Can someone from ZOS explain the magicka warden nerfs?

MLGProPlayer · September 2018

I'm really confused as to why you nerfed the weakest class in the game. They are parsing way behind the other magicka classes on PTS right now (they would have even without all the nerfs).

Could someone from the dev team please explain their logic and provide some evidence (like DPS parses) to justify their decisions?

Considering I paid money for this class, I demand some kind of customer service.

Thanks.

Rukzadlithau · September 2018

Deep Fissure should have kept the stun and received Major Breach as a buff.

One of the Swarm morphs should be magicka and have a Dot-Execute function similar to Poison Injection. The other should be a stamina morph with a snare that increases over time. (Effects increase the longer the insects feast on you)

Dive should set Off-Blance.

It‘s truly frustrating that there‘s no imagination behind the skills to create viable gameplay. The adjustments would be easy and not have hurt the ongoing magsorc/magnb meta that reigns.

Just so much potential wasted on the class for PVE/PVP.

Drygon · September 2018

Not to mention the lazy animation for Shalks.

And they can fix them so easly by buffing the frost dmg,

One Idea:
Icy Aura needs to be reworked, really, that ability is not even worth two skillpoints atm. Make it part of Glacial presence or remove it and add something else that will benefit the magicka warden as that is the spec that needs the most help like something called Shatter: When you deal critical frost direct damage to an imobilized target, it shatters receaving X DMG and gets debuffed with Minor Breach and Minor Fracture for X seconds. This ability can proc once every X seconds. This would buff both magicka warden and PVE warden tanks.

Instead on Advanced species Buff they should have buffed Piercing cold to buff only magicka wardens not stamdens.

MLGProPlayer · September 2018

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Wrobel

So, can we get an explanation?

titaniumdust · September 2018

They should buff piercing cold so that ice staves are more powerful than fire staves for wardens. Wardens get a 6% damage bonus to ice damage, but everyone gets an 8% bonus to single target skills from fire staves so fire is better. They should bump up the ice damage bonus to at least 10%, maybe 12% to account for dark elf fire bonuses. A lot of people in the class feedback threads wanted ice wardens to be viable. Increasing the piercing cold frost bonus would allow wardens to run ice blockade and have ice light attacks which at least gives us more than one source of ice damage and wouldn't interfere with the ice tanking skills.

StamWhipCultist · September 2018

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

I'm really confused as to why you nerfed the weakest class in the game. They are parsing way behind the other magicka classes on PTS right now (they would have even without all the nerfs).

Could someone from the dev team please explain their logic and provide some evidence (like DPS parses) to justify their decisions?

Considering I paid money for this class, I demand some kind of customer service.

Thanks.

You need to cry harder, see sorcs? They cried 24/7 like toddlers and zos reverted shield cast time to instant.

MLGProPlayer · September 2018

StamWhipCultist wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

I'm really confused as to why you nerfed the weakest class in the game. They are parsing way behind the other magicka classes on PTS right now (they would have even without all the nerfs).

Could someone from the dev team please explain their logic and provide some evidence (like DPS parses) to justify their decisions?

Considering I paid money for this class, I demand some kind of customer service.

Thanks.

You need to cry harder, see sorcs? They cried 24/7 like toddlers and zos reverted shield cast time to instant.

I guess you're right. It's too bad that most magden players have given up on the class and respecced. Who can blame them though after 15 months of inaction from ZOS (and now even nerfs)?

I will keep on crying though. Would be nice if the other 5-10 magden players who still remain joined in.

We can't let ZOS get away with selling us a product and then failing to supoort that product.

OtarTheMad · September 2018

I don't get how some of us can come up with these ideas to get Magdens back on track and good DPS but not OP and ZOS just can't.

@Buzo idea is pretty good (except swarm getting a stamina morph, stamdens are amazing and don't need help right now)

Someone else's idea of adding frost damage to one of the unpopular morphs to counter AB losing damage is good. Adjusting some of the passives so Frost damage is on par with other elemental damage is good. Magden just needs some pretty minor adjustments so they are at least not so far behind other classes.

I mean imagine where Magden would be if they gave one morph of Swarm an execute element, gave an unpopular Winter's Embrace skill some frost damage it didn't have, adjust Piercing Cold so it does a tad more damage (and Destro staff is effected by it) None of these changes would make Magden top DPS but would go a long way to them being on par with other magicka DPS.

Lake · September 2018

Tag the class reps.

Tonturri · September 2018

Buzo wrote: »

Deep Fissure should have kept the stun and received Major Breach as a buff.

One of the Swarm morphs should be magicka and have a Dot-Execute function similar to Poison Injection. The other should be a stamina morph with a snare that increases over time. (Effects increase the longer the insects feast on you)

Dive should set Off-Blance.

It‘s truly frustrating that there‘s no imagination behind the skills to create viable gameplay. The adjustments would be easy and not have hurt the ongoing magsorc/magnb meta that reigns.

Just so much potential wasted on the class for PVE/PVP.

This sums up my beef with the entire game. ZOS has shown a startling lack of creativity when it comes to skills. There's a heck-ton of just 'does damage' or 'heals' skills. Not many that actually feel unique - most just do one thing, one thing only, and in the most generic way possible.

Still though, I'm extremely pleased we can use Nature's Grasp on the bear pet again, as that's what drove me away from the class at the start. I believe they're increasing our dmg bonus from slotting animal companion skills from 2->3%, which is a not-insignificant buff (my setup is getting 5% more damage).

Drygon wrote: »

Not to mention the lazy animation for Shalks.

And they can fix them so easly by buffing the frost dmg,

One Idea:
Icy Aura needs to be reworked, really, that ability is not even worth two skillpoints atm. Make it part of Glacial presence or remove it and add something else that will benefit the magicka warden as that is the spec that needs the most help like something called Shatter: When you deal critical frost direct damage to an imobilized target, it shatters receaving X DMG and gets debuffed with Minor Breach and Minor Fracture for X seconds. This ability can proc once every X seconds. This would buff both magicka warden and PVE warden tanks.

Instead on Advanced species Buff they should have buffed Piercing cold to buff only magicka wardens not stamdens.

Probably better to have it when you deal critical frost direct damage to a chilled target, as bosses can't be immobilized insofar as I'm aware. Your version feels like it leans a bit too close towards sorcerer's Implosion in spirit - in that it's extremely useful in some scenarios, garbage everywhere else.

WTB frost DoT, too. Arctic Winds should, instead of a ticking PBAoE, apply a stacking DoT to everyone near you that increases up to a cap, but lingers even if the person is out of range. And keeps ticking even when refreshed - none of that ridiculous 'refreshing a dot cuts off ticks'.

LiquidPony · September 2018

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

I'm really confused as to why you nerfed the weakest class in the game. They are parsing way behind the other magicka classes on PTS right now (they would have even without all the nerfs).

Could someone from the dev team please explain their logic and provide some evidence (like DPS parses) to justify their decisions?

Considering I paid money for this class, I demand some kind of customer service.

Thanks.

What are other magicka specs parsing solo on the 6mil on PTS right now?

Maybe I just haven't figured out what to do with a sorc yet, but I'm parsing way higher on PTS with a magwarden than I am a magsorc.

It's a bit of cheese (Zaan + Trap), but that's where all of those super-high magblade parses come from. Admittedly I know absolutely nothing about magwarden, just created one on PTS a few days ago to see how it'd parse. I imagine that will go over 50k with a bit of tweaking (I know my Fetcher uptime is not good, I don't have a great "rotation"), easily well over that number using bi-stat food with someone providing orbs and ele.

Drygon · September 2018

LiquidPony wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

I'm really confused as to why you nerfed the weakest class in the game. They are parsing way behind the other magicka classes on PTS right now (they would have even without all the nerfs).

Could someone from the dev team please explain their logic and provide some evidence (like DPS parses) to justify their decisions?

Considering I paid money for this class, I demand some kind of customer service.

Thanks.

What are other magicka specs parsing solo on the 6mil on PTS right now?

Maybe I just haven't figured out what to do with a sorc yet, but I'm parsing way higher on PTS with a magwarden than I am a magsorc.

It's a bit of cheese (Zaan + Trap), but that's where all of those super-high magblade parses come from. Admittedly I know absolutely nothing about magwarden, just created one on PTS a few days ago to see how it'd parse. I imagine that will go over 50k with a bit of tweaking, easily well over that number using bi-stat food with someone providing orbs and ele.

Yes, well the problem is regarding diversity and the fun of the game. I've seen different builds perform simmilary on other classes but Magden needs the same cheese to score that high. We do not want to be top or anything just that the warden gets more versatility.

They can do that easly by moving the bonus from Advanced Species to Piercing Cold. At least that. A new passive in place of Icy Aura to help Frost DPS would be cool but IF the buff that Advanced species recieved is moved to Piercing cold ramping it up to 10% or even 12%, Magicka warden could be on the right road while keeping the stamina warden from getting any more stronger as it already is quite strong.

I know that many would worry about the bear beeing nerfed, and regarding that i think that the active Damage(The execute) should be reduced, but the bear auto attack dmg should be reverted to current live if the buff from Advanced species is replaced by a buff to Piercing cold.

This could also fix the frost staff problem.

@Joy_Division

Rukzadlithau · September 2018

LiquidPony wrote: »

What are other magicka specs parsing solo on the 6mil on PTS right now?

Maybe I just haven't figured out what to do with a sorc yet, but I'm parsing way higher on PTS with a magwarden than I am a magsorc.

It's a bit of cheese (Zaan + Trap), but that's where all of those super-high magblade parses come from. Admittedly I know absolutely nothing about magwarden, just created one on PTS a few days ago to see how it'd parse. I imagine that will go over 50k with a bit of tweaking (I know my Fetcher uptime is not good, I don't have a great "rotation"), easily well over that number using bi-stat food with someone providing orbs and ele.

@LiquidPony
Saying you‘re a newcomer to Magden and admitting the parse relies on cheese is not really helping the case. The parse itself is proof you’re more than aware how to rotate correctly on magicka and you’d achieve better results on the usual top specs - even if your rotation isn‘t great on them either. Also is your skill layout taking survivability into account or is it purely an utopian damage layout for parses?

The DPS problems Magden struggles with since release are still there and hurt build diversity. Magsorcs are top 2 for magicka DPS since Homestead, I‘m not really sure what changed apart from the shield adjustment that affects all mag dps equally. So I guess what you‘re subtly trying to say here is: „Supposedly underpowered Magden parses higher than supposedly overpowered Magsorc“. But why?

I still think Magden atleast needs my suggested changes to offer more diversity and viability for damageing. Both in PvE and PvP.

MLGProPlayer · September 2018

LiquidPony wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

I'm really confused as to why you nerfed the weakest class in the game. They are parsing way behind the other magicka classes on PTS right now (they would have even without all the nerfs).

Could someone from the dev team please explain their logic and provide some evidence (like DPS parses) to justify their decisions?

Considering I paid money for this class, I demand some kind of customer service.

Thanks.

What are other magicka specs parsing solo on the 6mil on PTS right now?

Maybe I just haven't figured out what to do with a sorc yet, but I'm parsing way higher on PTS with a magwarden than I am a magsorc.

It's a bit of cheese (Zaan + Trap), but that's where all of those super-high magblade parses come from. Admittedly I know absolutely nothing about magwarden, just created one on PTS a few days ago to see how it'd parse. I imagine that will go over 50k with a bit of tweaking (I know my Fetcher uptime is not good, I don't have a great "rotation"), easily well over that number using bi-stat food with someone providing orbs and ele.

~57k is pretty standard for the other magicka classes on PTS.

Vahrokh · September 2018

StamWhipCultist wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

I'm really confused as to why you nerfed the weakest class in the game. They are parsing way behind the other magicka classes on PTS right now (they would have even without all the nerfs).

Could someone from the dev team please explain their logic and provide some evidence (like DPS parses) to justify their decisions?

Considering I paid money for this class, I demand some kind of customer service.

Thanks.

You need to cry harder, see sorcs? They cried 24/7 like toddlers and zos reverted shield cast time to instant.

Let's conveniently forget how sorcs are a pure DPS class with zero utility and cannot respec into the top PvP spec, trial quality tank or trial quality healer.

MLGProPlayer · September 2018

Vahrokh wrote: »

StamWhipCultist wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

I'm really confused as to why you nerfed the weakest class in the game. They are parsing way behind the other magicka classes on PTS right now (they would have even without all the nerfs).

Could someone from the dev team please explain their logic and provide some evidence (like DPS parses) to justify their decisions?

Considering I paid money for this class, I demand some kind of customer service.

Thanks.

You need to cry harder, see sorcs? They cried 24/7 like toddlers and zos reverted shield cast time to instant.

Let's conveniently forget how sorcs are a pure DPS class with zero utility and cannot respec into the top PvP spec, trial quality tank or trial quality healer.

DPS is by far the most sought after role in all content (2-3x in dungeons and 8x in trials). Magden is literally useless in this role.

And warden tanks and healers were always second rate compared to DKs and templars, although they were viable.

Warden representation in vet trials was never higher than 4% while sorcs have always hovered around 20%, even when they weren't doing so well. To insinuate that sorcs' troubles come even close to what wardens are facing is laughable.

Joy_Division · September 2018

Drygon wrote: »

LiquidPony wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

I'm really confused as to why you nerfed the weakest class in the game. They are parsing way behind the other magicka classes on PTS right now (they would have even without all the nerfs).

Could someone from the dev team please explain their logic and provide some evidence (like DPS parses) to justify their decisions?

Considering I paid money for this class, I demand some kind of customer service.

Thanks.

What are other magicka specs parsing solo on the 6mil on PTS right now?

Maybe I just haven't figured out what to do with a sorc yet, but I'm parsing way higher on PTS with a magwarden than I am a magsorc.

It's a bit of cheese (Zaan + Trap), but that's where all of those super-high magblade parses come from. Admittedly I know absolutely nothing about magwarden, just created one on PTS a few days ago to see how it'd parse. I imagine that will go over 50k with a bit of tweaking, easily well over that number using bi-stat food with someone providing orbs and ele.

Yes, well the problem is regarding diversity and the fun of the game. I've seen different builds perform simmilary on other classes but Magden needs the same cheese to score that high. We do not want to be top or anything just that the warden gets more versatility.

They can do that easly by moving the bonus from Advanced Species to Piercing Cold. At least that. A new passive in place of Icy Aura to help Frost DPS would be cool but IF the buff that Advanced species recieved is moved to Piercing cold ramping it up to 10% or even 12%, Magicka warden could be on the right road while keeping the stamina warden from getting any more stronger as it already is quite strong.

I know that many would worry about the bear beeing nerfed, and regarding that i think that the active Damage(The execute) should be reduced, but the bear auto attack dmg should be reverted to current live if the buff from Advanced species is replaced by a buff to Piercing cold.

This could also fix the frost staff problem.

@Joy_Division

Our internal DPs testing (mostly done by @stileanima , who is a very strong warden player) came out differently than ZOS's (lower). Also we had a different interpretation of the data. Stiles has indicated that is is hard to simulate a raid environment and account for the differing variables so we're not 100% sure exactly where Warden DPS is.

The reps think that even if the numbers are kosher, we still believe warden game-play and options to get that DPS can be improved. We'd like a reform to Swarm, we'd rather not the bear to be hit with a nerf, we think more frost options should be made available, stuff like that. Passive cold damage is something to consider for sure, but pure damage wardens will go for lightning/inferno and I'm guessing that why the damage bonus went into advanced species because all warden interested in some sort of damage will use those. Just a guess though.

MLGProPlayer · September 2018

Joy_Division wrote: »

Drygon wrote: »

LiquidPony wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

I'm really confused as to why you nerfed the weakest class in the game. They are parsing way behind the other magicka classes on PTS right now (they would have even without all the nerfs).

Could someone from the dev team please explain their logic and provide some evidence (like DPS parses) to justify their decisions?

Considering I paid money for this class, I demand some kind of customer service.

Thanks.

What are other magicka specs parsing solo on the 6mil on PTS right now?

Maybe I just haven't figured out what to do with a sorc yet, but I'm parsing way higher on PTS with a magwarden than I am a magsorc.

It's a bit of cheese (Zaan + Trap), but that's where all of those super-high magblade parses come from. Admittedly I know absolutely nothing about magwarden, just created one on PTS a few days ago to see how it'd parse. I imagine that will go over 50k with a bit of tweaking, easily well over that number using bi-stat food with someone providing orbs and ele.

Yes, well the problem is regarding diversity and the fun of the game. I've seen different builds perform simmilary on other classes but Magden needs the same cheese to score that high. We do not want to be top or anything just that the warden gets more versatility.

They can do that easly by moving the bonus from Advanced Species to Piercing Cold. At least that. A new passive in place of Icy Aura to help Frost DPS would be cool but IF the buff that Advanced species recieved is moved to Piercing cold ramping it up to 10% or even 12%, Magicka warden could be on the right road while keeping the stamina warden from getting any more stronger as it already is quite strong.

I know that many would worry about the bear beeing nerfed, and regarding that i think that the active Damage(The execute) should be reduced, but the bear auto attack dmg should be reverted to current live if the buff from Advanced species is replaced by a buff to Piercing cold.

This could also fix the frost staff problem.

@Joy_Division

Our internal DPs testing (mostly done by @stileanima , who is a very strong warden player) came out differently than ZOS's (lower). Also we had a different interpretation of the data. Stiles has indicated that is is hard to simulate a raid environment and account for the differing variables so we're not 100% sure exactly where Warden DPS is.

The reps think that even if the numbers are kosher, we still believe warden game-play and options to get that DPS can be improved. We'd like a reform to Swarm, we'd rather not the bear to be hit with a nerf, we think more frost options should be made available, stuff like that. Passive cold damage is something to consider for sure, but pure damage wardens will go for lightning/inferno and I'm guessing that why the damage bonus went into advanced species because all warden interested in some sort of damage will use those. Just a guess though.

Pet damage will logically always come down in actual content. Any time a boss moves/teleports (forcing the bear to move to the new position as well), applies an AOE CC (knocking down the bear, for example), or kills the bear (forcing a lengthy re-spawn), you lose DPS.

Drygon · September 2018

Joy_Division wrote: »

Drygon wrote: »

LiquidPony wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

I'm really confused as to why you nerfed the weakest class in the game. They are parsing way behind the other magicka classes on PTS right now (they would have even without all the nerfs).

Could someone from the dev team please explain their logic and provide some evidence (like DPS parses) to justify their decisions?

Considering I paid money for this class, I demand some kind of customer service.

Thanks.

What are other magicka specs parsing solo on the 6mil on PTS right now?

Maybe I just haven't figured out what to do with a sorc yet, but I'm parsing way higher on PTS with a magwarden than I am a magsorc.

It's a bit of cheese (Zaan + Trap), but that's where all of those super-high magblade parses come from. Admittedly I know absolutely nothing about magwarden, just created one on PTS a few days ago to see how it'd parse. I imagine that will go over 50k with a bit of tweaking, easily well over that number using bi-stat food with someone providing orbs and ele.

Yes, well the problem is regarding diversity and the fun of the game. I've seen different builds perform simmilary on other classes but Magden needs the same cheese to score that high. We do not want to be top or anything just that the warden gets more versatility.

They can do that easly by moving the bonus from Advanced Species to Piercing Cold. At least that. A new passive in place of Icy Aura to help Frost DPS would be cool but IF the buff that Advanced species recieved is moved to Piercing cold ramping it up to 10% or even 12%, Magicka warden could be on the right road while keeping the stamina warden from getting any more stronger as it already is quite strong.

I know that many would worry about the bear beeing nerfed, and regarding that i think that the active Damage(The execute) should be reduced, but the bear auto attack dmg should be reverted to current live if the buff from Advanced species is replaced by a buff to Piercing cold.

This could also fix the frost staff problem.

@Joy_Division

Our internal DPs testing (mostly done by @stileanima , who is a very strong warden player) came out differently than ZOS's (lower). Also we had a different interpretation of the data. Stiles has indicated that is is hard to simulate a raid environment and account for the differing variables so we're not 100% sure exactly where Warden DPS is.

The reps think that even if the numbers are kosher, we still believe warden game-play and options to get that DPS can be improved. We'd like a reform to Swarm, we'd rather not the bear to be hit with a nerf, we think more frost options should be made available, stuff like that. Passive cold damage is something to consider for sure, but pure damage wardens will go for lightning/inferno and I'm guessing that why the damage bonus went into advanced species because all warden interested in some sort of damage will use those. Just a guess though.

Thanks, glad to see the problems are known. Now only if ZOS acknowledges them. I am aware that coding those abilities takes time and so the easiest thing they could do now is change Icy aura into a Frost dmg passive with only two ranks to code.

Still i won't complain if they fix Fetcher infection, make it act like an execute and i bet that i won't be the only one that will accept the trade-off we got with the cost increase and bear dmg reduced.

Cheers!

MLGProPlayer · September 2018

Drygon wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

Drygon wrote: »

LiquidPony wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

I'm really confused as to why you nerfed the weakest class in the game. They are parsing way behind the other magicka classes on PTS right now (they would have even without all the nerfs).

Could someone from the dev team please explain their logic and provide some evidence (like DPS parses) to justify their decisions?

Considering I paid money for this class, I demand some kind of customer service.

Thanks.

What are other magicka specs parsing solo on the 6mil on PTS right now?

Maybe I just haven't figured out what to do with a sorc yet, but I'm parsing way higher on PTS with a magwarden than I am a magsorc.

It's a bit of cheese (Zaan + Trap), but that's where all of those super-high magblade parses come from. Admittedly I know absolutely nothing about magwarden, just created one on PTS a few days ago to see how it'd parse. I imagine that will go over 50k with a bit of tweaking, easily well over that number using bi-stat food with someone providing orbs and ele.

Yes, well the problem is regarding diversity and the fun of the game. I've seen different builds perform simmilary on other classes but Magden needs the same cheese to score that high. We do not want to be top or anything just that the warden gets more versatility.

They can do that easly by moving the bonus from Advanced Species to Piercing Cold. At least that. A new passive in place of Icy Aura to help Frost DPS would be cool but IF the buff that Advanced species recieved is moved to Piercing cold ramping it up to 10% or even 12%, Magicka warden could be on the right road while keeping the stamina warden from getting any more stronger as it already is quite strong.

I know that many would worry about the bear beeing nerfed, and regarding that i think that the active Damage(The execute) should be reduced, but the bear auto attack dmg should be reverted to current live if the buff from Advanced species is replaced by a buff to Piercing cold.

This could also fix the frost staff problem.

@Joy_Division

Our internal DPs testing (mostly done by @stileanima , who is a very strong warden player) came out differently than ZOS's (lower). Also we had a different interpretation of the data. Stiles has indicated that is is hard to simulate a raid environment and account for the differing variables so we're not 100% sure exactly where Warden DPS is.

The reps think that even if the numbers are kosher, we still believe warden game-play and options to get that DPS can be improved. We'd like a reform to Swarm, we'd rather not the bear to be hit with a nerf, we think more frost options should be made available, stuff like that. Passive cold damage is something to consider for sure, but pure damage wardens will go for lightning/inferno and I'm guessing that why the damage bonus went into advanced species because all warden interested in some sort of damage will use those. Just a guess though.

Thanks, glad to see the problems are known. Now only if ZOS acknowledges them. I am aware that coding those abilities takes time and so the easiest thing they could do now is change Icy aura into a Frost dmg passive with only two ranks to code.

Still i won't complain if they fix Fetcher infection, make it act like an execute and i bet that i won't be the only one that will accept the trade-off we got with the cost increase and bear dmg reduced.

Cheers!

Get rid of the damage nerf to eternal guardian and reduce the cost/increase the effectiveness of swarm and we're good to go.

Drygon · September 2018

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Drygon wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

Drygon wrote: »

LiquidPony wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

I'm really confused as to why you nerfed the weakest class in the game. They are parsing way behind the other magicka classes on PTS right now (they would have even without all the nerfs).

Could someone from the dev team please explain their logic and provide some evidence (like DPS parses) to justify their decisions?

Considering I paid money for this class, I demand some kind of customer service.

Thanks.

What are other magicka specs parsing solo on the 6mil on PTS right now?

Maybe I just haven't figured out what to do with a sorc yet, but I'm parsing way higher on PTS with a magwarden than I am a magsorc.

It's a bit of cheese (Zaan + Trap), but that's where all of those super-high magblade parses come from. Admittedly I know absolutely nothing about magwarden, just created one on PTS a few days ago to see how it'd parse. I imagine that will go over 50k with a bit of tweaking, easily well over that number using bi-stat food with someone providing orbs and ele.

Yes, well the problem is regarding diversity and the fun of the game. I've seen different builds perform simmilary on other classes but Magden needs the same cheese to score that high. We do not want to be top or anything just that the warden gets more versatility.

They can do that easly by moving the bonus from Advanced Species to Piercing Cold. At least that. A new passive in place of Icy Aura to help Frost DPS would be cool but IF the buff that Advanced species recieved is moved to Piercing cold ramping it up to 10% or even 12%, Magicka warden could be on the right road while keeping the stamina warden from getting any more stronger as it already is quite strong.

I know that many would worry about the bear beeing nerfed, and regarding that i think that the active Damage(The execute) should be reduced, but the bear auto attack dmg should be reverted to current live if the buff from Advanced species is replaced by a buff to Piercing cold.

This could also fix the frost staff problem.

@Joy_Division

Our internal DPs testing (mostly done by @stileanima , who is a very strong warden player) came out differently than ZOS's (lower). Also we had a different interpretation of the data. Stiles has indicated that is is hard to simulate a raid environment and account for the differing variables so we're not 100% sure exactly where Warden DPS is.

The reps think that even if the numbers are kosher, we still believe warden game-play and options to get that DPS can be improved. We'd like a reform to Swarm, we'd rather not the bear to be hit with a nerf, we think more frost options should be made available, stuff like that. Passive cold damage is something to consider for sure, but pure damage wardens will go for lightning/inferno and I'm guessing that why the damage bonus went into advanced species because all warden interested in some sort of damage will use those. Just a guess though.

Thanks, glad to see the problems are known. Now only if ZOS acknowledges them. I am aware that coding those abilities takes time and so the easiest thing they could do now is change Icy aura into a Frost dmg passive with only two ranks to code.

Still i won't complain if they fix Fetcher infection, make it act like an execute and i bet that i won't be the only one that will accept the trade-off we got with the cost increase and bear dmg reduced.

Cheers!

Get rid of the damage nerf to eternal guardian and reduce the cost/increase the effectiveness of swarm and we're good to go.

Thing is, from what i saw the bear remained the same with the buff to advanced species. The only thing he lost was a bit of Active bonus and that was to be expected as it did a lot of dmg for a low cost. The problem with the bear is the AI, not the DMG. Make it teleport to the target we cast the active on and that would help with the curent AI problems. (I know there are more but this can be a step)

Again, it needs a way to reach its targets, both pvp and pve could use the teleport mechanic, and they could use the spawn animation to make him appear next to the target.

Stibbons · September 2018

Deleted my magic warder few moths ago. I had poor Templar as bank and crafter already

LiquidPony · September 2018

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

LiquidPony wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

I'm really confused as to why you nerfed the weakest class in the game. They are parsing way behind the other magicka classes on PTS right now (they would have even without all the nerfs).

Could someone from the dev team please explain their logic and provide some evidence (like DPS parses) to justify their decisions?

Considering I paid money for this class, I demand some kind of customer service.

Thanks.

What are other magicka specs parsing solo on the 6mil on PTS right now?

Maybe I just haven't figured out what to do with a sorc yet, but I'm parsing way higher on PTS with a magwarden than I am a magsorc.

It's a bit of cheese (Zaan + Trap), but that's where all of those super-high magblade parses come from. Admittedly I know absolutely nothing about magwarden, just created one on PTS a few days ago to see how it'd parse. I imagine that will go over 50k with a bit of tweaking (I know my Fetcher uptime is not good, I don't have a great "rotation"), easily well over that number using bi-stat food with someone providing orbs and ele.

~57k is pretty standard for the other magicka classes on PTS.

I doubt any magicka spec is hitting 57k solo on the PTS right now. Maybe magblades, I'm not sure, I saw Get Em Shauna post a ~54k parse last week.

The 57k parses are grouped up with Combat Prayer, Infallible Aether, Orbs, and Ele Drain. Or at least the 57k magsorc and magplar parses I've seen were done like that.

Starlight_Knight · September 2018

There were loads of cool ideas thrown about initially when the class rep program first started. Yet zos hasn't implemented any that were suggested, its almost like they have to do something else deliberately so nobody calls it and says " that was my idea"
If fetcher was to be reworked properly using the ideas of execute damage to low health then that might be all it takes to bring this class inline. Instead, we get weird stuff that has everyone scratching their heads.

Magica warden has always felt like a neglected pay to loose class. why stop now.

jypcy · September 2018

LiquidPony wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

LiquidPony wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

I'm really confused as to why you nerfed the weakest class in the game. They are parsing way behind the other magicka classes on PTS right now (they would have even without all the nerfs).

Could someone from the dev team please explain their logic and provide some evidence (like DPS parses) to justify their decisions?

Considering I paid money for this class, I demand some kind of customer service.

Thanks.

What are other magicka specs parsing solo on the 6mil on PTS right now?

Maybe I just haven't figured out what to do with a sorc yet, but I'm parsing way higher on PTS with a magwarden than I am a magsorc.

It's a bit of cheese (Zaan + Trap), but that's where all of those super-high magblade parses come from. Admittedly I know absolutely nothing about magwarden, just created one on PTS a few days ago to see how it'd parse. I imagine that will go over 50k with a bit of tweaking (I know my Fetcher uptime is not good, I don't have a great "rotation"), easily well over that number using bi-stat food with someone providing orbs and ele.

~57k is pretty standard for the other magicka classes on PTS.

I doubt any magicka spec is hitting 57k solo on the PTS right now. Maybe magblades, I'm not sure, I saw Get Em Shauna post a ~54k parse last week.

The 57k parses are grouped up with Combat Prayer, Infallible Aether, Orbs, and Ele Drain. Or at least the 57k magsorc and magplar parses I've seen were done like that.

I agree, 57k solo for any other class sounds hyperbolic (but if there are pictures, I’d love to see them!). But the spell strategist set is imaginably inflating magicka parses a significant amount. I wouldn’t doubt that every magicka class is breaking 50k solo in the hands of skilled players now.

_Ahala_ · September 2018

Magden still feels like a Stamden with all the wrong morphs selected... All other mag subclasses play very different from their stam counterparts so the question remains... when are we going to get some offensive ice morphs in winters embrace?

lassitershawn · September 2018

Buzo wrote: »

Deep Fissure should have kept the stun and received Major Breach as a buff.

One of the Swarm morphs should be magicka and have a Dot-Execute function similar to Poison Injection. The other should be a stamina morph with a snare that increases over time. (Effects increase the longer the insects feast on you)

Dive should set Off-Blance.

It‘s truly frustrating that there‘s no imagination behind the skills to create viable gameplay. The adjustments would be easy and not have hurt the ongoing magsorc/magnb meta that reigns.

Just so much potential wasted on the class for PVE/PVP.

Magsorc is literally only in meta rn for a synergy for alkosh. 1 group member tops in optimized groups, sometimes the duty is relegated to a healer in some content if seriously pushing score. People saying stuff like this really hurts magsorc. Ofc I disagree with magden nerfs.

MLGProPlayer · September 2018

Yolokin_Swagonborn · September 2018

Every class gets nerfed. Even classes that don't need it. It's just a side effect of the champion system.

MinarasLaure · September 2018

jypcy wrote: »

LiquidPony wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

LiquidPony wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

I'm really confused as to why you nerfed the weakest class in the game. They are parsing way behind the other magicka classes on PTS right now (they would have even without all the nerfs).

Could someone from the dev team please explain their logic and provide some evidence (like DPS parses) to justify their decisions?

Considering I paid money for this class, I demand some kind of customer service.

Thanks.

What are other magicka specs parsing solo on the 6mil on PTS right now?

Maybe I just haven't figured out what to do with a sorc yet, but I'm parsing way higher on PTS with a magwarden than I am a magsorc.

It's a bit of cheese (Zaan + Trap), but that's where all of those super-high magblade parses come from. Admittedly I know absolutely nothing about magwarden, just created one on PTS a few days ago to see how it'd parse. I imagine that will go over 50k with a bit of tweaking (I know my Fetcher uptime is not good, I don't have a great "rotation"), easily well over that number using bi-stat food with someone providing orbs and ele.

~57k is pretty standard for the other magicka classes on PTS.

I doubt any magicka spec is hitting 57k solo on the PTS right now. Maybe magblades, I'm not sure, I saw Get Em Shauna post a ~54k parse last week.

The 57k parses are grouped up with Combat Prayer, Infallible Aether, Orbs, and Ele Drain. Or at least the 57k magsorc and magplar parses I've seen were done like that.

I agree, 57k solo for any other class sounds hyperbolic (but if there are pictures, I’d love to see them!). But the spell strategist set is imaginably inflating magicka parses a significant amount. I wouldn’t doubt that every magicka class is breaking 50k solo in the hands of skilled players now.

Spell strategist set is useful in solo or if noons in your group is wearing it.
Which means that it pulls great numbers on dummies but in any other content is pretty meh

starkerealm · September 2018

StamWhipCultist wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

I'm really confused as to why you nerfed the weakest class in the game. They are parsing way behind the other magicka classes on PTS right now (they would have even without all the nerfs).

Could someone from the dev team please explain their logic and provide some evidence (like DPS parses) to justify their decisions?

Considering I paid money for this class, I demand some kind of customer service.

Thanks.

You need to cry harder, see sorcs? They cried 24/7 like toddlers and zos reverted shield cast time to instant.

And now they're balling about having a cap on their shields, like it was balanced for a player to more than double their effective health on a whim as part of their rotation.