Maintenance for the week of March 9:
• NA megaservers for patch maintenance – March 9, 4:00AM EDT (8:00 UTC) - 12:00PM EDT (16:00 UTC)
• EU megaservers for patch maintenance – March 9, 8:00 UTC (4:00AM EDT) - 16:00 UTC (12:00PM EDT)
• ESO Store and Account System for maintenance – March 11, 9:00AM EDT (13:00 UTC) - 1:00PM EDT (17:00 UTC)
• NA megaservers for patch maintenance – March 9, 4:00AM EDT (8:00 UTC) - 12:00PM EDT (16:00 UTC)
• EU megaservers for patch maintenance – March 9, 8:00 UTC (4:00AM EDT) - 16:00 UTC (12:00PM EDT)
• ESO Store and Account System for maintenance – March 11, 9:00AM EDT (13:00 UTC) - 1:00PM EDT (17:00 UTC)
Stop Putting Crit Rating On Proc Sets
Solariken
✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭
If you plan to keep the terrible bandage fix that does not allow damage proc sets to critically strike, please stop adding critical strike rating to item set bonuses. This is completely counter intuitive and limits build potential. The obvious exceptions would be the sets that require critical strikes as a proc condition, a la Briarheart.
In Summerset only Mantle of Siroria and Arms of Relequen feature this poor itemization but there are a large number of sets throughout the rest of the game (like Viper) that could have the itemization improved.
Maybe this isn't a big deal to most players but it sure triggers my OCD.
In Summerset only Mantle of Siroria and Arms of Relequen feature this poor itemization but there are a large number of sets throughout the rest of the game (like Viper) that could have the itemization improved.
Maybe this isn't a big deal to most players but it sure triggers my OCD.
6
-
DuskMarine✭✭✭✭✭
✭If you plan to keep the terrible bandage fix that does not allow damage proc sets to critically strike, please stop adding critical strike rating to item set bonuses. This is completely counter intuitive and limits build potential. The obvious exceptions would be the sets that require critical strikes as a proc condition, a la Briarheart.
In Summerset only Mantle of Siroria and Arms of Relequen feature this poor itemization but there are a large number of sets throughout the rest of the game (like Viper) that could have the itemization improved.
Maybe this isn't a big deal to most players but it sure triggers my OCD.
the only sets that really shouldnt add it are monster helmets.0 -
DeadlyRecluse✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Crit rating doesn't help proc damage, but neither does spell/weapon damage or max stats, and I don't think there is anyone who wants all of those removed off of any set with a damage proc.
It is counter-intuitive at first blush, but I don't really think it's a big deal. Just one more thing to consider when evaluating sets.Thrice Empress, Forever Scrub9 -
DuskMarine✭✭✭✭✭
✭DeadlyRecluse wrote: »Crit rating doesn't help proc damage, but neither does spell/weapon damage or max stats, and I don't think there is anyone who wants all of those removed off of any set with a damage proc.
It is counter-intuitive at first blush, but I don't really think it's a big deal. Just one more thing to consider when evaluating sets.
um your like 100% wrong if you put a stam set on a magic user since their stamina and WD is so low the damage proc is gonna be pathetic0 -
Tempestwrath✭✭✭DuskMarine wrote: »DeadlyRecluse wrote: »Crit rating doesn't help proc damage, but neither does spell/weapon damage or max stats, and I don't think there is anyone who wants all of those removed off of any set with a damage proc.
It is counter-intuitive at first blush, but I don't really think it's a big deal. Just one more thing to consider when evaluating sets.
um your like 100% wrong if you put a stam set on a magic user since their stamina and WD is so low the damage proc is gonna be pathetic
He's correct. Proc sets' proc magnitude is a result of three factors:
1) Item quality of the set (blue, purple, gold, etc)
2) Racial or class passives that improve the proc damage type (Eg, the Sorc shock damage passive improving Stormfist)
3) Champion Point allocation. (Passives that increase Physical, Poison, and Disease damage affect those procs, whereas Magic or Elemental damage is affected by that set of Champion passives.)
Total Mag/Stam and Weapon/Spell Power is not part of the calculation.Edited by Tempestwrath on April 27, 2018 2:09PM8 -
DeadlyRecluse✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭DuskMarine wrote: »DeadlyRecluse wrote: »Crit rating doesn't help proc damage, but neither does spell/weapon damage or max stats, and I don't think there is anyone who wants all of those removed off of any set with a damage proc.
It is counter-intuitive at first blush, but I don't really think it's a big deal. Just one more thing to consider when evaluating sets.
um your like 100% wrong if you put a stam set on a magic user since their stamina and WD is so low the damage proc is gonna be pathetic
Lol.
Proc's don't scale off of max stats, weapon damage, etc.
They DO take the relevant penetration and CP bonuses into consideration.Thrice Empress, Forever Scrub1 -
Solariken✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Tempestwrath wrote: »DuskMarine wrote: »DeadlyRecluse wrote: »Crit rating doesn't help proc damage, but neither does spell/weapon damage or max stats, and I don't think there is anyone who wants all of those removed off of any set with a damage proc.
It is counter-intuitive at first blush, but I don't really think it's a big deal. Just one more thing to consider when evaluating sets.
um your like 100% wrong if you put a stam set on a magic user since their stamina and WD is so low the damage proc is gonna be pathetic
He's correct. Proc sets' proc magnitude is a result of three factors:
1) Item quality of the set (blue, purple, gold, etc)
2) Racial or class passives that improve the proc damage type (Eg, the Sorc shock damage passive improving Stormfist)
3) Champion Point allocation. (Passives that increase Physical, Poison, and Disease damage affect those procs, whereas Magic or Elemental damage is affected by that set.)
Total Mag/Stam and Weapon/Spell Power is not part of the calculation.
I think he meant that with low wpn/spell dmg the proc dmg alone will not be meaningful in a skill combo.
Wpn/spell dmg are more valuable on a dmg proc set for sure. Crit rating is almost a complete waste.0 -
Tempestwrath✭✭✭Tempestwrath wrote: »DuskMarine wrote: »DeadlyRecluse wrote: »Crit rating doesn't help proc damage, but neither does spell/weapon damage or max stats, and I don't think there is anyone who wants all of those removed off of any set with a damage proc.
It is counter-intuitive at first blush, but I don't really think it's a big deal. Just one more thing to consider when evaluating sets.
um your like 100% wrong if you put a stam set on a magic user since their stamina and WD is so low the damage proc is gonna be pathetic
He's correct. Proc sets' proc magnitude is a result of three factors:
1) Item quality of the set (blue, purple, gold, etc)
2) Racial or class passives that improve the proc damage type (Eg, the Sorc shock damage passive improving Stormfist)
3) Champion Point allocation. (Passives that increase Physical, Poison, and Disease damage affect those procs, whereas Magic or Elemental damage is affected by that set.)
Total Mag/Stam and Weapon/Spell Power is not part of the calculation.
I think he meant that with low wpn/spell dmg the proc dmg alone will not be meaningful in a skill combo.
Wpn/spell dmg are more valuable on a dmg proc set for sure. Crit rating is almost a complete waste.
Crit rating on a proc set is unintuitive since it's not a self-reinforcing buff, but a lot of PVE builds have crit rating targets to hit, and having those bonuses integrated across sets make it easier. There aren't as many 5pc proc sets that are used in PVE (Most of them aren't BIS, but are 2nd or 3rd tier options that are viable but not the best), but there's at least some niche purpose there.
In PVP it makes no sense and I totally see your point of view. And I also understand it from the perspective that an item set should have a fairly harmonious group of set bonuses that build off of, and interrelate with each other. I'm in total agreement there.3 -
Avran_Sylt✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Gonna use a proc set? Get less effective stats.
IMO it's there as a balancing mechanism. Lose overall resources for a free source of damage. It's a pseudo skill after all.0 -
Solariken✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Avran_Sylt wrote: »Gonna use a proc set? Get less effective stats.
IMO it's there as a balancing mechanism. Lose overall resources for a free source of damage. It's a pseudo skill after all.
Haha, savage design philosophy @Avran_Sylt. XD
Honestly IMO they should be treated as skills with all the same scaling mechanisms and should also cost resources. Part of the problem with proc damage historically in ESO is that they were just as effective on a tank as a DD. That's bass-ackward. The most damage-centric advantage you should get from a proc set like Viper etc is liberation from one GCD.Edited by Solariken on April 27, 2018 2:48PM0 -
Solariken✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Narvuntien wrote: »Stop making proc sets....
It's not so simple... We have a limited number of skill slots and very shallow character stat mechanics in ESO. There is only so much they can do, and proc sets add some flavor and diversity to the game. They just need to update itemization and functionality.Edited by Solariken on April 27, 2018 2:54PM4 -
Murador178✭✭✭✭DuskMarine wrote: »DeadlyRecluse wrote: »Crit rating doesn't help proc damage, but neither does spell/weapon damage or max stats, and I don't think there is anyone who wants all of those removed off of any set with a damage proc.
It is counter-intuitive at first blush, but I don't really think it's a big deal. Just one more thing to consider when evaluating sets.
um your like 100% wrong if you put a stam set on a magic user since their stamina and WD is so low the damage proc is gonna be pathetic
but u can put a mag set on a stamchar in duels - as long as its Zaan
0 -
Solariken✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Murador178 wrote: »DuskMarine wrote: »DeadlyRecluse wrote: »Crit rating doesn't help proc damage, but neither does spell/weapon damage or max stats, and I don't think there is anyone who wants all of those removed off of any set with a damage proc.
It is counter-intuitive at first blush, but I don't really think it's a big deal. Just one more thing to consider when evaluating sets.
um your like 100% wrong if you put a stam set on a magic user since their stamina and WD is so low the damage proc is gonna be pathetic
but u can put a mag set on a stamchar in duels - as long as its Zaan
Or Knight Slayer like those derpy DW Stamplars running around lately.0 -
Murador178✭✭✭✭Murador178 wrote: »DuskMarine wrote: »DeadlyRecluse wrote: »Crit rating doesn't help proc damage, but neither does spell/weapon damage or max stats, and I don't think there is anyone who wants all of those removed off of any set with a damage proc.
It is counter-intuitive at first blush, but I don't really think it's a big deal. Just one more thing to consider when evaluating sets.
um your like 100% wrong if you put a stam set on a magic user since their stamina and WD is so low the damage proc is gonna be pathetic
but u can put a mag set on a stamchar in duels - as long as its Zaan
Or Knight Slayer like those derpy DW Stamplars running around lately.
stamplars? Feel like using it on stamplar sounds very counterintuitive - maybe stam dk0 -
Solariken✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Murador178 wrote: »Murador178 wrote: »DuskMarine wrote: »DeadlyRecluse wrote: »Crit rating doesn't help proc damage, but neither does spell/weapon damage or max stats, and I don't think there is anyone who wants all of those removed off of any set with a damage proc.
It is counter-intuitive at first blush, but I don't really think it's a big deal. Just one more thing to consider when evaluating sets.
um your like 100% wrong if you put a stam set on a magic user since their stamina and WD is so low the damage proc is gonna be pathetic
but u can put a mag set on a stamchar in duels - as long as its Zaan
Or Knight Slayer like those derpy DW Stamplars running around lately.
stamplars? Feel like using it on stamplar sounds very counterintuitive - maybe stam dk
Yeah idk, it's not my flavor, but Essa and a few other well-known PvP Stamplars have been doing it lately. Seems only mildly effective to me.
It's really just a stacking of cancerous bleeds and Oblivion damage so it would work on any class. Only point I can see is all the free damage and therefore infinite sustain.0 -
Murador178✭✭✭✭Murador178 wrote: »Murador178 wrote: »DuskMarine wrote: »DeadlyRecluse wrote: »Crit rating doesn't help proc damage, but neither does spell/weapon damage or max stats, and I don't think there is anyone who wants all of those removed off of any set with a damage proc.
It is counter-intuitive at first blush, but I don't really think it's a big deal. Just one more thing to consider when evaluating sets.
um your like 100% wrong if you put a stam set on a magic user since their stamina and WD is so low the damage proc is gonna be pathetic
but u can put a mag set on a stamchar in duels - as long as its Zaan
Or Knight Slayer like those derpy DW Stamplars running around lately.
stamplars? Feel like using it on stamplar sounds very counterintuitive - maybe stam dk
Yeah idk, it's not my flavor, but Essa and a few other well-known PvP Stamplars have been doing it lately. Seems only mildly effective to me.
It's really just a stacking of cancerous bleeds and Oblivion damage so it would work on any class. Only point I can see is all the free damage and therefore infinite sustain.
Wont matter this patch so - I dont think stamplar will be a big thing this patch anyways (its getting even worse). So shieldbreaker and sload will get quite popular 0 -
Minno✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Narvuntien wrote: »Stop making proc sets....
It's not so simple... We have a limited number of skill slots and very shallow character stat mechanics in ESO. There is only so much they can do, and proc sets add some flavor and diversity to the game. They just need to update itemization and functionality.
The crit dmg modifer nerf ruins alot more sets than people expect now.
Need to test, especially now that I am swapping over to stamina templar.Minno - DC - Forum-plar Extraordinaire
- Guild-lead for MV
- Filthy Casual0 -
Ragnaroek93✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Narvuntien wrote: »Stop making proc sets....
This.I used to think that PvP was a tragedy, but now I realize, it's a comedy.0 -
Murador178✭✭✭✭Narvuntien wrote: »Stop making proc sets....
It's not so simple... We have a limited number of skill slots and very shallow character stat mechanics in ESO. There is only so much they can do, and proc sets add some flavor and diversity to the game. They just need to update itemization and functionality.
The crit dmg modifer nerf ruins alot more sets than people expect now.
Need to test, especially now that I am swapping over to stamina templar.
From what class are u downgrading
1 -
mesmerizedish✭✭✭✭✭Did you know that people who use proc sets actually use a lot of other spells and abilities as well?1 -
Minno✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Murador178 wrote: »Narvuntien wrote: »Stop making proc sets....
It's not so simple... We have a limited number of skill slots and very shallow character stat mechanics in ESO. There is only so much they can do, and proc sets add some flavor and diversity to the game. They just need to update itemization and functionality.
The crit dmg modifer nerf ruins alot more sets than people expect now.
Need to test, especially now that I am swapping over to stamina templar.
From what class are u downgrading
Magplar. So you meant upgrading lolMinno - DC - Forum-plar Extraordinaire
- Guild-lead for MV
- Filthy Casual0 -
Murador178✭✭✭✭Murador178 wrote: »Narvuntien wrote: »Stop making proc sets....
It's not so simple... We have a limited number of skill slots and very shallow character stat mechanics in ESO. There is only so much they can do, and proc sets add some flavor and diversity to the game. They just need to update itemization and functionality.
The crit dmg modifer nerf ruins alot more sets than people expect now.
Need to test, especially now that I am swapping over to stamina templar.
From what class are u downgrading
Magplar. So you meant upgrading lol
Hmm depends what u want to do. But for solo PvP both are rather meh imo . Both are decentish in smallscale group so 
. So i prob would go magplar over stamplar for solo 
. 0 -
Minno✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Murador178 wrote: »Murador178 wrote: »Narvuntien wrote: »Stop making proc sets....
It's not so simple... We have a limited number of skill slots and very shallow character stat mechanics in ESO. There is only so much they can do, and proc sets add some flavor and diversity to the game. They just need to update itemization and functionality.
The crit dmg modifer nerf ruins alot more sets than people expect now.
Need to test, especially now that I am swapping over to stamina templar.
From what class are u downgrading
Magplar. So you meant upgrading lol
Hmm depends what u want to do. But for solo PvP both are rather meh imo . Both are decentish in smallscale group so . So i prob would go magplar over stamplar for solo .
at least stamplar doesnt need to use pots to get major expedition lolMinno - DC - Forum-plar Extraordinaire
- Guild-lead for MV
- Filthy Casual0 -
Murador178✭✭✭✭Murador178 wrote: »Murador178 wrote: »Narvuntien wrote: »Stop making proc sets....
It's not so simple... We have a limited number of skill slots and very shallow character stat mechanics in ESO. There is only so much they can do, and proc sets add some flavor and diversity to the game. They just need to update itemization and functionality.
The crit dmg modifer nerf ruins alot more sets than people expect now.
Need to test, especially now that I am swapping over to stamina templar.
From what class are u downgrading
Magplar. So you meant upgrading lol
Hmm depends what u want to do. But for solo PvP both are rather meh imo . Both are decentish in smallscale group so . So i prob would go magplar over stamplar for solo .
at least stamplar doesnt need to use pots to get major expedition lol
most stamplar run dw/2h or snb/2h - so most need it - so maybe the 2h changes change that ^^
But with a 2h/bow medium armor stamplar u will have some serious trouble vs the upcoming runecage changes.Edited by Murador178 on April 27, 2018 5:30PM0 -
Minno✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Murador178 wrote: »Murador178 wrote: »Murador178 wrote: »Narvuntien wrote: »Stop making proc sets....
It's not so simple... We have a limited number of skill slots and very shallow character stat mechanics in ESO. There is only so much they can do, and proc sets add some flavor and diversity to the game. They just need to update itemization and functionality.
The crit dmg modifer nerf ruins alot more sets than people expect now.
Need to test, especially now that I am swapping over to stamina templar.
From what class are u downgrading
Magplar. So you meant upgrading lol
Hmm depends what u want to do. But for solo PvP both are rather meh imo . Both are decentish in smallscale group so . So i prob would go magplar over stamplar for solo .
at least stamplar doesnt need to use pots to get major expedition lol
most stamplar run dw/2h or snb/2h - so most need it - so maybe the 2h changes change that ^^
But with a 2h/bow medium armor stamplar u will have some serious trouble vs the upcoming runecage changes.
good point. Though how many sorcs will be running it or know how to time it (because isnt the time buff for the morph that is defensive not the offensive style cc?).
Either way, it would be interesting to try out stamplar.Minno - DC - Forum-plar Extraordinaire
- Guild-lead for MV
- Filthy Casual0 -
Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Crit provides more damage than the max mag counter part.
Dunno wut OP is thinking, unless he doesn't use any abilities1 -
Chilly-McFreeze✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭I don't agree with you but I'd like to read what you'd put there instead?0 -
Solariken✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Waffennacht wrote: »Crit provides more damage than the max mag counter part.
Dunno wut OP is thinking, unless he doesn't use any abilities
Crit provides more damage IF you crit.
Max resource is way better IMO, reliable boost to dmg + healing, bigger wards, more gas in the tank, bigger Backlash, synergy with more %amps, etc.0 -
DeadlyRecluse✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭I think he meant that with low wpn/spell dmg the proc dmg alone will not be meaningful in a skill combo.
Wpn/spell dmg are more valuable on a dmg proc set for sure. Crit rating is almost a complete waste.
He specifically said
, which is absolutely incorrect.DuskMarine wrote: »the damage proc is gonna be patheticWaffennacht wrote: »Crit provides more damage than the max mag counter part.
Dunno wut OP is thinking, unless he doesn't use any abilities
Crit provides more damage IF you crit.
Max resource is way better IMO, reliable boost to dmg + healing, bigger wards, more gas in the tank, bigger Backlash, synergy with more %amps, etc.
Sure...but that's unrelated to the bonus being on a proc set. Max resource is more reliable for all of those things on a "stat" set or on a passive 5piece set, too.
So is what you are really arguing here "stop putting crit as a bonus on sets in general"?
It's initially compelling to try and link crit on proc sets as a design flaw because the procs can't crit, but again--the other bonuses don't effect them either.Edited by DeadlyRecluse on April 27, 2018 8:27PMThrice Empress, Forever Scrub0
