Bruccius wrote: »

Agenericname wrote: »

Davor wrote: »

Entitled PvP people saying it's the only way to play.

Reistr_the_Unbroken wrote: »

PvPer’s ganking people trying to do PvE in a mixed area

If you can be attacked by another player, it's a PvP area.

If you can do quests unrelated to PvP, it's a PvE area.

See, this is why Cyrodiil is a mixed zone.

You clearly don't get it, it's an old practice like the oldest MMOs, ZOS didn't introduced something new to this genere. Many games had OPEN WORLD PVP servers meaning you could fight players almost everywhere, yes a PVP SERVER - though you could do PvE quests there it was a PVP SERVER. In ESO we have a PVP ZONE where you can fight players almost everywhere though you can do PvE quests there it still is a PVP ZONE. Glad I could help.

bellanca6561n wrote: »

LizziAS wrote: »

For me it's how people wrap up their identities and their worth as a person into how well they play a video game.

News FLASH

Playing a video game well is NOT a virtue.


what's your issue with the type of game?

I have to disagree with you here in that, in online games outside the casual category, which ESO certainly is, your character is revealed in the course of playing the game. This does not make a good player virtuous of course. Rather in harder core online games, the conflict strips away pretense from players.

Simple fact is that you cannot be more than you are, or other than you are in a multiplayer environment. And it's not just how well you play the game, it's how you play the game that matters in an edgy MMO. This is both why the MMO was never as popular as mainstream entertainment and why efforts to shield players from that basic fact, which ESO takes GREAT PAINS to do, has put the genre in stasis.

The ultimate endgame in online games is revealing, and often discovering, who you are. Not a popular notion. Thus ESO, through its dilution of persistent player groups (5 guilds?!), the absurd number of characters you can have on each account, its rigorous segregation of players in PvE through instancing, its painfully absent structure in PvP, a non-existent justice system, removal of any meaningful risk, strips away the possibility of virtue from playing ESO.

ESO is good at one thing: helping you pass the time. Nothing more.

What? This supposed to be a game right? The point of game is to have fun and pass time. Why do a mmo have to be some journey of self discovery. That is what you do outside of game because it meaningless if you can not find the discovery in the acutal world. Not some virtual world with anonymity.

Agenericname wrote: »

Davor wrote: »

Entitled PvP people saying it's the only way to play.

Reistr_the_Unbroken wrote: »

PvPer’s ganking people trying to do PvE in a mixed area

If you can be attacked by another player, it's a PvP area.

That's what a lot of devs don't seem to get. You can't have both PvP and PvE in the same instance and expect everyone to be able to play the way they wanna play. PvPers will kill PvErs 'cuz they wanna kill other players and PvErs will just stop playing 'cuz they can't play the way they wanna play. Fallout 76 for example is a PvP game, not PvP and PvE. Todd is just trying to make PvErs buy the game 'cuz he knows most of his fans are into PvE.

Leogon wrote: »

Agenericname wrote: »

Davor wrote: »

Entitled PvP people saying it's the only way to play.

Reistr_the_Unbroken wrote: »

PvPer’s ganking people trying to do PvE in a mixed area

If you can be attacked by another player, it's a PvP area.

That's what a lot of devs don't seem to get. You can't have both PvP and PvE in the same instance and expect everyone to be able to play the way they wanna play. PvPers will kill PvErs 'cuz they wanna kill other players and PvErs will just stop playing 'cuz they can't play the way they wanna play. Fallout 76 for example is a PvP game, not PvP and PvE. Todd is just trying to make PvErs buy the game 'cuz he knows most of his fans are into PvE.

The issue with this line of thinking is that it proceeds from the idea that quests are for PVE-exclusive players only. What you’re failing to understand is that MMOS provide quests (which are usually repeatable) in PVP zones to give people in those zones something to do during down time and also to increase the chances of running into other players. Fortunately, campaigns like Vivec are usually busy enough that you don’t need to resort to questing for something to do, but in other MMOs I’ve played (e.g. LOTRO) it was sometimes your only way of earning PVP currency until more people logged on.

The sooner strict PVEers realize that Cyrodiil’s quests are not there just for them, the less frustration we will all endure.

Other people.

Aurielle wrote: »

The sooner strict PVEers realize that Cyrodiil’s quests are not there just for them, the less frustration we will all endure.

In fact, I'd take this a step further: Cyrodiil's quests are not intended for PvEers, full stop. They were not created with PvE-only players in mind; they were created for PvPers. Yes, PvEers can do them, but they're placed in a war zone with hostile players, and that PvE gear and skillset isn't really going to work out.

This goes the other way, too. Content like vet Maelstrom Arena? That's PvE content that is not intended for PvP players. PvP gear and skillsets simply will not work, although yes, PvPers can participate if they'd like. However, if they want to succeed, they need to learn how the PvE side of the game works and gear and skill up accordingly... just like PvE players who want to succeed in PvP zones.

Related, speaking as someone who spends an equal amount of time playing PvE and PvP, the entitlement displayed by some PvE purists is definitely high on my list of pet peeves in MMOs. Some content is made for PvPers. Some content is made for PvEers. It's okay if you don't like one or the other—it's not necessary for you to enjoy or engage with literally every aspect of a game. Similarly, it is not reasonable to expect every aspect of a large, several million player game to conform to your particular play style and preferences.

There are many forms of grinding, but two of them that I really hate: repeatable quests and killing a lot of mobs for hours/days/weeks/months to gain level. I'm glad that ESO managed to give other options, maybe slower options, to avoid this. There are grinding opportunities for those who really like repeating same stuff again and again but do not expect me to answer your call for a Skyreach partner cuz I played it only once for the quest and achievement (I think there was one).

People that complain that the game is multiplayer and that they can't do certain stuff because it requires a group. Deal with it, most of the content in the present MMOs is solo content, just let us who enjoy group stuff doing it as a group and having a challenge too.

PvP affecting PvE, and this is affecting a lot of games. I get it, unbalance is bad, I played competitive games and I know how it feels, but is worse when over an update your PvE gear you have invested a lot of time and resources is rendered less than worthless and you have to grind again and endure bad RNG. No really, I'm trying for three months already to get those stupid Seline's shoulders from Girilion's chest and I'm covered in every other useless shoulder you can get from it, but no Selene yet. If I finally get those and soon after the set will get nerfed, then that will be the most frustrating and most infuriating thing that ever happened in a game. Why don't instead make sets special for Cyrodiil and Battlegrounds that can be used only there while PvE sets will be useless against players? There are respecs for skill points, but sometimes items take a lot to get just to be nerfed next week after you finally got your decent set.

Elitist players which lives orbits around a game. There are very competent people that are pushing themselves to reach higher grounds, but they are still very friendly to noobs and offers to help them, teaching them without being too pushy and adopting an arrogant position. One of them I meet in ESO was amazed at how a group of people that never run a trial before managed to be more coordinate and willing to follow the tactics better than his more elitist guild. Some of the group members were even under level 50. And then, there are the cancerous snowflakes. Sometimes there aren't even as good as they pretend to be but still acts like gods among sheep. They start to yell and fill the groups chat with insults to everyone even for the smallest mistakes that barely has any impact on the entire run. Instead of telling people what they have done wrong, they complain like some of my former *** teachers that expect everyone to already know everything that was totally new to them. Communication is the key, not smashing your keyboard to throw insults you frustrated baboons! In other game there where customs chats, one of them dedicated to people new to end game content. Some players with the maximum possible gear were active there and joined noob groups just because they preferred to have longer runs but more relaxed with them than having shorter toxic runs with above-mentioned specimens. If there are people at your level, even higher than you, that is hating you for your toxic behavior, then you have some real issues and you have to burst out your "I'm the best, the rest suck" ideology and seek some help.

Aurielle wrote: »

Bruccius wrote: »

Agenericname wrote: »

Bruccius wrote: »

Agenericname wrote: »

Davor wrote: »

Entitled PvP people saying it's the only way to play.

Reistr_the_Unbroken wrote: »

PvPer’s ganking people trying to do PvE in a mixed area

If you can be attacked by another player, it's a PvP area.

If you can do quests unrelated to PvP, it's a PvE area.

See, this is why Cyrodiil is a mixed zone.

PvP is like a light switch, its switched on or its switched off. It differs from PvE in the sense that it's compulsory. You dont have to want to do it. Once you enter a PvP zone, you're engaged. How much PvE content is for the most part irrelevant.

That's not how it works, a properPvP zone doesn't have PvE elements, like quests, in it.

I get the sense that you haven’t played many MMORPGs... Every single MMO I’ve ever played has had quests in PVP areas, and several have had open world PVP servers.

Open world PvP servers seperated from PvE servers, yeah, that's pretty damn different.

I dilsike mandatory and unavoidable PvE content in PvP zones, because you always get ganked by dudes with x10 times better gear or stronger PvP classes.

But I don't think that's a huge problem in ESO though. You're not forced to go to PvP areas as a newbie to level up, grind or get gear in this game thankfully. You can always wait with PvP, until you're ready and able to defend yourself.

I hate P2W. Basically when whales can use irl money to get endgame&BIS gear etc in a matter of weeks, while for a casual player it takes years. Than all the whiteknights calls it "p2progress faster"LOL.

I dislike how imbalance is a problem in mmorpgs to. But I understand why. It's ofc harder for developers to perfectly balance a game, that has countless of skills, passives, stats, multipliers, sets and abilities affecting each other. It's still really infuriating though and especially if you didn't hit the jackpot after a major update and your class&build got rekt.

What do you dislike most about MMORPGs?
Let me tell you.

1. I "dislike" the most is non-persistant zoning events.
Nothing ever changes in the game world. ESO did implement it a bit with small "areas" like towns or camps that change for the play whom has finished the quest there, vs one that has not. Even at times enemy's are passive to you, but not them.
When you finish a quest the NPC just stays there.. forever. Still recovering, or gathering, or whatever, even though a real year has gone by. There is no life in MMORPGs.

2. Boss ganking & wait timers for them.
Other players can just ruin my gaming experience during a quest. NPC will say no one has been this deep before, then 4 players come shooting by from the depths. Which brings me to 3.

3. Non-instanced Dungeons.
Especially for quests, now not as limiting as the main quest line, but if I have a team, and we go to the door of any dungeon, I'd like an option to say "enter public" or "enter private / instanced". Then me and my group (wife, & friend) could do the dungeon just us 3, and go at our pace enjoying the story or quest etc, with no other players running around.

4. Respawning monsters in dungeons.
In a dungeon settings, I'd like to clear the dungeon, of course this would only work for instanced versions.

5. Crap loot systems.
I really like Diablo / PoExile style loot systems, where you can get good stuff from practically anywhere.
In most MMOs & ESO, you know all the gear you get from drops and delves are going to be crap, and good gear only drops from specific enemy's at specific locations in specific modes, yuck.

6. Lack of open world exploration.
MMOs are big, but all seam to tunnel the player with artificial walls.

so...
Yea I'd be really happy for a LAN based or internet based co-op mode (1-6 players max) sandboxed RPG games.

Guildwars 1 was my first MMORPG & I loved that towns were the only "group" areas, and everything else was instanced with your team you venture out with. No random player to spoil anything, can clear zones of all life & go at our own pace.

In ESO I always feel rushed to click through voiced dialog, or get to the boss with the one guy that's just plowing through just so I don't have to wait 5+ mins before they spawn again.

Aurielle wrote: »

Bruccius wrote: »

Aurielle wrote: »

Bruccius wrote: »

Agenericname wrote: »

Bruccius wrote: »

Agenericname wrote: »

Davor wrote: »

Entitled PvP people saying it's the only way to play.

Reistr_the_Unbroken wrote: »

PvPer’s ganking people trying to do PvE in a mixed area

If you can be attacked by another player, it's a PvP area.

If you can do quests unrelated to PvP, it's a PvE area.

See, this is why Cyrodiil is a mixed zone.

PvP is like a light switch, its switched on or its switched off. It differs from PvE in the sense that it's compulsory. You dont have to want to do it. Once you enter a PvP zone, you're engaged. How much PvE content is for the most part irrelevant.

That's not how it works, a properPvP zone doesn't have PvE elements, like quests, in it.

I get the sense that you haven’t played many MMORPGs... Every single MMO I’ve ever played has had quests in PVP areas, and several have had open world PVP servers.

Open world PvP servers seperated from PvE servers, yeah, that's pretty damn different.

Conveniently neglected the fact that most (if not all) MMOs have quests in PVP areas. Even LOTRO, the most PVE-friendly MMO out there, has quests in its tiny PvP areas.

Quests.
Are.
Not.
Just.
For.
You.

And other players are not just for you.

Aurielle wrote: »

Bruccius wrote: »

Agenericname wrote: »

Bruccius wrote: »

Agenericname wrote: »

Davor wrote: »

Entitled PvP people saying it's the only way to play.

Reistr_the_Unbroken wrote: »

PvPer’s ganking people trying to do PvE in a mixed area

If you can be attacked by another player, it's a PvP area.

If you can do quests unrelated to PvP, it's a PvE area.

See, this is why Cyrodiil is a mixed zone.

PvP is like a light switch, its switched on or its switched off. It differs from PvE in the sense that it's compulsory. You dont have to want to do it. Once you enter a PvP zone, you're engaged. How much PvE content is for the most part irrelevant.

That's not how it works, a properPvP zone doesn't have PvE elements, like quests, in it.

I get the sense that you haven’t played many MMORPGs... Every single MMO I’ve ever played has had quests in PVP areas, and several have had open world PVP servers.

And all of them (especially the "open world pvp" ones) loaded with griefers, sociopaths, and other assorted reasons-to-hate-humanity, stroking themselves over how awesome they are that they can curbstomp lower-level PvE geared victims. Oh, while exclaiming that they love pvp for the "challenge".