Remove quick mending for argonian

zaria · November 2018

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

The point is ZOS said this:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/445615/combat-update-in-u21-a-new-approach/p1

ZOS_RobGarrett wrote: »

Hi all,
While we aren’t ready to share specific details yet, here’s a peek at the goals driving the team’s effort:
When selecting a race, players should have multiple effective options for any given gameplay role.

The combat power provided by each race should be more equalized.

Players should feel a stronger sense of power progression through racial passives as they level up.

The unique feeling and flavor each race provides should be retained and enhanced where possible, and remain faithful to established lore.

So basically they are going to keep each race "theme" but you will be able to be equally effective in all roles. I hope that means buffs not nerfs.

^^ thanks for that ^

I guess all race balance will go nuts soon and probably my favorite races (nords, orcs, bosmers) will be buffed since they sxxx in PVE now badly (gigglin', rubbing hands)

I think it all know it would be mostly nerfs.

On the other hand ESO does racials totally wrong, they should not be power progression at all.
They should be starting bonuses like in Daggerfall Morrowind and Oblivion.

Its an starting bonus because of race. its very strong at low level, try play some of the weaker races like female Bosmer or Khajiit in Oblivion and you want to increase your strength fast simply to carry loot.
At higher level this goes away more and more.

In ESO its the other way around, its an end game bonus, all races start equal but at level 50 an Altmer has 10% more magic even if never cast an spell.
For more fun: In an competitive multiplayer game, and new players has no way to know the racial descriptions are pretty much the same as in Skyrim.

Kel · November 2018

ffs

BWS2K · November 2018

I love Argonians and, while I don't support semi-random nerfs inspired by salty minmaxers in a roleplaying game, I have to admit - Argonians aren't better healers in lore. They should keep the incoming healing buff, but the outgoing healing buff doesn't totally jive with them. I could suggest other things, like a better bonus to punching or stealth...

#argonian4life

Rohaus · November 2018

Wouldn’t it be awesome if ZOS did just that and buffed other races? Sadly it’s eaiser to nerf one class versus buff many...

MartiniDaniels · November 2018

PapaWeeb wrote: »

They are BIS for healing (with altmers) and completely OP for tanking. They are so powerful that hi-end argonian tank can ditch "tanking" sets and completely stick to support utility, leaving any build diversity not viable. If this is good, i'm Santa Claus.

All "high end" tanks stick to utility and support. Never seen Woeler? Khajiit tank?

[/quote]

This is all is obvious about khajits, sets, woelers, alcast etc, like obvious is that everyone wants argonian tank. You may do simple math to calculate that even without jewelry this ability far outshines any other race sustain and with jewelry it's simply hilarious. And even here nobody is telling that it is not OP. Counterarguments are all:
1. argonians sxxxed before, they earned to be BIS today
2. but altmer are better dps
3. any nerf is bad

Mettaricana · November 2018

If thays your logic then high elves should be nerfed for the best go to mag dps.

And redguards should be nerfed because they are the best go to for stam dps.

5% isnt that big a deal now that potion chugger passive is insane but its balanced due to theor crap max stats and recovery

Synnastix · November 2018

If any nerf just remove all racial passives. Shouldn’t be a racial bias anyway rite?

GreenhaloX · November 2018

Leave those poor argonians alone already. Haven't they not been oppressed, messed with and slaven enough?!

Paazhahdrimaak · November 2018

Ive been an argonian back before they were good.
I wasnt invited to groups because i was an argonian, this is when imperial city first dropped.
Keep them the way they are

MartiniDaniels · November 2018

Why you are not trying to argue that they are balanced and lizardfolk isn't more powerful then other "tank" races? I mean nords, orcs, which are suggested to be toughest of all races in lore?

alanmatillab16_ESO · November 2018

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

Come on, this not even funny

Indeed...get your head out of damage/heal meters and just play the game or do you want ESO to end up like WoW?

wenchmore420b14_ESO · November 2018

How bout just stop with the nerfs already!!!
#NOMORENERFS

evoniee · November 2018

Royaji wrote: »

I would say BiS healer, BiS tank and a very strong PvP race is pretty close to "BiS for EVERY role"

agreed sir
maybe just remove 5% healing taken and 3% max magicka

Silver_Strider · November 2018

Can no one actually make a well thought out and comprehensive argument anymore?
The argument that Argonians are OP because they are the best at support roles is asinine on the ground that Altmer, whom are equally as adapt at Healing as Argonian, are also BiS Magic DPS in almost every single regard with the only exception being Magic DK. If a race can't be good at 2 roles, Altmer are just as equally in need of a nerf as Argonian.

As for the argument about Quick to Mend, I wonder in what way is it OP. Overhealing in this game is practically a feature; it's expected to such a degree, there's a set that rewards you for doing it and how long was SPC meta before Olorime's dethroned it? What difference does it if Argonians overheal more than other races? Who is complaining that they're being healed too much that this "argument" has any merit at all NVM, I can already hear the PvPers typing about this, acting as though it's to help balance the game but the reality is that an Altmer or Breton is healing just as much as an Argonian while having higher damage to boot, the only trade off being Argonians are much more durable than either Breton or Altmer, which is a fair balance point. Nerfing Argonians would upset that balance so that argument still has no merits.

Now, I will admit, Argonians are a little too well off ATM, I won't deny it, which is why I ask that ZOS simply revert the One Tamriel change to the potion passive from a flat number back to a percentage again so people can shut up about Argonians already.

Cously · November 2018

Keep argonians as it is, ppl need motivation to play that ugly race. Buff other races.

killimandrosb16_ESO · November 2018

What about wood elfs and snipe? What about dark elf and magblades? What about orcs and stamDK? The problem isnt the races, its the meta, which currently invites all minimaxers to go with tanky and heavy armour. Argonians are best for magplar support class with cleanses and healing, but when it comes to dps theres other classes which are far better, especially stamina builds demand other classes. What needs to be done is buff the races which currently is less desireable (im looking at nords here), give magclasses better mobility by class design, not race design.
If you take a look at how some of the best players build their toons youll see the diversity in races, apart from Fengrush who will always go orc due to sentimental reasons, and hell, I think he manages just fine.

Valrien · November 2018

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

Aurielle wrote: »

Leave Argonians alone. They were, at one point, one of the most useless classes — second only to Nords. Why is it bad that there’s one race that has an edge over other races in a particular role? I would understand your complaint if Argonians were BIS for EVERY role, but they’re not.

They are BIS for healing (with altmers) and completely OP for tanking. They are so powerful that hi-end argonian tank can ditch "tanking" sets and completely stick to support utility, leaving any build diversity not viable. If this is good, i'm Santa Claus.

Tanks do that whether or not they're argonians. They've been doing that for years. Argonian hasn't affected this

MartiniDaniels · November 2018

Valrien wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

Aurielle wrote: »

Leave Argonians alone. They were, at one point, one of the most useless classes — second only to Nords. Why is it bad that there’s one race that has an edge over other races in a particular role? I would understand your complaint if Argonians were BIS for EVERY role, but they’re not.

They are BIS for healing (with altmers) and completely OP for tanking. They are so powerful that hi-end argonian tank can ditch "tanking" sets and completely stick to support utility, leaving any build diversity not viable. If this is good, i'm Santa Claus.

Tanks do that whether or not they're argonians. They've been doing that for years. Argonian hasn't affected this

That's why only argonians are welcome to high-end tanking

to use zero passive sustain and live on potions / synergies. There are no other viable builds, wear ebon/alkosh/torug, keep block, blow in horn, drink potions/trigger synergies.

D0PAMINE · November 2018

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

Valrien wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

Aurielle wrote: »

Leave Argonians alone. They were, at one point, one of the most useless classes — second only to Nords. Why is it bad that there’s one race that has an edge over other races in a particular role? I would understand your complaint if Argonians were BIS for EVERY role, but they’re not.

They are BIS for healing (with altmers) and completely OP for tanking. They are so powerful that hi-end argonian tank can ditch "tanking" sets and completely stick to support utility, leaving any build diversity not viable. If this is good, i'm Santa Claus.

Tanks do that whether or not they're argonians. They've been doing that for years. Argonian hasn't affected this

That's why only argonians are welcome to high-end tanking to use zero passive sustain and live on potions / synergies. There are no other viable builds, wear ebon/alkosh/torug, keep block, blow in horn, drink potions/trigger synergies.

Imo the Argonian passive works well to aid the group, maybe place that passive in the Alchemy skill line so all roles can get a bit of a break, maybe recalibrate it to be more effective with user made potions than it would be with trash pots. I don't agree that they're OP for tanking, just that they have better balance for it.

CrimsonGTX · November 2018

BWS2K wrote: »

I love Argonians and, while I don't support semi-random nerfs inspired by salty minmaxers in a roleplaying game, I have to admit - Argonians aren't better healers in lore. They should keep the incoming healing buff, but the outgoing healing buff doesn't totally jive with them. I could suggest other things, like a better bonus to punching or stealth...
#argonian4life

I agree, this always been something that bugged me because they aren't the best at restoration. Argonians should have the 'Reduces Sprint cost by 8% and increases Sprint speed by 6%' passive that orcs have, while keeping quick mending since they do restore health 10x faster as a unique passive in tes5, and replace the resourceful passive with something else. If anything Breton's or even Imperials(tes5) should have had that resourceful passive in their kit.

BWS2K · November 2018

CrimsonGTX wrote: »

BWS2K wrote: »

I love Argonians and, while I don't support semi-random nerfs inspired by salty minmaxers in a roleplaying game, I have to admit - Argonians aren't better healers in lore. They should keep the incoming healing buff, but the outgoing healing buff doesn't totally jive with them. I could suggest other things, like a better bonus to punching or stealth...
#argonian4life

I agree, this always been something that bugged me because they aren't the best at restoration. Argonians should have the 'Reduces Sprint cost by 8% and increases Sprint speed by 6%' passive that orcs have, while keeping quick mending since they do restore health 10x faster as a unique passive in tes5, and replace the resourceful passive with something else. If anything Breton's or even Imperials(tes5) should have had that resourceful passive in their kit.

Ah, yeah, that'd be cool. Something small like that would be totally reasonable. I have no mind at all for the Meta and so on but I absolutely could drop the Restoration staff buff and the part about outgoing healing and wouldn't mind at all.

peacenote · November 2018

I remember when Argonians weren't good. It's nice to see more people playing them, and I have had no urge to switch my healer to be an Argonian due to the advantage.

SydneyGrey · November 2018

Argonians are balanced by not having huge bonuses to total magicka/stamina, or to mag/stam regeneration outside of potions. Leave them alone.
Stop wanting to nerf everything.

Kurat · November 2018

Another nerf thread. This game has been nerfed enough already. Stop whining. If you think Argonians are so op then roll one yourself.
Leave poor lizards alone. First slavery now this. Quick mending and our potions are all that we have left. If you take them away as well then theres no point playing as lizard and we might as well jump off the cliff.

Skander · November 2018

Bretons, imperials, nords

Seems like Zenimax doesn't want humans in this game

MartiniDaniels · November 2018

SydneyGrey wrote: »

Argonians are balanced by not having huge bonuses to total magicka/stamina, or to mag/stam regeneration outside of potions. Leave them alone.
Stop wanting to nerf everything.

Lol wut?
Argonians get +9% to health, to their main base stat. Only Imperials, Redguard and Altmer got slightly more. Still, Imperials are underdog both in tanking and stamina dps and Altmer and Redguard are BIS. So in base resource Argonian are on BIS level while keeping best sustain and whopping +5/5%% to healing received/done. Basically, most imbalanced race of all 10, that is clear for everybody.

Rake · November 2018

remove all bonuses from all races
make them potatoes

Valrien · November 2018

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

SydneyGrey wrote: »

Argonians are balanced by not having huge bonuses to total magicka/stamina, or to mag/stam regeneration outside of potions. Leave them alone.
Stop wanting to nerf everything.

Lol wut?
Argonians get +9% to health, to their main base stat. Only Imperials, Redguard and Altmer got slightly more. Still, Imperials are underdog both in tanking and stamina dps and Altmer and Redguard are BIS. So in base resource Argonian are on BIS level while keeping best sustain and whopping +5/5%% to healing received/done. Basically, most imbalanced race of all 10, that is clear for everybody.

Psst, Dunmer is actually BiS unless you're a very specific spec of Sorcerer.

Just a correction

MartiniDaniels · November 2018

Valrien wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

SydneyGrey wrote: »

Argonians are balanced by not having huge bonuses to total magicka/stamina, or to mag/stam regeneration outside of potions. Leave them alone.
Stop wanting to nerf everything.

Lol wut?
Argonians get +9% to health, to their main base stat. Only Imperials, Redguard and Altmer got slightly more. Still, Imperials are underdog both in tanking and stamina dps and Altmer and Redguard are BIS. So in base resource Argonian are on BIS level while keeping best sustain and whopping +5/5%% to healing received/done. Basically, most imbalanced race of all 10, that is clear for everybody.

Psst, Dunmer is actually BiS unless you're a very specific spec of Sorcerer.

Just a correction

Correction to what? top builds for magsorcs and magblades are altmers.. well, magdk benefits more from dunmer, but that is magdk. Ok, let's put dunmer on altmer level (though altmer is excellent healer too), this doesn't change that argonian have same bonus to main stat like 3 BIS races, though they don't have such sustain (obviously dunmer don't have any) and healing.

Argonian is IMBA. I-M-B-A. You may argue about khajits, imperials and breton viability in comparison to mentioned above BIS and tell that bosmer and orc have their niche role in PVP, but non of them can be so good in so many roles like lizard.

templesus · November 2018

You've got to be flat out blind to not see that Argonian is getting nerfed in U21. You people arguing against nerfs should start to argue for the ones that aren't as bad. Would you rather keep the healing, or potion passive? I'd look at it like that.