"Please note that anyone found exploiting will be handled on a case-by-case basis."

SydneyGrey · February 2018

nm

Flynch · February 2018

So playing Devil's advocate while I wait for the server to come up;

How many, in your opinion, is 'enough' mobs killed to warrant a ban?

You'd think you kill 1 mob and everyone would see that 1.9mil xp right? Or is that perhaps a little to constrictive. How about 2? Ok sounds fairer, so killing a third mob then means they are exploiting? Or is it 4, because they may have missed the second kill XP too?

That's sort of the only thing the devs can base the case-by-case on surely?

Senk3tsu · February 2018

This is the same story, every time a new exploit is found out.

"ITS A ZOSE ISSUE DON'T PUNISH MEEE!111"

Feanor · February 2018

Azarai wrote: »

Right. A lot of people in this thread keep calling this an 'exploit', which does not even seem to be correct. I am very hesitant to call people using the product in the intended purpose an exploit. It does happen, for instance a company putting up a 50% discount instead of a 5%. They might revoke the order and apologize, but punishing customers for an issue that occurs with normal use seems backwards.

And as for the VAS comparison, also not completely accurate. The exploit involved using a game issue NOT in the intended way, DPSing the boss from where it could not hurt back. Can anyone point out where people were using the system in a way not intended to be played? You are not 'exploiting' the game by playing it as you normally should be.

By that logic nothing ever is an exploit as you can always claim you were just doing what the game allowed you to do. Of course it is an exploit if you keep doing it and gain some hundred CP that way. Or, in your own words:

"The exploit involved using a game issue NOT in the intended way, killing mobs when they were known to give way more XP than rational."

Elvent · February 2018

Flynch wrote: »

So playing Devil's advocate while I wait for the server to come up;

How many, in your opinion, is 'enough' mobs killed to warrant a ban?

You'd think you kill 1 mob and everyone would see that 1.9mil xp right? Or is that perhaps a little to constrictive. How about 2? Ok sounds fairer, so killing a third mob then means they are exploiting? Or is it 4, because they may have missed the second kill XP too?

That's sort of the only thing the devs can base the case-by-case on surely?

I would just take a wild guess but would say more than 10-20+ ... people grinding like crazy non-stop until the servers went offline. 1-5 mobs wouldn't be enough.

VaranisArano · February 2018

Azarai wrote: »

Right. A lot of people in this thread keep calling this an 'exploit', which does not even seem to be correct. I am very hesitant to call people using the product in the intended purpose an exploit. It does happen, for instance a company putting up a 50% discount instead of a 5%. They might revoke the order and apologize, but punishing customers for an issue that occurs with normal use seems backwards.

And as for the VAS comparison, also not completely accurate. The exploit involved using a game issue NOT in the intended way, DPSing the boss from where it could not hurt back. Can anyone point out where people were using the system in a way not intended to be played? You are not 'exploiting' the game by playing it as you normally should be.

Killing mobs is exactly what the Imperial City is partly designed for. Clearly, I'm allowed to keep killing mobs even though I'm getting a ton more exp than I should, right?

The correct response upon noticing a glitch is to report it and to stop doing whatever causes the glitch. I don't have a problem with anyone who went to IC, killed mobs, reported the obviously abnormal exp gains, and stopped doing it. I do have a problem with anyone who went to IC, killed mobs, did not report the obviously abnormal exp gains and continued to kill mobs for those enormous exp gains.

Anyone who went to IC, failed to report the obviously abnormal exp gains, and continued killing mobs as though the game was somehow intended to be played that way for that reward was exploiting.

nathan_bri · February 2018

A_G_G_R_O wrote: »

nathan_bri wrote: »

Hollery wrote: »

Sigtric wrote: »

DarkAedin wrote: »

Unfadingsilence wrote: »

Jayman1000 wrote: »

Ackwalan wrote: »

Here come all the people with their excuses, claiming how they didn't notice because of bla bla bla.

So if your account is banned wrongfully you will be happy to lose your character, right? After all your stupid excuses will just be bla bla bla.

How would one not notice going from none CP to hitting CP after a few kills or having low CP then going up a few CP after a few kills?

Example 1: watching a movie while grinding

Your screen will be spammed with level up animations or CP Earned messages with out noticing the xp still. No matter multitasking if you're that oblivious...

stop blaming players for playing a broken game

No one is blaming players for a playing a so-called “broken game.” They are blaming players for exploiting a bug. I stand with them. Permanent bans for any cheaters found, just like with the VAS exploit. If you are one of them, then I hope you get banned too.

Bruh, go outside take a breath and chill.

No. The sun. It burns. It burns.

Riverspirit · February 2018

Totally agree. It isn't an exploit if it's there for everyone due to an oversight or lack of testing.

The_Brosteen · February 2018

Taysa wrote: »

Jadokis wrote: »

The bank left this money out on accident. I guess it belongs to me now because the bank messed up, I did nothing wrong in taking it.

The mentality of lots of people in this thread. ^

It's a basic concept and just because it's in an online game that doesn't change.

"Hey let me try to grasp at straws and try to make a relevant argument that isn't relevant at all because I fail to understand basic logic!"

^ Your mentality

I'm sorry if you get banned for taking part in this exploit, but it's just the new standard. Exploiters are to be banned. They have admitted to being to lax on punishing exploiters in the past and that has now changed. It's a hard lesson, I understand.

robertthebard · February 2018

DarkAedin wrote: »

Unfadingsilence wrote: »

Jayman1000 wrote: »

Ackwalan wrote: »

Here come all the people with their excuses, claiming how they didn't notice because of bla bla bla.

So if your account is banned wrongfully you will be happy to lose your character, right? After all your stupid excuses will just be bla bla bla.

How would one not notice going from none CP to hitting CP after a few kills or having low CP then going up a few CP after a few kills?

Example 1: watching a movie while grinding

Yeah, that's a classic: I didn't know I was exploiting an xp bug because I was botting... /hide

Cpt_Teemo · February 2018

Riverspirit wrote: »

Totally agree. It isn't an exploit if it's there for everyone due to an oversight or lack of testing.

It was a bug, people used that bug to there advantage knowing full well it shouldn't have done that, which in turn is an exploit.

SynodicOracle · February 2018

It's becoming clear that the only people raging upset about this are those who exploited it. You know what you did, so accept the consequences. ZOS are generally a very lenient company, and their punishing (yet to be known how they will execute it) is very much justified.

The innocents have nothing to fear. Whether or not people admit on here if they did it, and I guarantee many will deny it, they know what they did and they should expect to be punished.

We have the opportunity to play the best MMO ever created, and we abide by a simple TOS, if you violate this you are subject to the consequences of your own actions.

I also doubt they'll do much, if anything at all. So stop panicking and keep your underwear clean.

GCVDJ11T · February 2018

RANKK7 wrote: »

CountEdmondDantes wrote: »

RANKK7 wrote: »

It seems the Coldharbour house went on live priced 1 Crown, they forgot to change the price from the pts.

Now I wonder what will happen, are the people who bought the product for that price keeping it?

I have to say, had I seen that I'd have bought that house in a heartbeat and argued:

'Wait, what?? You mean that house wasn't 1 gold? No!!! C'mon, I was acting in good faith. I really thought, you know, Molag Bal, all the daedra, the smell ... I really thought that was the price.

I wasn't taking advantage of the Crown Store AT ALL."

Indeed...

Well I really want to know if ZOS consider this too an exploit or they got screwed over this and are forced to leave the product to the ones who bought it.
Digital content market is still shady and much undefined but this time around they could get the shaft.

I know in one of my trade guilds they were talking all excited about it like when the daedric thrones were 1. They were talking like they thought it was intended. Taking it back yeah I can see that but an exploit? Nah

nathan_bri · February 2018

Riverspirit wrote: »

Totally agree. It isn't an exploit if it's there for everyone due to an oversight or lack of testing.

I think ZeniMax will disagree with you on that.

iiYuki · February 2018

Flynch wrote: »

So playing Devil's advocate while I wait for the server to come up;

How many, in your opinion, is 'enough' mobs killed to warrant a ban?

You'd think you kill 1 mob and everyone would see that 1.9mil xp right? Or is that perhaps a little to constrictive. How about 2? Ok sounds fairer, so killing a third mob then means they are exploiting? Or is it 4, because they may have missed the second kill XP too?

That's sort of the only thing the devs can base the case-by-case on surely?

You could go an entire dolmen without noticing that could be 20+ mobs + the dolmen completion xp that might be over 20 levels in one go.

Ackwalan · February 2018

Flynch wrote: »

So playing Devil's advocate while I wait for the server to come up;

How many, in your opinion, is 'enough' mobs killed to warrant a ban?

You'd think you kill 1 mob and everyone would see that 1.9mil xp right? Or is that perhaps a little to constrictive. How about 2? Ok sounds fairer, so killing a third mob then means they are exploiting? Or is it 4, because they may have missed the second kill XP too?

That's sort of the only thing the devs can base the case-by-case on surely?

Instead of how many levels, I would ask how long did they do it. For example, a level 10 kills 1 mob earns a million xp, has earned many levels. While someone at CP 690 that killed 5 mobs and earned 5 million xp has only gained about 6 CP levels. On a chart the level 10 looks to have exploited much more then the CP 690, yet they have actually exploited less.

DieAlteHexe · February 2018

Riverspirit wrote: »

Totally agree. It isn't an exploit if it's there for everyone due to an oversight or lack of testing.

No. It "being there" is a bug.

Taking advantage of a bug is exploiting.

Cpt_Teemo · February 2018

SynodicOracle wrote: »

It's becoming clear that the only people raging upset about this are those who exploited it. You know what you did, so accept the consequences. ZOS are generally a very lenient company, and their punishing (yet to be known how they will execute it) is very much justified.

The innocents have nothing to fear. Whether or not people admit on here if they did it, and I guarantee many will deny it, they know what they did and they should expect to be punished.

We have the opportunity to play the 2nd best MMO ever created, and we abide by a simple TOS, if you violate this you are subject to the consequences of your own actions.

I also doubt they'll do much, if anything at all. So stop panicking and keep your underwear clean.

Correction ^ 1st will always be Swg

Jayman1000 · February 2018

Ackwalan wrote: »

Jayman1000 wrote: »

Ackwalan wrote: »

Here come all the people with their excuses, claiming how they didn't notice because of bla bla bla.

So if your account is banned wrongfully you will be happy to lose your character, right? After all your stupid excuses will just be bla bla bla.

I haven't even logged in. How many levels did you earn?

I have no idea, I vaguely recall the champion level gained message popping up a few times, but I onyl recall this retrospectively after looking here on forums that the reason for additional downtime was xp exploit. I almost never do anything in game for the purpose of earning xp, so I don't much care for it. So the cp messages are not interesting for me. I have spent years on my account only being cp 300 or something now.

nathan_bri · February 2018

Servers are up.

Shimmer · February 2018

Let’s look at it this way

Let’s say you go into a convenice store and the clerk stepped out and locked the door but it malfunctioned, door left open and a ton of money on the counter. Would you phone the owner and let him know? Or take it and hope you don’t get caught, and when you do get caught argue with the police that it was ok to steal it because it was the clerks fault the lock didn’t lock...

Kanar · February 2018

Not an exploit. ZoS should roll back the servers and not punish anyone.

Imagine you're a kid and log in, kill some stuff and see so much xp. It would be like christmas, you'd just be so happy and excited and go killing a bunch of stuff. They shouldn't be punished for that, just the xp taken away.

DarkAedin · February 2018

robertthebard wrote: »

DarkAedin wrote: »

Unfadingsilence wrote: »

Jayman1000 wrote: »

Ackwalan wrote: »

Here come all the people with their excuses, claiming how they didn't notice because of bla bla bla.

So if your account is banned wrongfully you will be happy to lose your character, right? After all your stupid excuses will just be bla bla bla.

How would one not notice going from none CP to hitting CP after a few kills or having low CP then going up a few CP after a few kills?

Example 1: watching a movie while grinding

Yeah, that's a classic: I didn't know I was exploiting an xp bug because I was botting... /hide

Example 2: im over cp cap and have xp gains turned off in my settings

I can keep going. This is zos' fault.

And today all i did was my writs, make one and a half costumes, and did both of the new dungeons, never stepped into IC

Cpt_Teemo · February 2018

Shimmer wrote: »

Let’s look at it this way

Let’s say you go into a convenice store and the clerk stepped out and locked the door but it malfunctioned, door left open and a ton of money on the counter. Would you phone the owner and let him know? Or take it and hope you don’t get caught, and when you do get caught argue with the police that it was ok to steal it because it was the clerks fault the lock didn’t lock...

I'll just wait till the money blows out the door if there was a gust of wind then they can't tell me I stole from the store cause it wasn't in the store anymore

The_Brosteen · February 2018

Taysa wrote: »

The_Brosteen wrote: »

Perma ban everyone involved. This is on the same level of the VAS exploit.

The new standard was set then, "it was something obviously not intended, you should've known better". @ZOS_GinaBruno

No, it's not. The VAS exploit only affected a small minority of people and wasn't made public until WEEKS after CWC dropped.

This affects literally everyone.

By your "logic," a brand new player or returning player deserves a perma ban for getting discovery EXP or killing a scamp in IC.

I only hope that one day you encounter an "exploit" simply from playing the game on accident and due to ZoS's failure to QA stuff correctly or code anything correctly, you are slapped with a perma ban.

I can only imagine how quickly your tune would change

The bans mainly happened on console. So it wasn't weeks after it was a few days. If more people had exploited VAS should they not have been perma banned? With the next exploit perhaps we can rally the populace to take part then, safety in numbers!
This doesn't literally affect everyone. It obviously affects no one on PS4 or xbox. This affects the small minority of players who played in the window of time the server was live on PC today, found this bug, and continued to exploit it.

I say this is on the same level of the VAS exploit because perma bans were dished out based on the logic of "it was obviously not intended" which getting millions of xp on a mob in IC would easily fall under.

WildWilbur · February 2018

So a lot of peeps in this thread will be awarded with a little more spare time in the next days?

If I learned one thing from this game than it's "Never play on patch day!"

Bosov · February 2018

i got perma banned

ZOS_GinaBruno · February 2018

The ZeniMax Code of Conduct that you agreed to when starting the game states that you will not exploit any bug, or abuse any game system. As such, we'll be doing a full audit over the next few days to identify any accounts that were found to be exploiting the issue with XP gains.

LordSemaj · February 2018

Riverspirit wrote: »

Totally agree. It isn't an exploit if it's there for everyone due to an oversight or lack of testing.

Oh, the testing happened. Just no one reported it.

Sigtric · February 2018

Kanar wrote: »

Not an exploit. ZoS should roll back the servers and not punish anyone.

Imagine you're a kid and log in, kill some stuff and see so much xp. It would be like christmas, you'd just be so happy and excited and go killing a bunch of stuff. They shouldn't be punished for that, just the xp taken away.

rolling back the server would punish everyone who wasn't an exploiting *** that did things in the game with out taking advantage of a bug