LadyLethalla wrote: »

Iluvrien wrote: »

And here was I thinking that ZOS had run out of ways to further devalue crafting. I should have known better.

Except... how many players will actually have more than one Master Crafter, and more than one that knows most or all motifs?
I have one Master, who doesn't yet know ALL motifs - the addition of new ones is too fast to keep up with, especially since I'm not going to spend huge amounts of gold on DLC drops. And my other 8 toons, while they're usually always researching items, I won't ever do Nirn items on any of them. And they learn only cheap motifs I can't be bothered listing, like Mercenary.

Me. I have 5 characters who have 50 in their craft skills and three who have been working on their motifs. I know that I am not the only one, but since I haven't done a full survey of the entire playerbase I am not about to make an appeal to majority here.

LadyLethalla wrote: »

As a (small) plus, if you got a particular high priced motif page and accidentally read it on the wrong character, it's now worth something.

O.o .. have you ever actually done this? Yourself I mean. If I have a high-priced motif page then I am extra careful with it. It either goes to the character who needs to read it, or into my bank. The chance of any other outcome is pretty much nil*.

[*allowing for factors such as my baby son smashing the keyboard, single-key sized meteorites, acts of deity etc.]

LadyLethalla wrote: »

So IMO I don't think it devalues crafting any further than it is now.

Your points above refer to a crafter on their own, and the effects this system will have on that one crafter.

The effects of this will be felt in terms of the motif economy and the crafting economy (what's left of it):

Motif Economy: There will be a short-term run on motifs that will, likely, drive up prices as things get scarce after release. However, since only one motif will be needed by each player, instead of each character, the eventual prospect for this market is negative. Every sale that might have been made based on a player investing even a single gold piece in buying a motif for another one of their characters... may well now not take place. Why both learning a motif when you can craft in your race-base style and then use an outfit to make it look the way you want?

Crafting Economy: I've had orders in the past that were entirely based on motif. Good luck with that. It is more likely that another player will buy the motif themselves (and thus be able to use it at any time) rather than track down a crafter who will then make them the specific armour piece required (and have to repeat that any time they want to reuse/change the piece).

IMO this devalues the effort put in by players like me to have motifs on more than one character, it will devalue the motif market and it will (further) devalue the crafting economy as a whole.

I would prefer a LOTRO style outfit system, but even if they just removed the account-wide motif access then I would be much MUCH happier about this.

Alcast wrote: »

SantieClaws wrote: »

Khajiit has thoughts. Questions. Things with pictures.

Is it possible to use the outfit system to mix a store costume with a piece of armour - say a pretty dress and a level 14 Khajiit style helmet ... ?

If the home is already full will this one need to remove some of her fishes and yarn to make room for the chests?

Will the chests obtained from crafting writs grumpy elf be bound or can we sell them on as with the crafting stations?

Yours with paws
Santie Claws

I do not think so, Lambert explained the hirarchy: Costumes overwrite Outfits, Outfits overwrite Armor. So you could prolly wear a costume hat over a outfit but not the other way around

Yep, you cannot mix costumes and normal gear.
The outfit system will not change the current hirarchy. Costumes will still override gear.

Dracane wrote: »

The_Brosteen wrote: »

Wait so I can duel wield axes in cyrodiil but make them look like swords?

*braces for CE claims*

Exactly, you can
Remember though: You can make one handed weapons like swords look like other 1 handed weapons only (daggers, axes, maces) and the same goes for 2 handed weapons.

How about shields?

Iluvrien wrote: »

LadyLethalla wrote: »

Iluvrien wrote: »

And here was I thinking that ZOS had run out of ways to further devalue crafting. I should have known better.

Except... how many players will actually have more than one Master Crafter, and more than one that knows most or all motifs?
I have one Master, who doesn't yet know ALL motifs - the addition of new ones is too fast to keep up with, especially since I'm not going to spend huge amounts of gold on DLC drops. And my other 8 toons, while they're usually always researching items, I won't ever do Nirn items on any of them. And they learn only cheap motifs I can't be bothered listing, like Mercenary.

Me. I have 5 characters who have 50 in their craft skills and three who have been working on their motifs. I know that I am not the only one, but since I haven't done a full survey of the entire playerbase I am not about to make an appeal to majority here.

LadyLethalla wrote: »

As a (small) plus, if you got a particular high priced motif page and accidentally read it on the wrong character, it's now worth something.

O.o .. have you ever actually done this? Yourself I mean. If I have a high-priced motif page then I am extra careful with it. It either goes to the character who needs to read it, or into my bank. The chance of any other outcome is pretty much nil*.

[*allowing for factors such as my baby son smashing the keyboard, single-key sized meteorites, acts of deity etc.]

LadyLethalla wrote: »

So IMO I don't think it devalues crafting any further than it is now.

Your points above refer to a crafter on their own, and the effects this system will have on that one crafter.

The effects of this will be felt in terms of the motif economy and the crafting economy (what's left of it):

Motif Economy: There will be a short-term run on motifs that will, likely, drive up prices as things get scarce after release. However, since only one motif will be needed by each player, instead of each character, the eventual prospect for this market is negative. Every sale that might have been made based on a player investing even a single gold piece in buying a motif for another one of their characters... may well now not take place. Why both learning a motif when you can craft in your race-base style and then use an outfit to make it look the way you want?

Crafting Economy: I've had orders in the past that were entirely based on motif. Good luck with that. It is more likely that another player will buy the motif themselves (and thus be able to use it at any time) rather than track down a crafter who will then make them the specific armour piece required (and have to repeat that any time they want to reuse/change the piece).

IMO this devalues the effort put in by players like me to have motifs on more than one character, it will devalue the motif market and it will (further) devalue the crafting economy as a whole.

I would prefer a LOTRO style outfit system, but even if they just removed the account-wide motif access then I would be much MUCH happier about this.

Dont see any issue with account wide access to motifs for this.
LOTRO system would let you buy crafted gear to use as outfits. this would typical be cp150 or lower gear there the only benefit was the motif. In ESO you need to know the motif on one character this would be on you main crafter who would also make crafted gear. Crafting economy is dead as half the high level players can make julianos and hurdling and you go to guild members who just want an tip for doing it.

Require that the character knew the motif would be seriously annoying.

However I don't see how this has negative impact, more players would be buying motifs, crafted sets will not take an huge hit, main benefit is that they are easy to get and easy to adjust around, yes some wear them just for the look.

I recall them mentioning a beef jerky mount; I am intrigued.

thanks for this, I tried to watch it this morning but the quality was terrible.

Iluvrien wrote: »

*allowing for factors such as my baby son smashing the keyboard, single-key sized meteorites, acts of deity etc.*

You forgot to mention "Act of Cat"....

"Your adorable fluffy but ARRRRRGH!"

*Shake fist in air*

LadyAstrum wrote: »

red_emu wrote: »

Just a bit of a shame that it will cost gold. My characters are always broke to create any costume with fancier styles (only ones that have texture resolution and mesh better than Pong) it will cost around 14000 gold

Go and earn some gold then!

Any advice on that apart from spending ages playing with market stock? Not all of us have time to play as much as we'd like

zaria wrote: »

Iluvrien wrote: »

LadyLethalla wrote: »

Iluvrien wrote: »

And here was I thinking that ZOS had run out of ways to further devalue crafting. I should have known better.

Except... how many players will actually have more than one Master Crafter, and more than one that knows most or all motifs?
I have one Master, who doesn't yet know ALL motifs - the addition of new ones is too fast to keep up with, especially since I'm not going to spend huge amounts of gold on DLC drops. And my other 8 toons, while they're usually always researching items, I won't ever do Nirn items on any of them. And they learn only cheap motifs I can't be bothered listing, like Mercenary.

Me. I have 5 characters who have 50 in their craft skills and three who have been working on their motifs. I know that I am not the only one, but since I haven't done a full survey of the entire playerbase I am not about to make an appeal to majority here.

LadyLethalla wrote: »

As a (small) plus, if you got a particular high priced motif page and accidentally read it on the wrong character, it's now worth something.

O.o .. have you ever actually done this? Yourself I mean. If I have a high-priced motif page then I am extra careful with it. It either goes to the character who needs to read it, or into my bank. The chance of any other outcome is pretty much nil*.

[*allowing for factors such as my baby son smashing the keyboard, single-key sized meteorites, acts of deity etc.]

LadyLethalla wrote: »

So IMO I don't think it devalues crafting any further than it is now.

Your points above refer to a crafter on their own, and the effects this system will have on that one crafter.

The effects of this will be felt in terms of the motif economy and the crafting economy (what's left of it):

Motif Economy: There will be a short-term run on motifs that will, likely, drive up prices as things get scarce after release. However, since only one motif will be needed by each player, instead of each character, the eventual prospect for this market is negative. Every sale that might have been made based on a player investing even a single gold piece in buying a motif for another one of their characters... may well now not take place. Why both learning a motif when you can craft in your race-base style and then use an outfit to make it look the way you want?

Crafting Economy: I've had orders in the past that were entirely based on motif. Good luck with that. It is more likely that another player will buy the motif themselves (and thus be able to use it at any time) rather than track down a crafter who will then make them the specific armour piece required (and have to repeat that any time they want to reuse/change the piece).

IMO this devalues the effort put in by players like me to have motifs on more than one character, it will devalue the motif market and it will (further) devalue the crafting economy as a whole.

I would prefer a LOTRO style outfit system, but even if they just removed the account-wide motif access then I would be much MUCH happier about this.

Dont see any issue with account wide access to motifs for this.
LOTRO system would let you buy crafted gear to use as outfits. this would typical be cp150 or lower gear there the only benefit was the motif. In ESO you need to know the motif on one character this would be on you main crafter who would also make crafted gear. Crafting economy is dead as half the high level players can make julianos and hurdling and you go to guild members who just want an tip for doing it.

And this change will make it less dead how?

Making it an LOTRO-style system might actually get some crafting trade moving again as people might actually buy a piece of armour that had the right look. That way crafters who had a wide range of motifs known would gain some value again. The current incarnation of the system does none of this.

zaria wrote: »

Require that the character knew the motif would be seriously annoying.

Just like it is seriously annoying that one character knows a trait that another one does? Or that one character is a DK and the other is a NB? Character level separation is only annoying to the people who care nothing for characters as characters and only as assemblages of numbers.

zaria wrote: »

However I don't see how this has negative impact, more players would be buying motifs, crafted sets will not take an huge hit, main benefit is that they are easy to get and easy to adjust around, yes some wear them just for the look.

Motif buying will be a short term effect, as described in the post you actually quoted.
Crafted sets will continue to be useful purely for their stats, rather than adding value by making the appearance important too.

Please, ZOS, make this a positive for the crafting community!

@red_emu Steal things. One green legerdemain item is 100 gold, and blues are 250 each. Skip over the white items you find. Occasionally you may even find a rare furnishing recipe which you can then sell for more gold.