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What is the purpose of a 20 hours CD vs a fixed reset time in the AM?
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Linaleah✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
Which AM? Yours? ZOSs? The servers? My cousins half-sister in Germany?vs a fixed reset time in the AM
Doing a reset every 20 hours after the last time you did a dungeon requires no timezone conversion, it's straight math.
Finding your local timezone requires reading your computers timezone settings (which could be wrong) or Lat/Lng if available (best option) or IP based geo-location (may get you close).
That's a lot of extra overhead just to find your personal AM ...
all they need to do is make all resets happen at the same time as pledges and dailies that are already resetting at a set time. a LOT more simple than having resets all over the place per character. a lot LESS overhead. the system is already in game, all they have to do is normalize everything to it.
to give it a different perspective. current random dungeon reset. a minimum of 20 hours. current pledge reset. a maximum of 24. random dungeon will never reset faster then 20 hours. but pledge will never take more the 24 hours to allow you to do the next one.
Edited by Linaleah on December 4, 2017 11:59PMdirty worthless casual.
Lois McMaster Bujold "A Civil Campaign"Reputation is what other people know about you. Honor is what you know about yourself. Guard your honor. Let your reputation fall where it will. And outlive the ***1 -
badmojo✭✭✭✭✭
✭The reason is to make it more fair for everyone.
For example, if the reset was at 1am, the people who regularly play from midnight until 3am would have an advantage over the rest of us who have to sleep. That person could feed their horse and run their daily dungeon at midnight and then again at 1am, then they dont have to login to the game until midnight two days later, when they repeat the process and take another 48hr break, while those who dont have the same schedule have to log in everyday to maintain the same progress.
I used to do this with the crafting writs when my schedule accomidated it.
but its NOT more fair to everyone.
right now you are beholden to this schedule no matter what. no matter what your schedule is. and becasue you are beholden to this schedule, you end up missing days if time doesn't align. with regular reset - someone who might do their dailies in the same time slot? STILL only gets 2 dailies in 48 hours. they just chose to do them back to back, but its NOT some inherent advantage. do NOT underestimate just how valuable ability to spread your dailies across smaller chunks of time, without worrying that you miss your window of opportunity is.
meanwhile right now, you know who has an advantage? people who can shift their schedule at will and get 7 dailies done in a space of 6 days. how is this fair to everyone?
and meanwhile. what you describe above? people are already doing with pledges and world dailies. and the sky is not falling. because there is NO inherent advantage to that other then flexibility for all. unlike 20 hour reset where those with more flexible schedules DO in fact get a very tangible numerical advantage every 6 days
I didnt design the system nor do I even like it. I just stated why I believe ZOS went with the cooldown insted of the reset.
The unfairness you bring up could also be solved by increasing the cooldown by 4hrs and applying cooldown timers to the things that currently have reset times. But the 4hr grace period is nice so your activites dont get pushed later and later into your playtime.
If somebody wants to exploit that grace period and squeeze out another dungeon run every week by modifying their sleep schedule around a cooldown timer then damn, they probably deserve an extra, that is some hardcore dedication to a videogame.[DC/NA]0 -
Linaleah✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The reason is to make it more fair for everyone.
For example, if the reset was at 1am, the people who regularly play from midnight until 3am would have an advantage over the rest of us who have to sleep. That person could feed their horse and run their daily dungeon at midnight and then again at 1am, then they dont have to login to the game until midnight two days later, when they repeat the process and take another 48hr break, while those who dont have the same schedule have to log in everyday to maintain the same progress.
I used to do this with the crafting writs when my schedule accomidated it.
but its NOT more fair to everyone.
right now you are beholden to this schedule no matter what. no matter what your schedule is. and becasue you are beholden to this schedule, you end up missing days if time doesn't align. with regular reset - someone who might do their dailies in the same time slot? STILL only gets 2 dailies in 48 hours. they just chose to do them back to back, but its NOT some inherent advantage. do NOT underestimate just how valuable ability to spread your dailies across smaller chunks of time, without worrying that you miss your window of opportunity is.
meanwhile right now, you know who has an advantage? people who can shift their schedule at will and get 7 dailies done in a space of 6 days. how is this fair to everyone?
and meanwhile. what you describe above? people are already doing with pledges and world dailies. and the sky is not falling. because there is NO inherent advantage to that other then flexibility for all. unlike 20 hour reset where those with more flexible schedules DO in fact get a very tangible numerical advantage every 6 days
I didnt design the system nor do I even like it. I just stated why I believe ZOS went with the cooldown insted of the reset.
The unfairness you bring up could also be solved by increasing the cooldown by 4hrs and applying cooldown timers to the things that currently have reset times. But the 4hr grace period is nice so your activites dont get pushed later and later into your playtime.
If somebody wants to exploit that grace period and squeeze out another dungeon run every week by modifying their sleep schedule around a cooldown timer then damn, they probably deserve an extra, that is some hardcore dedication to a videogame.
the problem is, unless you absolutely positively play around same time every day? even with current system with its grace period? if you miss that window, your activities DO in fact get pushed back. with set reset that ALREADY EXISTS IN GAME, SO ITS NOT LIKE THEY HAVE TO CODE IT FROM SCRATCH. guarantees that it will never get pushed back, just becasue you had an emergency, or had to work late, or have a schedule that can change from day to day, etc.dirty worthless casual.
Lois McMaster Bujold "A Civil Campaign"Reputation is what other people know about you. Honor is what you know about yourself. Guard your honor. Let your reputation fall where it will. And outlive the ***0 -
badmojo✭✭✭✭✭
✭The reason is to make it more fair for everyone.
For example, if the reset was at 1am, the people who regularly play from midnight until 3am would have an advantage over the rest of us who have to sleep. That person could feed their horse and run their daily dungeon at midnight and then again at 1am, then they dont have to login to the game until midnight two days later, when they repeat the process and take another 48hr break, while those who dont have the same schedule have to log in everyday to maintain the same progress.
I used to do this with the crafting writs when my schedule accomidated it.
but its NOT more fair to everyone.
right now you are beholden to this schedule no matter what. no matter what your schedule is. and becasue you are beholden to this schedule, you end up missing days if time doesn't align. with regular reset - someone who might do their dailies in the same time slot? STILL only gets 2 dailies in 48 hours. they just chose to do them back to back, but its NOT some inherent advantage. do NOT underestimate just how valuable ability to spread your dailies across smaller chunks of time, without worrying that you miss your window of opportunity is.
meanwhile right now, you know who has an advantage? people who can shift their schedule at will and get 7 dailies done in a space of 6 days. how is this fair to everyone?
and meanwhile. what you describe above? people are already doing with pledges and world dailies. and the sky is not falling. because there is NO inherent advantage to that other then flexibility for all. unlike 20 hour reset where those with more flexible schedules DO in fact get a very tangible numerical advantage every 6 days
I didnt design the system nor do I even like it. I just stated why I believe ZOS went with the cooldown insted of the reset.
The unfairness you bring up could also be solved by increasing the cooldown by 4hrs and applying cooldown timers to the things that currently have reset times. But the 4hr grace period is nice so your activites dont get pushed later and later into your playtime.
If somebody wants to exploit that grace period and squeeze out another dungeon run every week by modifying their sleep schedule around a cooldown timer then damn, they probably deserve an extra, that is some hardcore dedication to a videogame.
the problem is, unless you absolutely positively play around same time every day? even with current system with its grace period? if you miss that window, your activities DO in fact get pushed back. with set reset that ALREADY EXISTS IN GAME, SO ITS NOT LIKE THEY HAVE TO CODE IT FROM SCRATCH. guarantees that it will never get pushed back, just becasue you had an emergency, or had to work late, or have a schedule that can change from day to day, etc.
Sure that happens. Just today I went to do a dungeon on my healer but the cooldown hadent passed so I had to oit it off until tonight. It sucks, but thats life. What if there was no cooldown and you tried to run a dungeon right before the reset and couldnt get a group in time, that would also suck.
Neither system is perfect, just because we might prefer one over the other we shouldnt ignore its flaws and focus only on the flaws in the other system.[DC/NA]0 -
Linaleah✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The reason is to make it more fair for everyone.
For example, if the reset was at 1am, the people who regularly play from midnight until 3am would have an advantage over the rest of us who have to sleep. That person could feed their horse and run their daily dungeon at midnight and then again at 1am, then they dont have to login to the game until midnight two days later, when they repeat the process and take another 48hr break, while those who dont have the same schedule have to log in everyday to maintain the same progress.
I used to do this with the crafting writs when my schedule accomidated it.
but its NOT more fair to everyone.
right now you are beholden to this schedule no matter what. no matter what your schedule is. and becasue you are beholden to this schedule, you end up missing days if time doesn't align. with regular reset - someone who might do their dailies in the same time slot? STILL only gets 2 dailies in 48 hours. they just chose to do them back to back, but its NOT some inherent advantage. do NOT underestimate just how valuable ability to spread your dailies across smaller chunks of time, without worrying that you miss your window of opportunity is.
meanwhile right now, you know who has an advantage? people who can shift their schedule at will and get 7 dailies done in a space of 6 days. how is this fair to everyone?
and meanwhile. what you describe above? people are already doing with pledges and world dailies. and the sky is not falling. because there is NO inherent advantage to that other then flexibility for all. unlike 20 hour reset where those with more flexible schedules DO in fact get a very tangible numerical advantage every 6 days
I didnt design the system nor do I even like it. I just stated why I believe ZOS went with the cooldown insted of the reset.
The unfairness you bring up could also be solved by increasing the cooldown by 4hrs and applying cooldown timers to the things that currently have reset times. But the 4hr grace period is nice so your activites dont get pushed later and later into your playtime.
If somebody wants to exploit that grace period and squeeze out another dungeon run every week by modifying their sleep schedule around a cooldown timer then damn, they probably deserve an extra, that is some hardcore dedication to a videogame.
the problem is, unless you absolutely positively play around same time every day? even with current system with its grace period? if you miss that window, your activities DO in fact get pushed back. with set reset that ALREADY EXISTS IN GAME, SO ITS NOT LIKE THEY HAVE TO CODE IT FROM SCRATCH. guarantees that it will never get pushed back, just becasue you had an emergency, or had to work late, or have a schedule that can change from day to day, etc.
Sure that happens. Just today I went to do a dungeon on my healer but the cooldown hadent passed so I had to oit it off until tonight. It sucks, but thats life. What if there was no cooldown and you tried to run a dungeon right before the reset and couldnt get a group in time, that would also suck.
Neither system is perfect, just because we might prefer one over the other we shouldnt ignore its flaws and focus only on the flaws in the other system.
I'm not ignoring the flaws. I'm merely pointing out that a system of set daily cooldown is far more scheduling friendly and flexible and as such more fair for more people. there are no perfect systems. but some systems are worse then others. 20 hour cd is one such system.dirty worthless casual.
Lois McMaster Bujold "A Civil Campaign"Reputation is what other people know about you. Honor is what you know about yourself. Guard your honor. Let your reputation fall where it will. And outlive the ***0 -
badmojo✭✭✭✭✭
✭Your response to me bringing up the point about doing dailies back to back at reset time was mostly ignored. You simply cited that other dailies are already abused in the same way. That seemed like you ignoring a flaw because you want that system.Edited by badmojo on December 5, 2017 12:49AM[DC/NA]0 -
Linaleah✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Your response to me bringing up the point about doing dailies back to back at reset time was mostly ignored. You simply cited that other dailies are already abused in the same way. That seemed like you ignoring a flaw because you want that system.
that's not abuse. that's taking advantage of flexibility in a system. you calling it abuse doesn't actualy make it abuse. i didn't ignore it, I'm saying that its an ADVANTAGE of the system, NOT its flaw. people not being forced to log in at the same time every day? is AN ADVANTAGE not a flaw.
becasue you seem to miss out the little fact that with 20 hour cooldown, if you want to do something daily, you cannot postpone it in any way, if you don't do it at that time, you don't do it at all. wait now, you somehow see it as fairness of the system? punishing people for not being regimented enough or something? I'm honestly having trouble seeing in what way is the system that makes you wait 20 hours and then punishes you if you miss that window - fair. or fun.Edited by Linaleah on December 5, 2017 1:28AMdirty worthless casual.
Lois McMaster Bujold "A Civil Campaign"Reputation is what other people know about you. Honor is what you know about yourself. Guard your honor. Let your reputation fall where it will. And outlive the ***1 -
badmojo✭✭✭✭✭
✭Your response to me bringing up the point about doing dailies back to back at reset time was mostly ignored. You simply cited that other dailies are already abused in the same way. That seemed like you ignoring a flaw because you want that system.
that's not abuse. that's taking advantage of flexibility in a system. you calling it abuse doesn't actualy make it abuse. i didn't ignore it, I'm saying that its an ADVANTAGE of the system, NOT its flaw. people not being forced to log in at the same time every day? is AN ADVANTAGE not a flaw.
becasue you seem to miss out the little fact that with 20 hour cooldown, if you want to do something daily, you cannot postpone it in any way, if you don't do it at that time, you don't do it at all. wait now, you somehow see it as fairness of the system? punishing people for not being regimented enough or something? I'm honestly having trouble seeing in what way is the system that makes you wait 20 hours and then punishes you if you miss that window - fair. or fun.
The fairness I spoke of in my original post is in reference to people being able to log in and do two days worth of dailies in one short play session. Playing a 2 hour session every two days is more convenient than playing two 1 hour sessions over two days. If some people are rewarded with more convenience due to the time of day they happen to play the game, that seems unfair.
When I was on another schedule at work I would wait until an hour before the writs reset to do them, and just go through the characters twice. It was like working an hour after midnight so you didn't have to come in the next day. Which I guess is alright. But, if we're going there, why not all the way? Let me pump out the whole months worth of writs and dungeons. It's because they're designed to keep us playing....daily.[DC/NA]0 -
NolaArch✭✭✭✭✭paulsimonps wrote: »Mounts, daily random rewards as well as Trial weekly coffers should reset daily and weekly. This 20h and 168h BS is just annoying. Make it more convenient for everyone if it was just reset daily with the writs, pledges and leaderboards. Its a PitA trying to keep your coffers straight on all of your toons and for those that do our mounts on a specific time of day to keep it straight, missing it by a few hours can make you miss the next day completely if you want to get back on track. The timers are unnecessary get rid of them.
Thank you, someone gets it.
The problem with the CD being attached to the character and not the day is that you have to reschedule real life events around the character CD, where as you do not have to reschedule real life events around the day cd.
Yes. Both of these. With a 20H CD over a hard reset like pledges, if I have a week like this week, for example, where I’m putting in long hours at work and don’t get home until after 8, the 20H CD can put off running things on characters for an entire day so I don’t get stuck in a loop of running late into a weeknight. Sure, it goes back four hours, but one night can throw off your timing by a lot.
I have to agree that I just don’t see the harm in a hard reset and nixing the 20H CD altogether.
Edited by NolaArch on December 5, 2017 2:06AMArdat-Yakshii EP Stam NB
36k anchovy club
Mash the buttons, hope for the best!
I have some achievements3 -
Runefang✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Your response to me bringing up the point about doing dailies back to back at reset time was mostly ignored. You simply cited that other dailies are already abused in the same way. That seemed like you ignoring a flaw because you want that system.
It's a tiiiny flaw. Even then doing them back to back means that in a 48 hour period you still did them just twice. So not really abuse, its only helpful if you are playing at reset time AND you won't be playing again in the next 24 hours.
On the other hand if I play Friday night and then again Saturday morning but not Saturday night I can only get the better reward once right now. So I'm punished for that, where as with a fixed reset I'd get it both days.
In both systems you can still only get rewarded twice in 48 hours but one is flexible where the other is not.
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Linaleah✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Your response to me bringing up the point about doing dailies back to back at reset time was mostly ignored. You simply cited that other dailies are already abused in the same way. That seemed like you ignoring a flaw because you want that system.
that's not abuse. that's taking advantage of flexibility in a system. you calling it abuse doesn't actualy make it abuse. i didn't ignore it, I'm saying that its an ADVANTAGE of the system, NOT its flaw. people not being forced to log in at the same time every day? is AN ADVANTAGE not a flaw.
becasue you seem to miss out the little fact that with 20 hour cooldown, if you want to do something daily, you cannot postpone it in any way, if you don't do it at that time, you don't do it at all. wait now, you somehow see it as fairness of the system? punishing people for not being regimented enough or something? I'm honestly having trouble seeing in what way is the system that makes you wait 20 hours and then punishes you if you miss that window - fair. or fun.
The fairness I spoke of in my original post is in reference to people being able to log in and do two days worth of dailies in one short play session. Playing a 2 hour session every two days is more convenient than playing two 1 hour sessions over two days. If some people are rewarded with more convenience due to the time of day they happen to play the game, that seems unfair.
When I was on another schedule at work I would wait until an hour before the writs reset to do them, and just go through the characters twice. It was like working an hour after midnight so you didn't have to come in the next day. Which I guess is alright. But, if we're going there, why not all the way? Let me pump out the whole months worth of writs and dungeons. It's because they're designed to keep us playing....daily.
but that was more convenient for you. for someone else its more convenient to do dailies across the day in short bursts. there is nothing wrong with doing everything in one sitting OR in small bursts. the problem is - that 20 hour cooldown - rewards the first, while punishing the second. set cooldown - rewards both.
so what if you play every other day? I mean.. there are people who don't do dailies at all. they log in on weekends casually and this is fine, they are just as valuable for the health of the game, however. why are we so bound and determined to make it more annoying for people who log in more often? because if someone is concerned with doing dailies? they are already a regular player.Edited by Linaleah on December 5, 2017 2:29AMdirty worthless casual.
Lois McMaster Bujold "A Civil Campaign"Reputation is what other people know about you. Honor is what you know about yourself. Guard your honor. Let your reputation fall where it will. And outlive the ***0 -
Jaybe_Mawfaka✭✭✭✭✭Kudos to the flawless reset timer I will not be able to participate in the last day of the event because of the cooldowns on my characters. And of course Special thanks to the first day when I was keep trying to *** queue in the dungeon for over 6 hours without any success.2 -
Cpt_Teemo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Jaybe_Mawfaka wrote: »Kudos to the flawless reset timer I will not be able to participate in the last day of the event because of the cooldowns on my characters. And of course Special thanks to the first day when I was keep trying to *** queue in the dungeon for over 6 hours without any success.
Yeah, if you want the last day you'll have to wake up super early if your pst I really don't get why they did that it could've ended at 10 pm est instead no problem and still be full 7 days come on ZoS.Edited by Cpt_Teemo on December 5, 2017 2:36AM0 -
Jarryzzt✭✭✭✭The advantage of having a fixed reset is twofold.
First, a number of gaming companies do it for purely technical reasons. E.g. EVE literally reboots the server at the same time every single day, which also resets whatever needs to be reset. I don't know, nor am really interested, in how ZOS handles this side of things, but my point is that in principle fixed server resets can sometimes be helpful from a purely technical standpoint.
Second, it's essentially a Friday-to-Saturday convenience for players. Meaning, if a person plays on Friday night, say, after work or school, and then wakes up and plays again on Saturday morning. Now this person has cleared two dailies in 12 hours and can go about their Saturday however they want. [I use Friday-to-Saturday example as likely the most common, but obviously any pair of days where the player changes over between morning and evening play windows work just as well.]
I think a better way of expressing the above is - with a fixed reset, a player can pick up the daily at any time of the day, which leads to a lot more flexible scheduling of play sessions. Today, I do it in the morning, tomorrow, in the evening, et cetera.
Obviously ZOS does not need fixed resets from a technical standpoint, although I would argue that having to keep track of every reset for every player in real time is not the most optimal way to handle things.
I honestly do not really understand the design decision to not give players scheduling flexibility of the type I outlined above - though at least they were kind enough to set the interval at 20 hours and thus avoid the "sliding window" problem. [With a 24 hour timer, the next reset happens 24 hours after the completion of the daily content, which means each day the content has to be completed later and later.] I doubt anything is going to be changed at this point, but it, to me, is of the same family of design decisions as the whole guild-store-and-not-auction-house mess. Clearly there was some internal justification and rationale, because there always is one (even if it's not exactly rational to an outside observer).
So yes, in principle I would support a fixed reset, but in practice I suppose we'll just have to live with what we have, and yes, that means occasionally skipping the daily content because I am not going to modify my "life" schedule for the sake of hitting a particular 20-hour window in-game...1 -
NewBlacksmurf✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The point is ppl don’t overload the servers trying to log in at reset. Instead it creates a pace by user-PC (PTS)/Xbox One: NewBlacksmurf
~<{[50]}>~ looks better than *5010 -
MaxwellC✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭ZOS should just make it so your cool-down resets every-time at 12pm EDT or 9am EDT (use your global time converter to check which time that converts to).不動の Steadfast - Unwavering
XBL Gamer Tag - Maxwell
XB1 Maxwell Crystal - NA DC CP 800+ Redguard Stamina DK
XB1 Max Crystal - NA DC CP 800+ Brenton Magicka DK
PC Maxwell-Crystal - NA DC - CP 200+ Brenton Magicka DK 「Retired」Band Camp statements: To state "But this one time I saw X doing X... so that justifies X" Refers to the Band camp statement.
Coined by Maxwell1 -
Bevik✭✭✭✭I'm using this add-on anyway. It's a nice multi tool.
http://www.esoui.com/downloads/info1190-WPamAWhatPledgesatmyAlts.html0 -
LonePirate✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭For those having trouble here, once every 24 hours means you can perform the action 7 times a week. If it has a 20 hour cool down, then you can perform the action 8 times a week since there are 168 hours in a week. It's up to you.0 -
Linaleah✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭NewBlacksmurf wrote: »The point is ppl don’t overload the servers trying to log in at reset. Instead it creates a pace by user
people STILL do that for pledges and crafting dailies as those have a set reset.dirty worthless casual.
Lois McMaster Bujold "A Civil Campaign"Reputation is what other people know about you. Honor is what you know about yourself. Guard your honor. Let your reputation fall where it will. And outlive the ***1 -
paulsimonps✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭NewBlacksmurf wrote: »The point is ppl don’t overload the servers trying to log in at reset. Instead it creates a pace by user
Do you know how many people will NOT be doing that? Cause its early in the morning/late at night for most people. How is there ANY arguments against a hard reset? There are no down sides to this....3 -
Magdalina✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Your response to me bringing up the point about doing dailies back to back at reset time was mostly ignored. You simply cited that other dailies are already abused in the same way. That seemed like you ignoring a flaw because you want that system.
Why is this a flaw though? Most of the people who legit are concerned over daily quests/dungeons/whatever do indeed play daily(because otherwise it's a non-issue - everything will have long reset if you don't play for 24+ hours). So even if we do run 2 dungeons back to back for max xp - why not? That means we did not run a random in ~23 hours before that and will not run another in ~23 hours after. Still only 2 dungeons in 2 days. Anyone else who cannot log in at the time of the reset will simply log in at their preferred time and do the (now reset) dungeon then without missing anything.
With the current system...gods forbid our schedule changes even for a day. For example I ran the first set of randoms this event late at night(my time) because I was busy til then that day - but the next day I, on the contrary, had time before that and would rather do them during the day and go to bed earlier but I had to stay up if I wanted my dailies. Now I'm basically stuck staying up late to run dungeons if I want all the rewards. It's really a rather lame system. I don't know why they'd implement it, only thing that comes to mind is so people would be able to run less dungeons(since schedule changes inevitably happen and you end up missing your daily random), but why? It's not like a random dungeon gives you some op tremendous advantage that would be too much to bear if you 100% got it every day. Sure the XP is nice but not THAT nice.0 -
zaria✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
The problem with cooldowns is then you do an dungeon late at night you have to wait until late the next day to do it.The reason is to make it more fair for everyone.
For example, if the reset was at 1am, the people who regularly play from midnight until 3am would have an advantage over the rest of us who have to sleep. That person could feed their horse and run their daily dungeon at midnight and then again at 1am, then they dont have to login to the game until midnight two days later, when they repeat the process and take another 48hr break, while those who dont have the same schedule have to log in everyday to maintain the same progress.
I used to do this with the crafting writs when my schedule accomidated it.
but its NOT more fair to everyone.
right now you are beholden to this schedule no matter what. no matter what your schedule is. and becasue you are beholden to this schedule, you end up missing days if time doesn't align. with regular reset - someone who might do their dailies in the same time slot? STILL only gets 2 dailies in 48 hours. they just chose to do them back to back, but its NOT some inherent advantage. do NOT underestimate just how valuable ability to spread your dailies across smaller chunks of time, without worrying that you miss your window of opportunity is.
meanwhile right now, you know who has an advantage? people who can shift their schedule at will and get 7 dailies done in a space of 6 days. how is this fair to everyone?
and meanwhile. what you describe above? people are already doing with pledges and world dailies. and the sky is not falling. because there is NO inherent advantage to that other then flexibility for all. unlike 20 hour reset where those with more flexible schedules DO in fact get a very tangible numerical advantage every 6 days
I didnt design the system nor do I even like it. I just stated why I believe ZOS went with the cooldown insted of the reset.
The unfairness you bring up could also be solved by increasing the cooldown by 4hrs and applying cooldown timers to the things that currently have reset times. But the 4hr grace period is nice so your activites dont get pushed later and later into your playtime.
If somebody wants to exploit that grace period and squeeze out another dungeon run every week by modifying their sleep schedule around a cooldown timer then damn, they probably deserve an extra, that is some hardcore dedication to a videogame.
the problem is, unless you absolutely positively play around same time every day? even with current system with its grace period? if you miss that window, your activities DO in fact get pushed back. with set reset that ALREADY EXISTS IN GAME, SO ITS NOT LIKE THEY HAVE TO CODE IT FROM SCRATCH. guarantees that it will never get pushed back, just becasue you had an emergency, or had to work late, or have a schedule that can change from day to day, etc.
Sure that happens. Just today I went to do a dungeon on my healer but the cooldown hadent passed so I had to oit it off until tonight. It sucks, but thats life. What if there was no cooldown and you tried to run a dungeon right before the reset and couldnt get a group in time, that would also suck.
Neither system is perfect, just because we might prefer one over the other we shouldnt ignore its flaws and focus only on the flaws in the other system.
I'm not ignoring the flaws. I'm merely pointing out that a system of set daily cooldown is far more scheduling friendly and flexible and as such more fair for more people. there are no perfect systems. but some systems are worse then others. 20 hour cd is one such system.
Grinding just make you go in circles.
Asking ZoS for nerfs is as stupid as asking for close air support from the death star.1 -
ArchMikem✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭paulsimonps wrote: »Mounts, daily random rewards as well as Trial weekly coffers should reset daily and weekly. This 20h and 168h BS is just annoying. Make it more convenient for everyone if it was just reset daily with the writs, pledges and leaderboards. Its a PitA trying to keep your coffers straight on all of your toons and for those that do our mounts on a specific time of day to keep it straight, missing it by a few hours can make you miss the next day completely if you want to get back on track. The timers are unnecessary get rid of them.
Thank you, someone gets it.
The problem with the CD being attached to the character and not the day is that you have to reschedule real life events around the character CD, where as you do not have to reschedule real life events around the day cd.
Or maybe you can just not be so ornery about it?CP2,100 Master Explorer - AvA Two Star Warlord - Console Peasant - Khajiiti Aficionado - The Clan
Quest Objective: OMG Go Talk To That Kitty!0 -
Raideen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭paulsimonps wrote: »Mounts, daily random rewards as well as Trial weekly coffers should reset daily and weekly. This 20h and 168h BS is just annoying. Make it more convenient for everyone if it was just reset daily with the writs, pledges and leaderboards. Its a PitA trying to keep your coffers straight on all of your toons and for those that do our mounts on a specific time of day to keep it straight, missing it by a few hours can make you miss the next day completely if you want to get back on track. The timers are unnecessary get rid of them.
Thank you, someone gets it.
The problem with the CD being attached to the character and not the day is that you have to reschedule real life events around the character CD, where as you do not have to reschedule real life events around the day cd.
Or maybe you can just not be so ornery about it?
I was not being ornery. My OP was an actual question. In fact, I don't see how you read "bad tempered" into the original post.
I suggest in the future when you read a post by me, you read it with the "they are being sincere" voice inside your head, because that is the most likely case.
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Raideen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭LonePirate wrote: »For those having trouble here, once every 24 hours means you can perform the action 7 times a week. If it has a 20 hour cool down, then you can perform the action 8 times a week since there are 168 hours in a week. It's up to you.
That was covered in my OP.
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badmojo✭✭✭✭✭
✭Your response to me bringing up the point about doing dailies back to back at reset time was mostly ignored. You simply cited that other dailies are already abused in the same way. That seemed like you ignoring a flaw because you want that system.
Why is this a flaw though? Most of the people who legit are concerned over daily quests/dungeons/whatever do indeed play daily(because otherwise it's a non-issue - everything will have long reset if you don't play for 24+ hours). So even if we do run 2 dungeons back to back for max xp - why not? That means we did not run a random in ~23 hours before that and will not run another in ~23 hours after. Still only 2 dungeons in 2 days. Anyone else who cannot log in at the time of the reset will simply log in at their preferred time and do the (now reset) dungeon then without missing anything.
With the current system...gods forbid our schedule changes even for a day. For example I ran the first set of randoms this event late at night(my time) because I was busy til then that day - but the next day I, on the contrary, had time before that and would rather do them during the day and go to bed earlier but I had to stay up if I wanted my dailies. Now I'm basically stuck staying up late to run dungeons if I want all the rewards. It's really a rather lame system. I don't know why they'd implement it, only thing that comes to mind is so people would be able to run less dungeons(since schedule changes inevitably happen and you end up missing your daily random), but why? It's not like a random dungeon gives you some op tremendous advantage that would be too much to bear if you 100% got it every day. Sure the XP is nice but not THAT nice.
I will say I dont have a vested interest in keeping this system I am simply stating why I believe ZOS went with it.
It boils down to keeping the players playing the game more. If a player logs in to do a daily and sees that the cooldown isnt done, they might decide to do something else until it is. With reset times you know with 100% certainty exactly when you need to log in for the daily, so you are never in a situation where you might need to kill some time. Why is getting players into the game and making them wait desirable for ZOS? Because bored players might check out the ctown store, they might decide to buy some crates and try their luck, or they might simply chat in zone or guild chat, perhaps even helping new players to the game, new players who might go on to sub and make purchases. More players in-game means more money for ZOS.
From my perspective a reset timer would enable players to spend as little time possible in-game while reaping the daily rewards. As a player that sounds nice, but this game wasnt designed by players.[DC/NA]0 -
Raideen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Your response to me bringing up the point about doing dailies back to back at reset time was mostly ignored. You simply cited that other dailies are already abused in the same way. That seemed like you ignoring a flaw because you want that system.
Why is this a flaw though? Most of the people who legit are concerned over daily quests/dungeons/whatever do indeed play daily(because otherwise it's a non-issue - everything will have long reset if you don't play for 24+ hours). So even if we do run 2 dungeons back to back for max xp - why not? That means we did not run a random in ~23 hours before that and will not run another in ~23 hours after. Still only 2 dungeons in 2 days. Anyone else who cannot log in at the time of the reset will simply log in at their preferred time and do the (now reset) dungeon then without missing anything.
With the current system...gods forbid our schedule changes even for a day. For example I ran the first set of randoms this event late at night(my time) because I was busy til then that day - but the next day I, on the contrary, had time before that and would rather do them during the day and go to bed earlier but I had to stay up if I wanted my dailies. Now I'm basically stuck staying up late to run dungeons if I want all the rewards. It's really a rather lame system. I don't know why they'd implement it, only thing that comes to mind is so people would be able to run less dungeons(since schedule changes inevitably happen and you end up missing your daily random), but why? It's not like a random dungeon gives you some op tremendous advantage that would be too much to bear if you 100% got it every day. Sure the XP is nice but not THAT nice.
I will say I dont have a vested interest in keeping this system I am simply stating why I believe ZOS went with it.
It boils down to keeping the players playing the game more. If a player logs in to do a daily and sees that the cooldown isnt done, they might decide to do something else until it is. With reset times you know with 100% certainty exactly when you need to log in for the daily, so you are never in a situation where you might need to kill some time. Why is getting players into the game and making them wait desirable for ZOS? Because bored players might check out the ctown store, they might decide to buy some crates and try their luck, or they might simply chat in zone or guild chat, perhaps even helping new players to the game, new players who might go on to sub and make purchases. More players in-game means more money for ZOS.
From my perspective a reset timer would enable players to spend as little time possible in-game while reaping the daily rewards. As a player that sounds nice, but this game wasnt designed by players.
I understand what you are saying, but the scenario can just as easily be reversed so that the personal timer actually interrupts you playing ESO.
Lets say I run a dungeon in the evening and this is my daily goal (like this event). I see no reason to log early in the day because I know the most likely the reset is not off CD. So, I go play something else instead. The problem with that is the other game now has your attention and you may or may not log off to come back into ESO.
If your assertion that ZOS designed the personal CD timer for the reason you listed is true, then their decision is extremely short sighted because the systems does not work in favor for the average daily lifestyle of the target audience.
Another way to look at this is that if the personal 20 hour CD was a brainstorm of an idea, other game companies would have already employed this tactic long ago, but this is the first I have come across it and so far all it has done is interrupted game play.
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Linaleah✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Your response to me bringing up the point about doing dailies back to back at reset time was mostly ignored. You simply cited that other dailies are already abused in the same way. That seemed like you ignoring a flaw because you want that system.
Why is this a flaw though? Most of the people who legit are concerned over daily quests/dungeons/whatever do indeed play daily(because otherwise it's a non-issue - everything will have long reset if you don't play for 24+ hours). So even if we do run 2 dungeons back to back for max xp - why not? That means we did not run a random in ~23 hours before that and will not run another in ~23 hours after. Still only 2 dungeons in 2 days. Anyone else who cannot log in at the time of the reset will simply log in at their preferred time and do the (now reset) dungeon then without missing anything.
With the current system...gods forbid our schedule changes even for a day. For example I ran the first set of randoms this event late at night(my time) because I was busy til then that day - but the next day I, on the contrary, had time before that and would rather do them during the day and go to bed earlier but I had to stay up if I wanted my dailies. Now I'm basically stuck staying up late to run dungeons if I want all the rewards. It's really a rather lame system. I don't know why they'd implement it, only thing that comes to mind is so people would be able to run less dungeons(since schedule changes inevitably happen and you end up missing your daily random), but why? It's not like a random dungeon gives you some op tremendous advantage that would be too much to bear if you 100% got it every day. Sure the XP is nice but not THAT nice.
I will say I dont have a vested interest in keeping this system I am simply stating why I believe ZOS went with it.
It boils down to keeping the players playing the game more. If a player logs in to do a daily and sees that the cooldown isnt done, they might decide to do something else until it is. With reset times you know with 100% certainty exactly when you need to log in for the daily, so you are never in a situation where you might need to kill some time. Why is getting players into the game and making them wait desirable for ZOS? Because bored players might check out the ctown store, they might decide to buy some crates and try their luck, or they might simply chat in zone or guild chat, perhaps even helping new players to the game, new players who might go on to sub and make purchases. More players in-game means more money for ZOS.
From my perspective a reset timer would enable players to spend as little time possible in-game while reaping the daily rewards. As a player that sounds nice, but this game wasnt designed by players.
I understand what you are saying, but the scenario can just as easily be reversed so that the personal timer actually interrupts you playing ESO.
Lets say I run a dungeon in the evening and this is my daily goal (like this event). I see no reason to log early in the day because I know the most likely the reset is not off CD. So, I go play something else instead. The problem with that is the other game now has your attention and you may or may not log off to come back into ESO.
If your assertion that ZOS designed the personal CD timer for the reason you listed is true, then their decision is extremely short sighted because the systems does not work in favor for the average daily lifestyle of the target audience.
Another way to look at this is that if the personal 20 hour CD was a brainstorm of an idea, other game companies would have already employed this tactic long ago, but this is the first I have come across it and so far all it has done is interrupted game play.
this. so much this.
if I want to do something in game, I will do it. if the game is telling me that my cooldown is not up yet, I'll log out and do something else.
"tricking" people into staying around longer with this cooldown is counter intuitive. its more likely to push them away.
and couple that with the fact that regular daily cooldowns DO in fact exists and that the only reason people are only just now starting to really notice the random dungeon mess becasue most people don't actualy run random dungeons, they either run specific pledges, or nothing at all... makes this choice to add a cooldown more of an archaic left over from the original horse leveling design which btw? is just as terrible.dirty worthless casual.
Lois McMaster Bujold "A Civil Campaign"Reputation is what other people know about you. Honor is what you know about yourself. Guard your honor. Let your reputation fall where it will. And outlive the ***1 -
Danikat✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I assume they do it this way to try and avoid the problem Guild Wars 2 has. Their daily reset is at midnight UTC, which is basically GMT. Nice and convenient for everyone to remember.
But not at all convenient if you're in the Americas, because that puts the reset at 4-7pm (depending on time zone) - right at peak time. Which means anyone wanting to do the daily stuff either has to rush to finish it or wait until after the reset. Either way it means they have to schedule their play time around the game instead of when it's convenient for them.
Whereas a 20 hour reset, for someone who works (and therefore probably sleeps and does other things) at the same time each day is, most of the time, exactly the same as a daily reset, except it puts the reset time a few hours before they start playing, no matter where they are in the world. It's only a problem on weekends, other days off and if you work an irregular schedule.
Now the usual answer to the inconvenient daily reset time is usually "so change it to X time when it will only affect [place/people I imagine don't play this game and/or don't care about]" but that's still going to be inconvenient for some people, and it's still going to include everyone who works irregular hours or is outside of their normal schedule for whatever reason.
It's one of those situations where you're never going to find a system that works for everyone, so developers just have to pick a system and accept that some people are going to be inconvenienced by it. Which considering time gating is literally there to make something less convenient anyway I suspect they see as a minor problem.PC EU player | She/her/hers | PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!
"Remember in this game we call life that no one said it's fair"0 -
Sibenice✭✭✭✭
Which AM? Yours? ZOSs? The servers? My cousins half-sister in Germany?vs a fixed reset time in the AM
Doing a reset every 20 hours after the last time you did a dungeon requires no timezone conversion, it's straight math.
Finding your local timezone requires reading your computers timezone settings (which could be wrong) or Lat/Lng if available (best option) or IP based geo-location (may get you close).
That's a lot of extra overhead just to find your personal AM ...
Which would be fine if it were my personal AM. But mine resets in the middle of peak hours in the evening.0
