Open letter to ZOS concerning bots

Marginis · April 2018

dimensional wrote: »

Any chance you are reading this thread @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_RichLambert @ZOS_KaiSchober ?

Almost definitely lurking.

In response to OP, I wonder what that would mean logistically, hiring individuals to patrol the game world?... I mean, I like the idea, but I'm not sure how effective it would be in the end at accomplishing its goal of stopping bots, if it would be cost-effective, and what other responsibilities they might add to the hire in addition to bot hunting. Good food for thought, in the very least, however, and there are almost definitely people who would apply for the job (sign me up ZOS~).

Marginis · April 2018

sirston wrote: »

couldn't they pull a runescape and have a % chance of npcs spawning and yelling "HA HA GOT YOU NOW" which could be labed as thief's/murders and would K.O. you if you try to run?

Keep in mind that this didn't eliminate bots either, and there were reasons that Jagex took random events out as well, but it's not the worst idea.

Soul_Marrow · April 2018

Watch how quickly the effort is made to silence this thread vs the effort to tone down botting. lol

Fleshreaper · April 2018

Could possibly have a pop-up window that you have to click through. If you are reported for botting, you will get an automatic pop-up window that block off most of the screen, with in second of being reported, asking if you are a real person. If you click the window right away, you are flagged as clear and won't see another window for a while. If it take a few minutes to clear the window, your account is flagged for review by a GM. On the other hand if one person is flagging everyone in zone, then their account will get flagged for abuse.

Dragonnord · April 2018

Violynne wrote: »

I don't see a solution that's not going to waste time. Every single online game has bots, and there's nothing anyone can do about them except ignore them.

I've seen bots, but as long as they don't affect my game, I couldn't care less about them.

Kicking them off is only temporary. They'll be back. They're always going to be back.

Why you say "there's nothing anyone can do"? SURE THERE IS! Put a GM (as the OP said) to work ONLY on this. Again, ONLY on removing bots. His/her role in the company is SOLELY to deal with bots, nothing else.

Once the bots owners see that their bots are being removed quickly, they will surely cease.

Sorry to tell you are wrong, because there are solutions if ZOS is willing...

dimensional · April 2018

Can we keep this thread alive until we at least see some kind of acknowledgment from ZOS about this problem? Voice your concerns and tag the community staff in your posts. Even if they can't jump on top of this problem immediately, I think we can all agree that they should do a better job communicating with us. Let us know that you care, ZOS.

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_KaiSchober @ZOS_RichLambert

grom1024 · April 2018

Some community patrol solution:

Allow player to issue bot curse to any player in open world (there is already kick in dungeons). While under bot curse all actions are locked down except for capcha input and cursed is immune to any damage and looses all aggro. Bot curse persists under logout or game exit.
The player could issue bot curse only with cooldown of 4 hours.
The player could be cursed only with cooldown of the 2 hours.

If player was under bot curse use keyboard and mouse commands, automatic notification of support is triggered.

Basically it paralize bots, so they will eat electricity and will do nothing in exchange.

Walting · April 2018

Marginis wrote: »

In response to OP, I wonder what that would mean logistically, hiring individuals to patrol the game world?... I mean, I like the idea, but I'm not sure how effective it would be in the end at accomplishing its goal of stopping bots, if it would be cost-effective, and what other responsibilities they might add to the hire in addition to bot hunting. Good food for thought, in the very least, however, and there are almost definitely people who would apply for the job (sign me up ZOS~).

ZOS hired an external expert team to implement the Crown Crates - to make money in the long run.

Hiring external experts to implement algorithms to detect farming bots and ban them automatically also costs money but ZOS does not make money with it.

Instead the next senche mount is in ZOS development while the bots make good cash selling gold on gold selling websites

dimensional · May 2018

So literally no response to this at all, huh? Come on @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_GaryA @ZOS_RichLambert @ZOS_BillE @ZOS_MichaelServotte @ZOS_Wrobel

Can we get a single developer or ZOS employee to forward this along? How about some more bumps to this thread? IMO we shouldn't stop talking about this issue until it is addressed.

IXxIronWolfxXI · June 2018

Everyone would love to get rid of bots however like others have said it's a thing in every online game, whether thats BDO, WoW, FIFA or anything. They aren't dealt with simply because they aren't 'worth' dealing with. Sure you could randomise mob spawns, however that screws over people who genuinely grind mob spawns/have rotations to farm XP/mats. There simply isn't a conventional solution. Hire a GM? ZoS is a company and this game is a business to them, hiring a GM to solely ban bots gives them absolutely NO benefit but costs them MONEY. The bots are not game breaking and have a high cost to pay to be removed therefore it is incredibly unlikely anything will be done, every MMORPG suffers from this unfortunately you need to accept it and move on.

Walting · June 2018

IXxIronWolfxXI wrote: »

The bots are not game breaking and have a high cost to pay to be removed therefore it is incredibly unlikely anything will be done, every MMORPG suffers from this unfortunately you need to accept it and move on.

As said by many people before, there is no reason to accept Bots in an MMO. Also it is not acceptable how ZoS is handling Bots literally doing nothing while saying otherwise.

I doubt that there are high costs involved in removing bots and i have no clue what you mean by "game breaking" Let me tell you that bots on PC EU have influenced market prices by a lot - selling Dreugh Wax and other gathered stuff way below market prices. So bots do influence players that farm and sell materials.

Also, on PC EU there are guilds that are founded or at least supported by bot gold. These guilds have been successfully biding on the best guild traders in the game.

Lastely, the amount of farming bots has been growing on a daily basis. On PC EU the big bot trains have become bigger than 20+ bots farming like you see on the screenshot taken at southern Reaper's March

So please don't tell the people that are bringing this topic to attention to move on. Instead you should have an eye on if ZoS is becoming active in this matter to reflect user concerns and enforce their own terms of service.

dimensional · July 2018

Is anyone else having any more problems with bots or do we all just not care?

Asha_11_ESO · July 2018

Agree with those mentioning how part of what's very frustrating about bots, is reporting them. It's not that easy to do when there are 8+ characters bunched up together and constantly on the move.

I also don't understand why a lot of mmo's don't have a specific report botting option, rather than cheating/spamming. It makes it seem confusing, like it will just get lost in a pile of other unrelated reports, and like your efforts to help the game aren't worthwhile.

Shadow-Fighter · July 2018

dimensional wrote: »

Is anyone else having any more problems with bots or do we all just not care?

You still here? Thats why Zos dont care...

Morgul667 · July 2018

dimensional wrote: »

Is anyone else having any more problems with bots or do we all just not care?

Honestly I care more about bad game performance and crappy pvp conditions than for those bots

Ragebull · July 2018

Morgul667 wrote: »

dimensional wrote: »

Is anyone else having any more problems with bots or do we all just not care?

Honestly I care more about bad game performance and crappy pvp conditions than for those bots

ZOS doesn't have to choose between bots or stability. There's no excuse why they can't address everything (being stingy is not a reason to neglect your product)

Kelces · July 2018

Looks like only name-shamers get banned, still waiting for a response aswell for a bot group I reported...

Blacknight841 · July 2018

Walting wrote: »

Marginis wrote: »

In response to OP, I wonder what that would mean logistically, hiring individuals to patrol the game world?... I mean, I like the idea, but I'm not sure how effective it would be in the end at accomplishing its goal of stopping bots, if it would be cost-effective, and what other responsibilities they might add to the hire in addition to bot hunting. Good food for thought, in the very least, however, and there are almost definitely people who would apply for the job (sign me up ZOS~).

ZOS hired an external expert team to implement the Crown Crates - to make money in the long run.

Hiring external experts to implement algorithms to detect farming bots and ban them automatically also costs money but ZOS does not make money with it.

Instead the next senche mount is in ZOS development while the bots make good cash selling gold on gold selling websites

They don't need to hire an external expert. I would do it for free.

webrgesner · July 2018

On Xbox i was peacefully question until i saw a group of sorcs in lightning form and pets running around killing imps! I was disgusted seing one of the bots is cp200. WHICH MEANS THAT BOT HAS BEEN THERE FARMING SINCE LVL1 AND STILL HAVENT GOTTEN BANNED! Also the dolmens in alikr desert. I always go there to power level my new toons or skills and lately there have been like 10 bots runnung around doing the same thing in sync when theirs a dolmen fight and its always sorcs

Morgul667 · July 2018

webrgesner wrote: »

On Xbox i was peacefully question until i saw a group of sorcs in lightning form and pets running around killing imps! I was disgusted seing one of the bots is cp200. WHICH MEANS THAT BOT HAS BEEN THERE FARMING SINCE LVL1 AND STILL HAVENT GOTTEN BANNED! Also the dolmens in alikr desert. I always go there to power level my new toons or skills and lately there have been like 10 bots runnung around doing the same thing in sync when theirs a dolmen fight and its always sorcs

They're so obvious at some point they have to be blind not to see themn them

Vrany69 · July 2018

I have seen low level players grouping up and farming in that style, so you can't always judge low levels for being bots if they farm consistently, grow some balls and start whining, you obviously do not have time for anything better than watching other people farm.

FakeFox · July 2018

Violynne wrote: »

I don't see a solution that's not going to waste time. Every single online game has bots, and there's nothing anyone can do about them except ignore them.

I've seen bots, but as long as they don't affect my game, I couldn't care less about them.

Kicking them off is only temporary. They'll be back. They're always going to be back.

I would disagree. Warframe for example automatically banns you if you even try to log in with any third party software running in the background that could potentially be harmful for the game. This is a pretty radical solution that leads to other problems, but it never the less shows that you can have a automated systems that prevents things like bots.

Edit: It's to early for me to read dates correctly. Let the necro comments begin.

nryerson1025 · July 2018

Just curious OP but why does it bother you so much? I get that it ruins immersion but, as you said, they are plaguing you. Why? It's not like we go from zone to zone seeing one bot train after another... at least I don't.

Aurielle · July 2018

nryerson1025 wrote: »

Just curious OP but why does it bother you so much? I get that it ruins immersion but, as you said, they are plaguing you. Why? It's not like we go from zone to zone seeing one bot train after another... at least I don't.

Bots do the following:

1. Make it difficult, if not impossible sometimes, to complete certain quests (you know, quests of the “kill ten rats” variety).
2. Mess with the cost of certain crafting items by flooding the market with said items.
3. Contribute to the insane costs for weekly bids on traders, as some trading GMs unfortunately buy gold from bots.
4. Harass you in places like Craglorn when they’re NOT botting by spamming trade windows on you with the intent of offloading their crafting mats in exchange for gold to sell for real money.

Need I go on? Bots are basically the mosquito swarms of the MMO-world: difficult to get rid of and terribly annoying.

cokkto · July 2018

1 crown crate per 20 verified bot reports - and this won't take much time for bots to die

nryerson1025 · July 2018

Aurielle wrote: »

nryerson1025 wrote: »

Just curious OP but why does it bother you so much? I get that it ruins immersion but, as you said, they are plaguing you. Why? It's not like we go from zone to zone seeing one bot train after another... at least I don't.

Bots do the following:

1. Make it difficult, if not impossible sometimes, to complete certain quests (you know, quests of the “kill ten rats” variety).
2. Mess with the cost of certain crafting items by flooding the market with said items.
3. Contribute to the insane costs for weekly bids on traders, as some trading GMs unfortunately buy gold from bots.
4. Harass you in places like Craglorn when they’re NOT botting by spamming trade windows on you with the intent of offloading their crafting mats in exchange for gold to sell for real money.

Need I go on? Bots are basically the mosquito swarms of the MMO-world: difficult to get rid of and terribly annoying.

1. 3 years I've played ESO, I can't say that has ever happened to me.
2. Creating a steady suppy of a particular item brings down the cost l, allowing more players to buy said item. From the perspective of zenimax, this only means sustaining users.
3. Trading guilds don't seem to have a problem maintaining these expenses.
4. I find the people who continuously spam zone chat to sell items/get skyreach carries/looking for group to be of a particular personality--immature, spoiled, childish. Traits of people, not bots.

I'm not trying to advocate botting or gold selling in any way. I just think that maybe they have a function to the game's creators, the people running a business, and maybe that is why they're still here. And it certainly seems like some people are really exaggerating their presence.

antihero727 · July 2018

dimensional wrote: »

Please read this @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_RichLambert or anyone else that can forward this along.

I know that you know that we all know, bots have been plaguing ESO since basically forever. I have been playing since launch but now I am at the point that I am considering not spending a single dime on ESO until SOME kind of meaningful steps are taken towards this problem. Or even some kind of acknowledgement that the way it's currently being handled is not satisfactory.

I propose a simple solution: Just hire ONE game master per megaserver whose sole duty is to be IN-GAME and check on reports of botting as they are generated in real time. They can simply teleport to the location and ban the accounts. I can't stress enough how absolutely miserable it is seeing long bot trains every single zone I go to. Not only is it unfair for people who don't use bots, it's an ugly eye-sore and 100% ruins my gaming experience.

Do you guys and girls at ZOS even take this seriously? Let's see some *real* action on this finally, once and for all.

If any of the community members agree, I implore you to contribute to the thread, tag ZOS people and let them know. Please don't fall into the trap of "oh nothing will be done so there's no point". If you truly feel that way, then don't bother posting. I know for a fact that they read these threads and there have been issues that were resolved in the past simply because a thread like this gained enough traction.

Without bots your gold mats and other endgame mats would be very pricey. Honestly bots should be at the lower end of the care list with how server performance is. It’s not the bots causing the bugged sets and crashes. It’s not bots mismanaging the community. Let’s get the game out of beta then we can address the bots. It is widely believed that the anti bot program they used after the lightning patch is also a large factor in deteriorating server performance. Was the trade off worth it as we still have bots and can’t run a trial without lag

Kelces · July 2018

antihero727 wrote: »

dimensional wrote: »

Please read this @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_RichLambert or anyone else that can forward this along.

I know that you know that we all know, bots have been plaguing ESO since basically forever. I have been playing since launch but now I am at the point that I am considering not spending a single dime on ESO until SOME kind of meaningful steps are taken towards this problem. Or even some kind of acknowledgement that the way it's currently being handled is not satisfactory.

I propose a simple solution: Just hire ONE game master per megaserver whose sole duty is to be IN-GAME and check on reports of botting as they are generated in real time. They can simply teleport to the location and ban the accounts. I can't stress enough how absolutely miserable it is seeing long bot trains every single zone I go to. Not only is it unfair for people who don't use bots, it's an ugly eye-sore and 100% ruins my gaming experience.

Do you guys and girls at ZOS even take this seriously? Let's see some *real* action on this finally, once and for all.

If any of the community members agree, I implore you to contribute to the thread, tag ZOS people and let them know. Please don't fall into the trap of "oh nothing will be done so there's no point". If you truly feel that way, then don't bother posting. I know for a fact that they read these threads and there have been issues that were resolved in the past simply because a thread like this gained enough traction.

Without bots your gold mats and other endgame mats would be very pricey. Honestly bots should be at the lower end of the care list with how server performance is. It’s not the bots causing the bugged sets and crashes. It’s not bots mismanaging the community. Let’s get the game out of beta then we can address the bots. It is widely believed that the anti bot program they used after the lightning patch is also a large factor in deteriorating server performance. Was the trade off worth it as we still have bots and can’t run a trial without lag?

Maybe that's the reason, why the performance issues wont ever be solved. It would be so easy, there were only some cosmetic changes made and voilá...L A G....
Many people still remember, as I do for example as I had better performance with a less advanced PC. It worked fine, except for various bugs, which persist in partly other forms, but it's certainly not to fix those with some graphics enhancement.

Perfect excuse, wouldn't you say?

pslagalb14_ESO · August 2018

I have noticed over the past few days about 60 bots camping ore nodes in Bleakrock and Stros M'kai on the Xbox NA server. I've been reporting the botters gamertags for cheating through the Xbox reporting system along with contacting them through Xbox live chat support. From the two conversations I had it seems they are very concerned about the number of bots. I will be following up with them in a few days. The last conversation with them is worse case scenario they will brick the botters hardware.

madchuska83 · August 2018

Bots = Accounts

Accounts = $$$

ZO$

$$$