heavier wrote: »

steven22 wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

steven22 wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

steven22 wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

Its annoying but mostly because some other classes have been nerfed and we have soo many NBs now. Its just annoying when you go through more detect pots in a night than you do your main pot because everywhere you go; cloakers.

That said; I don't think a direct nerf is needed. If you play a NB, you can see it is not a guarantee that it will work. What I would like to see is get rid of the eye for detection so we can catch more flies. Increase the radius of camo hunter and radiant magelight to be that of a detect pot. One nerf though, would be any channeled ability removes stealth at the begining of activation. You can leave heavy attacks for magblades but snipes are outside of the range of all the counters. Alternatively to the channel nerf; make flare do like a rapid fire 5 shots that follows where you move your cursor up to 40 meters

Basically make the counters better and give us some way to deal with max range cloaking.

There are enough counters which are working fine against Cloak . If you cant handle it , maybe you are the problem. Think about that.

Wow. That's so insightful and profound. I should just use that 7 meter detect ability or detect pots that are what? 17 meters to detect someone sniping from 40 M. Totally my bad.

Cloak needs a rework or maybe they should remove this Skill completly. I would not mind cuz i dont use it very often in Pvp.
Maybe cost increase or a mechanic like streak.

But it would be nice if snipe gets a damage decrease.

Thats the thing. I dont want cloak outright nerfed. Its not a given that its going to save you and thats why so many bad ones just sit back using snipe. Thats why I suggest making the counters more effective but it still requires you to use them rather than just demolish the playstyle of NB. Good NBs are going to be able to kite around and fight just like any non-cloaking class so a full cloak nerf is just taking away some identity.

Yes . In my opinion two things could be done : Increase the cost of cloak and / or decrease the damage out of it.
Good nbs are using their shades for kiting mostly, so cloak isnt that necessary for them.
Maybe next update ( Elsweyr ? ) we will see this change.

increasing the cost would be the best solution.
have it increase with each cast like dodge roll...

That idea won't work, it will only further harm magnb. Problem with increased cost is alot of the stam nb have very low stealth detection radius so they stealth > dodgeroll > cloak and then they are in actual stealth. They don't spam cloak but maybe twice if caught out.

Aurielle wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

heavier wrote: »

steven22 wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

steven22 wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

steven22 wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

Its annoying but mostly because some other classes have been nerfed and we have soo many NBs now. Its just annoying when you go through more detect pots in a night than you do your main pot because everywhere you go; cloakers.

That said; I don't think a direct nerf is needed. If you play a NB, you can see it is not a guarantee that it will work. What I would like to see is get rid of the eye for detection so we can catch more flies. Increase the radius of camo hunter and radiant magelight to be that of a detect pot. One nerf though, would be any channeled ability removes stealth at the begining of activation. You can leave heavy attacks for magblades but snipes are outside of the range of all the counters. Alternatively to the channel nerf; make flare do like a rapid fire 5 shots that follows where you move your cursor up to 40 meters

Basically make the counters better and give us some way to deal with max range cloaking.

There are enough counters which are working fine against Cloak . If you cant handle it , maybe you are the problem. Think about that.

Wow. That's so insightful and profound. I should just use that 7 meter detect ability or detect pots that are what? 17 meters to detect someone sniping from 40 M. Totally my bad.

Cloak needs a rework or maybe they should remove this Skill completly. I would not mind cuz i dont use it very often in Pvp.
Maybe cost increase or a mechanic like streak.

But it would be nice if snipe gets a damage decrease.

Thats the thing. I dont want cloak outright nerfed. Its not a given that its going to save you and thats why so many bad ones just sit back using snipe. Thats why I suggest making the counters more effective but it still requires you to use them rather than just demolish the playstyle of NB. Good NBs are going to be able to kite around and fight just like any non-cloaking class so a full cloak nerf is just taking away some identity.

Yes . In my opinion two things could be done : Increase the cost of cloak and / or decrease the damage out of it.
Good nbs are using their shades for kiting mostly, so cloak isnt that necessary for them.
Maybe next update ( Elsweyr ? ) we will see this change.

increasing the cost would be the best solution.
have it increase with each cast like dodge roll...

That idea won't work, it will only further harm magnb. Problem with increased cost is alot of the stam nb have very low stealth detection radius so they stealth > dodgeroll > cloak and then they are in actual stealth. They don't spam cloak but maybe twice if caught out.

Kinda like how the increasing mag cost on streak places balanced limitations on the number of times mag and stamsorc can use their powerful escape tool? If my magsorc can’t streak for days to reset a fight, why should a magNB be able to freely spam cloak to a safe space, heal up, and immediately go on the offensive again? My old stamsorc could only use streak once, maybe twice, before running out of magicka, similar to how a stamNB would not be able to spam cloak if cloak had a timed cost increase associated with it.

You are comparing apples and oranges, I hate how people compare streak to cloak they are totally different in every single way. Streak is a gap creater, stam sorc is the fastest class in the game. 1 streak should be all you need with shuffle or forward momentum and they fastest movement speed in the game. Magsorc it's streak streal dardeal streak streak darkdeal. It's a gap creater man I hate you sorcs trying to act like your class is not strong. Come play magnb with me and we will see you here in a week crying.

Gnozo wrote: »

Cloak doesnt have a cooldown nor cost increase, Cloak works against 90% of all encounters and skills ingame. Huge damage mitigation, reset the fight whenever you want, get a crit heal/damage after it, regen ressources while in it, charge heavy attack, reposition yourself without anyone knowing, surpress every dot on yourself. Did i miss something?

Counters for cloak: holy detect pots with 49 (?) Seconds Cooldown if not already on Cooldown from previous potion.

Aoe spam: barely works cause nightblades are fast in cloak and dont stand still. Hard to hit, needs to guess where the nightblade is. 40 Meter ranged attacks give nightblade a quite good save area from aoe.

Magelight/Evil hunter: short range, expensive af and only counters cloak while cloak counters nearly everything.

Mark: 5 seconds duration, class exclusive to nightblade....

Ye, some really valid counters against cloak here.

This is the problem with nb, people lump then together, they don't play the class and just do not understand. I am in no way defending how easy it is for STAMINA nightblades to utilize cloak. STAMINA nb has easy access to snare removal and the ability to dodge roll. This is what makes cloak strong, not the skill itself.

This is why I said increase cost of cloak is a bad idea because it will only hurt MAGICKA nightblade. Good stamblades use the combination on snare removal and dodgerolls to maximize thier use of an expensive mag skill to pull this number

stealth > dodgeroll > cloak

they do not "spam" cloak, the idea they do is hoestly dumb.

try using cloak on a MAGICKA night blade and you will understand that it's no just the skill that makes stam nb strong but the combination of snare removal so you can't lock them down, low stealth detection radius so they can stealth easily, dodge roll which also dodges all projectiles etc...

However I'm sure you will still just say it's op so I don't even know why I bothered typing this

Datthaw wrote: »

Gnozo wrote: »

Cloak doesnt have a cooldown nor cost increase, Cloak works against 90% of all encounters and skills ingame. Huge damage mitigation, reset the fight whenever you want, get a crit heal/damage after it, regen ressources while in it, charge heavy attack, reposition yourself without anyone knowing, surpress every dot on yourself. Did i miss something?

Counters for cloak: holy detect pots with 49 (?) Seconds Cooldown if not already on Cooldown from previous potion.

Aoe spam: barely works cause nightblades are fast in cloak and dont stand still. Hard to hit, needs to guess where the nightblade is. 40 Meter ranged attacks give nightblade a quite good save area from aoe.

Magelight/Evil hunter: short range, expensive af and only counters cloak while cloak counters nearly everything.

Mark: 5 seconds duration, class exclusive to nightblade....

Ye, some really valid counters against cloak here.

This is the problem with nb, people lump then together, they don't play the class and just do not understand. I am in no way defending how easy it is for STAMINA nightblades to utilize cloak. STAMINA nb has easy access to snare removal and the ability to dodge roll. This is what makes cloak strong, not the skill itself.

This is why I said increase cost of cloak is a bad idea because it will only hurt MAGICKA nightblade. Good stamblades use the combination on snare removal and dodgerolls to maximize thier use of an expensive mag skill to pull this number

stealth > dodgeroll > cloak

they do not "spam" cloak, the idea they do is hoestly dumb.

try using cloak on a MAGICKA night blade and you will understand that it's no just the skill that makes stam nb strong but the combination of snare removal so you can't lock them down, low stealth detection radius so they can stealth easily, dodge roll which also dodges all projectiles etc...

However I'm sure you will still just say it's op so I don't even know why I bothered typing this

I agree. Magblades have indeed a harder time to utilize cloak then stamblades. And most of the magblades i encounter in cyro doesnt even use cloak.

The most complains are coming from stamblade encounters. Snipers are one of the main complain points. They already have the advantage of a huge ranged hard hitting skill, snipe. On the first encounter their target isnt even aware of their present so they are free to fully buff up and fire 2 snipes at max range before the first on hits their target. So basicly 2 x 10k snipe + at least 1 enchant proc + cc from stealth. If this didnt killed your target they are completly free to vanish into stealth and prepare their next attack.

The counters to this are actually limited and quite useless.

Then we have melee nightblades. They take a higher risk and the counters to cloak are indeed stronger in melee but its still a very very potent skill in many aspect of the game. Damage mitigation by avoiding every single target attack and granting a crit on next heal or damage. Most nightblades enter cloak when they are low hp to benefit from a lot. Damage mitigation even from dots and a crit rally heal, then enter combat again without being in execute range again. This can get really frustrating tbh.

Imagine fighting a nightblade, getting him to 10% hp with your ult and going for execute. Dodgeroll, cloak, rally. 80% hp +

Thats soooo frustrating and players searching for ways to counter this. Hello steel tornado. And there we got another "meta" to complain about.

By giving cloak an cost increase after each use would reduce a lot of complains. Stamblade will have a harder time to sustain cloak and cant use it so frequently anymore. Magblades have a higher magicka pool and a higher regen to sustain this.

Gnozo wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Gnozo wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Gnozo wrote: »

Cloak doesnt have a cooldown nor cost increase, Cloak works against 90% of all encounters and skills ingame. Huge damage mitigation, reset the fight whenever you want, get a crit heal/damage after it, regen ressources while in it, charge heavy attack, reposition yourself without anyone knowing, surpress every dot on yourself. Did i miss something?

Counters for cloak: holy detect pots with 49 (?) Seconds Cooldown if not already on Cooldown from previous potion.

Aoe spam: barely works cause nightblades are fast in cloak and dont stand still. Hard to hit, needs to guess where the nightblade is. 40 Meter ranged attacks give nightblade a quite good save area from aoe.

Magelight/Evil hunter: short range, expensive af and only counters cloak while cloak counters nearly everything.

Mark: 5 seconds duration, class exclusive to nightblade....

Ye, some really valid counters against cloak here.

This is the problem with nb, people lump then together, they don't play the class and just do not understand. I am in no way defending how easy it is for STAMINA nightblades to utilize cloak. STAMINA nb has easy access to snare removal and the ability to dodge roll. This is what makes cloak strong, not the skill itself.

This is why I said increase cost of cloak is a bad idea because it will only hurt MAGICKA nightblade. Good stamblades use the combination on snare removal and dodgerolls to maximize thier use of an expensive mag skill to pull this number

stealth > dodgeroll > cloak

they do not "spam" cloak, the idea they do is hoestly dumb.

try using cloak on a MAGICKA night blade and you will understand that it's no just the skill that makes stam nb strong but the combination of snare removal so you can't lock them down, low stealth detection radius so they can stealth easily, dodge roll which also dodges all projectiles etc...

However I'm sure you will still just say it's op so I don't even know why I bothered typing this

I agree. Magblades have indeed a harder time to utilize cloak then stamblades. And most of the magblades i encounter in cyro doesnt even use cloak.

The most complains are coming from stamblade encounters. Snipers are one of the main complain points. They already have the advantage of a huge ranged hard hitting skill, snipe. On the first encounter their target isnt even aware of their present so they are free to fully buff up and fire 2 snipes at max range before the first on hits their target. So basicly 2 x 10k snipe + at least 1 enchant proc + cc from stealth. If this didnt killed your target they are completly free to vanish into stealth and prepare their next attack.

The counters to this are actually limited and quite useless.

Then we have melee nightblades. They take a higher risk and the counters to cloak are indeed stronger in melee but its still a very very potent skill in many aspect of the game. Damage mitigation by avoiding every single target attack and granting a crit on next heal or damage. Most nightblades enter cloak when they are low hp to benefit from a lot. Damage mitigation even from dots and a crit rally heal, then enter combat again without being in execute range again. This can get really frustrating tbh.

Imagine fighting a nightblade, getting him to 10% hp with your ult and going for execute. Dodgeroll, cloak, rally. 80% hp +

Thats soooo frustrating and players searching for ways to counter this. Hello steel tornado. And there we got another "meta" to complain about.

By giving cloak an cost increase after each use would reduce a lot of complains. Stamblade will have a harder time to sustain cloak and cant use it so frequently anymore. Magblades have a higher magicka pool and a higher regen to sustain this.

Dude I main a magnb. Ranged magnb every attack we have can be dodge rolled and can be reflected.

But I still say you put a 2-3 second cost timer on cloak like sorc, it will only hurt magnb.

But how should we else reduce the effectiveness of cloak?

You just say, that cost increase in Bad. Give an alternative then .

I dont think you need to alter cloak at all. Because, I keep saying it, cloak is not over performing. There is alot of other variables that go into why people think it is.