The answer is the Steed. Definitely the Steed. Everybody should be using the Steed.

@casparian and @Lexxypwns always appreciate your feedback. once I get home I am gonna swap to apprentice to see how it is doing. Thanks !

Apprentice

Apprentice, and because I've seen you use Refreshing path before I would suggest Juli over war maiden

Hollery wrote: »

Apprentice, and because I've seen you use Refreshing path before I would suggest Juli over war maiden

refreshing was replaced with shade ions ago. but shade has been acting strange recently.

Maulkin wrote: »

I definitely don't classify as an experienced NB but as with all magicka builds, I'm really confused why anyone would pick something other than Mage mundus.

- More dommage
- More healing
- More sustain
- More shields

Nothing trumps it.

Serpent ftw!

Maulkin wrote: »

Lexxypwns wrote: »

Maulkin wrote: »

I definitely don't classify as an experienced NB but as with all magicka builds, I'm really confused why anyone would pick something other than Mage mundus.

- More dommage
- More healing
- More sustain
- More shields

Nothing trumps it.

mage adds 2028 base magika
apprentice adds 238 base spell damage

By the time we consider max magika buffs vs major/minor sorcery its not even close. Apprentice is going to be more damage and healing. He's already running lich so the sustain is irrelevant and he doesn't run harness so he doesn't get larger shields from mage.

I don't know how he plays, but Mage also buffs Healing Ward. He don't run that either?

NB has no access to minor sorcery, if I'm not mistaken. Unless there’s a Templar in the group. Major Sorcery is definitely inferior to the combined max mag bonuses of Altmer, Siphoning tree and CPs if you have all these at your disposal.

Plenty of mageblades playing with Necropotence and Shackle and stacking near 50k max magicka for huge damage and large shields.

Healing Ward also scales off Spell Damage, though...

@Maulkin it isn't a DW bomber setup, it's good old destro resto. Here is the build more or less fully buffed (no Continuous).

That particular setup requires spell pots, but you could trade inner light on the back bar for Degeneration in order to get tri-pots back, and you would still be at 53k magicka on front bar.

I'm not sure why we're seeing different numbers.

casparian wrote: »

@Maulkin it isn't a DW bomber setup, it's good old destro resto. Here is the build more or less fully buffed (no Continuous).

That particular setup requires spell pots, but you could trade inner light on the back bar for Degeneration in order to get tri-pots back, and you would still be at 53k magicka on front bar.

I'm not sure why we're seeing different numbers.

Missing undaunted maybe?

casparian wrote: »

@Maulkin it isn't a DW bomber setup, it's good old destro resto. Here is the build more or less fully buffed (no Continuous).

That particular setup requires spell pots, but you could trade inner light on the back bar for Degeneration in order to get tri-pots back, and you would still be at 53k magicka on front bar.

I'm not sure why we're seeing different numbers.

Do these numbers match your in-game numbers?

We have almost identical bars, only I have Dampen Magic and Cloak in place of Magelight and Siphoning Attacks. At a quick glance the difference in Magicka is from attribute allocation (I run 54-10 in Mag/HP) and the fact I run tristat on chest and and legs instead of magicka enchants.Also Magelight.

Regarding the Spell Damage, I didn't take the infused weapon damage enchant into consideration, or major sorcery. Those numbers I posted were a quick run from Mundus to Mundus, to illustrate how the numbers change, in game.

Anyhow, my real question is how do you survive without Cloak and without a damage shield in 5 light? What do you do when you get pressured? I know you'll say Shadow Image, but in BGs that doesn't take you very far usually. Not out of the spotlight at least, unless you can cloak afterwards. 21k hp in Light as Vamp in PvP can go in one CC/Burst combo. One Dizzy -> Shalks -> Dawnbreaker combo and it's lights out.

Admittedly, I only recently started playing mageblade and I am primarily a Sorc player. Which means my playstyle is still pretty much front-tanking damage with a big shield till I set up my burst. Which is why I used the disclaimer that I don't classify as an experienced mageblade.

Minno wrote: »

casparian wrote: »

@Maulkin it isn't a DW bomber setup, it's good old destro resto. Here is the build more or less fully buffed (no Continuous).

That particular setup requires spell pots, but you could trade inner light on the back bar for Degeneration in order to get tri-pots back, and you would still be at 53k magicka on front bar.

I'm not sure why we're seeing different numbers.

Missing undaunted maybe?

I got those too.

Maulkin wrote: »

casparian wrote: »

@Maulkin it isn't a DW bomber setup, it's good old destro resto. Here is the build more or less fully buffed (no Continuous).

That particular setup requires spell pots, but you could trade inner light on the back bar for Degeneration in order to get tri-pots back, and you would still be at 53k magicka on front bar.

I'm not sure why we're seeing different numbers.

Do these numbers match your in-game numbers?

We have almost identical bars, only I have Dampen Magic and Cloak in place of Magelight and Siphoning Attacks. At a quick glance the difference in Magicka is from attribute allocation (I run 54-10 in Mag/HP) and the fact I run tristat on chest and and legs instead of magicka enchants.Also Magelight.

Regarding the Spell Damage, I didn't take the infused weapon damage enchant into consideration, or major sorcery. Those numbers I posted were a quick run from Mundus to Mundus, to illustrate how the numbers change, in game.

Anyhow, my real question is how do you survive without Cloak and without a damage shield in 5 light? What do you do when you get pressured? I know you'll say Shadow Image, but in BGs that doesn't take you very far usually. Not out of the spotlight at least, unless you can cloak afterwards. 21k hp in Light as Vamp in PvP can go in one CC/Burst combo. One Dizzy -> Shalks -> Dawnbreaker combo and it's lights out.

Admittedly, I only recently started playing mageblade and I am primarily a Sorc player. Which means my playstyle is still pretty much front-tanking damage with a big shield till I set up my burst. Which is why I used the disclaimer that I don't classify as an experienced mageblade.

My in-game numbers are a bit lower than this because not all of my gear is gold yet -- I made that build in UESP in order to see how much of an improvement buying gold Necro jewelry and golding out a couple more Shackle pieces would be. And I just noticed that the build I linked has max mag enchants on chest and head, but in game I'm using Prismatics there. So my hp is more like 22k and my magicka is a little lower. But it's still comfortably above 50k.

Yeah, Shadow Image is a lifesaver. I don't play BGs or care much about them, so I have no idea how this would fare there. Shadow Image is a reactive defense, though -- I have to plan out my fights in advance in order for it to work. But that's true of good magblade play in general, in my experience.

The thing you have on your magblade that you didn't have on your sorc is that juicy Swallow hot. You don't have to tank so much on your shield because your main HOT is so strong that it counts as a source of mitigation in its own right.

I do sometimes run Cloak instead of Double Take -- that's really a flex spot. I don't really need a damage shield in 1v1 or 1v2 fights. But I can often survive just fine without Cloak. Shadow Image not only gets me out of bad stuff I don't want to stand in, it gives me enough time and distance to cast a Ward and get off one or two healing ticks from Swallow before I'm under attack again. (Or at least it used to do that before it got bugged this week.) The main thing I miss from Cloak is that sweet DOT supression. But I do find that abandoning Cloak does wonders for my sustain.

If I am being focused by more than 2 players then I struggle a lot more, and in some cases then it's worth putting Dampen in the flex spot -- it will definitely make you feel tankier. But even when 1v3+, a properly timed Healing Ward into resto ult will give you plenty of breathing room to take down a player or two while feeling more or less invulnerable.

Edit: the one thing I like about Dampen Magic is that it does what it says on the tin. I love magblade and still consider it my main class, but my three main defenses -- Ward, Cloak, and Image -- are all currently bugged, so that I can never actually know whether Ward will heal me, Cloak will hide me, or Image will teleport me. Dampen is worse than any of those three, but it just works.

Derra wrote: »

Lexxypwns wrote: »

Maulkin wrote: »

I definitely don't classify as an experienced NB but as with all magicka builds, I'm really confused why anyone would pick something other than Mage mundus.

- More dommage
- More healing
- More sustain
- More shields

Nothing trumps it.

mage adds 2028 base magika
apprentice adds 238 base spell damage

By the time we consider max magika buffs vs major/minor sorcery its not even close. Apprentice is going to be more damage and healing. He's already running lich so the sustain is irrelevant and he doesn't run harness so he doesn't get larger shields from mage.

Most builds get atleast 36% of increase max magica.
On nb it´s usually between 37% and 44% minimum.
When you add magelight/entropy it´s not as wide of a difference as you´re making it out to be (especially when considering some builds do not run major sorcery or only aquire it from potions and do not have 100% uptime).

Also OP does not state he´s not using harness/dampen (which could very much be a possibility in the metioned min 5p lightarmor setup).

Unless divine pieces are used difference between mage and apprentice mundus is usually less than 1% in CP environment on 5 1 1 builds with a magica race.
For someone who does not know the barsetup of OP but only the sets used it´s correct to point out that given the incomplete information mage is the best possible choice when looking at offence, defence and sustain.

I do not use harness/dampen. they knew it cuz they know my play style. They also know my bar set up. although its my bad I should have stated it initially. We talk in forums so much that I assumed every one know what skills I am running. my bad.. haha

Front bar: Swallow Soul, clench / fear, mark / degeneration. leeching strikes, Merciless Resolve Ult: Soul Harvest
Back bar: Impale, shade, crippling, cloak/mutagen/refreshing path, Healing Ward Ult: Lights Champion.