Please remove the "in front of you" from healing spells
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Apache_Kid✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭If you think healing is difficult in this game you should try healing in TERA. That really made me appreciate how easy and simple it is to be a healer in this game. Except from some of the DLC trials (and HMs of the others) Healing is by far and away the easiest role to play.
If you are having problems healing it might be the positioning of your group that is the problem. If you are running with a guild maybe talk to your guildmates about positioning and where you want them to stand. I like using the olorimes circle as a marker for where the group should be stacked. Yes there are fights where you can't be stacked but even then they should have a loose stack and have positioning that is beneficial to the healers. If you are running with pugs then yeah you will probably need to spread heals all over the place as they run around like headless chickens but that is on them, not the games healing mechanics.Edited by Apache_Kid on August 22, 2018 1:26PM0 -
kathandira✭✭✭✭✭
✭kathandira wrote: »So in order to fit the entire party into the circle you typically have to center yourself between the tank and the ranged classes. So I suppose when a ranged character needs healing I'm suppose to spin my camera around to face them before healing? And that's not to mention fights where everyone is running around frantically killing things... often in circles behind me or to my sides... and rarely in front.
If DDs run around like headless chicken let them die so they learn it. DDs need to stand in front of the healer for effective performance and this is not because of smart target heals not hitting otherwise but because this allows for effective buffing. There is absolutely no reason why a range DD needs to stand 40 meters away from a boss.
Certain fights require them to run around to kill adds or dodge Area Attacks.
It's just not feasible to expect damage dealers to always stay in front of the healer.
Situational Awareness.
If a healer knows that there is a phase where the DPS has to kill Adds, then that healers should know when that will happen, and to position themselves well enough to heal the tank and the DPS at the same time.
This isn't about "situational awareness".
You have to be situationaly aware on this game regardless if you have to stare at your target to heal them with breath of life or not.
I think "stare" is a bit exaggerated. You just need to be looking in their general direction. Could be worse, you could have to highlight them. That would be a disaster.PS4-NA. Breton Templar Healer, Bosmer Stamplar, Breton Magplar, Orsimer StamDK, Dunmer MagDK, Khajiit StamNB, Dunmer MagNB, Argonian Warden Tank, Altmer Magsorc1 -
Jeremy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Apache_Kid wrote: »If you think healing is difficult in this game you should try healing in TERA. That really made me appreciate how easy and simple it is to be a healer in this game. Except from some of the DLC trials (and HMs of the others) Healing is by far and away the easiest role to play.
If you are having problems healing it might be the positioning of your group that is the problem. If you are running with a guild maybe talk to your guildmates about positioning and where you want them to stand. I like using the olorimes circle as a marker for where the group should be stacked. Yes there are fights where you can't be stacked but even then they should have a loose stack and have positioning that is beneficial to the healers. If you are running with pugs then yeah you will probably need to spread heals all over the place as they run around like headless chickens but that is on them, not the games healing mechanics.
This thread isn't about healing being difficult.
It's addressing a nuisance change that should have never been implemented in the first place. Breath of life worked fine the way it was. There was no reason to make it more annoying to use.Edited by Jeremy on August 22, 2018 1:28PM3 -
Jeremy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭kathandira wrote: »kathandira wrote: »So in order to fit the entire party into the circle you typically have to center yourself between the tank and the ranged classes. So I suppose when a ranged character needs healing I'm suppose to spin my camera around to face them before healing? And that's not to mention fights where everyone is running around frantically killing things... often in circles behind me or to my sides... and rarely in front.
If DDs run around like headless chicken let them die so they learn it. DDs need to stand in front of the healer for effective performance and this is not because of smart target heals not hitting otherwise but because this allows for effective buffing. There is absolutely no reason why a range DD needs to stand 40 meters away from a boss.
Certain fights require them to run around to kill adds or dodge Area Attacks.
It's just not feasible to expect damage dealers to always stay in front of the healer.
Situational Awareness.
If a healer knows that there is a phase where the DPS has to kill Adds, then that healers should know when that will happen, and to position themselves well enough to heal the tank and the DPS at the same time.
This isn't about "situational awareness".
You have to be situationaly aware on this game regardless if you have to stare at your target to heal them with breath of life or not.
I think "stare" is a bit exaggerated. You just need to be looking in their general direction. Could be worse, you could have to highlight them. That would be a disaster.
Perhaps I'm exaggerating a bit to make my point - but you know what I mean.
Anyway: I have to head out so this will probably be the last time I comment on this thread. I hope the developers take note - because breath of life was fine the way it was.0 -
e1team✭✭✭I don’t know. The main healing ability in this game is Healing Springs by far, and you can already target that pretty well. That burst heals are a frontal cone is ok, it requires some group coordination at least instead of just hitting a button.
Any heal that requires party members to coordinate and line up in front of you just isn't going to work out in the real world.
That's one of those strategies that sound good on paper but instantly fall apart when you throw 4 four random players together.
If you don’t like group coordination as a requirement, why would you play group content in a MMO?
Group coordination is ok up to a point - but not as a requirement to simply heal people. Other players are not going to run in front of me every time they need a heal. And I don't really blame them either.
And I've been playing MMORPGs since they existed - and I've never played a game that requires you to adjust the camera to look at someone to heal them. So your implication that is somehow standard for MMO's is ridiculous.
Well, ESO is not like any other MMO (thankfully) and hopefully it'll stay that way for a while. Good we have something new and different. Now deal with it.1 -
kathandira✭✭✭✭✭
✭Wasn't there a time when on the PC beta, you weren't able to shoot through friendly players when attacking an enemy? I feel like this was a thing, but I might not remember correctly.PS4-NA. Breton Templar Healer, Bosmer Stamplar, Breton Magplar, Orsimer StamDK, Dunmer MagDK, Khajiit StamNB, Dunmer MagNB, Argonian Warden Tank, Altmer Magsorc0 -
rfennell_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I'm not sure if it was always like this (I don't remember it being this way in the beginning for some reason) but I have never played a game where in order to heal an ally you have to face the camera toward them first.
It's annoying.
Especially for a Templar - who has abilities like Ritual of Retribution that places an area of effect on the ground. So in order to fit the entire party into the circle you typically have to center yourself between the tank and the ranged classes. So I suppose when a ranged character needs healing I'm suppose to spin my camera around to face them before healing? And that's not to mention fights where everyone is running around frantically killing things... often in circles behind me or to my sides... and rarely in front.
So I don't really see the point of this. It's nothing but a nuisance and adds nothing of value to the game play.
They made an effort to *not* make this a targeted healing game (not going down that rabbit hole, it was a decision that cemented into the game at this point).
Instead of targeted healing they made it so the only true controlled healing was cone based on the direction you cast.
They did add options for smart healing, though you could argue only one class really excels at it.0 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Have concerns about healing? Join us in healers discord https://discord.gg/TfjSbu9
This is a great idea for these situations.0 -
Jinchuu✭✭✭✭
Most games you can simply use the control pad to choose your target from the party member list and pick the one who is losing health. So I don't see why it should be an issue for console.
I recommend actually playing on console before commenting on it, the d-pad is already mapped to functions.
Unless you are willing to be a mindless sycophant and/or coddle others due to their insecurities prepare to be harrased by the Orwellian enforcers on these forums. You should also try to refrain from using any words more complex than those used by a small child due to the fact that said enforcers have made it clear that their vocabulary pool is aenemic.1 -
kathandira✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Most games you can simply use the control pad to choose your target from the party member list and pick the one who is losing health. So I don't see why it should be an issue for console.
I recommend actually playing on console before commenting on it, the d-pad is already mapped to functions.
Indeed. If you had to select from the party list in this game, or actually move your reticle to highlight the target to heal, it would be near impossible.PS4-NA. Breton Templar Healer, Bosmer Stamplar, Breton Magplar, Orsimer StamDK, Dunmer MagDK, Khajiit StamNB, Dunmer MagNB, Argonian Warden Tank, Altmer Magsorc0 -
Apache_Kid✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Apache_Kid wrote: »If you think healing is difficult in this game you should try healing in TERA. That really made me appreciate how easy and simple it is to be a healer in this game. Except from some of the DLC trials (and HMs of the others) Healing is by far and away the easiest role to play.
If you are having problems healing it might be the positioning of your group that is the problem. If you are running with a guild maybe talk to your guildmates about positioning and where you want them to stand. I like using the olorimes circle as a marker for where the group should be stacked. Yes there are fights where you can't be stacked but even then they should have a loose stack and have positioning that is beneficial to the healers. If you are running with pugs then yeah you will probably need to spread heals all over the place as they run around like headless chickens but that is on them, not the games healing mechanics.
This thread isn't about healing being difficult.
It's addressing a nuisance change that should have never been implemented in the first place. Breath of life worked fine the way it was. There was no reason to make it more annoying to use.
God forbid you have to move the camera to heal. What a travesty. Hey come to think of it why should I have to look at the boss as a DPS to do damage to it? Why don't all my skills just travel to the boss like heat seeking missiles while I'm facing 180 degrees away?Edited by Apache_Kid on August 22, 2018 2:07PM2 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Apache_Kid wrote: »If you think healing is difficult in this game you should try healing in TERA. That really made me appreciate how easy and simple it is to be a healer in this game. Except from some of the DLC trials (and HMs of the others) Healing is by far and away the easiest role to play.
If you are having problems healing it might be the positioning of your group that is the problem. If you are running with a guild maybe talk to your guildmates about positioning and where you want them to stand. I like using the olorimes circle as a marker for where the group should be stacked. Yes there are fights where you can't be stacked but even then they should have a loose stack and have positioning that is beneficial to the healers. If you are running with pugs then yeah you will probably need to spread heals all over the place as they run around like headless chickens but that is on them, not the games healing mechanics.
This thread isn't about healing being difficult.
It's addressing a nuisance change that should have never been implemented in the first place. Breath of life worked fine the way it was. There was no reason to make it more annoying to use.
BoL is the only heal that’s changed like this and only the primary heal is a come. The secondary heal is 360.
Also, in a trial it’s not uncommon for one healer to focus range and another to focus melee when the two groups are able to stand separate. Rakhaat is a great example for this. Raid leaders should also organize the group and focus the healers when there is the need.0 -
Narvuntien✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Let me intro you to sorcerer healing.... 360o no scope healing look no further than twlight matriach.1 -
Sigtric✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭You should place yourself behind the group so you can see them all. Any dps behind the healer is wrong.
Stormproof: Vibeke - 50 EP mDragonknight | Savi Dreloth - 50 EP Magsorc | Sadi Dreloth - 50 EP Magblade | Sigtric Stormaxe - 50 EP Stamsorc | Valora Dreloth - 50 EP Magplar | Sigtric the Unbearable 50 EP Stam Warden
Scrub: Chews-on-Beavers - 50 EP DK Tank | Vera the Wild - 50 EP magicka Warden | Sigtric the Axe - 50 EP Dragonknight Crafter | Sigtric the Blade - 50 EP Lost Nightblade | Sigtric the Savage - 50 EP magicka Templar | Vibeka Shadowblade - 50 Ep Stealthy Ganky Nightblade |
Show Me Your Dunmer
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GimpyPorcupine✭✭✭✭✭If you're not looking at your DPS, you're not giving them Combat Prayer.
Healing Ward and Mutagen are 360-degree smart heals, and what I rely on for that "Oh $#!+" moment with every class.
The "in front of you" for BoL/HtD is a 180-degree cone. That's 9-3 o'clock, as compared to the Warden's truly-directional 11-1 o'clock burst heal.
Ritual of Rebirth is expensive, but heals EVERYONE within 10m for a huge amount, and smart-heals one flyer outside of that.
Honestly, I don't see the problem.
8-hr/day casual on Xbox NA. 20 Characters, all DC, all Level 50. +2900CP2 -
DanteYoda✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Naughty_Ryder wrote: »You should be able to select your target to be healed... I hate the healing mechanics in ESO - I have been a healer for over 10 years across many MMO’s and its amazing. ESO is healing [removed inappropriate language]
You've obviously never played the secret world.. because healing there was a multitasking nightmare.0 -
TequilaFire✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
Most games you can simply use the control pad to choose your target from the party member list and pick the one who is losing health. So I don't see why it should be an issue for console.
I recommend actually playing on console before commenting on it, the d-pad is already mapped to functions.
You do know that by looking st s target and holding R3 you lock that target right?0 -
Jinchuu✭✭✭✭TequilaFire wrote: »
You do know that by looking st s target and holding R3 you lock that target right?
And locking on to enemies is going to help me heal my team how exactly?
Unless you are willing to be a mindless sycophant and/or coddle others due to their insecurities prepare to be harrased by the Orwellian enforcers on these forums. You should also try to refrain from using any words more complex than those used by a small child due to the fact that said enforcers have made it clear that their vocabulary pool is aenemic.0 -
TequilaFire✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭TequilaFire wrote: »
You do know that by looking st s target and holding R3 you lock that target right?
And locking on to enemies is going to help me heal my team how exactly?
Pointing out that they can add target healing if they want to and has nothing to do with d-pad.
But I get it, argue on!Edited by TequilaFire on August 22, 2018 3:17PM0 -
Sange13✭✭✭It wasn't always like this but some forumers complained "muh takes no skills to heal brhal".
They didn't know but they said the magic word: our devs are obsessed with the game being "skilled".
So there you go, they nerfed templar smart healing to the ground. IMO it would have been enough to add a class where healing requires targeting (they did, called warden) that way "skilled" players would play wardens, and the others could still have templar and have fun healing.
Gameplay combat wise the game caters to hardcore players, while everything else caters to casuals which is just weird.
This. The focus on more heals having to be in front of you was actually a change they made with the release of Morrowind. Before that, healing was more like "you or closest ally" for the most part.IGN: Sange-130 -
Sange13✭✭✭Sure.
Also, while we are at it, make all taunts AoE with 24m range.
And make all DoT damage skills fire automatically on cooldown.
And make all red AoEs under your feet periodically move away from players to the edge of the room.
This kind of argument is never convincing, and only makes it appear that you are trying to be dismissive rather than provide some actual justification why things are okay how they are.
-1, man.IGN: Sange-130 -
Jinchuu✭✭✭✭TequilaFire wrote: »
Pointing out that they can add target healing if they want to and has nothing to do with d-pad.
But I get it, argue on![/quote]
You should learn how to conduct a proper discourse instead of claiming someone pointing out the fallacies in your statement is "arguing", but that would prevent you from attempting to portray yourself as the victim in order to gain sympathy, the moral high ground or whatever it is you're seeking so you obviously won't and instead will continue to post drivel.Unless you are willing to be a mindless sycophant and/or coddle others due to their insecurities prepare to be harrased by the Orwellian enforcers on these forums. You should also try to refrain from using any words more complex than those used by a small child due to the fact that said enforcers have made it clear that their vocabulary pool is aenemic.0 -
FakeFox✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭So in order to fit the entire party into the circle you typically have to center yourself between the tank and the ranged classes. So I suppose when a ranged character needs healing I'm suppose to spin my camera around to face them before healing? And that's not to mention fights where everyone is running around frantically killing things... often in circles behind me or to my sides... and rarely in front.
If DDs run around like headless chicken let them die so they learn it. DDs need to stand in front of the healer for effective performance and this is not because of smart target heals not hitting otherwise but because this allows for effective buffing. There is absolutely no reason why a range DD needs to stand 40 meters away from a boss.
Certain fights require them to run around to kill adds or dodge Area Attacks.
It's just not feasible to expect damage dealers to always stay in front of the healer.
It is for most of the group most of the time. Avoiding AOEs usually takes like 5 seconds and after that everyone stands in front of the healer again. Special roles that require running around outside of the healers field of view usually should not take a lot of damage or use self healing. Apart from that those role only really exist in high difficulty content anyway. In probably 95% of fights you can just stay in one spot as a group and go a few steps left or right from time to time, that's it.
Most DD movement really comes from people not being able to hold still just because they think they need to avoid every single thing that tickles them or are simply hyperactive and require jumping around like mad as part of their rotation.Edited by FakeFox on August 22, 2018 4:22PMEU/PC (GER) - Healermain since 2014 - 50305 Achievement Points - Youtube (PvE Healing Guides, Builds & Gameplay)1 -
FakeFox✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Naughty_Ryder wrote: »You should be able to select your target to be healed... I hate the healing mechanics in ESO - I have been a healer for over 10 years across many MMO’s and its amazing. ESO is healing [removed inappropriate language]
I healed for 6 years in WoW before switching to ESO and find it very fun to actually see something instead of having my screen cluttered with healing addons. I agree that more control about your healing spells would be great. However I still like it more then what most classic mouse on screen, hardtraget MMOs do. And I also think it would be very hard to implement into ESO. We already have targeted heals and it's awful to use.EU/PC (GER) - Healermain since 2014 - 50305 Achievement Points - Youtube (PvE Healing Guides, Builds & Gameplay)1 -
BigBragg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Naughty_Ryder wrote: »You should be able to select your target to be healed... I hate the healing mechanics in ESO - I have been a healer for over 10 years across many MMO’s and its amazing. ESO is healing [removed inappropriate language]
I healed for 6 years in WoW before switching to ESO and find it very fun to actually see something instead of having my screen cluttered with healing addons. I agree that more control about your healing spells would be great. However I still like it more then what most classic mouse on screen, hardtraget MMOs do. And I also think it would be very hard to implement into ESO. We already have targeted heals and it's awful to use.
I have had some success and fun in Cyrodiil with the new Psijic healing toggle, Mend Wounds, especially when players are far away. Seemed faster and more controlled than spamming Healing Springs.0 -
Krayl✭✭✭✭✭never had a prob.
Run in, extended ritual near the tank, roll back, drop rune focus near the edge of the ritual, pivot to heal people...not sure it needs to be easier than that. Perhaps let your dps know they aren't going to get heals if they are actively trying to stand behind you?1 -
FakeFox✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Naughty_Ryder wrote: »You should be able to select your target to be healed... I hate the healing mechanics in ESO - I have been a healer for over 10 years across many MMO’s and its amazing. ESO is healing [removed inappropriate language]
I healed for 6 years in WoW before switching to ESO and find it very fun to actually see something instead of having my screen cluttered with healing addons. I agree that more control about your healing spells would be great. However I still like it more then what most classic mouse on screen, hardtraget MMOs do. And I also think it would be very hard to implement into ESO. We already have targeted heals and it's awful to use.
I have had some success and fun in Cyrodiil with the new Psijic healing toggle, Mend Wounds, especially when players are far away. Seemed faster and more controlled than spamming Healing Springs.
Yeah, it situationaly works great, however it becomes impractical as soon as people are stacked. So for pretty much all PvE.EU/PC (GER) - Healermain since 2014 - 50305 Achievement Points - Youtube (PvE Healing Guides, Builds & Gameplay)0
