Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

leekirlewb16_ESO wrote: »

I guess this is a morph or re-arming trap or something new?

Yes, it is the other morph of Trap Beast. It has its advantages and weaknesses. It is half the duration, so it needs to be cast twice as often, but it can be cast from range which can be handy at times. It's not as good IMO for places like the VMA or DSA because it doesnt work as well for portal killing, but for straight sustained damage it is certainly a viable alternative.

This is Hatchet Haro's buld on Tamriel Foundry. I dont know him really well, but we are in a few of the same guilds, so I see his trial scores. Dude can play. haha

http://tamrielfoundry.com/topic/hatchetharos-rising-storm-stamina-sorcerer-pve-dps/

jakeedmundson wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

jakeedmundson wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

jakeedmundson wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

leekirlewb16_ESO wrote: »

jakeedmundson wrote: »

leekirlewb16_ESO wrote: »

So I should start to farm Sunderflame to slowly replace Sprig? I have a couple of pieces I saved so it wont be terrible

Sunderflame is a good set but it shines more in trial groups. what content do you mostly focus on?

If you dont' plan on doing trials, then its not necessary. Really all this gear farming is up to you. Find a couple sets you like and play around with the combinations until you find one that does best for you dps/sustain wise.

once you hit 20-25kish you have enough to breeze through all vet dungeons and normal trials
once you hit 30k+ you're more than capable of pulling your own weight in vet trials

The set you're wearing now (in your original post) is what i use to hit around 32-34k. (while being provide with a major fracture buff - 5280 physical penetration)

Also, what do you play on? pc, ps4, or xbox?

PC

Just got the medium stormfist, so got full 7/7 or 5 1/1 now, will see which I prefer. Also got WW bite, gonna level that line up (I know FDB is the meta) to use some of my over flowing skill points!

Some good advice here already.

7/7 is more damage, 5/1/1 or 6/1 will typically make survival a bit better. It's a judgement call. In raids with good support, I go 7/7, when running the arena, I prefer 6 medium/1 heavy.

As others have said, get rid of flurry. The build no longer works. Also, dont get hung up on monster parses like that. It takes a near perfect raid and a bit of luck with mechanics to get a parse like that.

As to gear, there is no set "best" for stamina. I wont go into a crazy amount of detail, but stamina should always carry a few options. Your gear is perfectly fine for 4 man content. If you want to get into serious trials, you should get your hands on some Debuff sets, Sunder and Nightmothers are the obvious choices for a sorc.

You will definitley want to farm VMA for a bow. I am not sure any single item/weapon can give you as much DPS boost as a VMA bow, except for maybe a perfect asylum staff in the right hands.

jakeedmundson wrote: »

Drakkdjinn wrote: »

1. Crafted poison on how.
2. Difference in those combos in dps are negligible but if I understand your post what ur currently running is optimal, esp if ur khajiit.
3. No comment, your set loadout isnt trial optimal so no point in commenting. You need to add VO, TFS and automatons to your repertoire and be able adjust based on what others are running. Aim to phase out sprigs first.
4. Get rid of rending/shrouded for flurry & deadly cloak.

-Drakk

There is literally nothing wrong with using spriggans over TFS.... its crazy to me that people down play the spriggan set.

- 95% of people farming/wearing TFS will never reap the full benefit of the penetration value in their normal rotation. so spriggan will out perform there for most people. ALSO, when you have to adjust for boss mechanics... guess what? you lose ALL penetration stacks and have to rebuild them, unlike spriggan that has a flat value 100% of the time. TFS might work great on the dummy, but not optimal for a vast majority of players in dungeons and trials. In an optimal trial you shouldn't run either of these sets anyway since you don't need the extra penetration.

- the lesser bonus trade off of crit chance (TFS) and 1k extra stamina (sprig) is such a minimal difference in the end result that it doesn't make or break anything in any build. Instead of extra crit you get 1000 stamina which essentially adds 100 weapon damage.

Both sets are great... and yes, in the right hands with perfect rotation TFS will be better. But its not 5k-10k damage better. Maybe in the 1k-2k range.

Also, don't use flurry. Those builds are long gone with the sustain changes from morrowind.
your rotation should be this to break 30k dps with your current gear setup.

Buffs (deadly cloak, hurricane bar swap, crit surge)
endless hail > light weave > poison inj. > light weave > rearming trap > light weave > caltrops > bar swap
Heavy attack > rending slashes > heavy attack > shrouded daggers > heavy attack > deadly cloak > heavy attack > hurricane bar swap
Repeat that and drop ultimate when ready, casting crit surge every 3rd rotation.
to push that even further into the mid to high 30,000s.. use weapon power potions.

@jakeedmundson

I agree with most of what you have said in this thread. One thing i want to point out is that rotation you posted doesnt work unless you drop bound armaments, you have one too many skills. You cant run both Surge and a Spam skill like Daggers. You have to pick one or the other, as I would not advise dropping bound armaments, which takes two slots. You might also consider keeping daggers and dropping rending slashes.

If you are new to stam/trials, I recommend running Crit surge to keep you alive. Once you get the hang of it, you can drop it for either your spam skill or one of your DOTs like rending. Another option, which i have actually seen really good results with, is to run lightweight trap instead of shrouded daggers. This allows you to keep surge for the survival. What you do is cast it at the beginning and end of your front bar (twice per rotation).

I mentioned that was how our two bars were different because the OP had bound arm. on his bar.
My bad on the confusing wording. I actually do NOT use bound arm. I personally prefer to use crit surge and vigor most times to help survive in dungeon pugs.
in the harder trials... yes i put bound arm. in those places and use weapon power potions.

All good, just didnt want people scratching their heads looking for a bar spot. haha. Have you ever tried the lightweight trap setup? I was pleasantly surprised with the damage. It keeps the rotation circular (no spam skill) and allows room for surge. I have seen people break 60k ST with it on valarial.

Edit: Probably not as good with add heavy fights, as daggers is a lot of splash damage, but for people trying to keep it simple and safe, it's a strong option i think.

i DID see the lightweight trap thing... i liked the damage it showed but it seemed like a lot of extra barswaps... unless you saw a different one than i did.
The one i remember seeing started with trap on the front bar, ended with trap on the front bar, and then did another trap in the middle of the back bar rotation. is that not the right way to do it?

No, it was circular. Basically one trap gets you through your front bar, and one gets through the back bar. You really dont need 4 heavy attacks in a rotation. I think it's over kill. So the way I was doing it was your typical back bar, Hail, PI,Caltrops (surge when needed) with light attacks, and front bar was HA trap, HA, Slashes, HA Cloak, HA Hurricane, LA Trap. But I might might mix and match HAs with LAs on the front bar depending on resources. Again, 4 is plenty of HAs and I think you can get away with 3 most of the time. If I am running sunder, I typically put a HA before both traps and a LA in front of slashes, to ensure good up time.

good to know....i'm going to try this later and see how it goes. But you're right about the shrouded daggers thing... super helpful for aoe (its also fun to have on my bar)
It's a cheap change of skill morphs though to give it a shot. Thanks for the insight !

How did the parse compare on the dummy to the shrouded dagger rotation btw?

I havent spent a lot of time comparing the two, but they arent far off if memory serves. It also depends how you use shrouded daggers. The easy way is to just cast it as part of a circular rotation, so its really not a spam skill. If that is how you play, I think Lightweight trap is a bit better. The other way is to juggle some of your front bar DOTs independently of one another, which allows you to use daggers as a true spam skill (i.e. as often as possible assuming your other DOTs are ticking). That is certainly the most DPS you will find on a sorc, but it makes the rotation more difficult. And of course, a difficult rotation executed poorly will never out parse a simple rotation executed well. But again, I think that with a lot of adds, Daggers becomes tough to pass up no matter how you use it.

@jakeedmundson
Edit: Doing some analysis of that monster parse. Correct me if I am wrong on this, but there are three shrouded daggers on that parse. I believe the initial hit is the big one, and the ones lower down are the first and second "bounce" of the dagger. It only bounces if their are adds, which is why its a smaller number of ticks. So that means he cast shrouded daggers 29 times in a 123 second parse, or once every 4.27 seconds. in other words, he is juggling DOTs and casting daggers more than once a rotation. If you can pull it off, I highly doubt a Lightweight trap rotation will beat it.

For most of us mortals running around Tamriel, circular rotation are the better option, even if we dont want to admit it.

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

@jakeedmundson

Just a quick update. I have been messing a bit with stam sorc since we had this convo. I have been going back and forth between the shrouded daggers and Lightweight trap rotation. If I only do one dagger per rotation, lightweight trap wins by a little bit. I have tried doing a 3 heavy attack rotation with daggers, where my front bar is basically: HA>slashes, LA>daggers, LA>Daggers, HA cloak, HA hurricane (as opposed to one of each all with HAs). This does pull a bit ahead of my lightweight trap rotation, but sustain becomes a huge factor. I usually have to do the 4 HA rotation at least once or twice on a 3 million dummy to sustain. All my parses for these rotations land in the 35-37K (no major fracture), and they are all pretty close.

My conclusion: Multiple daggers per rotation will give you the best DPS, but will come at the cost of sustain issues (group can help there) and survivability (no room for any kind of heal). It will certainly scale the best with a lot of adds present. The light weight trap rotation has less of a ceiling, wont scale quite as well, but sustain and survival arent issues. Not sure I would recommend anyone simply do a 1 dagger per rotation build. Seems to have no upside.