Psijic Order Too Grindy

NyassaV · April 2018

I'm ok with Grinding the skill line out, but with the current amount needed to max out the skill line I think it is a bit too much. I'd like to see the amount of xp reduced by 15%-20%

To put it in perspective my friend reached level two after 6 hours of closing portals. Or he finished Level 2, can't remember, either way it feels a little too long

CP5 · April 2018

Levels are purely based on quest completion, its just the fact that each batch of portals being one quest makes it feel long.

Ashtaris · April 2018

With Jewelry crafting apparently being a major grind, Summerset might be remembered as Grinderset instead.

Kikke · April 2018

grinding? in an mmo? nooooo, that cant be!

Mannox · April 2018

Worse than hunting down books for the Mages Guild? Nothing is more fun then that!

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO · April 2018

kikkehs wrote: »

grinding? in an mmo? nooooo, that cant be!

Needing ten rare drops to make a piece of jewelry then needing 40 to get it from white to gold all of that just for one piece. Three pieces per character well you have 15 characters that’s just too much. That’s 50 drops to make and upgrade a ring from white to gold. Three jewelry slots so 50 x 3 x 15 that’s 2,250 mats. That’s way beyond a grind.

Edit: white to gold not white to green.

The_Protagonist · April 2018

Crown Mats coming in Crown Crates soon....

KwarcPL · April 2018

draekab14_ESO wrote: »

Worse than hunting down books for the Mages Guild? Nothing is more fun then that!

But hunting books was basing on wandering Tamriel freely. No slowdowns, no obstacles, just go here, go there. And for Psijiic... one portal mean one quest. You have to visit Artaeum, close breach and return. That tooks time. I believe it would be nice if you've got more distortions per quest or... get one quest and could start closing them all.

Lr0dy · April 2018

KwarcPL wrote: »

draekab14_ESO wrote: »

Worse than hunting down books for the Mages Guild? Nothing is more fun then that!

But hunting books was basing on wandering Tamriel freely. No slowdowns, no obstacles, just go here, go there. And for Psijiic... one portal mean one quest. You have to visit Artaeum, close breach and return. That tooks time. I believe it would be nice if you've got more distortions per quest or... get one quest and could start closing them all.

What? With each PO quest I've gotten, it's included a map and multiple portals across multiple zones to close...

Alakaii · April 2018

The_Protagonist wrote: »

Crown Mats coming in Crown Crates soon....

Great...Another way to take my $

MLGProPlayer · April 2018

Alakaii wrote: »

The_Protagonist wrote: »

Crown Mats coming in Crown Crates soon....

Great...Another way to take my $

You don't have to buy any of the items in the crown store/crates. This is why ZOS releases this stuff: people are willing to buy it. Speak with your wallet if you don't like a business practice.

red_emu · April 2018

What worries me is that it might end up being like dolmens. Dozens of players in one place closing the portal within 30 seconds. It will most likely take a year or so to max out this skill line unless you play 24/7

starkerealm · April 2018

red_emu wrote: »

What worries me is that it might end up being like dolmens. Dozens of players in one place closing the portal within 30 seconds. It will most likely take a year or so to max out this skill line unless you play 24/7

As far as I know, those portals are non-competitive. You interact with them, it's shared with each group member. I don't think they conflict with other players.

My only concern is that there's not enough feedback on where to go. I've seen a lot of people getting very confused in Summerset Zone, trying to figure out where the Illiac Bay is.

kind_hero · April 2018

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

kikkehs wrote: »

grinding? in an mmo? nooooo, that cant be!

Needing ten rare drops to make a piece of jewelry then needing 40 to get it from white to green all of that just for one piece. Three pieces per character well you have 15 characters that’s just too much. That’s 50 drops to make and upgrade a ring from white to gold. Three jewelry slots so 50 x 3 x 15 that’s 2,250 mats. That’s way beyond a grind.

The game is not designed with 14 master crafter alts in mind, nor it should. The fact that some players are ready to invest this much time and effort in a game to have everything maxed/completed for each alt is their choice. I don't think the game should be streamlined so it would be easy to unlock everything for your 14th alt. As a former WoW player, I know what grinding is, so I dislike it. But this profession is something special, it should not be powerleveled in the first 3 days after launch. It is a good thing that the devs decided that you cannot deconstruct jewelry obtained prior the patch, because I know people were hoarding jewelry exactly for this. Leveling JC shouldn't be to grindy, I fully agree with that, but saying that it would be to grindy to do this for 14 alts, its not how the game should be designed. I think the investment in JC should be rewarding, since is available only to those who bought the new chapter. So maxing this profession should feel like an accomplishment, not like leveling alchemy on your alt.

AEAltadoonPadhome · April 2018

The problem is that the people who have the time to maintain 14 alts are also the people who have enough time to grind the full skill out.
The people who can play max a few hours a day or who dont want to grind need maybe a year to max out the skill by doing normal content such as quests, dungeons, trials and pvp.
Besides, there is not really a point in leveling such a skill for 14 alts besides doing the crafting writs more times a day.

Kilandros · April 2018

NyassaV wrote: »

I'm ok with Grinding the skill line out, but with the current amount needed to max out the skill line I think it is a bit too much. I'd like to see the amount of xp reduced by 15%-20%

To put it in perspective my friend reached level two after 6 hours of closing portals. Or he finished Level 2, can't remember, either way it feels a little too long

I reached rank 3 and unlocked imbue weapons in about 1.5 hours so it's not quite that grindy. It is too grindy for me to advance any further on a PTS, but I don't think it's too grindy for a pretty powerful skill line.

heaven13 · April 2018

I don't think the point was the max the craft on 15 characters but to gear out 15 characters (1 crafter who makes jewelry for everyone). Trying to do that for 15 characters with the mats as rare as they are atm is going to be ridiculous.

Enodoc · April 2018

KwarcPL wrote: »

I believe it would be nice if you've got more distortions per quest or... get one quest and could start closing them all.

IMO it doesn't even need to be a quest at all. Kari's Hit List works fine without one. Just make them all available for closing as soon as you finish the first set on Summerset.

Minno · April 2018

Kilandros wrote: »

NyassaV wrote: »

I'm ok with Grinding the skill line out, but with the current amount needed to max out the skill line I think it is a bit too much. I'd like to see the amount of xp reduced by 15%-20%

To put it in perspective my friend reached level two after 6 hours of closing portals. Or he finished Level 2, can't remember, either way it feels a little too long

I reached rank 3 and unlocked imbue weapons in about 1.5 hours so it's not quite that grindy. It is too grindy for me to advance any further on a PTS, but I don't think it's too grindy for a pretty powerful skill line.

I haven't tested the grind yet, but 1.5hrs to unlock close to the accelerate spell is good enough for me.

It sounds like it's fine on paper to spend more hours to unlock meditate/undo.

RaddlemanNumber7 · April 2018

I started this PTS with a new character. He's now level 12. I have not left Summerset with this character. After you've done the first map it seems to me that Psijic Order advancement is just not a practical proposition for a new character.

I don't feel I'm missing out though. The spells seem very niche. Opportunity cost looks far too high to slot any of them on a serious toon. They look like they're just for fun builds and RP'ing.

And a talking skull with attitude? I can do without listening to yet another one of them in yet another FRPG.

Derra · April 2018

NyassaV wrote: »

I'm ok with Grinding the skill line out, but with the current amount needed to max out the skill line I think it is a bit too much. I'd like to see the amount of xp reduced by 15%-20%

To put it in perspective my friend reached level two after 6 hours of closing portals. Or he finished Level 2, can't remember, either way it feels a little too long

I don´t know what your friend did but i took me roughly 6 hours getting from 0 to the last quest with a character that didn´t have all wayshrines unlocked.
It will be way faster on chars with wayshrines and once you know the locations of portals.

llElLoboll · April 2018

I reached rank 9 last night on the Psijic skill line and while the quests are boring they really don't take long. Currently you gain one rank per quest and on a character that had no wayshrines I was completing the quests in thirty minutes or less. My main concern is that the initial quest to close portals around Iliac bay is pretty confusing. After you figure that out though it all goes pretty fast.

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO · April 2018

kind_hero wrote: »

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

kikkehs wrote: »

grinding? in an mmo? nooooo, that cant be!

Needing ten rare drops to make a piece of jewelry then needing 40 to get it from white to green all of that just for one piece. Three pieces per character well you have 15 characters that’s just too much. That’s 50 drops to make and upgrade a ring from white to gold. Three jewelry slots so 50 x 3 x 15 that’s 2,250 mats. That’s way beyond a grind.

The game is not designed with 14 master crafter alts in mind, nor it should. The fact that some players are ready to invest this much time and effort in a game to have everything maxed/completed for each alt is their choice. I don't think the game should be streamlined so it would be easy to unlock everything for your 14th alt. As a former WoW player, I know what grinding is, so I dislike it. But this profession is something special, it should not be powerleveled in the first 3 days after launch. It is a good thing that the devs decided that you cannot deconstruct jewelry obtained prior the patch, because I know people were hoarding jewelry exactly for this. Leveling JC shouldn't be to grindy, I fully agree with that, but saying that it would be to grindy to do this for 14 alts, its not how the game should be designed. I think the investment in JC should be rewarding, since is available only to those who bought the new chapter. So maxing this profession should feel like an accomplishment, not like leveling alchemy on your alt.

I would never waste my time trying to make 15 master craftsmen ever. All my alts are / will be at lv 50 crafting just cause they decon trash when they were leveling. They learn traits if I remember to check no real need to have more then one crafter motifs are expensive for the new one, why buy or grind more then once. Any good motifs are send to my main. My main is well my first guy he’s 9 traits everything and knows nearly all the motifs. He crafts for everyone. I have enough skill points to make a crafter for literally everything and still play him.

They don’t need to balance for 14 crafting alts I’m sure no one has a second crafting alt like me most alt just decon and research whatever trash they happen to have. I just have them learn traits so they can transmute without having to log to my main. Literally all my crafted gear, food, enchants and potions are made on my main.

As it stands I will need 150 rare drops to make a jewelry set for just one character. Now all my alts play a role I can have unique CP and gear for each cause they only do x or y. When you have 15 guys you use crafted gear a lot and to use two crafted sets and a monster set sounds like heaven but when you need 2,250 RARE drops that’s not balanced or grindly it’s just a fake out.

Like hey you can craft your own jewelry but it will take you much longer then just grinding out jewelry sets the old way.

josiahva · April 2018

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

kikkehs wrote: »

grinding? in an mmo? nooooo, that cant be!

Needing ten rare drops to make a piece of jewelry then needing 40 to get it from white to gold all of that just for one piece. Three pieces per character well you have 15 characters that’s just too much. That’s 50 drops to make and upgrade a ring from white to gold. Three jewelry slots so 50 x 3 x 15 that’s 2,250 mats. That’s way beyond a grind.

Edit: white to gold not white to green.

Lets be realistic here: No one is going to get gold jewelry on 15 toons unless they are a completionist. On my tank(My most often played toon) I have been running plague doctor ever since it came out back with One Tamriel...and I STILL dont have plague doctor gold...there is nothing actually stopping me from making it gold, I just dont feel the need to do so, I am fully able to complete all the content in the game in purple gear and the cost/benefit just doesnt make it seem worth it...now, its true this is on a tank, not a DPS so its not like I am giving up any damage...since my DPS toons tend to be much more likely to have gold gear, but even so, I would probably only bother to get gold jewelry for one toon...just like I dont have multiple outfit slots for each toon, I wont have gold jewelry for each and every toon...only my highest DPS toon will it be worth the effort of grinding...otherwise I will just keep on playing the others as they already are.

ecru · April 2018

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

kind_hero wrote: »

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

kikkehs wrote: »

grinding? in an mmo? nooooo, that cant be!

Needing ten rare drops to make a piece of jewelry then needing 40 to get it from white to green all of that just for one piece. Three pieces per character well you have 15 characters that’s just too much. That’s 50 drops to make and upgrade a ring from white to gold. Three jewelry slots so 50 x 3 x 15 that’s 2,250 mats. That’s way beyond a grind.

The game is not designed with 14 master crafter alts in mind, nor it should. The fact that some players are ready to invest this much time and effort in a game to have everything maxed/completed for each alt is their choice. I don't think the game should be streamlined so it would be easy to unlock everything for your 14th alt. As a former WoW player, I know what grinding is, so I dislike it. But this profession is something special, it should not be powerleveled in the first 3 days after launch. It is a good thing that the devs decided that you cannot deconstruct jewelry obtained prior the patch, because I know people were hoarding jewelry exactly for this. Leveling JC shouldn't be to grindy, I fully agree with that, but saying that it would be to grindy to do this for 14 alts, its not how the game should be designed. I think the investment in JC should be rewarding, since is available only to those who bought the new chapter. So maxing this profession should feel like an accomplishment, not like leveling alchemy on your alt.

I would never waste my time trying to make 15 master craftsmen ever. All my alts are / will be at lv 50 crafting just cause they decon trash when they were leveling. They learn traits if I remember to check no real need to have more then one crafter motifs are expensive for the new one, why buy or grind more then once. Any good motifs are send to my main. My main is well my first guy he’s 9 traits everything and knows nearly all the motifs. He crafts for everyone. I have enough skill points to make a crafter for literally everything and still play him.

They don’t need to balance for 14 crafting alts I’m sure no one has a second crafting alt like me most alt just decon and research whatever trash they happen to have. I just have them learn traits so they can transmute without having to log to my main. Literally all my crafted gear, food, enchants and potions are made on my main.

As it stands I will need 150 rare drops to make a jewelry set for just one character. Now all my alts play a role I can have unique CP and gear for each cause they only do x or y. When you have 15 guys you use crafted gear a lot and to use two crafted sets and a monster set sounds like heaven but when you need 2,250 RARE drops that’s not balanced or grindly it’s just a fake out.

Like hey you can craft your own jewelry but it will take you much longer then just grinding out jewelry sets the old way.

almost no one has 14 alts. if it's too grindy for one or two, then say that, but 14? come on.

xaraan · April 2018

draekab14_ESO wrote: »

Worse than hunting down books for the Mages Guild? Nothing is more fun then that!

eh, Mage guild still kind of takes the cake (If you do it seperately/on it's own) just due to the sheer number of books needed I guess.

But psijiic isn't far behind, esp considering it's not build into main storyline and traveling around - so there is no built in way to do it as you do other stuff really. I leveled all my mage guilds by picking up books as I did quests, got shards, etc. all together - this doesn't even feel like there would be an option for something like that.

More like, if you had to go to a mage guild, pick up a quest to get 10 books, then follow a horrible map to find the book and pick it up and not get any points until you went and turned that quest in to get the next 10 books quest. And even if you found a way to jump into the psijiic line with a new character and try and work it into leveling, most of the portal spots aren't like books where they are in locations you will be going to, but in out of the way spots on the map.

So if the contest was to make something worse than Mage Guild leveling, they might not have won that contest, but they came really close and gave it a good effort.

I'd rather they'd have learned from mage's guild and Dark Brotherhood guild leveling and then saw how nice the TG leveling was with several rotating options/quests to level it and figured out that it would be more fun for players in a non-boring grind of repetition. I was really hoping for a variety of things going on to level the line and portals would have just been one type of repeatable.

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO · April 2018

I

josiahva wrote: »

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

kikkehs wrote: »

grinding? in an mmo? nooooo, that cant be!

Needing ten rare drops to make a piece of jewelry then needing 40 to get it from white to gold all of that just for one piece. Three pieces per character well you have 15 characters that’s just too much. That’s 50 drops to make and upgrade a ring from white to gold. Three jewelry slots so 50 x 3 x 15 that’s 2,250 mats. That’s way beyond a grind.

Edit: white to gold not white to green.

Lets be realistic here: No one is going to get gold jewelry on 15 toons unless they are a completionist. On my tank(My most often played toon) I have been running plague doctor ever since it came out back with One Tamriel...and I STILL dont have plague doctor gold...there is nothing actually stopping me from making it gold, I just dont feel the need to do so, I am fully able to complete all the content in the game in purple gear and the cost/benefit just doesnt make it seem worth it...now, its true this is on a tank, not a DPS so its not like I am giving up any damage...since my DPS toons tend to be much more likely to have gold gear, but even so, I would probably only bother to get gold jewelry for one toon...just like I dont have multiple outfit slots for each toon, I wont have gold jewelry for each and every toon...only my highest DPS toon will it be worth the effort of grinding...otherwise I will just keep on playing the others as they already are.

Even at purple that’s still 1,800 refined mats. Yes I would craft for all my guys it’s faster then the grind I hate not knowing what I’m going to get or how to work for it. All of my 15 guys have a 5 piece crafted set on. But I have great dropped sets that I’m missing rings or necklace on

ecru wrote: »

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

kind_hero wrote: »

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

kikkehs wrote: »

grinding? in an mmo? nooooo, that cant be!

Needing ten rare drops to make a piece of jewelry then needing 40 to get it from white to green all of that just for one piece. Three pieces per character well you have 15 characters that’s just too much. That’s 50 drops to make and upgrade a ring from white to gold. Three jewelry slots so 50 x 3 x 15 that’s 2,250 mats. That’s way beyond a grind.

The game is not designed with 14 master crafter alts in mind, nor it should. The fact that some players are ready to invest this much time and effort in a game to have everything maxed/completed for each alt is their choice. I don't think the game should be streamlined so it would be easy to unlock everything for your 14th alt. As a former WoW player, I know what grinding is, so I dislike it. But this profession is something special, it should not be powerleveled in the first 3 days after launch. It is a good thing that the devs decided that you cannot deconstruct jewelry obtained prior the patch, because I know people were hoarding jewelry exactly for this. Leveling JC shouldn't be to grindy, I fully agree with that, but saying that it would be to grindy to do this for 14 alts, its not how the game should be designed. I think the investment in JC should be rewarding, since is available only to those who bought the new chapter. So maxing this profession should feel like an accomplishment, not like leveling alchemy on your alt.

I would never waste my time trying to make 15 master craftsmen ever. All my alts are / will be at lv 50 crafting just cause they decon trash when they were leveling. They learn traits if I remember to check no real need to have more then one crafter motifs are expensive for the new one, why buy or grind more then once. Any good motifs are send to my main. My main is well my first guy he’s 9 traits everything and knows nearly all the motifs. He crafts for everyone. I have enough skill points to make a crafter for literally everything and still play him.

They don’t need to balance for 14 crafting alts I’m sure no one has a second crafting alt like me most alt just decon and research whatever trash they happen to have. I just have them learn traits so they can transmute without having to log to my main. Literally all my crafted gear, food, enchants and potions are made on my main.

As it stands I will need 150 rare drops to make a jewelry set for just one character. Now all my alts play a role I can have unique CP and gear for each cause they only do x or y. When you have 15 guys you use crafted gear a lot and to use two crafted sets and a monster set sounds like heaven but when you need 2,250 RARE drops that’s not balanced or grindly it’s just a fake out.

Like hey you can craft your own jewelry but it will take you much longer then just grinding out jewelry sets the old way.

almost no one has 14 alts. if it's too grindy for one or two, then say that, but 14? come on.

It's too grindly for one. It does not matter if you play 15 guys or the base 8 you should be able to craft for them all without dropping a few weeks for the grind. Crafting is made to be faster to get then drops but not as powerful. This will actual take longer to get the normal dropped rings.

DRAGON_KILLER_HUNTER · April 2018

well, its THE psijic order after all...

Number_51 · April 2018

So does it work like the Vampire skill line, where it takes X amount of EXP to level the skill line? Getting vamp straight outta Coldharbor and you probably won't hit 50 in the skill line till you're level 40 or so. Getting vamp with a CP capped char and you can max it in a few hours.

xaraan · April 2018

ecru wrote: »

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

kind_hero wrote: »

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

kikkehs wrote: »

grinding? in an mmo? nooooo, that cant be!

Needing ten rare drops to make a piece of jewelry then needing 40 to get it from white to green all of that just for one piece. Three pieces per character well you have 15 characters that’s just too much. That’s 50 drops to make and upgrade a ring from white to gold. Three jewelry slots so 50 x 3 x 15 that’s 2,250 mats. That’s way beyond a grind.

The game is not designed with 14 master crafter alts in mind, nor it should. The fact that some players are ready to invest this much time and effort in a game to have everything maxed/completed for each alt is their choice. I don't think the game should be streamlined so it would be easy to unlock everything for your 14th alt. As a former WoW player, I know what grinding is, so I dislike it. But this profession is something special, it should not be powerleveled in the first 3 days after launch. It is a good thing that the devs decided that you cannot deconstruct jewelry obtained prior the patch, because I know people were hoarding jewelry exactly for this. Leveling JC shouldn't be to grindy, I fully agree with that, but saying that it would be to grindy to do this for 14 alts, its not how the game should be designed. I think the investment in JC should be rewarding, since is available only to those who bought the new chapter. So maxing this profession should feel like an accomplishment, not like leveling alchemy on your alt.

I would never waste my time trying to make 15 master craftsmen ever. All my alts are / will be at lv 50 crafting just cause they decon trash when they were leveling. They learn traits if I remember to check no real need to have more then one crafter motifs are expensive for the new one, why buy or grind more then once. Any good motifs are send to my main. My main is well my first guy he’s 9 traits everything and knows nearly all the motifs. He crafts for everyone. I have enough skill points to make a crafter for literally everything and still play him.

They don’t need to balance for 14 crafting alts I’m sure no one has a second crafting alt like me most alt just decon and research whatever trash they happen to have. I just have them learn traits so they can transmute without having to log to my main. Literally all my crafted gear, food, enchants and potions are made on my main.

As it stands I will need 150 rare drops to make a jewelry set for just one character. Now all my alts play a role I can have unique CP and gear for each cause they only do x or y. When you have 15 guys you use crafted gear a lot and to use two crafted sets and a monster set sounds like heaven but when you need 2,250 RARE drops that’s not balanced or grindly it’s just a fake out.

Like hey you can craft your own jewelry but it will take you much longer then just grinding out jewelry sets the old way.

almost no one has 14 alts. if it's too grindy for one or two, then say that, but 14? come on.

I have 15 characters as well. No mules. All geared out, done quests/mage guild/shards on all them, etc. Just b/c it's a feature of the game that not many have gotten into doesn't mean those players should get a big middle finger in game design. In fact, players like that are actually at a disadvantage compared to a player that has a bunch of crafting mules - b/c I don't have fifteen guys feeding matts into one or two characters, they are all needing gear load outs and consuming more than they earn.

I do have one master crafter even though all the others have it all leveled up they don't know all traits and motifs - but they all still need to grind all those matts for all those characters to make gear load outs for them. They don't need to balance things, as he said, as if each of them were a master crafter, but they should not get carried away making things too grindy. The amount of boring grind for psijiic is mind-numbingly not fun (did we forget we are playing a game to have fun?) and the needing ten raw jewelry matts to refine to make one and maybe also get one dust to get ten of those to make one bar so we can one day have 2/3/4/8 various bars to upgrade a ring is a bit ridiculous. As someone that barely keeps up with Wax and Alloy to make gear for all my characters, I don't even want to think about how only one or two of my guys will ever get gold crafted jewelry and they definitely won't have the luxury of set variety to swap around - it will be one special set that gets made.

And it's not about balance b/c as soon as a handful of players have it, then we'll see whether having them is balanced or not and if it is balanced, then having it for all your characters wouldn't be a bad thing. The only reason to keep it super restrictive would be b/c it's not balanced and you are scared of everyone having it.

In the end, this is a game. It's supposed to be fun, not boring. Anyone that has seen me post knows I don't have a problem with the idea of working for what you build in game - I've never been a gimme gimme poster, but once the grind gets to points where ridiculous and boring take over as the main description then the game is in a bad spot.

Bazeric · April 2018

It certainly is expensive for literally just running across the map to push a button, between the quickport cost and deathports I'll be broke and insane. Maybe I am doing it wrong? No enemies, just a quick line from a skull and the push the button. I don't mind taking time do get cool things, but this is different since you are seriously just running around pushing buttons.