to forget that the new class is called the Necromancer. ESO wants all classes to be able to do all things: heal, magic DPS, stamina tank, etc. Classes have little meaning in ESO.
A stamina tank Necro is really the opposite of what everybody thinks Necromancers are, but I bet ESO will have them.
So just think of it as "Class X".
Just a mere handful of basic Concepts of Necromancer that have appeared in (A)D&D to World of Warcraft and beyond.Most common of all concepts behind Necromancers in games (be table top or video games) is that they are a collection of Cultists studying / using forbidden knowledge to gain more power.
Many Summon their monstrosities from some form of nether realm where the "dead" reside.
Many use the corspes of old and freshly fallen allies and foes as cannon fodder / shock troops.
Many take things to a more scientific method by incorporating Alchemy, creating multiple blights and plagues to do the work for them while they safely hide away, letting their diseases scorch the earth.
Many go a step further with Alchemy, to use diseases to plague foods and crops to cause it to bring pestilence to the land and raise mindless scourge from those who consumed the food that the crops provided for, solely to reign chaos through the lands.
Many use the studies to just communicate with the dead.
Many go Victor von Frankenstein approach and construct their own undead, be it dead, living, human or creature.
Many have used modern technologies to create viruses and implants to generate their own undead / diseases to plague the lands.
Many will enchant and wear the bones and torn limbs of their foes while standing in the midst of battle, feeding off the horror that they are creating.
Many have dedicated a simple ghoul / skeleton as a mindless slave for minimal lab tasks, while they do other things.
Many trap their souls or even the souls of their enemies into items to maintain a pseudo form of immortality.
Many (well, not many only one has) accidentally used the wrong phrase and summoned the undead from a book, cause he was more interested in pillow talk.
Many have done all of the above. Many have not. Many have done a different of things listed above, but not all.
There is no set-in-stone archetype for necromancers, they are just an old idea given twists and unique developments over the centuries to fit and survive in today's modern pop culture. While many share a similar opinion what necromancy should be, remember, that they are not wrong, but they are not right either, cause too many creations brought versatility and unique identify to the idea opening it up to be enjoyed and liked by more.Edited by StormeReigns on April 2, 2019 11:54PM5 -
Tasear✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Really reality is too many issues with Sorc class pets even now.
They kinda had to do something different Sorc the real pet class and dps wardens.
Nercomancer lore is eso makes it unreliable dark art.0 -
Dark_Lord_Kuro✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭You guys are....Nevermind.
You realize your arguments are basically like saying. "We can't have a sorcerer with magic! That would be boring! Besides, we have other classes with magic so we can't do that. We can just have the sorcerer face tank instead."
It makes no sense. The necromancer is a raiser of the dead. That is THE SINGLE MOST ICONIC THING ABOUT THEM. You take that away and they are not a necromancer anymore. I don't care that other classes can have a summon. That just means that Necros need the option to have more summons.
Sigh.
If anything, they have to rename this class to a warlock, because it is NOT a necromancer the way that it stands.
They have summons just not permanent one and its fine like that1 -
mayasunrising✭✭✭✭✭All your minions are belong to us:
"And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom." ♥ Anaïs Nin
“There’s a difference between wanting to be looked at and wanting to be seen." ♥ Amanda Palmer
“A game is an opportunity to focus our energy, with relentless optimism, at something we’re good at (or getting better at) and enjoy. In other words, gameplay is the direct emotional opposite of depression.” ♥ Jane McGonigal
“They'll tell you you're too loud, that you need to wait your turn and ask the right people for permission. Do it anyway." ♥ Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez6 -
Michaelkeir✭✭✭✭✭Was I the only one disappointed that the necromancer class has not even one permanent/semi permanent minion? The longest one is 16 seconds (I think) and that is only one of 2...I mean, even the sorcerer has several options for permanent minions...why not he necromancer? Why is having multiple minions (skeletons) THE MOST ICONIC THING FOR WHICH NECROS ARE KNOWN not even an option?
I am so disappointed. Not even sure if this class is worth it anymore.
You're operating under the assumption that because Necromancers in other games have permanent pets, then they should also have that in ESO too. Considering Necromancers are completely fictional, they can fulfill ANY criteria that the developers choose for their product.
That being said, I dont recall any TES game ever having permanent pets for Necromancers. They always raise them or summon them temporarily during fights, usually only when there are corpses nearby. This iteration of the Necromancer seems to be right in line with previous TES games.
Skyrim...undead thrall spell. Raises up to 2 permanent undead humanoids to fight for you. I had a basement full of corpses i would choose from based on if I wanted a melee or ranged thrall. It was glorious.0 -
Michaelkeir✭✭✭✭✭
Well one NPC who's meant to be one of the greatest Necromancers and had the backing of Daedric Prince during his highest points.Your arguments: Your version of a necromancer doesn't exist in ES!
What about Mannimarko?
You: He doesn't count.
Me: Uhhhh
Almost every other Necromancer in the game hasn't had an army of undead at their back.
That necromancer world boss in Murkmire has a small army of skeletons at his beck and call. And with all those zombies and skeletons walking around in all the zones....somebody is summoning them.0 -
Michaelkeir✭✭✭✭✭I was very disapointed, too.
Actually Eso´s Necromancer isnt a Necromancer. Point. You cant argue with "we dont need another sorc". People were asking for a Necromancer class and the ones who asked for that are now disapointed.
All the others just like to be fanboys like: "Oh this necromancer is so different, this is so cool" no its not....
And since when is warden a pet class? because of one (ONE) bear as an ultimate which basically sucks in every game content compared to other ult skills? lol....
I'll piggy back on this. Wardens stopped being a pet class the moment ZoS nerfed the bear because too many people where using the bear. According to them they wanted other Ultimates to be used more.0 -
logarifmik✭✭✭✭✭
✭Personally, the only thing I don't like about the Necromancer is Flesh Atronach ultimate. I'd rather prefer to have something like Sorcerer's Storm Atronach with an ability to move and smash enemies, with close to it duration instead of the amount of strikes to disappear. But it's still better, than previously revealed Bone Dragon ultimate. Also, I'd prefer to have mass skeleton rising instead of what we'll have, but one skeleton per cast is not so bad. Also, I like the Living Death skill line. I always wanted to roleplay (as far as it's possible it TESO...) a Necromacer Healer, which story-wise will tinker with souls and dark practices in order to help people, to break the cycle, to fool Arkay, so to speak.Edited by logarifmik on April 3, 2019 1:24PMEU PC: @logarifmik | Languages: Русский, English
Dimitri Frernis | Breton Sorcerer | Damage Dealer | Daggerfall Covenant
Scales-of-Ice | Argonian Warden | Tank / Healer | Daggerfall Covenant0 -
Michaelkeir✭✭✭✭✭OP.....I can understand your frustration. I too wanted permanent pets. I understand the devs wanted to try something different...I do. So I'll wait and see how this plays out.
My only real issuse (small one) is they could have at least allowed us a ranged and melee temporary pet out at the same time for 16 sec. The bomber to me is cool....but I'm going to play my necro ranged and I wanted a melee pet to rush in and fight while i fling spells.0 -
Fur_like_snow✭✭✭✭✭
✭Pets in ESO are awful. They have to be double barred, they target random mobs, pull aggo when you don’t want them too. They’re never where you need them to be and because they have terrible pathing they often get lost. To ask for more of this is just insane. This game has a lot of limitations and that doesn’t get into the lag that it would create if you had 10 necros on screen with 10 pets each it would be a nightmare. If temporary pets is what it takes to get necro into the game functionally then this is just how it’s gotta be.Edited by Fur_like_snow on April 3, 2019 11:58AM3 -
Zenzuki✭✭✭✭✭Fur_like_snow wrote: »Pets in ESO are awful. They have to be double barred, they target random mobs, pull aggo when you don’t want them too. They’re never where you need them to be and because they have terrible pathing they often get lost. To ask for more of this is just insane. This game has a lot of limitations and that doesn’t get into the lag that it would create if you had 10 necros on screen with 10 pets each it would be a nightmare. If temporary pets is what it takes to get necro into the game functionally then this is just how it’s gotta be.
Agreed!
Also like that they went further with the lore in that since this a "dark arts" practice, most npcs/guards, etc. will aggro against anyone openly practicing it in towns, etc.
I was dreading the thought of necro being released and having a &#%$-ton of people standing around in cities and wayshrines, spamming their pets/minions, "awesome" necro-spells ad nauseum!
Take that crap to your lairs boys and girls!Can Open...
Worms EVERYWHERE!0 -
logarifmik✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Most of your statements were true a year ago or so. Nowadays pets are more viable.Fur_like_snow wrote: »Pets in ESO are awful. They have to be double barred, they target random mobs, pull aggo when you don’t want them too. They’re never where you need them to be and because they have terrible pathing they often get lost.Edited by logarifmik on April 3, 2019 12:39PMEU PC: @logarifmik | Languages: Русский, English
Dimitri Frernis | Breton Sorcerer | Damage Dealer | Daggerfall Covenant
Scales-of-Ice | Argonian Warden | Tank / Healer | Daggerfall Covenant0 -
Zenzuki✭✭✭✭✭@logarifmik You're qouting "Fur_like_snow" mate... not me!
But to that.... been in bank lately? guild trader? Gotta love them flappy birds all up your face the whole time while.
Permanent means they never get put away... EVER!
Can Open...
Worms EVERYWHERE!0 -
logarifmik✭✭✭✭✭
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@Zenzuki, my apologies. I've corrected the mistake. In my post I spoke about combat aspect of pets. Regarding the pets-in-city problem I agree with you. Something must be done about that. I playing a Sorcerer with summons a lot, and always unsummon pets in the city, but I understand why some Sorcerers and Wardens around don't. The way it's implemented in the game is quite unhandy. By the way, pets chasing the mount riding master is an idiotic spectacle as well. Why there is no autounsummon implemented in such occasion so far I do not know.@logarifmik You're qouting "Fur_like_snow" mate... not me!
But to that.... been in bank lately? guild trader? Gotta love them flappy birds all up your face the whole time while.
Permanent means they never get put away... EVER!Edited by logarifmik on April 3, 2019 12:49PMEU PC: @logarifmik | Languages: Русский, English
Dimitri Frernis | Breton Sorcerer | Damage Dealer | Daggerfall Covenant
Scales-of-Ice | Argonian Warden | Tank / Healer | Daggerfall Covenant1