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Is Miats Add-On Cheating to you?
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DDuke✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭YESDocFrost72 wrote: »Avran_Sylt wrote: »The edge-cases present with the cast-timer part of his addon I consider an unfair advantage due to the ability to instantly react against another player via information not present in the basic UI in any manner.
The rest of the addon, and there is a lot more to this addon than just the cast-timer, are fine in my opinion. Given that these reactions are not quite so instantaneous. (Keep alerts, etc. all require travel time)
Don't blanket his entire addon as a cheat.
^^^
As it stands, it tells the user when someone presses their frags/snipe as an example, even if they are stealthed, combat has not started, and the ability isn't yet cast. That is not possible in the base game- the addon allows you to react faster to events a regular player playing vanilla cannot. This specific function is absolutely cheating in my opinion.
Rest of the addon is great, and a shame I'll never get to DL it.
Turn your music up. as SOON as the combat music starts, you're in combat. There. I just did the same thing Miat's does...I'm willing to bet everyone that's [snip] about this add-on doesn't listen to the in-game music.
As far as the casting timer. The default UI DOES show this. You ever see the red sparkly lines around a player, guess what, they casting/channeling something.
And if you can't see the player as they're behind an obstacle, out of your camera angle or simply invisible, in stealth?
Listening to when the combat music begins works for the first time someone tries to attack you (and if you're not in combat already), but that's it. It also doesn't tell you if your opponent canceled the cast, or the exact moment that projectile is in the air. It's basicly how actual competent players used to avoid ganks in the middle of nowhere back in the days before Miat's existed.Edited by ZOS_KatP on February 28, 2018 3:40PM2 -
jaws343✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭YESDocFrost72 wrote: »Avran_Sylt wrote: »The edge-cases present with the cast-timer part of his addon I consider an unfair advantage due to the ability to instantly react against another player via information not present in the basic UI in any manner.
The rest of the addon, and there is a lot more to this addon than just the cast-timer, are fine in my opinion. Given that these reactions are not quite so instantaneous. (Keep alerts, etc. all require travel time)
Don't blanket his entire addon as a cheat.
^^^
As it stands, it tells the user when someone presses their frags/snipe as an example, even if they are stealthed, combat has not started, and the ability isn't yet cast. That is not possible in the base game- the addon allows you to react faster to events a regular player playing vanilla cannot. This specific function is absolutely cheating in my opinion.
Rest of the addon is great, and a shame I'll never get to DL it.
Turn your music up. as SOON as the combat music starts, you're in combat. There. I just did the same thing Miat's does...I'm willing to bet everyone that's [snip] about this add-on doesn't listen to the in-game music.
As far as the casting timer. The default UI DOES show this. You ever SEE the red sparkly lines around a player, guess what, they casting/channeling something.
Unless that player is out of your line of sight. Or you are taking on multiple players and don't see the cast time ability being charged by one. Your argument actually supports the removal of this feature in the add-on with the use of a key word: SEE. If you are unable to see the casting opponent, whether they are in stealth, behind you, or you just miss the animation, you shouldn't be allowed a cheating crutch to avoid the ability to make up for a lack of skill or an oversight.Edited by ZOS_KatP on February 28, 2018 3:40PM2 -
KRBMMO✭✭✭✭YESYes - but I also think keyboard macros are cheating, but accepted my Zenimax. They both replace actual skill and muscle speed with an automated program. They don't actually have to pay attention to their environment - a big signal flashes on their screen and with a little more programming actually executes the dodge roll, block, or shield for them ...
Oh, is it against the TOS to mention that little bit at the end?0 -
PlagueSD✭✭✭✭✭
✭NODocFrost72 wrote: »Avran_Sylt wrote: »The edge-cases present with the cast-timer part of his addon I consider an unfair advantage due to the ability to instantly react against another player via information not present in the basic UI in any manner.
The rest of the addon, and there is a lot more to this addon than just the cast-timer, are fine in my opinion. Given that these reactions are not quite so instantaneous. (Keep alerts, etc. all require travel time)
Don't blanket his entire addon as a cheat.
^^^
As it stands, it tells the user when someone presses their frags/snipe as an example, even if they are stealthed, combat has not started, and the ability isn't yet cast. That is not possible in the base game- the addon allows you to react faster to events a regular player playing vanilla cannot. This specific function is absolutely cheating in my opinion.
Rest of the addon is great, and a shame I'll never get to DL it.
Turn your music up. as SOON as the combat music starts, you're in combat. There. I just did the same thing Miat's does...I'm willing to bet everyone that's [snip] about this add-on doesn't listen to the in-game music.
As far as the casting timer. The default UI DOES show this. You ever SEE the red sparkly lines around a player, guess what, they casting/channeling something.
Unless that player is out of your line of sight. Or you are taking on multiple players and don't see the cast time ability being charged by one. Your argument actually supports the removal of this feature in the add-on with the use of a key word: SEE. If you are unable to see the casting opponent, whether they are in stealth, behind you, or you just miss the animation, you shouldn't be allowed a cheating crutch to avoid the ability to make up for a lack of skill or an oversight.
Well, If ZoS provides the API, it's fair game. They can always remove it in a future patch. What's that saying? "When in Rome, do as the Romans do." If you want an addon free gaming experience, there's Xbox and Playstation.Edited by ZOS_KatP on February 28, 2018 3:41PM2 -
Enslaved✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭YESI like using addons. I find them very useful for various things. But there has to be a line somewhere. Any combat addon that gives you info you should not have at that point (attack from stealth, attack from behind, attack via skills that requires cast time etc) is cheating.0 -
Demion✭✭✭YESIt is, but I dont blame Miats for making it or any other modder for that matter, the blood of innocents is on ZOS hands
And so is most Mods that allows you to get information that's is normally not available in core gameEdited by Demion on October 18, 2017 6:49AM@darksenechal - EU PC - Demion Samenel - Templar "The Reluctant Hero of Tamriel"0 -
GrigorijMalahevich✭✭✭✭✭YESMiat's does give you the edge vs players not using it... but mate "mechanics how nighttblade COMBATS their enemies" - is just stupid. There is no combat in bursting someone from stealth... It actually makes the "combat" fair and gives your enemy a chance to fight back...PC/EU 800 CP.
PvP MagSorc.Pedro Gonzales - Mag Sorc EP vMA Flawless Conqueror clear http://imgur.com/a/CB6j6
Valera Progib - Stam Sorc DC vMA Flawless Conqueror clear https://i.imgur.com/eYgpXG2.png
Valera Pozhar - Mag DK EP vMA Flawless Conqueror clear http://imgur.com/a/jrsuK
Valera Podlechi - Mag Templar AD vMA Flawless Conqueror clear http://imgur.com/a/N0BYq1 -
Drummerx04✭✭✭✭✭
✭YESTo be clear, I think the API should not provide information that an attack is incoming. Reporting that something HAS hit you and what exactly it was would be fine.
As some have noted there are plenty of base game notifications that some attacks are incoming. Your character randomly slows down when someone is using a gap closer, you can hear loud whooshing sounds when a dark flare is incoming, you can usually hear snipes.
That should be enough.PC/NA - Nightfighters, Raid Leader and Officer
Lilith Arujo - DC sorc tank/dps/healer - Dro-m'Athra Destroyer, Gryphon Heart, Grand Warlord
Lilith Tortorici - DC templar trials healer
Notable Completions:
vAS (72k), vMoL HM (160k), vAA HM (135k), vHRC HM, vSO HM (141k), vHoF HM (168k), vCR+3(129k), vDSA 45k, vMA 591k
Original Addons:
Lilith's Group Manager
Lilith's Lazy Hacks - Auto Recharge/Repair
Bot Scanner 2000
Lilith's Command History
Maintained Addons:
Kill Counter1 -
red_emu✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭NONo - a good gankblade will usually be much quicker than the Miat's Add-On can register.
Besides, with the lag in PvP you don't even need stealth to gank. The amount of times in Cyrodiil I ride to help my alliance and all of a sudden I'm dead with death re-cap showing 5 long wind up skills in a row is incredible.
Maybe for some Miat's add-on is a way to combat lag and game not registering that someone has been killing you for the past 30 minutes with light attacks?
PC - EU:
Falathren Noctis - AD MagNecro
Falathren - AD StamSorc
Falathren Eryndaer - AD StamDen
Falathren Irimion - AD MagPlar
Talagan Falathren - AD StamDK
Falathren Infernis - AD MagDK
Your-Ex - AD MagBlade5 -
soll✭✭✭NOI'm actually surprised with results. so many cry onesEU PC
I like to heal
Triggered Tryhards/ HighRisk
EP – Sollencia
AD – Sollencia Overdoseandreasranasen wrote: »When you've invested time and money into a company, you have the right to be upset over changes that will negatively affect your experience and gameplay.3 -
Turelus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭YESYes, however I have stated in the past that most add-ons offer an unfair advantage of some kind.
HUDs which show keeps status, add-ons which print flag status to chat, add-ons which show you enemies class, add-ons which track buffs/debuffs, add-ons which mark node locations, add-ons which auto craft for you, add-ons which tell you when boss mechanics happen etc.
The whole add-on system from launch has been a requirement to be competitive. It's one thing console players are lucky they don't have to deal with.@Turelus - EU PC Megaserver
"Don't count on others for help. In the end each of us is in this alone. The survivors are those who know how to look out for themselves."2 -
Juhasow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭NOGrow up people. If Miat is cheating then any add on is cheating. I would go even further and say that if Miat is cheating then any playstyle or build in the game that gives adventage to user is cheating. Miat is not cheating but it's definietly development oversight.4 -
Enslaved✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭YESGrow up people. If Miat is cheating then any add on is cheating. I would go even further and say that if Miat is cheating then any playstyle or build in the game that gives adventage to user is cheating. Miat is not cheating but it's definietly development oversight.
So, you say that addon that tracks crafting is cheating?
Maybe addon that tracks what daily quests you did?
Or addon that shows you what recipes you know on your characters?
You clearly have no idea what you are talking about. Similar to miat I guess.2 -
Juhasow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭NOGrow up people. If Miat is cheating then any add on is cheating. I would go even further and say that if Miat is cheating then any playstyle or build in the game that gives adventage to user is cheating. Miat is not cheating but it's definietly development oversight.
So, you say that addon that tracks crafting is cheating?
Maybe addon that tracks what daily quests you did?
Or addon that shows you what recipes you know on your characters?
You clearly have no idea what you are talking about. Similar to miat I guess.
Every add-on is using data from same source provided by development and allowed to use to create add-ons. At the end add-ons are using same data but serve different purpose so why 1 purpose is cheating and 2nd isnt if both are based on same legit source ? If You call one add-on a cheat then basicly You call every add-on a cheat.
Simple as that.4 -
Enslaved✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭YESGrow up people. If Miat is cheating then any add on is cheating. I would go even further and say that if Miat is cheating then any playstyle or build in the game that gives adventage to user is cheating. Miat is not cheating but it's definietly development oversight.
So, you say that addon that tracks crafting is cheating?
Maybe addon that tracks what daily quests you did?
Or addon that shows you what recipes you know on your characters?
You clearly have no idea what you are talking about. Similar to miat I guess.
Every add-on is using data from same source provided by development and allowed to use to create add-ons. At the end add-ons are using same data but serve different purpose so why 1 purpose is cheating and 2nd isnt if both are based on same legit source ? If You call one add-on a cheat then basicly You call every add-on a cheat.
Simple as that.
This logic is brilliant. Same as it would be calling every single German ***, because of WW2, or calling every single Albanian holy, because of Mother Teresa.0 -
Pele✭✭✭✭✭Never heard of this addon until now. Looked it up. Wow. That's some very creative use of the API.
Anyone using that has a clear advantage over those who don't. But since all PC users have free access to this addon, and it's obviously fine with ZOS, I can't say it's a cheat.
Personally, I wouldn't use it because it'd make me stupid (lower my situational awareness). But if there are those who need this to play competently then meh.0 -
Narvuntien✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭YESIts "cheating" but I am not negative about players that use it they are just doing whatever they can to win. It is Zos job to stop it. Preferably just turning off add ons for PVP so we don't have to play "where is the line" games.3 -
Jade1986✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭YESThannazzar wrote: »Nope, anything which cripples stealth bombers and gankers is a feature rather than an exploit.
Don't like it then strap on some heavy armor and fight like a warrior not a skulking coward!
Bombers arent effected by this, please try again. Also, I would rather fight like an intelligent rogue than a half bred walnut brained brute. If you want to take that route.Edited by Jade1986 on October 18, 2017 10:21AM2 -
Sheezabeast✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭YESSheezabeast wrote: »Yes but my opinion doesn't mean crap because Zos said they approve of it.
No they didnt. They never officially said that, and they have recently stated they are looking back into it.
I didn't know that, I just saw the post they made addressing it. Thanks for the info Grand Master Crafter, Beta baby who grew with the game. PC/NA. @Sheezabeast if you have crafting needs!0 -
Jade1986✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭YESAutumnhart wrote: »This addon has been around for quite a while now, at what point will the death of stealth PVP people keep foretelling happen? My cloakblades are doing fine.
Edited for gratuitous insult.
Oh for the love of sanguine, this addon and addons like it do not effect stealth classes that do not use charge up abilities. It efects ALL ranged classes that use charge up attacks. That is the problem, try playing a ranger, see how you feel then.2 -
Malmai✭✭✭✭✭
✭YESNever heard of this addon until now. Looked it up. Wow. That's some very creative use of the API.
Anyone using that has a clear advantage over those who don't. But since all PC users have free access to this addon, and it's obviously fine with ZOS, I can't say it's a cheat.
Personally, I wouldn't use it because it'd make me stupid (lower my situational awareness). But if there are those who need this to play competently then meh.
Than let all also use CE its free and all can use it on pc...2 -
Jade1986✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭YESDocFrost72 wrote: »Avran_Sylt wrote: »The edge-cases present with the cast-timer part of his addon I consider an unfair advantage due to the ability to instantly react against another player via information not present in the basic UI in any manner.
The rest of the addon, and there is a lot more to this addon than just the cast-timer, are fine in my opinion. Given that these reactions are not quite so instantaneous. (Keep alerts, etc. all require travel time)
Don't blanket his entire addon as a cheat.
^^^
As it stands, it tells the user when someone presses their frags/snipe as an example, even if they are stealthed, combat has not started, and the ability isn't yet cast. That is not possible in the base game- the addon allows you to react faster to events a regular player playing vanilla cannot. This specific function is absolutely cheating in my opinion.
Rest of the addon is great, and a shame I'll never get to DL it.
Turn your music up. as SOON as the combat music starts, you're in combat. There. I just did the same thing Miat's does...I'm willing to bet everyone that's [snip] about this add-on doesn't listen to the in-game music.
As far as the casting timer. The default UI DOES show this. You ever see the red sparkly lines around a player, guess what, they casting/channeling something.
Except unless you are professor X you cant see that when you are not paying attention to the player doing that. But please, continue defending your need for a crutch which most reasonable and respectable people find cheating.Edited by ZOS_KatP on February 28, 2018 3:40PM0 -
Jade1986✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭YESDocFrost72 wrote: »Avran_Sylt wrote: »The edge-cases present with the cast-timer part of his addon I consider an unfair advantage due to the ability to instantly react against another player via information not present in the basic UI in any manner.
The rest of the addon, and there is a lot more to this addon than just the cast-timer, are fine in my opinion. Given that these reactions are not quite so instantaneous. (Keep alerts, etc. all require travel time)
Don't blanket his entire addon as a cheat.
^^^
As it stands, it tells the user when someone presses their frags/snipe as an example, even if they are stealthed, combat has not started, and the ability isn't yet cast. That is not possible in the base game- the addon allows you to react faster to events a regular player playing vanilla cannot. This specific function is absolutely cheating in my opinion.
Rest of the addon is great, and a shame I'll never get to DL it.
Turn your music up. as SOON as the combat music starts, you're in combat. There. I just did the same thing Miat's does...I'm willing to bet everyone that's [snip] about this add-on doesn't listen to the in-game music.
As far as the casting timer. The default UI DOES show this. You ever SEE the red sparkly lines around a player, guess what, they casting/channeling something.
Unless that player is out of your line of sight. Or you are taking on multiple players and don't see the cast time ability being charged by one. Your argument actually supports the removal of this feature in the add-on with the use of a key word: SEE. If you are unable to see the casting opponent, whether they are in stealth, behind you, or you just miss the animation, you shouldn't be allowed a cheating crutch to avoid the ability to make up for a lack of skill or an oversight.
Well, If ZoS provides the API, it's fair game. They can always remove it in a future patch. What's that saying? "When in Rome, do as the Romans do." If you want an addon free gaming experience, there's Xbox and Playstation.
Exploits such as the double mundus were also around and were cheating, and it took zos time to deal with it, but by your logic, it wasnt exploiting and cheating? Good thing zos said they are looking back into it.Edited by ZOS_KatP on February 28, 2018 3:41PM0
This discussion has been closed.