Gravord wrote: »

agasaagasai wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

agasaagasai wrote: »

Not sure if it's already talked about in this thread, but Sigil can be one way or sometimes the only way PuGs have a chance at beating pre-formed groups.

It has many drawbacks for sure, but when I pug into a Battleground and one of the opposite groups is clearly very well coordinated (with dedicated healer and tank), I always ask the pug team to find the sigil so that we can outdamage the unending earthgore/healing springs/permablocking, and at least make it to second place.

If the coordinated team gets the sigil, well, they are going to win anyway, it doesn't really change much.

In short, the Sigil, in spite of all drawbacks, has its silver lining.

Even if the PuGs got it every time, there's no way they'd get enough kills to eclipse the premades over all kills. (Assuming it's the typical PuG vs the typical premade)

It really is mostly used by the better players or teams.

Exactly, as I mentioned, currently, the Sigil doesn't change the result.

So one possibility is to make Sigil only visible to the two lower scoring teams, dynamic visibility (whoever ranks first at the moment won't see it but they will if they get surpassed by others and become second place).

So it will have the same idea as sigils in vMA, to help lesser skilled players get a chance and at least to be able to pose more of a challenge. A Sigil to help prevent a total one-sided farming slaughter.

As explained earlier, its silly idea. Why you want reward team doing crap job? They play bad, they deserve to loose. They can improve their gameplay or builds and try again. Giving them free one shotting by sheer fact they played bad to this point is just wrong.
Not to mention possible abuse, team waiting for 2 other teams to make few kills to be the last ones on the leaderboard to get sigil and then proceed with wiping both teams in a seconds.

Why are sigils in Maelstrom then? They are a gap-closer between top-level players and average players. Even with Sigil, the better team is still able to win.

The best solution is actually to entirely separate pre-formed with pugs, making group formation all random. Before this happens, sigils are, as I mentioned already, to prevent one-sided farming and to make battlegrounds more challenging to elite players.

The abuse won't happen, as it's dynamic visibility. Wiping other two teams won't guarantee your team to be the victor unless the three teams' scores are already all really close to 500 beforehand.

Gravord wrote: »

agasaagasai wrote: »

Gravord wrote: »

agasaagasai wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

agasaagasai wrote: »

Not sure if it's already talked about in this thread, but Sigil can be one way or sometimes the only way PuGs have a chance at beating pre-formed groups.

It has many drawbacks for sure, but when I pug into a Battleground and one of the opposite groups is clearly very well coordinated (with dedicated healer and tank), I always ask the pug team to find the sigil so that we can outdamage the unending earthgore/healing springs/permablocking, and at least make it to second place.

If the coordinated team gets the sigil, well, they are going to win anyway, it doesn't really change much.

In short, the Sigil, in spite of all drawbacks, has its silver lining.

Even if the PuGs got it every time, there's no way they'd get enough kills to eclipse the premades over all kills. (Assuming it's the typical PuG vs the typical premade)

It really is mostly used by the better players or teams.

Exactly, as I mentioned, currently, the Sigil doesn't change the result.

So one possibility is to make Sigil only visible to the two lower scoring teams, dynamic visibility (whoever ranks first at the moment won't see it but they will if they get surpassed by others and become second place).

So it will have the same idea as sigils in vMA, to help lesser skilled players get a chance and at least to be able to pose more of a challenge. A Sigil to help prevent a total one-sided farming slaughter.

As explained earlier, its silly idea. Why you want reward team doing crap job? They play bad, they deserve to loose. They can improve their gameplay or builds and try again. Giving them free one shotting by sheer fact they played bad to this point is just wrong.
Not to mention possible abuse, team waiting for 2 other teams to make few kills to be the last ones on the leaderboard to get sigil and then proceed with wiping both teams in a seconds.

Why are sigils in Maelstrom then? They are a gap-closer between top-level players and average players. Even with Sigil, the better team is still able to win.

Gotta admit you lost me on this one.

Maybe... It should act like vMA, where you get the buff but you get less points for kills?

Waffennacht wrote: »

Gravord wrote: »

agasaagasai wrote: »

Gravord wrote: »

agasaagasai wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

agasaagasai wrote: »

Not sure if it's already talked about in this thread, but Sigil can be one way or sometimes the only way PuGs have a chance at beating pre-formed groups.

It has many drawbacks for sure, but when I pug into a Battleground and one of the opposite groups is clearly very well coordinated (with dedicated healer and tank), I always ask the pug team to find the sigil so that we can outdamage the unending earthgore/healing springs/permablocking, and at least make it to second place.

If the coordinated team gets the sigil, well, they are going to win anyway, it doesn't really change much.

In short, the Sigil, in spite of all drawbacks, has its silver lining.

Even if the PuGs got it every time, there's no way they'd get enough kills to eclipse the premades over all kills. (Assuming it's the typical PuG vs the typical premade)

It really is mostly used by the better players or teams.

Exactly, as I mentioned, currently, the Sigil doesn't change the result.

So one possibility is to make Sigil only visible to the two lower scoring teams, dynamic visibility (whoever ranks first at the moment won't see it but they will if they get surpassed by others and become second place).

So it will have the same idea as sigils in vMA, to help lesser skilled players get a chance and at least to be able to pose more of a challenge. A Sigil to help prevent a total one-sided farming slaughter.

As explained earlier, its silly idea. Why you want reward team doing crap job? They play bad, they deserve to loose. They can improve their gameplay or builds and try again. Giving them free one shotting by sheer fact they played bad to this point is just wrong.
Not to mention possible abuse, team waiting for 2 other teams to make few kills to be the last ones on the leaderboard to get sigil and then proceed with wiping both teams in a seconds.

Why are sigils in Maelstrom then? They are a gap-closer between top-level players and average players. Even with Sigil, the better team is still able to win.

Gotta admit you lost me on this one.

Maybe... It should act like vMA, where you get the buff but you get less points for kills?

I see, understand now, but still against the concept.
Unlike vMA, this is pvp and someone HAVE to loose. Worse, its tri realm fight so 2 out of 3 teams will loose, no matter what. Overprotecting wont change that fact. If team plays bad and looses, its their own fault. Randomly spawning free one shotting sigil is not the solution. Learning classes, gameplay and tactics is.

satanio wrote: »

I disagree. Sigil is easily counterable - you know your team doesn''t have it? -> sneak & wait. You're not forced to go and fight with buffed enemies...

Do you expect that you can wreck anything without using your brain? Choose your fights.

I don't think that DM needs a rework.

Hide and seek?? - Take that to the roleplaying boards.

agasaagasai wrote: »

Gravord wrote: »

agasaagasai wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

agasaagasai wrote: »

Not sure if it's already talked about in this thread, but Sigil can be one way or sometimes the only way PuGs have a chance at beating pre-formed groups.

It has many drawbacks for sure, but when I pug into a Battleground and one of the opposite groups is clearly very well coordinated (with dedicated healer and tank), I always ask the pug team to find the sigil so that we can outdamage the unending earthgore/healing springs/permablocking, and at least make it to second place.

If the coordinated team gets the sigil, well, they are going to win anyway, it doesn't really change much.

In short, the Sigil, in spite of all drawbacks, has its silver lining.

Even if the PuGs got it every time, there's no way they'd get enough kills to eclipse the premades over all kills. (Assuming it's the typical PuG vs the typical premade)

It really is mostly used by the better players or teams.

Exactly, as I mentioned, currently, the Sigil doesn't change the result.

So one possibility is to make Sigil only visible to the two lower scoring teams, dynamic visibility (whoever ranks first at the moment won't see it but they will if they get surpassed by others and become second place).

So it will have the same idea as sigils in vMA, to help lesser skilled players get a chance and at least to be able to pose more of a challenge. A Sigil to help prevent a total one-sided farming slaughter.

As explained earlier, its silly idea. Why you want reward team doing crap job? They play bad, they deserve to loose. They can improve their gameplay or builds and try again. Giving them free one shotting by sheer fact they played bad to this point is just wrong.
Not to mention possible abuse, team waiting for 2 other teams to make few kills to be the last ones on the leaderboard to get sigil and then proceed with wiping both teams in a seconds.

Why are sigils in Maelstrom then? They are a gap-closer between top-level players and average players. Even with Sigil, the better team is still able to win.

The best solution is actually to entirely separate pre-formed with pugs, making group formation all random. Before this happens, sigils are, as I mentioned already, to prevent one-sided farming and to make battlegrounds more challenging to elite players.

The abuse won't happen, as it's dynamic visibility. Wiping other two teams won't guarantee your team to be the victor unless the three teams' scores are already all really close to 500 beforehand.

Sigils were in MSA to help people complete what was, at the time, the hardest content in the game IMO - players that had 300CP and none of todays perks, might I add.

They didn't bridge a gap between scores or completion times at all.

The sigil doesn't make it more challenging for elite players as they know timers and spawn locations - It makes it more challenging/impossible for weaker players.

The bottom line is matchmaking needs to be addressed and when it's 'balanced', the sigil should be removed.

So there are many problems with the sigils. Some of which are. The winning team is the most likely to get it. Because I'd they are winning most likely there are more of them on the map at a time since they are constantly killing the other team. So they are more likely to get it. So in lopsided runs it is usually just serving to makie it even more so or not doing a darn thing. In close matches it really sucks and is salt inducing to lose based on some random chance like that. And in one team is like winning but not WINNING it is so unfair that they have and are maintaining a marginal lead but lose cause some of the others got a sigil.

Delete the sigil. Not needed the game mode is fun enough. Or perhaps add some counterplay that you take 50% more damage with the sigil. But I rather it just be deleted.

Furthermore there is an add-on or something that tells where it is. Because many times I see people go to exactly where it will spawn like they know. Now guessing right once in a while is something but every time across 3 matches is something else. I understand grouped with them afterwards cause I don't like to exploit like that.

Well there you go folks.

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Battlegrounds

• Sigils of Power in Deathmatch game modes have been disabled. We will be monitoring how the health of Deathmatch games progress once Update 19 goes live to determine if Sigils of Power return in their current form, a new form, or remain off.

/Close thread - Problem solved.

/Damn changed my mind, loved doing double damage every DM.

satanio wrote: »

BNOC wrote: »

satanio wrote: »

I disagree. Sigil is easily counterable - you know your team doesn''t have it? -> sneak & wait. You're not forced to go and fight with buffed enemies...

Do you expect that you can wreck anything without using your brain? Choose your fights.

I don't think that DM needs a rework.

Hide and seek?? - Take that to the roleplaying boards.

Whatever, retreat will forever exist as a valid tactics. Theres nothing RP in that.

Theres rather massive difference between retreating because enemy team is strong so you try play kite and kill tactics vs enemy team grabbed broken sigil and can one shot us, scurry away!

Sigil is gone... as someone who abused the crap out of its with Sigil empowered fissures and permafrosts... Good riddance to the broken red axe

Daus wrote: »

Man I'm so happy that horrible thing is gone! Now we can focus on PvP rather than chasing after the sigil.

Agreed

Awesome