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Lets finally talk about Asylum two hander.
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Juhasow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Joy_Division wrote: »
Mr smart here. L2ContextIt is PVP weapon first and foremost. It would be much worse if there was bigger difference between perfect and imperfect. No weapon with high impact in PVP should be hidden behind content 99.99999% of PVP players (well, it will be 99% for pve too) will never finish.
That goes for the destro staff too. They way they changed it made imperfect much worse than perfect.
Worst explanation ever. It's like saying "I am PvP player I am weak in PvE yet I need something from it so it have to be easy obtainable". Non perfected version is too strong for easiness of obtaining it. PvP players should be smarter afer seeing how making Viper easy to obtain changed PvP into proctard yard and destroyed enjoyment from PvP for few months. If something really strong becomes too easy to obtain it ends up in 2 ways : PvP ballance is destroyed and people compian about it or things that are strong are nerfed to the ground because everyone can have them in 1 day.
I dont have problem this weapon will be strong tbh Perfetced version should be as reward for huge effort of players but making non perfected version almost same strong as perfected one is step in a bad direction. Stam Nb's will be able to spam incaps like crazy and stam dk's with maesltorm s&b and asylum 2h will be even stonger then now despite shuffle and s&b ulti nerf. Non perfected version of 2h simply needs a nerf to around 10-12 ultimate points.
I never said it is not strong. All I am saying that no impactful PVP weapon should be hidden behind content few people will do or even be capable of doing.
Normal Trials are a joke in this game and with the new transmutation system, which pvpers get access to just from pvping, there is no farm, especially since the weapon will not be desirable for people concerned with DPS numbers on a test dummy.
That joke is something majority of PVP never done. The best procset in the game was trial drop and in a year people had chance to use it and abuse it I have never ever even saw it on my combat log. And this is not even discussion about normal trials. The perfected weapon are only in HM vet trial.
Simply put. Normal Trial is maximum (when it comes to group trials) PVP players should ever be forced to run for weapon with high impact in PVP. That is as objective as I can make it. Personally, no weapons impactful in PVP should be hidden behind endgame PVE content. PVP has its own features to separate capable PVPers from less than capable. Leaderboards and Emp. They could be better and there could be more if someone at ZoS cared obv.
If I go the extra mile, something many will disagree with, I think everything should be purchasable with gold. Gold is the only thing that connects PVP and PVE. Both group playing content they like and partaking in one economy.
Hmm I dont remember that PvP players were complaining that PvE players need to farm Ravager in PvP when it was BiS for stamina users. PvP community in this game is laughable and want everything without an effort. Best weapons in the game should cost You lot of time to get them.
Or you know - they just bought it.
Can they make it so i can buy my asylum weapons plox?
Yes those who had enough gold but You should remember how long it tooked back in a day to get enough gold to buy this things. It wasnt so easy like now. But yeah why not make perfected versions cost 50M gold and I am fine with that.Edited by Juhasow on October 8, 2017 8:44PM0 -
Juhasow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭It's no where near as OP as the staff.
Lets be honest, why would you nerf the non-perfected one, then the PVPers are just gunna QQ that they have to run trials/pve for some cool weapons. I'd be one of them as well tbh.
Compared to current state of Asylum destro and considering fact that Force Shock already have 20% chance to apply status effects 2h is much better especially if You compare Imperfected versions.Edited by Juhasow on October 8, 2017 8:46PM1 -
Juhasow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭arkansas_ESO wrote: »Joy_Division wrote: »
Mr smart here. L2ContextIt is PVP weapon first and foremost. It would be much worse if there was bigger difference between perfect and imperfect. No weapon with high impact in PVP should be hidden behind content 99.99999% of PVP players (well, it will be 99% for pve too) will never finish.
That goes for the destro staff too. They way they changed it made imperfect much worse than perfect.
Worst explanation ever. It's like saying "I am PvP player I am weak in PvE yet I need something from it so it have to be easy obtainable". Non perfected version is too strong for easiness of obtaining it. PvP players should be smarter afer seeing how making Viper easy to obtain changed PvP into proctard yard and destroyed enjoyment from PvP for few months. If something really strong becomes too easy to obtain it ends up in 2 ways : PvP ballance is destroyed and people compian about it or things that are strong are nerfed to the ground because everyone can have them in 1 day.
I dont have problem this weapon will be strong tbh Perfetced version should be as reward for huge effort of players but making non perfected version almost same strong as perfected one is step in a bad direction. Stam Nb's will be able to spam incaps like crazy and stam dk's with maesltorm s&b and asylum 2h will be even stonger then now despite shuffle and s&b ulti nerf. Non perfected version of 2h simply needs a nerf to around 10-12 ultimate points.
I never said it is not strong. All I am saying that no impactful PVP weapon should be hidden behind content few people will do or even be capable of doing.
Normal Trials are a joke in this game and with the new transmutation system, which pvpers get access to just from pvping, there is no farm, especially since the weapon will not be desirable for people concerned with DPS numbers on a test dummy.
That joke is something majority of PVP never done. The best procset in the game was trial drop and in a year people had chance to use it and abuse it I have never ever even saw it on my combat log. And this is not even discussion about normal trials. The perfected weapon are only in HM vet trial.
Simply put. Normal Trial is maximum (when it comes to group trials) PVP players should ever be forced to run for weapon with high impact in PVP. That is as objective as I can make it. Personally, no weapons impactful in PVP should be hidden behind endgame PVE content. PVP has its own features to separate capable PVPers from less than capable. Leaderboards and Emp. They could be better and there could be more if someone at ZoS cared obv.
If I go the extra mile, something many will disagree with, I think everything should be purchasable with gold. Gold is the only thing that connects PVP and PVE. Both group playing content they like and partaking in one economy.
Hmm I dont remember that PvP players were complaining that PvE players need to farm Ravager in PvP when it was BiS for stamina users. PvP community in this game is laughable and want everything without an effort. Best weapons in the game should cost You lot of time to get them.
You could just buy Ravager's from PVPers without ever having to step foot in Cyrodiil, though. That's not the same with Asylum weapons since they're BOP, not BOE.
Buying it costed You lot of effort to get gold for it. It was not so easy as it is now. People had to finish hardest content to get stuff they could sell.0 -
pieratsos✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭It is PVP weapon first and foremost. It would be much worse if there was bigger difference between perfect and imperfect. No weapon with high impact in PVP should be hidden behind content 99.99999% of PVP players (well, it will be 99% for pve too) will never finish.
That goes for the destro staff too. They way they changed it made imperfect much worse than perfect.
Worst explanation ever. It's like saying "I am PvP player I am weak in PvE yet I need something from it so it have to be easy obtainable". Non perfected version is too strong for easiness of obtaining it. PvP players should be smarter afer seeing how making Viper easy to obtain changed PvP into proctard yard and destroyed enjoyment from PvP for few months. If something really strong becomes too easy to obtain it ends up in 2 ways : PvP ballance is destroyed and people compian about it or things that are strong are nerfed to the ground because everyone can have them in 1 day.
I dont have problem this weapon will be strong tbh Perfetced version should be as reward for huge effort of players but making non perfected version almost same strong as perfected one is step in a bad direction. Stam Nb's will be able to spam incaps like crazy and stam dk's with maesltorm s&b and asylum 2h will be even stonger then now despite shuffle and s&b ulti nerf. Non perfected version of 2h simply needs a nerf to around 10-12 ultimate points.
No, thats like saying "im a PVP player and farming the hardest PVE content in the game to get a BiS PVP weapon its stupid".
But by all means how about we lock PVE BiS gear behind 2% PVP leaderboards. Im sure PVE players will have fun being forced to PVP every single day. Right?
And no, viper didnt ruin PVP because of how easy u could get it.Edited by pieratsos on October 9, 2017 1:44AM6 -
Joy_Division✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Joy_Division wrote: »
Mr smart here. L2ContextIt is PVP weapon first and foremost. It would be much worse if there was bigger difference between perfect and imperfect. No weapon with high impact in PVP should be hidden behind content 99.99999% of PVP players (well, it will be 99% for pve too) will never finish.
That goes for the destro staff too. They way they changed it made imperfect much worse than perfect.
Worst explanation ever. It's like saying "I am PvP player I am weak in PvE yet I need something from it so it have to be easy obtainable". Non perfected version is too strong for easiness of obtaining it. PvP players should be smarter afer seeing how making Viper easy to obtain changed PvP into proctard yard and destroyed enjoyment from PvP for few months. If something really strong becomes too easy to obtain it ends up in 2 ways : PvP ballance is destroyed and people compian about it or things that are strong are nerfed to the ground because everyone can have them in 1 day.
I dont have problem this weapon will be strong tbh Perfetced version should be as reward for huge effort of players but making non perfected version almost same strong as perfected one is step in a bad direction. Stam Nb's will be able to spam incaps like crazy and stam dk's with maesltorm s&b and asylum 2h will be even stonger then now despite shuffle and s&b ulti nerf. Non perfected version of 2h simply needs a nerf to around 10-12 ultimate points.
I never said it is not strong. All I am saying that no impactful PVP weapon should be hidden behind content few people will do or even be capable of doing.
Normal Trials are a joke in this game and with the new transmutation system, which pvpers get access to just from pvping, there is no farm, especially since the weapon will not be desirable for people concerned with DPS numbers on a test dummy.
That joke is something majority of PVP never done. The best procset in the game was trial drop and in a year people had chance to use it and abuse it I have never ever even saw it on my combat log. And this is not even discussion about normal trials. The perfected weapon are only in HM vet trial.
Simply put. Normal Trial is maximum (when it comes to group trials) PVP players should ever be forced to run for weapon with high impact in PVP. That is as objective as I can make it. Personally, no weapons impactful in PVP should be hidden behind endgame PVE content. PVP has its own features to separate capable PVPers from less than capable. Leaderboards and Emp. They could be better and there could be more if someone at ZoS cared obv.
If I go the extra mile, something many will disagree with, I think everything should be purchasable with gold. Gold is the only thing that connects PVP and PVE. Both group playing content they like and partaking in one economy.
If you don't want to run easy content to get a reward item, that's your problem. Why should I have to be punished for playing the game exactly as Zos intended, for PvE and PvP to be part of the same experience? ZoS having the weapon drop in the new trail is further proof of that. They made the imperfect practically the same to drop in easy content as a compromise for people who dont have to get in a max end-game raid. It's a compromise and it's fine.Edited by Joy_Division on October 9, 2017 3:43AMMake Rush of Agony "Monsters only." People should not be consecutively crowd controlled in a PvP setting. Period.0 -
AlcastClass RepresentativeAt 49% it gives 1 ultipoint.
At 2% it gives 15 ultipoint.
I think at like 30% it gibes around 7-8 ulti points. Not sure anymore i made video where ya cab see how it scales.
Tanky ultigen stamDKs and Gankbladed gonna love thisEdited by Alcast on October 9, 2017 6:04AMhttps://alcasthq.com - Alcasthq.com Builds & Guides
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Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Joy_Division wrote: »
Mr smart here. L2ContextIt is PVP weapon first and foremost. It would be much worse if there was bigger difference between perfect and imperfect. No weapon with high impact in PVP should be hidden behind content 99.99999% of PVP players (well, it will be 99% for pve too) will never finish.
That goes for the destro staff too. They way they changed it made imperfect much worse than perfect.
Worst explanation ever. It's like saying "I am PvP player I am weak in PvE yet I need something from it so it have to be easy obtainable". Non perfected version is too strong for easiness of obtaining it. PvP players should be smarter afer seeing how making Viper easy to obtain changed PvP into proctard yard and destroyed enjoyment from PvP for few months. If something really strong becomes too easy to obtain it ends up in 2 ways : PvP ballance is destroyed and people compian about it or things that are strong are nerfed to the ground because everyone can have them in 1 day.
I dont have problem this weapon will be strong tbh Perfetced version should be as reward for huge effort of players but making non perfected version almost same strong as perfected one is step in a bad direction. Stam Nb's will be able to spam incaps like crazy and stam dk's with maesltorm s&b and asylum 2h will be even stonger then now despite shuffle and s&b ulti nerf. Non perfected version of 2h simply needs a nerf to around 10-12 ultimate points.
I never said it is not strong. All I am saying that no impactful PVP weapon should be hidden behind content few people will do or even be capable of doing.
Normal Trials are a joke in this game and with the new transmutation system, which pvpers get access to just from pvping, there is no farm, especially since the weapon will not be desirable for people concerned with DPS numbers on a test dummy.
That joke is something majority of PVP never done. The best procset in the game was trial drop and in a year people had chance to use it and abuse it I have never ever even saw it on my combat log. And this is not even discussion about normal trials. The perfected weapon are only in HM vet trial.
Simply put. Normal Trial is maximum (when it comes to group trials) PVP players should ever be forced to run for weapon with high impact in PVP. That is as objective as I can make it. Personally, no weapons impactful in PVP should be hidden behind endgame PVE content. PVP has its own features to separate capable PVPers from less than capable. Leaderboards and Emp. They could be better and there could be more if someone at ZoS cared obv.
If I go the extra mile, something many will disagree with, I think everything should be purchasable with gold. Gold is the only thing that connects PVP and PVE. Both group playing content they like and partaking in one economy.
Hmm I dont remember that PvP players were complaining that PvE players need to farm Ravager in PvP when it was BiS for stamina users. PvP community in this game is laughable and want everything without an effort. Best weapons in the game should cost You lot of time to get them.
Or you know - they just bought it.
Can they make it so i can buy my asylum weapons plox?
Yes those who had enough gold but You should remember how long it tooked back in a day to get enough gold to buy this things. It wasnt so easy like now. But yeah why not make perfected versions cost 50M gold and I am fine with that.
It took just as long as it took today if you´re not in the comfortable position to be able to farm (preferably with emp) tel var on a buffcampaign.
Or don´t have 12 chars completing writs.
I think your statement shows a slight disconnect to how the game plays out for new players. You don´t make easy money if you´re not sitting on bank already or don´t have 2 years + of experience under your belly.
Ironically pvp has always been a moneydrain (except for 1.6) whereas pve made money up until the point where trialgear was made bop. Your comparison is lacking on several ends.Edited by Derra on October 9, 2017 6:27AM<Noricum>
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Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 501 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Worst explanation ever. It's like saying "I am PvP player I am weak in PvE yet I need something from it so it have to be easy obtainable". Non perfected version is too strong for easiness of obtaining it. PvP players should be smarter afer seeing how making Viper easy to obtain changed PvP into proctard yard and destroyed enjoyment from PvP for few months. If something really strong becomes too easy to obtain it ends up in 2 ways : PvP ballance is destroyed and people compian about it or things that are strong are nerfed to the ground because everyone can have them in 1 day.
Nope - do not agree with your assessment at all.
The only thing you can hope for when something too powerful gets introduced is that a large enough portion of the playerbase is able to aquire it - because otherwise it won´t get adressed.
Or is it desireable in your world that a few select players with obtain the perfected weapeons and wreak havoc in pvp with it upon the mere mortal fools not having them?
I´d rather have an even playing field where everyone has OP weapon X instead of only having the players that have the time to HM raid + pvp do it and have a significant advantage in pvp for pveing.
Viper was worse when it first got introduced than the proccalypse that followed after. People didn´t understand what happened to them. I had viper + veli on my NB two and a half weeks after dark brotherhood hit. It was disgusting and just because it was rare at that point it wasn´t any better than when every NB ran it.Edited by Derra on October 9, 2017 6:16AM<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 504 -
Juhasow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭At 49% it gives 1 ultipoint.
At 2% it gives 15 ultipoint.
I think at like 30% it gibes around 7-8 ulti points. Not sure anymore i made video where ya cab see how it scales.
Tanky ultigen stamDKs and Gankbladed gonna love this
Problem is that imperfect version will give similar numbers.0 -
AlcastClass RepresentativeAt 49% it gives 1 ultipoint.
At 2% it gives 15 ultipoint.
I think at like 30% it gibes around 7-8 ulti points. Not sure anymore i made video where ya cab see how it scales.
Tanky ultigen stamDKs and Gankbladed gonna love this
Problem is that imperfect version will give similar numbers.
Ye its like they are afraid to really make them worse as the perfected oneshttps://alcasthq.com - Alcasthq.com Builds & Guides
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Juhasow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭At 49% it gives 1 ultipoint.
At 2% it gives 15 ultipoint.
I think at like 30% it gibes around 7-8 ulti points. Not sure anymore i made video where ya cab see how it scales.
Tanky ultigen stamDKs and Gankbladed gonna love this
Problem is that imperfect version will give similar numbers.
Ye its like they are afraid to really make them worse as the perfected ones
Well they was not affaraid when they nerfed Destro staffs and maked imperfected versions weak. Looks like things can be changed only of there is enough QQ.0 -
Checkmath✭✭✭✭✭
✭Funny to read again pvpler qqing about doing pve content. ZoS created that system of getting special weapons in hard pve content. So what? How about doing that content untill you get, what you want. Because thats the way most people do stuff. Anyway in my opinion, this 2h weapon will fit into just a few scenarios in pvp. Its similar as the previous destro staff: good in duels and small scale, bad in open world pvp unless you are a ganking nb. Because everyone else running behind enemies to execute them is a dead man in open world pvp. Only issue i see here is as many already told: the unperfect weapon is too close to the perfect one.1 -
Victimize✭✭✭Funny to read again pvpler qqing about doing pve content. ZoS created that system of getting special weapons in hard pve content. So what? How about doing that content untill you get, what you want. Because thats the way most people do stuff. Anyway in my opinion, this 2h weapon will fit into just a few scenarios in pvp. Its similar as the previous destro staff: good in duels and small scale, bad in open world pvp unless you are a ganking nb. Because everyone else running behind enemies to execute them is a dead man in open world pvp. Only issue i see here is as many already told: the unperfect weapon is too close to the perfect one.
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Feanor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Yeah, PvE players never complain about having to go PvP. All the "OMG vigor and caltrops are locked behind PvP" threads must have been pure imagination. What's actually so hard about really awesome PvP rewards?Main characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 50 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard StamplarAll chars 50 @ CP 1900+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.1 -
Maulkin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Yeah, PvE players never complain about having to go PvP. All the "OMG vigor and caltrops are locked behind PvP" threads must have been pure imagination. What's actually so hard about really awesome PvP rewards?
Oh, I member. And let's not forget that getting AP is so extremely hard, like having to sit around a keep to collect def ticks or to go capture some resources from NPCs (i.e. PvE). Jesus wept.
Edited by Maulkin on October 9, 2017 11:18AMEU | PC | AD1 -
pieratsos✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Funny to read again pvpler qqing about doing pve content. ZoS created that system of getting special weapons in hard pve content. So what? How about doing that content untill you get, what you want. Because thats the way most people do stuff. Anyway in my opinion, this 2h weapon will fit into just a few scenarios in pvp. Its similar as the previous destro staff: good in duels and small scale, bad in open world pvp unless you are a ganking nb. Because everyone else running behind enemies to execute them is a dead man in open world pvp. Only issue i see here is as many already told: the unperfect weapon is too close to the perfect one.
No they are not complaining about doing PVE content. They are complaining because they cant do it. Its inaccessible. Thats the issue but apparently for some of you its still rocket science and you still dont get it.1 -
Juhasow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Yeah, PvE players never complain about having to go PvP. All the "OMG vigor and caltrops are locked behind PvP" threads must have been pure imagination. What's actually so hard about really awesome PvP rewards?
It's kinda same opposite situation hen PvP players want to have maxed undaunted , mages and fighters guilds.0 -
Feanor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Yeah, PvE players never complain about having to go PvP. All the "OMG vigor and caltrops are locked behind PvP" threads must have been pure imagination. What's actually so hard about really awesome PvP rewards?
It's kinda same opposite situation hen PvP players want to have maxed undaunted , mages and fighters guilds.
The difference is you don't see PvP players opening one thread per week complaining that grinding the guild lines is a chore. The PvE players on the other hand...Main characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 50 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard StamplarAll chars 50 @ CP 1900+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.0 -
Juhasow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Yeah, PvE players never complain about having to go PvP. All the "OMG vigor and caltrops are locked behind PvP" threads must have been pure imagination. What's actually so hard about really awesome PvP rewards?
It's kinda same opposite situation hen PvP players want to have maxed undaunted , mages and fighters guilds.
The difference is you don't see PvP players opening one thread per week complaining that grinding the guild lines is a chore. The PvE players on the other hand...
Well yes I see them. I remember the thread maded by PvPers complaining about farming Undaunted. Lets be honest PvP player base in this game is most QQ of them all and this is why PvPers defend imperfected Asylum 2h.Edited by Juhasow on October 9, 2017 12:16PM0 -
Feanor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭NPCs don't complain. That's why you don't see balance discussions on the PvE side - other than "my class doesn't do enough DPS".Main characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 50 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard StamplarAll chars 50 @ CP 1900+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.0 -
Checkmath✭✭✭✭✭
✭why should those weapons be inaccesable for pvp-players? everyone can go and do pve content as long he has the specific DLC. if you mean by inaccesable, that it is in pve end content, so what. being a pvp-player doesnt mean to be bad at pve. if you are a bad tank, healer or dd, then so be it, then its not ZoS fault, that items are "inaccesable" for you. actually most pvp players are decent pvers. they all can get into an end content playing guild. anyway the 2h weapon is slightly worse than the perfect one, so another reason for easy getting for everyone. this thread isnt about that the weapon is only found in pve, its about the strenght of the item itself and the difference between perfect weapon and not perfect. so pls stop complain about the doing pve content.1 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Yeah, PvE players never complain about having to go PvP. All the "OMG vigor and caltrops are locked behind PvP" threads must have been pure imagination. What's actually so hard about really awesome PvP rewards?
Well to be fair - same as aquiring undaunted exp/helmets that has been nerfed into oblivion.
Contrary to undaunted you can nowadays just pve your way to caltrops and vigor. Admittedly in cyrodiil but you just have to kill guards and siege stuff.
You never have to participate in any pvp interaction to get caltrops and vigor. They´re obtainable through pve.
There is absolutely nothing left that requires a player to pvp.<Noricum>
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Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 501 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭why should those weapons be inaccesable for pvp-players? everyone can go and do pve content as long he has the specific DLC. if you mean by inaccesable, that it is in pve end content, so what. being a pvp-player doesnt mean to be bad at pve. if you are a bad tank, healer or dd, then so be it, then its not ZoS fault, that items are "inaccesable" for you. actually most pvp players are decent pvers. they all can get into an end content playing guild. anyway the 2h weapon is slightly worse than the perfect one, so another reason for easy getting for everyone. this thread isnt about that the weapon is only found in pve, its about the strenght of the item itself and the difference between perfect weapon and not perfect. so pls stop complain about the doing pve content.
PvE endgame content fits the definition of "inaccessible" because it requires 12 people to run.
Some people only play during the daytime. Some can only play for 30 to 60 minute intervals because they have other obligations to take care of every now and then.
I don´t know any endgame raiding guild that does not raid on schedule of atleast two evenings a week for atleast 3 hours straight. That alone is an impossible requirement to meet for some players.
I don´t know any raiding guild that would accept a player that has to afk an 45min to hour into the raid for 10 to 15 minutes or that´s raiding during daytime.
So "get into an end content playing guild" isn´t just as simple as you would like it to be.
Now you might argue - well then they simply can´t aquire it and eso isn´t the game for them. But that´s what i think is wrong.
Esos endgame pvp gear never required you to run 12 man content so far. It was entirely possible to get bis setups without ever having stepped foot into that content.
This means for the past 3 years pvp players were very much able to alway aquire desired BIS gear for themselves. This no longer being the case is basically a 180° turn in esos gearing policy.
PvP players rightfully complain about such a change.Edited by Derra on October 9, 2017 12:44PM<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 504 -
DeadlyRecluse✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭At 49% it gives 1 ultipoint.
At 2% it gives 15 ultipoint.
I think at like 30% it gibes around 7-8 ulti points. Not sure anymore i made video where ya cab see how it scales.
Tanky ultigen stamDKs and Gankbladed gonna love this
Thank you for bringing actual information to a speculation fight.Thrice Empress, Forever Scrub0 -
Checkmath✭✭✭✭✭
✭if people want to say something about the gear policy, especially about asylum weapons, then they should do that in the right thread about that. this thread was started to discuss only the 2h weapon and its ability.0 -
pieratsos✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yeah, PvE players never complain about having to go PvP. All the "OMG vigor and caltrops are locked behind PvP" threads must have been pure imagination. What's actually so hard about really awesome PvP rewards?
It's kinda same opposite situation hen PvP players want to have maxed undaunted , mages and fighters guilds.
The difference is that vigor, warhorn etc just encourage you to try PVP. As it should be. The game should encourage you to try both PVE and PVP.
You try PVP for 2-3 hours, no PVP guilds required, solo or grouped doesnt really matter, not much PVP experience required, hell you dont even have to kill people. Get ur skills, if u dont like it, never f*cking step foot inside cyro again. Thats actually a very good design to promote PVP.
Undaunted is much much longer but at least its the same concept. It does encourage to do actual PVE content (not pointlessly running around farming books) get ur passives and never f*cking look back if u dont want to.
The common thing u have in both cases is accessibility. They are easily accessible by almost everyone and depending on skill it can be quite fast.
Locking gear behind HM of the hardest trial in the game however isnt encouraging you to do PVE . Its the exact opposite. Its inaccessible to 99% of the players in the game if not more. So get off ur high horse with ur stupid comparisons. Its not the same. Not even close.
If you want to nerf normal weapons then u have to make the perfected ones accessible. Whether by doing PVP or with a token system in PVE for master, maelstrom, asylum weapons. You get tokens by completing vMA, vDSA and vet trials. You are still forcing PVP players to grind PVE which is still not the same with getting PVP skills in 3 hours but at least vMA is accessible to everyone if they have the skill to complete it. Or just get it over with and completely disable all those weapons in PVP. One less thing to worry about.2 -
pieratsos✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭if people want to say something about the gear policy, especially about asylum weapons, then they should do that in the right thread about that. this thread was started to discuss only the 2h weapon and its ability.
No, this thread was started to nerf the normal weapon that is only good in PVP, and make it inaccessible to PVP players.
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Artis✭✭✭✭✭
✭That joke is something majority of PVP never done. The best procset in the game was trial drop and in a year people had chance to use it and abuse it I have never ever even saw it on my combat log. And this is not even discussion about normal trials. The perfected weapon are only in HM vet trial.
What set is that? Also, so it's great. You're saying that PvPers won't really have it then - then it doesn't matter that it's in vet HM. You won't see it in your death recap. Imperfect version will work just fine.Or is it desireable in your world that a few select players with obtain the perfected weapeons and wreak havoc in pvp with it upon the mere mortal fools not having them?
I´d rather have an even playing field where everyone has OP weapon X instead of only having the players that have the time to HM raid + pvp do it and have a significant advantage in pvp for pveing.
If it's just a few select players - then it won't be havoc. They will only fight that many players at a time and in group fight the effect won't be as significant.
An even playing field is in shooters and mobas. Even in chess whites have the advantage of the first move. MMORPGs are about progression and effort/reward.
If, for example, I'm PvPing AND PvEing competitively and you are only PvPing or only PvEing, why shouldn't I be rewarded more than you? I don't, but I imagine some people have time for both or have holidays etc,so they would have a reason to spend more time playing.Locking gear behind HM of the hardest trial in the game however isnt encouraging you to do PVE . Its the exact opposite. Its inaccessible to 99% of the players in the game if not more. So get off ur high horse with ur stupid comparisons. Its not the same. Not even close.
If you want to nerf normal weapons then u have to make the perfected ones accessible. Whether by doing PVP or with a token system in PVE for master, maelstrom, asylum weapons. You get tokens by completing vMA, vDSA and vet trials. You are still forcing PVP players to grind PVE which is still not the same with getting PVP skills in 3 hours but at least vMA is accessible to everyone if they have the skill to complete it. Or just get it over with and completely disable all those weapons in PVP. One less thing to worry about.
It' accessible to everyone. When the update is live, I can show you where the entrance is or post a screenshot of the map.
Now you get off your horse and let people get rewarded for putting tons of effort to complete that content. Including people who both PvE and PVP. Why shouldn't they be able to work towards that advantage over players who only PvP? And if only 1% will get there - then it's all good, they won't affect PvP situation much. It's nowhere near all those proctards that dominated Cyro and BGs for the past year or so?Edited by Artis on October 9, 2017 5:34PM1 -
scipionumatia✭✭✭✭why should those weapons be inaccesable for pvp-players? everyone can go and do pve content as long he has the specific DLC. if you mean by inaccesable, that it is in pve end content, so what. being a pvp-player doesnt mean to be bad at pve. if you are a bad tank, healer or dd, then so be it, then its not ZoS fault, that items are "inaccesable" for you. actually most pvp players are decent pvers. they all can get into an end content playing guild. anyway the 2h weapon is slightly worse than the perfect one, so another reason for easy getting for everyone. this thread isnt about that the weapon is only found in pve, its about the strenght of the item itself and the difference between perfect weapon and not perfect. so pls stop complain about the doing pve content.
PvE endgame content fits the definition of "inaccessible" because it requires 12 people to run.
Some people only play during the daytime. Some can only play for 30 to 60 minute intervals because they have other obligations to take care of every now and then.
I don´t know any endgame raiding guild that does not raid on schedule of atleast two evenings a week for atleast 3 hours straight. That alone is an impossible requirement to meet for some players.
I don´t know any raiding guild that would accept a player that has to afk an 45min to hour into the raid for 10 to 15 minutes or that´s raiding during daytime.
So "get into an end content playing guild" isn´t just as simple as you would like it to be.
Now you might argue - well then they simply can´t aquire it and eso isn´t the game for them. But that´s what i think is wrong.
Esos endgame pvp gear never required you to run 12 man content so far. It was entirely possible to get bis setups without ever having stepped foot into that content.
This means for the past 3 years pvp players were very much able to alway aquire desired BIS gear for themselves. This no longer being the case is basically a 180° turn in esos gearing policy.
PvP players rightfully complain about such a change.
@Derra
I couldn't agree more. I got a family, a full time job and can't spend entire nights 2 times a week to practice pve boss battles and partake in serious end game pve. My brother is all about pve and he will stay up all night with his buddies in pve content. What I like about pvp is i can fit it into my life, if I'm in imperial city and my wife needs me to change a diaper or run to the store quick I can park on a balcony and take a break. If I'm in cyrodiil I can just travel to a gate. Battle grounds are only about 10-15 mins at a time if that.
I'm not in high school anymore haha can't be spending 6 hours trying to beat end game pve content to get a 2h for my stam dk to use in pvp.
Please make these able to be purchased with AP or telvar. Obviously a lot of itScipio Numantia Red guard Nightblade PvP- AD
Scipio Asiaticus Khajiit Nightblade (CRAFTER/DPS) PvE- EP
Altmer Nightblade PvP- EP
Fueoculto Breton Templar (DPS) PvE- EP
Rasoculto Orc Dragon Knight PvP- EP
Caethus Argonian Templar (HEAL) PvE- EP
Vale Oso Nord Sorc (DPS) PvE- AD
Sir-Galahad-the-pure Altmer Sorc (DPS) PvE- EP
Scipionumantine Imperial Templar PvP- EP
Un-bearable Imperial Warden PVP- EP
Vale Bear Altmer Warden PvP- EP
Baits-All-Zergs Argonian Dragon knight PVP- DC1
