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Solution to rune cage problem.
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OdinForge✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Micah_Bayer wrote: »Just give frags it's 10% dmg back and it's stun. Thank you.
Current no counter-play rune cage- Goes through block
- Goes through dodge
- Cannot be reflected
- Does a sizeable amount of damage when broken
- High range
- Boring to use as it literally hand holds you through burst combos and punishes without counter-play
Pre 10% dmg and stun frag nerfs- Can be blocked
- Can be roll dodged and passively dodged
- Can be reflected by any number of abilities
- Operates on a proc basis
- Fun to use and punishing when lands
Magsorcs preferred the feel of fragments and the utility to slot a different skill, magsorcs almost unanimously hate the new rune cage despite how strong it is. No one ever complained about crystal fragment damage or CC, every complaint has revolved around the shield stacking mechanic.
Crystal fragments now feels practically useless and it hits like a wet noodle for many viable builds. And even on builds where it can hit hard (at the cost of sustain), it's just being carried by current rune cage anyway.
Revert the dmg nerf and stun to fragments. Revert rune cage to operate like defensive rune, with some extra perk.The Age of Wrobel.17 -
Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Gotta be frank.
Feels to me like it's way stronger on my Stam sorc than my mag sorc.
Don't really have to time anything to go cage, Dawnbreaker, spin2win.
With curse etc, it's a bit harder than just HaHA! I win! Like spin2win2 -
Maulkin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭rimmidimdim wrote: »Rune cage needs a range debuff, like fossilize received. That's all. Cheers.
Disagree.
DK is a melee class, Sorc is a ranged one. It has 0 melee skills, it has skills to keep people out of melee range (Mines). It wouldn't work with the rest of the toolkit.
I'd rather they change it to a DoT and a debuff or root/snare. Or anything else remotely useful. But it has to be something that works with rest of the class.
I'd rather that, then nerfing it back to being a nothing skill that no one uses ever. Which is what would happen if they reduce the range to 8m.EU | PC | AD5 -
LegacyDM✭✭✭✭✭
✭rimmidimdim wrote: »Rune cage needs a range debuff, like fossilize received. That's all. Cheers.
Disagree.
DK is a melee class, Sorc is a ranged one. It has 0 melee skills, it has skills to keep people out of melee range (Mines). It wouldn't work with the rest of the toolkit.
I'd rather they change it to a DoT and a debuff or root/snare. Or anything else remotely useful. But it has to be something that works with rest of the class.
I'd rather that, then nerfing it back to being a nothing skill that no one uses ever. Which is what would happen if they reduce the range to 8m.
Yea but um, Zos balances by making skills in line with similar skills. That was their justification for nerfing strife and other skills. strife got nerfed because devs wanted it to be consistent with force shock...logically, why does rune cage get to be different and more powerful? No, under their idiotic logic which stove pipes build diversity rune cage needs the same treatment as fossilize.Edited by LegacyDM on June 20, 2018 5:43PMLegacy of Kain
Vicious Carnage
¥ampire Lord of the South3 -
Maulkin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭rimmidimdim wrote: »Rune cage needs a range debuff, like fossilize received. That's all. Cheers.
Disagree.
DK is a melee class, Sorc is a ranged one. It has 0 melee skills, it has skills to keep people out of melee range (Mines). It wouldn't work with the rest of the toolkit.
I'd rather they change it to a DoT and a debuff or root/snare. Or anything else remotely useful. But it has to be something that works with rest of the class.
I'd rather that, then nerfing it back to being a nothing skill that no one uses ever. Which is what would happen if they reduce the range to 8m.
Yea but um, Zos balances by making skills in line with similar skills. That was their justification for nerfing strife and other skills. strife got nerfed because devs wanted it to be consistent with force shock...logically, why does rune cage get to be different and more powerful? No, under their idiotic logic which stove pipes build diversity rune cage needs the same treatment as fossilize.
Sure, I'm all for them making Rune Cage similar to Cripple :PEU | PC | AD1 -
Nerftheforums✭✭✭✭✭
✭"This stun is op, so keep it as it is and revert all nerfs to frags back because you know, sorcs lacks damage".
Despite I think everybody agrees that the stun on frags was WAY better than this op fossilize that is rune cage, there is no need whatsoever to buff the frag's damage. It hits as hard as a direct damage ulti and can be casted for a super low costs every 3-5 seconds from range.
A really nice idea I read some days ago was to make rune cage blockable but not dodgiable. That might be a tiny solution for non tanky players , while still having rc be one of the strongest CCs in the game.5 -
leb91han✭✭✭
i play on pc eu . I would be the happiest guy if i see a frag hitting a player for more then 4 to 4.5k dmg . Lol frag dmg is joke it only hit harder on mag sorc and mag/stam nb coz they in light/medium armor. Anything else its 4 to 4.5k which is nothing since those tankier guys usually are in the range of 25-30k health . Want more ? Go hit a mag templar with riposte or brass or pirate skeleton or a tanky stam warden its ridiculous on them i see 3k crit frags . Frag definetely needs back it 20% extra dmg . Rune cage is not op it does average 2-3k dmg again on squishy players like mag sorc mag/stam nb and an average of 1-2k on tankier opponents which is nothing. I hate rune cage its expensive and very hard to complete combo curse fury meteor rune frag. Always get stunned while doing it . Also i am not using rune im still using master staff with reach ,rune is so boring. Plz bring back frag 20% dmg + stun .Nerftheforums wrote: »Despite I think everybody agrees that the stun on frags was WAY better than this op fossilize that is rune cage, there is no need whatsoever to buff the frag's damage. It hits as hard as a direct damage ulti and can be casted for a super low costs every 3-5 seconds from range.
1 -
Vapirko✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Do people not remember when Cyrodiil was dominated by magicka sorcs? And again, without an unblockbale cc what exactly do you propose to do against mag DKs and/or permablock builds?2 -
thankyourat✭✭✭✭✭
✭rimmidimdim wrote: »Rune cage needs a range debuff, like fossilize received. That's all. Cheers.
Disagree.
DK is a melee class, Sorc is a ranged one. It has 0 melee skills, it has skills to keep people out of melee range (Mines). It wouldn't work with the rest of the toolkit.
I'd rather they change it to a DoT and a debuff or root/snare. Or anything else remotely useful. But it has to be something that works with rest of the class.
I'd rather that, then nerfing it back to being a nothing skill that no one uses ever. Which is what would happen if they reduce the range to 8m.
Yea but um, Zos balances by making skills in line with similar skills. That was their justification for nerfing strife and other skills. strife got nerfed because devs wanted it to be consistent with force shock...logically, why does rune cage get to be different and more powerful? No, under their idiotic logic which stove pipes build diversity rune cage needs the same treatment as fossilize.
Sure, I'm all for them making Rune Cage similar to Cripple :P
But sorcs already have mines which is cripple on steroids0 -
Aedaryl✭✭✭✭✭
✭thankyourat wrote: »rimmidimdim wrote: »Rune cage needs a range debuff, like fossilize received. That's all. Cheers.
Disagree.
DK is a melee class, Sorc is a ranged one. It has 0 melee skills, it has skills to keep people out of melee range (Mines). It wouldn't work with the rest of the toolkit.
I'd rather they change it to a DoT and a debuff or root/snare. Or anything else remotely useful. But it has to be something that works with rest of the class.
I'd rather that, then nerfing it back to being a nothing skill that no one uses ever. Which is what would happen if they reduce the range to 8m.
Yea but um, Zos balances by making skills in line with similar skills. That was their justification for nerfing strife and other skills. strife got nerfed because devs wanted it to be consistent with force shock...logically, why does rune cage get to be different and more powerful? No, under their idiotic logic which stove pipes build diversity rune cage needs the same treatment as fossilize.
Sure, I'm all for them making Rune Cage similar to Cripple :P
But sorcs already have mines which is cripple on steroids
You mean the 5 ones break with a dodge roll without taking health damage when I use a 13k shield ?0 -
Vaoh✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭thankyourat wrote: »rimmidimdim wrote: »Rune cage needs a range debuff, like fossilize received. That's all. Cheers.
Disagree.
DK is a melee class, Sorc is a ranged one. It has 0 melee skills, it has skills to keep people out of melee range (Mines). It wouldn't work with the rest of the toolkit.
I'd rather they change it to a DoT and a debuff or root/snare. Or anything else remotely useful. But it has to be something that works with rest of the class.
I'd rather that, then nerfing it back to being a nothing skill that no one uses ever. Which is what would happen if they reduce the range to 8m.
Yea but um, Zos balances by making skills in line with similar skills. That was their justification for nerfing strife and other skills. strife got nerfed because devs wanted it to be consistent with force shock...logically, why does rune cage get to be different and more powerful? No, under their idiotic logic which stove pipes build diversity rune cage needs the same treatment as fossilize.
Sure, I'm all for them making Rune Cage similar to Cripple :P
But sorcs already have mines which is cripple on steroids
How tf can people compare Sorc mines to NB cripple. They’re completely different skills. What’s the matter with you people lol.5 -
Feanor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭@Vaoh
We have reached a forum hysteria where every Sorc skill is considered OP. I’m waiting for the nerf calls to Bound Aegis because it has four effects (4!!!!!) while costing only 4,000 magicka.Main characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 50 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard StamplarAll chars 50 @ CP 1900+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.4 -
Emma_Overload✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭rimmidimdim wrote: »Rune cage needs a range debuff, like fossilize received. That's all. Cheers.
DKs are melee, Sorcs need to be able to fight at range. If you want to make us melee players, give us a powerful melee spammable like Whip!#CAREBEARMASTERRACE1 -
Emma_Overload✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭thankyourat wrote: »rimmidimdim wrote: »Rune cage needs a range debuff, like fossilize received. That's all. Cheers.
Disagree.
DK is a melee class, Sorc is a ranged one. It has 0 melee skills, it has skills to keep people out of melee range (Mines). It wouldn't work with the rest of the toolkit.
I'd rather they change it to a DoT and a debuff or root/snare. Or anything else remotely useful. But it has to be something that works with rest of the class.
I'd rather that, then nerfing it back to being a nothing skill that no one uses ever. Which is what would happen if they reduce the range to 8m.
Yea but um, Zos balances by making skills in line with similar skills. That was their justification for nerfing strife and other skills. strife got nerfed because devs wanted it to be consistent with force shock...logically, why does rune cage get to be different and more powerful? No, under their idiotic logic which stove pipes build diversity rune cage needs the same treatment as fossilize.
Sure, I'm all for them making Rune Cage similar to Cripple :P
But sorcs already have mines which is cripple on steroids
LOL. I think you meant to say mines is like cripple on hemorrhoids.
If cripple cost 5000 magicka and let you walk right around it, THEN it would be like mines!#CAREBEARMASTERRACE3 -
thankyourat✭✭✭✭✭
✭thankyourat wrote: »rimmidimdim wrote: »Rune cage needs a range debuff, like fossilize received. That's all. Cheers.
Disagree.
DK is a melee class, Sorc is a ranged one. It has 0 melee skills, it has skills to keep people out of melee range (Mines). It wouldn't work with the rest of the toolkit.
I'd rather they change it to a DoT and a debuff or root/snare. Or anything else remotely useful. But it has to be something that works with rest of the class.
I'd rather that, then nerfing it back to being a nothing skill that no one uses ever. Which is what would happen if they reduce the range to 8m.
Yea but um, Zos balances by making skills in line with similar skills. That was their justification for nerfing strife and other skills. strife got nerfed because devs wanted it to be consistent with force shock...logically, why does rune cage get to be different and more powerful? No, under their idiotic logic which stove pipes build diversity rune cage needs the same treatment as fossilize.
Sure, I'm all for them making Rune Cage similar to Cripple :P
But sorcs already have mines which is cripple on steroids
How tf can people compare Sorc mines to NB cripple. They’re completely different skills. What’s the matter with you people lol.
From a PvE perspective I completely agree. From a PvP perspective they serve the exact same purpose they are both roots used for fight control and kiting. Neither is used for the damage portion. They are both used for the same reason0 -
Feanor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭@thankyourat
Mines are more area denial than kiting though. The play style is completely different to using Cripple, and Cripple is used too because it procs Skoria.Main characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 50 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard StamplarAll chars 50 @ CP 1900+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.0 -
thankyourat✭✭✭✭✭
✭@thankyourat
Mines are more area denial than kiting though. The play style is completely different to using Cripple, and Cripple is used too because it procs Skoria.
Mines can be used for area denial but they are mostly used to keep melee characters from applying too much pressure to you which is the same function the crippling grasp is used for. Cripple can proc skoria but that's not why magblades slot it. I don't even use skoria and I slot cripple. It's only on my bar for the root I don't think I even waited 8 seconds to reapply it1 -
frostz417✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Do people not remember when Cyrodiil was dominated by magicka sorcs? And again, without an unblockbale cc what exactly do you propose to do against mag DKs and/or permablock builds?
Perma blocking was nerfed in dragonbones patch, the only class that can some what block for a while is a DK and they get destroyed by any form of defile so they die fast. L2p if you can’t counter a “Perma Blocker” build.3 -
Irylia✭✭✭✭✭
✭Seems like an odd buff, I mean sorc frags stunning?
*every new player ever*
But let’s keep complaining about Rc.
Frag hits hard against the bowtard running full divines. It hits for a pitiful 3-6k even as a crit vs heavy and it’s not a spammable.
Surprise attack hits for a consistent 5-7
1 -
Maulkin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭thankyourat wrote: »rimmidimdim wrote: »Rune cage needs a range debuff, like fossilize received. That's all. Cheers.
Disagree.
DK is a melee class, Sorc is a ranged one. It has 0 melee skills, it has skills to keep people out of melee range (Mines). It wouldn't work with the rest of the toolkit.
I'd rather they change it to a DoT and a debuff or root/snare. Or anything else remotely useful. But it has to be something that works with rest of the class.
I'd rather that, then nerfing it back to being a nothing skill that no one uses ever. Which is what would happen if they reduce the range to 8m.
Yea but um, Zos balances by making skills in line with similar skills. That was their justification for nerfing strife and other skills. strife got nerfed because devs wanted it to be consistent with force shock...logically, why does rune cage get to be different and more powerful? No, under their idiotic logic which stove pipes build diversity rune cage needs the same treatment as fossilize.
Sure, I'm all for them making Rune Cage similar to Cripple :P
But sorcs already have mines which is cripple on steroids
No it's not. Mines are great but situational, because they are area denial. Cripple on the other hand, is always useful.
Are you kiting? Cripple is a great DoT to apply from range.
Are you gap closing? Cripple roots and slows them while you get major expedition.
Are you trying to get away? Same as above....
Majority of Sorcs will mostly have Mines on the overload bar (if at all!) and use it when they want to hold a flag or defend a choke point. Or duels maybe. They are great skill, but situational.
Whereas Cripple is a constant on the Magblade bar, whatever build they are playing. And that applies to PvP and PvE.Edited by Maulkin on June 21, 2018 2:01PMEU | PC | AD0 -
rimmidimdim✭✭✭Emma_Overload wrote: »rimmidimdim wrote: »Rune cage needs a range debuff, like fossilize received. That's all. Cheers.
DKs are melee, Sorcs need to be able to fight at range. If you want to make us melee players, give us a powerful melee spammable like Whip!
You shouldn't be able to blow people up a mile away because of an OP stun. It's dumb, I actually feel it's more of a blight in battlegrounds than sloads. BG's feels like it's pretty much all ranged magic builds(the best groups) with the odd solo NB running around.4 -
Feanor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭rimmidimdim wrote: »Emma_Overload wrote: »rimmidimdim wrote: »Rune cage needs a range debuff, like fossilize received. That's all. Cheers.
DKs are melee, Sorcs need to be able to fight at range. If you want to make us melee players, give us a powerful melee spammable like Whip!
You shouldn't be able to blow people up a mile away because of an OP stun. It's dumb, I actually feel it's more of a blight in battlegrounds than sloads. BG's feels like it's pretty much all ranged magic builds(the best groups) with the odd solo NB running around.
You shouldn’t be able to gap close from a mile away with a free snare on top as well. Yet you can. Range is an illusion if you don’t have LoS.Main characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 50 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard StamplarAll chars 50 @ CP 1900+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.8 -
rimmidimdim✭✭✭rimmidimdim wrote: »Emma_Overload wrote: »rimmidimdim wrote: »Rune cage needs a range debuff, like fossilize received. That's all. Cheers.
DKs are melee, Sorcs need to be able to fight at range. If you want to make us melee players, give us a powerful melee spammable like Whip!
You shouldn't be able to blow people up a mile away because of an OP stun. It's dumb, I actually feel it's more of a blight in battlegrounds than sloads. BG's feels like it's pretty much all ranged magic builds(the best groups) with the odd solo NB running around.
You shouldn’t be able to gap close from a mile away with a free snare on top as well. Yet you can. Range is an illusion if you don’t have LoS.
Collusion illusion. I don't think you can compare Rune cage to a gap closer skill. You can compare it too another CC skill. You could compare a gap closer skill with another gap closer skill. Rune cage is OP versus other CC skills.
But to your point of you shouldn't be able to gap close from a mile away, even though a completely different topic, I can agree.
I would take rune cage over a gap closer personally.6 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭No, you wouldn't.
You would curse yourself when a sorc streaked away from you. Even WITH gapclosers, that's still a complaint from certain people. But even without Streak, people would slap on speed pots and run from you. Kiting around trees is also way harder with gapclosers in play, and the attached super snare.1 -
Vapirko✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭thankyourat wrote: »rimmidimdim wrote: »Rune cage needs a range debuff, like fossilize received. That's all. Cheers.
Disagree.
DK is a melee class, Sorc is a ranged one. It has 0 melee skills, it has skills to keep people out of melee range (Mines). It wouldn't work with the rest of the toolkit.
I'd rather they change it to a DoT and a debuff or root/snare. Or anything else remotely useful. But it has to be something that works with rest of the class.
I'd rather that, then nerfing it back to being a nothing skill that no one uses ever. Which is what would happen if they reduce the range to 8m.
Yea but um, Zos balances by making skills in line with similar skills. That was their justification for nerfing strife and other skills. strife got nerfed because devs wanted it to be consistent with force shock...logically, why does rune cage get to be different and more powerful? No, under their idiotic logic which stove pipes build diversity rune cage needs the same treatment as fossilize.
Sure, I'm all for them making Rune Cage similar to Cripple :P
But sorcs already have mines which is cripple on steroids
Id take a ranged root on my sorc over mines any day.1 -
LeHarrt91✭✭✭✭✭
✭I find the duration long and sometimes cannot break free instantly. I havent noticed the damage on break free, how mcuh is the tooltip? I understand the range as thats a sorcs forte but it makes escape hard in medium armor.PS NA
Have played all classes.
Warden Main0
