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[PvP] mDK changes
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DKsUnite✭✭✭✭✭
✭Enforce the rule that if you use power lash on an off balance target, the power lash is consumed (like on live). If you flame lash them again and they are still off balance, the power lash option comes up again.
This way in PvE, you still get multiple power lashes for an off balance boss (although it does cost you magicka, which can be remedied by reducing the cost if this is such a big issue).
In PvP you can't spam power lash over and over for free as their is now a cost associated with proccing the power lash and it gives counter play as you can now roll dodge the flame lash to stop them getting the power lash proc a second time.
Problem solved.Vyr Cor | Magicka Dragonknight | DC
Vir Cor | Stamina Dragonknight | DC
Latest Videos:
Magicka Dragonknight: Vyr Cor | "A Dragon's Fury" | Magicka Dragonknight PvP
Stamina Dragonknight: Vir Cor | "Heathen" | Stamina Dragonknight PvP
Youtube: CorGaming4 -
Solariken✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Enforce the rule that if you use power lash on an off balance target, the power lash is consumed (like on live). If you flame lash them again and they are still off balance, the power lash option comes up again.
This way in PvE, you still get multiple power lashes for an off balance boss (although it does cost you magicka, which can be remedied by reducing the cost if this is such a big issue).
In PvP you can't spam power lash over and over for free as their is now a cost associated with proccing the power lash and it gives counter play as you can now roll dodge the flame lash to stop them getting the power lash proc a second time.
Problem solved.
This has my vote. If I understand you correctly, essentially it would only allow for every other lash to be a Power Lash, but only if the target is rooted/stunned when you regular lash them. Seems reasonable to me.Edited by Solariken on January 10, 2018 2:07AM0 -
DKsUnite✭✭✭✭✭
✭Enforce the rule that if you use power lash on an off balance target, the power lash is consumed (like on live). If you flame lash them again and they are still off balance, the power lash option comes up again.
This way in PvE, you still get multiple power lashes for an off balance boss (although it does cost you magicka, which can be remedied by reducing the cost if this is such a big issue).
In PvP you can't spam power lash over and over for free as their is now a cost associated with proccing the power lash and it gives counter play as you can now roll dodge the flame lash to stop them getting the power lash proc a second time.
Problem solved.
This has my vote. If I understand you correctly, essentially it would only allow for every other lash to be a Power Lash, but only if the target is rooted/stunned when you regular lash them. Seems reasonable to me.
@Solariken
Not quite. Every other lash would be a power lash is correct however...
If the target is stunned/roooted and you flame lash, you set them off balance (like it is on live) and power lash procs. You power lash and the power lash option gets consumed. If you flame lash again and they are still off balance, power lash option comes up again. So the most you could power lash is twice unless you are lucky and can get it to go off 3 times.Edited by DKsUnite on January 10, 2018 2:28AMVyr Cor | Magicka Dragonknight | DC
Vir Cor | Stamina Dragonknight | DC
Latest Videos:
Magicka Dragonknight: Vyr Cor | "A Dragon's Fury" | Magicka Dragonknight PvP
Stamina Dragonknight: Vir Cor | "Heathen" | Stamina Dragonknight PvP
Youtube: CorGaming1 -
Solariken✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Enforce the rule that if you use power lash on an off balance target, the power lash is consumed (like on live). If you flame lash them again and they are still off balance, the power lash option comes up again.
This way in PvE, you still get multiple power lashes for an off balance boss (although it does cost you magicka, which can be remedied by reducing the cost if this is such a big issue).
In PvP you can't spam power lash over and over for free as their is now a cost associated with proccing the power lash and it gives counter play as you can now roll dodge the flame lash to stop them getting the power lash proc a second time.
Problem solved.
This has my vote. If I understand you correctly, essentially it would only allow for every other lash to be a Power Lash, but only if the target is rooted/stunned when you regular lash them. Seems reasonable to me.
@Solariken
Not quite. Every other lash would be a power lash is correct however...
If the target is stunned/roooted and you flame lash, you set them off balance (like it is on live) and power lash procs. You power lash and the power lash option gets consumed. If you flame lash again and they are still off balance, power lash option comes up again. So the most you could power lash is twice unless you are lucky and can get it to go off 3 times.
But the mechanic could be changed slightly such that any time you Flame Lash an immobile/stunned/off-balance target, you proc Power Lash opportunity, and then resets after you use the Power Lash.
This way you can still pull off the combo @Quantum_V mentioned (and procs are super reliable) but you can never get back-to-back Power Lashes (which IMO would be better for balance).0 -
DKsUnite✭✭✭✭✭
✭Enforce the rule that if you use power lash on an off balance target, the power lash is consumed (like on live). If you flame lash them again and they are still off balance, the power lash option comes up again.
This way in PvE, you still get multiple power lashes for an off balance boss (although it does cost you magicka, which can be remedied by reducing the cost if this is such a big issue).
In PvP you can't spam power lash over and over for free as their is now a cost associated with proccing the power lash and it gives counter play as you can now roll dodge the flame lash to stop them getting the power lash proc a second time.
Problem solved.
This has my vote. If I understand you correctly, essentially it would only allow for every other lash to be a Power Lash, but only if the target is rooted/stunned when you regular lash them. Seems reasonable to me.
@Solariken
Not quite. Every other lash would be a power lash is correct however...
If the target is stunned/roooted and you flame lash, you set them off balance (like it is on live) and power lash procs. You power lash and the power lash option gets consumed. If you flame lash again and they are still off balance, power lash option comes up again. So the most you could power lash is twice unless you are lucky and can get it to go off 3 times.
But the mechanic could be changed slightly such that any time you Flame Lash an immobile/stunned/off-balance target, you proc Power Lash opportunity, and then resets after you use the Power Lash.
This way you can still pull off the combo @Quantum_V mentioned (and procs are super reliable) but you can never get back-to-back Power Lashes (which IMO would be better for balance).
@Solariken
yeh i think we are saying the same thing but different explanations lol. Yes that's pretty much the mechanic I am putting forward.
Flame Lash on an immobile/stunned/off-balance target to get power lash. Power lash resets once used.
Vyr Cor | Magicka Dragonknight | DC
Vir Cor | Stamina Dragonknight | DC
Latest Videos:
Magicka Dragonknight: Vyr Cor | "A Dragon's Fury" | Magicka Dragonknight PvP
Stamina Dragonknight: Vir Cor | "Heathen" | Stamina Dragonknight PvP
Youtube: CorGaming0 -
Xvorg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Enforce the rule that if you use power lash on an off balance target, the power lash is consumed (like on live). If you flame lash them again and they are still off balance, the power lash option comes up again.
This way in PvE, you still get multiple power lashes for an off balance boss (although it does cost you magicka, which can be remedied by reducing the cost if this is such a big issue).
In PvP you can't spam power lash over and over for free as their is now a cost associated with proccing the power lash and it gives counter play as you can now roll dodge the flame lash to stop them getting the power lash proc a second time.
Problem solved.
This has my vote. If I understand you correctly, essentially it would only allow for every other lash to be a Power Lash, but only if the target is rooted/stunned when you regular lash them. Seems reasonable to me.
@Solariken
Not quite. Every other lash would be a power lash is correct however...
If the target is stunned/roooted and you flame lash, you set them off balance (like it is on live) and power lash procs. You power lash and the power lash option gets consumed. If you flame lash again and they are still off balance, power lash option comes up again. So the most you could power lash is twice unless you are lucky and can get it to go off 3 times.
That's how it works with tactician
Dodge roll -> Off Balance -> Power lash -> Stun -> Flame lash -> off Balance -> Power lash -> Stun -> CC immunity
Rememeber that Power lash stuns and flame lash procs power lash on stuned enemies.
I'm for a power lash stun and then a flame lash off balance proc (that leads to a new off balance)Sarcasm is something too serious to be taken lightly
I was born with the wrong sign
In the wrong house
With the wrong ascendancy
I took the wrong road
That led to the wrong tendencies
I was in the wrong place at the wrong time
For the wrong reason and the wrong rhyme
On the wrong day of the wrong week
Used the wrong method with the wrong technique0 -
Dracane✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Giving power lash a cooldown sounds reasonable.
And before you say "but there are no cooldowns in ESO" Yes there are actually. The Sorcerers Blood Magic passive has a cooldown for example.Auri-El is my lord,
Trinimac is my shield,
Magnus is my mind.
My debut album on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Gleandra/videos1 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Having thought about the "make powerlash procc on burning" a bit by now:
No i´m pretty convinced people don´t want that. Enchanting fire resist or being darkelf would create situations where you can´t use powerlash against these targets at all as having a specific resistance makes you immune to the corresponding elemental effect.<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 504 -
Kilandros✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Having thought about the "make powerlash procc on burning" a bit by now:
No i´m pretty convinced people don´t want that. Enchanting fire resist or being darkelf would create situations where you can´t use powerlash against these targets at all as having a specific resistance makes you immune to the corresponding elemental effect.
Yeah that's a good point actuallyInvictus
Kilandros - Dragonknight / Grand Overlord
Deimos - Templar / Grand Warlord
Sias - Sorcerer / PrefectZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Short answer is DKs likely won't be seeing a ton of changes before we go live; this class is still quite powerful (as it should be being a tank), even after some of the adjustments we've made to other classes and abilities.
DK IS NOT JUST A TANK CLASS. #PLAYTHEWAYYOUWANT2 -
LonePirate✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭LonePirate wrote: »I think it’s funny someone believes Power Lash is a high damage skill in PVP. I guess for a DK it is but compared to skills from the other classes, it’s weak sauce. It may be a fun and great skill in PVE; but it’s nothing special in PVP.
My power whips hit 3k+ on very nearly everyone. On light/med opponents 7k crits is common. Even got a 9k whip against a 690cp sorc. Obviously more against low CP.
3K on general use is still much lower than most class skills from the other four classes. 7K crits are not common unless you’re running a very high spell crit and you only face players in light armor or those without much impenetrable armor. As for your 9K (crit?) against that (light, no impen) sorc, that’s a once a week occurrence, maybe just once a month.
Do people not read their death recaps anymore? How often is there a 5K+ whip item in there? How often is there a 5K+ item from another class or a weapon? Whip/power lash may be the bread and butter skill for MDKs but it is still a relatively low damage PVP skill compared to almost anything else besides other DK skills.
While power lash certainly seems broken in PVE right now on the PTS, I think loftier and more useful aspirations are warranted when assessing the skill in PVP.2 -
Saint_Bud✭✭✭✭Evryone knows if offbalnce is bugged on pts at the moment or it works as it should???
Mdk are in a very bad spot. There are high damage builds possible, but with no reall defence or mobility its hard fight in open world. In pve they need offbalance to have a chance to sustain. Without, they deleate from the game. And for evry trial grop there is still the damage gab to stam toons.
In other words the are fuckt since morrowind and nothing changed.PVP Saint-Bud magicka Templar: AR 49
PVE Lord Victarion mDK : dro'm-Athra-Destroyer pre Morrowind retired for crafting
PVE Ramsay-Bolton magicka NB: Voice of Reason Clockwork City Patch retired
VAA hm/ VHRC hm/ VSO hm/ VMOL hm/ VHOF hm/ VAS hm clear
Stop playing PVE because its boring, content not disigned for melee players and class balance and sustain is ***0 -
Wing✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭i figured people must be freaking out because they thought DK's got a new skill.
I have not seen DK's use whip in ages.
and 3k a whip in pvp? is that supposed to be scary? let us not forget NB burst, warden burst, sorc burst, etc. I could give a crap about a DK trying to walk up on me and whip me for 3k, its the wardens able to burst out 20-25-30k damage in a second while still maintaining mobility, healing, etc.Edited by Wing on January 11, 2018 2:38PMESO player since beta.
previously full time subscriber, beta-2024, now off and on, game got too disappointing.
PC NA
( ^_^ )
You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods -XenogearsDK one trick2 -
Wing✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
I would suspect so, but if your confused hit me up with details or a screenshot or something and ill let you know.ESO player since beta.
previously full time subscriber, beta-2024, now off and on, game got too disappointing.
PC NA
( ^_^ )
You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods You shall be as gods -XenogearsDK one trick2 -
Passifest✭✭✭✭Hello everyone,
Well, at this point in time we all know that you can spam 4-5 powerlashes on CC immune targets 'cause Powerlash doesn't consume offbalance unless it stuns your opponent. This is most likely not gonna make it to live as it is WAY to strong to be able to spam a high damage, undodgeable, healing skill for 0 cost. And honestly, mDKs need no further buffs apart from maybe reworking banner as an ult.
HOWEVER
We also aren't in a position where we can take nerfs. Therefore, when addressing this PLEASE be careful not to make Powerlash consume offbalance, 'cause at that point we'll have a 7s cooldown to proc powerlash again. I just feel that this might be the most obvious change, but this will result in a considerable nerf to mdks in pvp.
Lets think this through to find other possible solutions (I'll increase the list if we get some ideas in this thread):- Make powerlash have a cooldown of like x (maybe 2.5 or so) seconds before it can proc again.
- Make it so you powerlash twice before consuming offbalance
- Proc powerlash off burning status effect
Sincerely,
Quantum
OBS.: Thanks for the changes, ZoS. Overall really liked them, specially the AOE caps reversal! Keep it up!
Burning status effect isn't applied to people with shields though so I don't think that suggestion is viable. Maybe if status effects were made to work vs shields that could work.
If any ZOS employee is reading this thread please acknowledge the DK bugs such as the wings bug as shown in this thread https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/382340/dk-wings-bugged-again1 -
Aerem✭✭✭Enforce the rule that if you use power lash on an off balance target, the power lash is consumed (like on live). If you flame lash them again and they are still off balance, the power lash option comes up again.
This way in PvE, you still get multiple power lashes for an off balance boss (although it does cost you magicka, which can be remedied by reducing the cost if this is such a big issue).
In PvP you can't spam power lash over and over for free as their is now a cost associated with proccing the power lash and it gives counter play as you can now roll dodge the flame lash to stop them getting the power lash proc a second time.
Problem solved.
@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Wrobel This.
#mDK Masterrace
#NerfDragonblood
#NerfmDK
Aerem Incendium l mDK0 -
Conduit0✭✭✭✭✭
✭Being able to hit a person with multiple Power Lashes in a row is not a problem at all. mDKs have no mobility, their one defensive option just got nerfed into the ground, and they have no real burst to speak of. Quite frankly if you're dying to Flame Flash spamming mDK its because you're bad and you deserve to die.0 -
ak_pvp✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Being able to hit a person with multiple Power Lashes in a row is not a problem at all. mDKs have no mobility, their one defensive option just got nerfed into the ground, and they have no real burst to speak of. Quite frankly if you're dying to Flame Flash spamming mDK its because you're bad and you deserve to die.
In openworld, not really a problem. Since if a DK is sitting on a single target spamming, then they are going to die. In duels its overpowered by quite a bit. High damage and spam heals, have little counter if its just you.MagDK main. PC/EU @AK-ESO
Best houseknight EU.2 -
kojou✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Being able to hit a person with multiple Power Lashes in a row is not a problem at all. mDKs have no mobility, their one defensive option just got nerfed into the ground, and they have no real burst to speak of. Quite frankly if you're dying to Flame Flash spamming mDK its because you're bad and you deserve to die.
In openworld, not really a problem. Since if a DK is sitting on a single target spamming, then they are going to die. In duels its overpowered by quite a bit. High damage and spam heals, have little counter if its just you.
I vote that we don't balance the game based on dueling builds and duels. It is just a small side piece of the game.Playing since beta...2 -
coplannb16_ESO✭✭✭✭Sorry, compared to all the cheese that is going on in Cyrodil they could as well make Power Lash the default skill without any further requirements.
We are talking about a close-range magicka skill that still does only mediocre damage compared to other classes skills. It is also basically the only skill that we could spam (if it wasnt for free that spam would end soon thanks to our crappy sustain). It has a delayed heal to it... so what? Jabs damages and heals too...
we still have zero mobility, no sustain, bad ultimate regeneration, bad ultimates except Leap, buggy pull/chain, buggy inferior wings, dots that are completely hardcountered by purge (which everyone can get), all skills exceot stone fist beeing melee range (thus not really allowing a decent ranged magicka caster) I could go on and on.
the other day I managed to creep into the weekly vMA leaderboard with a <300K score (and stay there). man the class is the red-headed stepchild of the game. if stamina DKs wouldnt magically parse insane single target DPS due to 1 class skill no one would notice that it still exists.
Yeah maybe we can troll some newbs in duels better than now, but whatever.
max level: mDK, stamBlade, stamSorc, magPlar, mDen, stamDen, magBlade, stamCro
ESO+
# of mules: 4 (FULL)
maxed bank: FULL -_-
Stop the grind! Get rid of stupid events and daily-quest gallore. Get rid of "have a chance of 1 in a million to get a piece of 1 in 30 to get a stupid motif or pet... wtf..."
And at this point just remove all classes and have everyone choose their set of skills. then balance accordingly to skills always used vs. skills never used.3 -
Smmokkee✭✭✭✭✭If this change and zaan go live mdks will be so disgusting in pvp there will be no point in playing anything else.
MDK is already one of the strongest classes in PVP. Boohoo its not good open world agaisnt a zerg of 20.. newsflash who really gives a *** about surviving in that situation.
Everytime I hear a noob mdk talk about the class like its weak, I cry.5 -
Smmokkee✭✭✭✭✭ztyhurstub17_ESO wrote: »Being able to hit a person with multiple Power Lashes in a row is not a problem at all. mDKs have no mobility, their one defensive option just got nerfed into the ground, and they have no real burst to speak of. Quite frankly if you're dying to Flame Flash spamming mDK its because you're bad and you deserve to die.
In openworld, not really a problem. Since if a DK is sitting on a single target spamming, then they are going to die. In duels its overpowered by quite a bit. High damage and spam heals, have little counter if its just you.
I vote that we don't balance the game based on dueling builds and duels. It is just a small side piece of the game.
Everything you do in this game is a small piece of it. Not all classes can be proficient at everything. Hearing a mdk talk about his class is hilarious.. these guys want everything.
"Hi I'm a MDK and I have access to more dots and cc's then everybody but Id also like to have the mobility of nightblades and burst like stamdens. Thank you."Edited by Smmokkee on January 12, 2018 5:00PM1 -
kojou✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭ztyhurstub17_ESO wrote: »Being able to hit a person with multiple Power Lashes in a row is not a problem at all. mDKs have no mobility, their one defensive option just got nerfed into the ground, and they have no real burst to speak of. Quite frankly if you're dying to Flame Flash spamming mDK its because you're bad and you deserve to die.
In openworld, not really a problem. Since if a DK is sitting on a single target spamming, then they are going to die. In duels its overpowered by quite a bit. High damage and spam heals, have little counter if its just you.
I vote that we don't balance the game based on dueling builds and duels. It is just a small side piece of the game.
Everything you do in this game is a small piece of it. Not all classes can be proficient at everything. Hearing a mdk talk about his class is hilarious.. these guys want everything.
"Hi I'm a MDK and I have access to more dots and cc's then everybody but Id also like to have the mobility of nightblades and burst like stamdens. Thank you."
Since when did Flame Lash grant the mobility of Nightblades and the burst of Stamdems? I must have missed that patch note...Playing since beta...0 -
Smmokkee✭✭✭✭✭ztyhurstub17_ESO wrote: »ztyhurstub17_ESO wrote: »Being able to hit a person with multiple Power Lashes in a row is not a problem at all. mDKs have no mobility, their one defensive option just got nerfed into the ground, and they have no real burst to speak of. Quite frankly if you're dying to Flame Flash spamming mDK its because you're bad and you deserve to die.
In openworld, not really a problem. Since if a DK is sitting on a single target spamming, then they are going to die. In duels its overpowered by quite a bit. High damage and spam heals, have little counter if its just you.
I vote that we don't balance the game based on dueling builds and duels. It is just a small side piece of the game.
Everything you do in this game is a small piece of it. Not all classes can be proficient at everything. Hearing a mdk talk about his class is hilarious.. these guys want everything.
"Hi I'm a MDK and I have access to more dots and cc's then everybody but Id also like to have the mobility of nightblades and burst like stamdens. Thank you."
Since when did Flame Lash grant the mobility of Nightblades and the burst of Stamdems? I must have missed that patch note...
Sarcasm bud, do you speak it.Edited by Smmokkee on January 12, 2018 5:05PM0 -
kojou✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭ztyhurstub17_ESO wrote: »ztyhurstub17_ESO wrote: »Being able to hit a person with multiple Power Lashes in a row is not a problem at all. mDKs have no mobility, their one defensive option just got nerfed into the ground, and they have no real burst to speak of. Quite frankly if you're dying to Flame Flash spamming mDK its because you're bad and you deserve to die.
In openworld, not really a problem. Since if a DK is sitting on a single target spamming, then they are going to die. In duels its overpowered by quite a bit. High damage and spam heals, have little counter if its just you.
I vote that we don't balance the game based on dueling builds and duels. It is just a small side piece of the game.
Everything you do in this game is a small piece of it. Not all classes can be proficient at everything. Hearing a mdk talk about his class is hilarious.. these guys want everything.
"Hi I'm a MDK and I have access to more dots and cc's then everybody but Id also like to have the mobility of nightblades and burst like stamdens. Thank you."
Since when did Flame Lash grant the mobility of Nightblades and the burst of Stamdems? I must have missed that patch note...
Sarcasm bud, do you speak it.
More like off topic, but ok.Playing since beta...1 -
Smmokkee✭✭✭✭✭ztyhurstub17_ESO wrote: »ztyhurstub17_ESO wrote: »ztyhurstub17_ESO wrote: »Being able to hit a person with multiple Power Lashes in a row is not a problem at all. mDKs have no mobility, their one defensive option just got nerfed into the ground, and they have no real burst to speak of. Quite frankly if you're dying to Flame Flash spamming mDK its because you're bad and you deserve to die.
In openworld, not really a problem. Since if a DK is sitting on a single target spamming, then they are going to die. In duels its overpowered by quite a bit. High damage and spam heals, have little counter if its just you.
I vote that we don't balance the game based on dueling builds and duels. It is just a small side piece of the game.
Everything you do in this game is a small piece of it. Not all classes can be proficient at everything. Hearing a mdk talk about his class is hilarious.. these guys want everything.
"Hi I'm a MDK and I have access to more dots and cc's then everybody but Id also like to have the mobility of nightblades and burst like stamdens. Thank you."
Since when did Flame Lash grant the mobility of Nightblades and the burst of Stamdems? I must have missed that patch note...
Sarcasm bud, do you speak it.
More like off topic, but ok.
Over your head completely. Lol.1 -
Irylia✭✭✭✭✭
✭How about we remove power lash and give them a stone fist damage buff.
It worked when sorcs lost their identity I don’t see why it couldn’t apply here as well.
Dk is a lot of fun in duels and small fights but I get roughed up hard when trying to 1vx.
Granted I was light and not utilizing block.
I do notice that dk needs a way to consistently have a heal that doesn’t get butchered by defile. Because they hurt the most by this defile meta.
Maybe an indirect buff being befoul removal. I do think adding minor protection to cinder storm and expanding its radius could be another way to say dk’s Holding their ground is feasible.
Also while we are at it can we revert surge to its old heal so I can run a 2h for forward momentum on mag sorc.
K thanks
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