Obviously important thoughts from an old player

Ydrisselle · January 2019

MaleAmazon wrote: »

You will never feel like a newbie again, no matter what ZOS would change. Even if it would be new for some time, you'd feel the same in the long term.

Long term, sure. But this isn´t without precedent. Fallout 4´s survival mode rejuvenated that game for me. Same thing with the mod (I forget the name) for Oblivion that completely revamped the difficulty so that deeper levels of dungeons and overland areas far from roads had greatly more challenging monsters. Not only would they one-shot you, they´d send you flying. Literally. Obviously there is only so much a difficulty increase can do. However - if I needed to respond to enemies during quests even somewhat like I have to do in vMA, I really do think it would make a large difference. When I have hairy fights ESO can be fast-paced and engaging. There is just something wrong when those fights don´t come versus storyline bosses, but when I solo the gryphons word bosses in suboptimal gear.

If you have quests with the difficulty of vMA, you will have a lot of players who simply can't complete them. And they will either complain in the forum/in-game chat or simply quit ESO. I know that ZOS don't really tell us stats, but I'm curios how many percent of the accounts - no, not the characters - have started vMA... I know that I haven't.

dazee · January 2019

Other mmos are boilerplate MMOs. if ESO went back to that model it would no longer interest me nor any other player who has better options. and we all have better options for boilerplate MMOs. ESO is the only good choice for modern mmo.

SkysOutThizeOut · January 2019

Hybrids are in a good spot. Don’t mess with pelinials.

Tholian1 · January 2019

I don’t understand these experienced vets that are still questing as if they are new to the game. Why aren’t they in veteran hard mode dungeons and trials? That is the content that is made especially for them, and doesn’t interfere with ZOS’s ability to sell as many new chapters to new players as possible.

It’s like college students going back to kindergarten and complaining that it is too easy for them.

Sylvermynx · January 2019

I expect that there are many who simply don't find vet hard mode dungeons and trials etc. fun. I wouldn't. Fun is different things to everyone. after all.

validifyedneb18_ESO · January 2019

Tholian1 wrote: »

I don’t understand these experienced vets that are still questing as if they are new to the game. Why aren’t they in veteran hard mode dungeons and trials? That is the content that is made especially for them, and doesn’t interfere with ZOS’s ability to sell as many new chapters to new players as possible.

It’s like college students going back to kindergarten and complaining that it is too easy for them.

Because sometimes people want to do things other than just dungeons, bigger dungeons, or PVP?

Tholian1 · January 2019

validifyedneb18_ESO wrote: »

Tholian1 wrote: »

I don’t understand these experienced vets that are still questing as if they are new to the game. Why aren’t they in veteran hard mode dungeons and trials? That is the content that is made especially for them, and doesn’t interfere with ZOS’s ability to sell as many new chapters to new players as possible.

It’s like college students going back to kindergarten and complaining that it is too easy for them.

Because sometimes people want to do things other than just dungeons, bigger dungeons, or PVP?

Well I don’t see how that would be possible without splitting up the player base again. When I’m out farming nodes, I still see brand new players struggle with overland content that I can easily defeat with a couple button presses.

Vapirko · January 2019

Aside from a few fundamental flaws, many of them being an issue because of lag of the most part, PvP is very balanced right now. I hear a lot of people still going on about broken builds, but what exactly are you referring to? 7th and Fury? If it were possible to somehow have all things equal (lag, skill level) I would happily fight someone wearing this combo 1v1 on my medium Stamplar. I guarantee it would give them no real advantage over my build. If you're talking about this build in group play, well again its prob not so much the build as it is getting lagged out by a group spamming skill and ultimate dumping. And I will say that the whole AOE snare/AoE damage tank ball group meta is out of hand but thats not really because of OP builds.

I hate stealth snipers, and I know its easy to get kills this way because Ive tried it, and even I would say that I would barely care less about snipe if it wasn't for the damn lag and health desyncs that go with it. It's a terrible Xv1 tool that really puts a damper in what should be a good fight but hey, thats the risk you run going 1vX.

So while the rest of your assessment seems pretty spot on, I don't really understand what you're referring to about broken builds in PvP, as many good players think its pretty damn balanced, and a lot of knowledgeable streamers, YTubers have said the same. And I may be a bit ignorant as to what's out there, but I haven't really run into any broken builds since the Sloads/Enchant proc debacles. I see a lot of good medium armor builds being put out there, class diversity isn't too bad, if it wasn't for the fact that the servers feel like they're going to melt down at any point then things would be pretty good.

dazee · January 2019

This game is being marketed for RP'ers and casuals that will buy a lot and leave after doing the latest chapters content.

God forbid an mmoRPG cater to RPers!

Nyladreas · January 2019

MajBludd wrote: »

Vigor should stay where it is. It doesn't take long to get it through running bgs. It takes a lot less time to unlock it then it did in the past. In BG's you get about 7-10k ap per bg. No need to move it.

You just like to slaughter defenseless newbies, don't you, ya bastud!

Ogou · January 2019

MajBludd wrote: »

@Oguo how long have you played eso? We're you here for the CE meteor spam, flying players?

Also, are you telling me they didn't ask 6k crowns for welkynar?

I don't pve, repeating content over and over is not fun to me and many others. I don't care how fast you can beat VDSA or any other trial. What I care about is persistent issues being fixed over making crown store junk, dont you?

@MajBludd I've been here since the closed beta in 2013. And I don't see how any of this shows that ZOS only cares about casual players or that they don't care about PvP.
So what you want is for ZOS to fix the PvP bugs. That is an understandable request, but instead of saying that you're making unfounded claims and diminishing the achievements of people playing the game differently. I wonder why more people don't support you.

Adernath · January 2019

Tholian1 wrote: »

I don’t understand these experienced vets that are still questing as if they are new to the game. Why aren’t they in veteran hard mode dungeons and trials? That is the content that is made especially for them, and doesn’t interfere with ZOS’s ability to sell as many new chapters to new players as possible.

It’s like college students going back to kindergarten and complaining that it is too easy for them.

Yea, its not enough that we already have 90% kindergarten... we need more, every patch!

Kindergarten for everyone!

AlienatedGoat · January 2019

I think my #1 wanted feature is a vet overland option. I simply don't enjoy overland content anymore because it is stupidly easy.

Even on a new alt with crappy dropped gear, I still just have too much experience under my belt for overland to even stand a chance. It's just so boring.

It's incredibly sad that I can't enjoy 95% of the game because it is too easy and not adjusted for vets like me.

I'm not asking that overland be changed for everyone else.

Just add an option to make it harder for the vets (preferably with an added reward for the risk).

MaleAmazon · January 2019

I don’t understand these experienced vets that are still questing as if they are new to the game. Why aren’t they in veteran hard mode dungeons and trials? That is the content that is made especially for them, and doesn’t interfere with ZOS’s ability to sell as many new chapters to new players as possible.

*Cathy Newman voice on* So you´re saying that those of us who have played since launch should just forget about a reasonable challenge in Morrowind, Clockwork and Summerset, DLC which we paid for?

If you argue that they should change how it is accessed because some people dont want to put in a couple of hours (tops) of playing content that isnt thier preferred type then holy hell man. Think monster sets, vma weapons, trial sets and jewellery.... where does that end. Especially since it is so EASY to get.

Vigor is just a small gripe that I have when I level alts. I don´t like grinding overall, but it is the fact that you need to grind for it in multiplayer, thus directly affecting other players. "Meh IDC I´m only here for vigor" isn´t exactly contributing to a healthy AvAvA environment.

So while the rest of your assessment seems pretty spot on, I don't really understand what you're referring to about broken builds in PvP, as many good players think its pretty damn balanced, and a lot of knowledgeable streamers, YTubers have said the same.

Well, I don´t personally think they are that broken, but I mean... it is after all a very stats-dependent game. And it is annoying to fight someone where you obviously don´t stand a chance simply because of the builds (have glass cannon and take out 80% of enemy HP only to have them constantly reheal in 2 seconds etc). But I am not personally bothered, much, by it - I am simply saying Cyrodiil is inherently imbalanced since there is no rule about an equal amount of team members, you can go in with any gear and CP you want, and so on. And the people who do whine about this whine loudly.

ezio45 · January 2019

overland
quest log
hot keys
vigor: dont care skipped

champion points: has nothing to do with why hybrid builds are unusable. Hybrid builds are unusable because of how builds work at there core. You cant have a stam and mag pool large enough to sustain trying to build them both. never going to get high spell and phys dmg. Its because they are separate stats with share ways of getting them higher

Racials hell no. This is a tes game, raciasl have always been part of tes games. you want to kill build diversity even more? take out all the passives right now and let ppl pick 3, everyone and there mother that it is mag dps would pick the 10% mag from highelf, regen from highelf and dark elf fire. I dont even care if they made new passives and let you pick 3, 3 of them would always out shine the rest for a specific role.

Hybrid builds: see champ points above

Cyro:

I dont know why your talking about this because you either hate cryo, which if so thats fine. not everything in eso is for everyone. I despise overland and dungeons. I dont do them. Or you have no clue what your talking about.

Ill agree with you that perfect balance isnt a thing. However If you have been playing half as long as you say you should know that balance is at an all time low. Stam has massive advantages. Heavy armor is the only usable type. stamblades and snipe build are insta killing players before they can fight back. Spin to win cheese killing regardless of player skill. Its perfect balance ever going to happen, no but i have seen it alot better than this. It is also not specific to cyro. Game balance for pve is also terrible, with 1 class dominating endgame dps roles. No you are also never going to balance group size but again it has been better than this. Smaller zergs that were skilled and well coordinated using strategy could over power larger zergs. Now everything is skillless, its about the larger size grp with more cancer builds.

Lag: cyro wasnt always a lagging mess. Zos did that and they can very easily undo it. Performance in cyro immediately took a nose dive after the anti bot patch. If any other game had fps for players across the board in the <10 fps range it would be a massive problem. Its not cyro players fault, at launch thins game was capable of handling 100s of players on screen. Zos did this, its not on the players, they need to fix it.

Why should anyone listen to pvpers about improving the game? Because we above anyone in this game know how far it has fallen. We can tell you every single miss step from zos were they went dont the wrong road. We know that performance got worse after the bot patch, it hurt us before everyone else. We know balance for pve and pvp is at an all time low because we see first hand. We see that the skill from this game and build diversity is gone. A brain dead boss ai does require skill to beat. Another player does. We can tell you pvp pop has gotten worse and worse since they removed faction locking and the fun is going too. Because everyone playing for one side farming the fraction loyals over and over isnt fun. Massive army against arm battles with strategy, upsets, unforeseen outcomes. That is what made this game fun 5 yrs ago

More importantly the people who are most unsatisfied with the world are the ones to bring about its greatest improvements

Also, I dont listen to or trust people in health care. they only bother to fix things when it means they get payed

Hotdog_23 · January 2019

VaranisArano wrote: »

I have some thoughts about your thoughts.

Overlnd difficulty is the way it is because ESO doesnt have a good tutorial for how to play the game. You learn how to do basic mechanics once in the tutorial, never learn from the game itself how to do am effective DPS rotation, and most of the "learning how to actually play the game" comes from other players. The Skills Advisor and Level Up tips are steps in the right direction, but they are bot sufficient if you want the overland difficulty increased.

Moreover, making the overland difficulty hard faces two challenges. Either ZOS does it in a simplistic way of just making enemies hit harder and have more HP, in which case you could have just debuffed yourself to get the same result, or ZOS has to be convinced there's enough profit in actually overhauling overland with new enemies with more challenging mechanics to make it worth the effort.

As for Vigor, its unlocked through PVP because PVP is the only content in the game aside from Maelstrom Arena where a stamina character can expect to need healing without a magicka healer in the group.

I agree with everything you said except the part about vigor. I would like to see in move to the fighters guild skill line because I believe stam players do need some sort of heal if playing solo.

pieratsos · January 2019

So first you "complain" about easy overland content and people not learning how to play the game and then you defend mechanics, sets etc that carry people and reward them for not knowing how to play the game. This is really confusing.

FierceSam · January 2019

Good thread, lots of interesting comments

Overland difficulty is a challenge. I can remember when I was starting out I had a major roadblock with this one L19 questboss. Yes, I know, L19. Just could not beat it. Over and over, rage quit after rage quit. Almost stopped playing the game. Had to go off and practice a bit until, eventually, I beat them. Can’t imagine I would have continued with the game if it had been any harder. On the other hand, being more experienced, while I enjoyed the story and the experience of Summerset, I had no difficulty with any of the overland fights bar the world bosses, so I get the need for there to be some kind of challenge for more experienced players, whether they are playing CP 810 characters or new toons. But I think you have to accept that once you can easily kill goblins, you aren’t going to find killing goblins a huge challenge.

For me, the balance is best in Murkmire, where the two world bosses present the right level of difficulty - there are clear, well thought out and easily understandable mechanics that don’t simply rely on avoiding one-shots (the go-to mechanic of the truly lazy developer), there’s a basic dps requirement and a certain amount of rotation skill and practice required to solo the boss. I find them continually satisfying whatever level of toon I am playing, certainly they are way more accomplished and well developed than the ones in Summerset. For me, this seems to be the best way to provide engaging content for experienced players.

Vigor and its friend Caltrops are a total pita. The way to get me involved and enjoying PvP is to encourage me in, not to force me to do it on all my toons just to get these essential skills. There should be some parallel way to get these in PvE - maybe via Maelstrom Arena or BRP. Filling Cyrodiil and Battlegrounds with inexperienced players with non-PvP gear, who don’t want to be there is the wrong way of getting them into PvP.

The tutorials in game are fundamentally useless and not fit for purpose. If they were any good, there would be practice areas where players could learn and refine their abilities with in-game feedback, so they would actually learn about the effects of light attacking, heavy attacking, blocking and interrupting. Being taught how to play should be an integral part of the game not an opional extra. Instead players are basically forced to learn through dying (the worst possible learning experience). This failure to teach on ZOS’s part contributes to many players’ reluctance to do group content for fear of appearing ‘not good enough’. And, I guess, it has a major impact on why the overland content is the way it is.

Oh and while we are ranting, I have to say that the Mac client for this game is f****** rancid, crashes regularly on the hour or when you change zones and is a total disgrace. Given ESO is apparently the top grossing game on Steam, this is inexcusable. Rant over.

Respect to all and enjoy the game.

MaleAmazon · January 2019

You cant have a stam and mag pool large enough to sustain trying to build them both. never going to get high spell and phys dmg. Its because they are separate stats with share ways of getting them higher

Tristats and triune give more in total than single-stat items, and Pelinal can boost your spell damage. And being able to draw from 2 pools is a benefit. So no, they can be viable. However CP makes them less so.

Racials hell no. This is a tes game, raciasl have always been part of tes games. you want to kill build diversity even more?

Yeah, they have been a part, along with classes etc... you know, the stuff they keep getting rid of more and more with each new RPG they make.

Racials add nothing to build diversity. The only thing they do is limit build diversity so that ZOS can sell race change tokens and additional character slot tokens. Give me one example of 2 high elf builds that don´t have the exact same racial passives by endgame. Ofc you can´t. You put the points in the passives and that´s it. No skill choice, no build diversity, only additional revenue from minmaxers while gimping RPers and people who want to redo their character´s role.

So first you "complain" about easy overland content and people not learning how to play the game and then you defend mechanics, sets etc that carry people and reward them for not knowing how to play the game. This is really confusing.

In no way do you need a set to carry you through overland content. Also I never 'defended' any set, besides saying that people who complain about Sload´s on youtube come across as pathetic. Which they do.

The tutorials in game are fundamentally useless and not fit for purpose.

Indeed. IIRC you only get a single prompt teaching you to block, one to interrupt, and that´s it.

The combination of the lack of clear information - what is a melee attack? how do bleeds work? what is direct damage? and the lack of needing to actually know these game mechanics creates this situation.

Still, I have to say ZOS have addressed this. DLC dungeons now consistently have small parts that give you hints to boss mechanics - the short passage with the crabs attacking you when you have the spice on you in Ruins of Mazzatun for example.

However my experience has been that many people are elitist in situations like this - when ppl don´t know mechanics already they get insulted and kicked. Conversely many people can for one reason or another simply not take instructions. The divide between casual and veteran player here is simply huge.

I had one great experience in vRoM PUG though, when we needed to teach one guy who only spoke german the last boss mechanics. I´ve forgotten most of my high school german so another teammember basically copypasted the information in english into google translate and then we pasted it in chat. We did win in the end

EDIT: The in-game help system DOES actually teach you quite a lot of things now, I believe it has gotten a lot better since launch. Though maybe it was always this way and I just misremember.

pieratsos · January 2019

MaleAmazon wrote: »

In no way do you need a set to carry you through overland content. Also I never 'defended' any set, besides saying that people who complain about Sload´s on youtube come across as pathetic. Which they do.

At least try to understand before you respond. Sloads is the one carrying people in PVP. Sloads and oblivion dmg in general is the definition of "no skill involved". Thats why people complain about sloads. Because people dont even have to think when using crap like that. Which ironically is the one thing you complain when it comes to overland. That people dont even have to L2P. And you find them pathetic? lol

MaleAmazon · January 2019

At least try to understand before you respond.

Don´t assume, don´t try to insult me. It won´t stick.

Sloads is the one carrying people in PVP. Sloads and oblivion dmg in general is the definition of "no skill involved". Thats why people complain about sloads. Because people dont even have to think when using crap like that. Which ironically is the one thing you complain when it comes to overland. That people dont even have to L2P. And you find them pathetic? lol

This is probably wasted but well I have 5 minutes so why not. I am probably older than most here, maybe not wiser but at least I have some perspective. So:

First of all there is essentially no difference between Oblivion damage and any other damage glyph aside from the fact that oblivion damage does more damage in PvP. Some people don´t like that, whatever - but don´t tell me there is 'skill' involved in putting points into the vampire damage mitigation passive... and yes, maybe some other time we can go into the amazing skill and technique involved in "using poison damage glyph" and "googling Alcast". As for Sload´s prenerf, it seemed mostly to be a problem for people who got wins by targeting groups of newbies. Sometimes the best sets and skills don´t require advanced knowledge, sometimes they do. Sload´s wasn´t worse than Red Mountain or Viper. People complaining about "heavy armor cancer builds" are the same kind of people who a few years back went "OMG heavy armor is so useless ZOS don´t play their own game destroy TES franchise".

Second, ESO is not exactly a game about combat 'skill'. I don´t even remember the last time I was surprised or truly outplayed in PvP. And vice versa, it is just a handful of situations I remember when I truly outthought my opponent. 95% of people seem to basically play the meta.

Third, the issue with overland isn´t about sets but that power creep etc means that people do not need to understand basic game concepts like "blocking". You can mow through overland in unupgraded sets that are considered useless by your average elitist.

Fourth, the reasonable adult response to something like Sload´s is not to make a 20 minute video about how the game was destroyed by idiot devs. And last time I checked this game has an 18+ year age limit on it. If you do not understand this you need to get out more.

Which come to think of it is what I´m gonna do now.

FrancisCrawford · January 2019

VaranisArano wrote: »

As for Vigor, its unlocked through PVP because PVP is the only content in the game aside from Maelstrom Arena where a stamina character can expect to need healing without a magicka healer in the group.

It's still hard to solo a public dungeon or a dolmen without self-heals.

Callous2208 · January 2019

FrancisCrawford wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

As for Vigor, its unlocked through PVP because PVP is the only content in the game aside from Maelstrom Arena where a stamina character can expect to need healing without a magicka healer in the group.

It's still hard to solo a public dungeon or a dolmen without self-heals.

I usually have repentance or something slotted for easier stuff like dolmens and pub dungeons and forget about vigor. But, your statement is true.

Smitch_59 · January 2019

Good discussion. Just one point about vigor and caltrops. I've been playing for over 3 years and none of my characters have vigor or caltrops. I've learned to live without them, but I may try BGs during Midyear Mayhem. Just to get vigor and maybe caltrops.

I'm going to suck so bad, my teammates will hate me! I can't wait!

Callous2208 · January 2019

Smitch_59 wrote: »

Good discussion. Just one point about vigor and caltrops. I've been playing for over 3 years and none of my characters have vigor or caltrops. I've learned to live without them, but I may try BGs during Midyear Mayhem. Just to get vigor and maybe caltrops.

I'm going to suck so bad, my teammates will hate me! I can't wait!

Look into the login rewards as well and the ap you get. Try and grab it on who you want to level the alliance skill line on. There is also a very simple quest when you first get to Cyrodiil that offers a decent ap reward.

MaleAmazon · January 2019

Look into the login rewards as well and the ap you get. Try and grab it on who you want to level the alliance skill line on. There is also a very simple quest when you first get to Cyrodiil that offers a decent ap reward.

Yeah. Also, if you detest PvP, you can go into a less populated campaign and do the scout quest and the daily quests at the towns in Cyrodiil. They don´t give a lot of AP, but there is a commensurate lowering of the risk to get nuked and teabagged.

pieratsos · January 2019

MaleAmazon wrote: »

Don´t assume, don´t try to insult me. It won´t stick.

I didnt try to insult you. I dont feel the need to. You just simply didnt understand and i told you to read again.

MaleAmazon wrote: »

This is probably wasted but well I have 5 minutes so why not. I am probably older than most here, maybe not wiser but at least I have some perspective. So:

First of all there is essentially no difference between Oblivion damage and any other damage glyph aside from the fact that oblivion damage does more damage in PvP. Some people don´t like that, whatever - but don´t tell me there is 'skill' involved in putting points into the vampire damage mitigation passive... and yes, maybe some other time we can go into the amazing skill and technique involved in "using poison damage glyph" and "googling Alcast". As for Sload´s prenerf, it seemed mostly to be a problem for people who got wins by targeting groups of newbies. Sometimes the best sets and skills don´t require advanced knowledge, sometimes they do. Sload´s wasn´t worse than Red Mountain or Viper. People complaining about "heavy armor cancer builds" are the same kind of people who a few years back went "OMG heavy armor is so useless ZOS don´t play their own game destroy TES franchise".

Second, ESO is not exactly a game about combat 'skill'. I don´t even remember the last time I was surprised or truly outplayed in PvP. And vice versa, it is just a handful of situations I remember when I truly outthought my opponent. 95% of people seem to basically play the meta.

Third, the issue with overland isn´t about sets but that power creep etc means that people do not need to understand basic game concepts like "blocking". You can mow through overland in unupgraded sets that are considered useless by your average elitist.

Fourth, the reasonable adult response to something like Sload´s is not to make a 20 minute video about how the game was destroyed by idiot devs. And last time I checked this game has an 18+ year age limit on it. If you do not understand this you need to get out more.

Which come to think of it is what I´m gonna do now.

There is absolutely huge difference between oblivion dmg and any other type of dmg. Well apart from bleeds. Bleeds are not far behind. Oblivion dmg literally ignores every single defensive mechanic. It literally has no counter. Its not about making a super competitive game or stuff like that. But you still have to draw the line somewhere. When the "worst" player in the game who has no clue about game mechanics, dont know how stats scale, how to break free and generally has no idea about the game can force huge amounts of dmg on the most "skilled" players in the game by just light attacking then you have a problem. A huge problem.

If players are taking it out on devs its because they deserve it. PVP is literally getting worse every patch both in terms of performance and balance. They never learn from their mistakes which is clearly evident from sloads and generally the proc sets destroying PVP now when we already have a procalypse before and the worst thing is that there is zero communication about the huge problems it has apart from making some sick jokes that if players are lagging its not their problem. And no im not kidding. Instead of putting their s*** together and do something about the lag which destroyed the game, they are joking about it. But its the players that are pathetic? No mate, players are not pathetic, the state of PVP is pathetic and players naturally react to it cause they literally care more about the state of the game than devs themselves.

Stop talking to me about sets in overland. I never said anything about sets in overland content. I literally told you to go back and read again. And do you even realise the irony in ur complaints? You again complain about players not learning how to block because its easy and at the same time defend every skilless crap thrown in the game. How the hell do you expect people to learn combat mechanics like block etc when crap like oblivion dmg renders them useless? Its literally the exact same concept. That was my point and you still dont get it.

AndyMac · January 2019

Great post.

Overland content has been hard coded at new player difficulty level because that's where the revenue growth is. New players = new money, so they can't have them getting stomped just wandering around or beginning to progress through the game. They will just quit.

I've played since beta myself and I definitely found the game far more fun when it was more difficult. Old Crag and the Caldwell's Gold zones were brutal, but a lot of fun. That said, players voted with their feet and these zones were almost always empty. Caldwell's gold zones were pretty much a solo game.

So, sadly, I don't see overland difficulty changing.

Hopefully ZOS can provide some hard challenging content for largely solo players to bring back some fun - like another solo arena for us to work on or solo mode for DLC dungeons. That's about as happy a medium as we are likely to see, imo.

Adernath · January 2019

AndyMac wrote: »

I've played since beta myself and I definitely found the game far more fun when it was more difficult. Old Crag and the Caldwell's Gold zones were brutal, but a lot of fun. That said, players voted with their feet and these zones were almost always empty. Caldwell's gold zones were pretty much a solo game.

So, sadly, I don't see overland difficulty changing.

Hopefully ZOS can provide some hard challenging content for largely solo players to bring back some fun - like another solo arena for us to work on or solo mode for DLC dungeons. That's about as happy a medium as we are likely to see, imo.

Yes, in my opinion it was only necessary to increase the respawn timers of the mob groups a bit more and significantly improve the rewards in the vet zones.

Finviuswe · January 2019

AndyMac wrote: »

Great post.

Overland content has been hard coded at new player difficulty level because that's where the revenue growth is. New players = new money, so they can't have them getting stomped just wandering around or beginning to progress through the game. They will just quit.

I've played since beta myself and I definitely found the game far more fun when it was more difficult. Old Crag and the Caldwell's Gold zones were brutal, but a lot of fun. That said, players voted with their feet and these zones were almost always empty. Caldwell's gold zones were pretty much a solo game.

So, sadly, I don't see overland difficulty changing.

Hopefully ZOS can provide some hard challenging content for largely solo players to bring back some fun - like another solo arena for us to work on or solo mode for DLC dungeons. That's about as happy a medium as we are likely to see, imo.

I'd almost disagree with with this bro, and this is much of what I've been driving at, which is, no.

The sub model is what drives profits in the long-run. Period.

The sub model has the power to keep customers for decades, the F2P model keeps people for weeks. The difference of power between the two models absolutely cannot be understated