Can we talk about the bad sorc balancing?

Karmanorway · September 2017

ak_pvp wrote: »

I mean seriously? Sorc, the class that has to give up very little for tankiness, mobility and damage, now is the tied best CCer in the game. I don't think they are god mode, burst is manageable, and I don't want every bit of it nerfed like pleebs, but they are definitely the most overpowered class now.

Let papa go through comparisons:

Streak: No counters until the sorc has already crossed the border and started a new life. This would be fine as a mobility based defense, but then they can facetank DK style without any block like slows. IMO i'd reduce the cost of streak and mines, but add a cooldown so its more usable in battle to reposition and less spammable, it would require some planning in where to use the streak.

Which brings me to... Shield stacking, its definitely possible to keep shields up constantly, as it has none of the penalties of block/roll or no shield defile, no regen blocks or repetitive cost increases. Also none of the counters, where is the attacks that goes through only shields (Oblivion/bleed ignores everything, cost poisons affect everyone) One of its main counters is in a set, great if you want to counter a sorc, nope, you might decimate the sorc, but you become potato to everyone without shields. The CP tree against shields gets a half mark, it doesn't fully counter them, more so depends on your damage. Something like siphoner to counterract the extra shield strength from bastion

How about, conversion costing more to interrupt than to be interrupted. Nope, too difficult to add some risk/reward to it. Too hard for FOTYers.

Also the auto execute, DK/warden get effectively nothing. Why?

If the rune prison change is added, then its just incredibly silly. Discuss.

I dont get it, if sorcerers are so OP , why are less ppl playing that class? And i have a magsorc myself, when a stam pvper gets up close to me and start spamming uppercut on me im pretty much screwed, so i for one thinks the rune prison buff is a good and fair thing,

Subversus · September 2017

BohnT wrote: »

Feanor wrote: »

ak_pvp wrote: »

The staff is definitely another issue, but I am not too sure about it quite yet. I have seen people used charged for similar effects. We will wait and see on that.

Feanor wrote: »

Again this? Seriously? I'd rather discuss the huge buff Fear got...

You mean the nerf fear got and the buff some silly traps recieved?

Well, I have seen the traps used by very good NBs on PC EU, and it's definitey not "silly" even on live now...

There is just a slight change which makes them useless you can see them, why would i use a trap if i place a sign on them saying "don't go on this field, it's a damn trap"

The only reason sorc was kinda balanced is that you could avoid the burst with block and dodge now every sorc can hit every burst with ease the only class capable of this is nightblade and they were brought in line with their squishiness.
Giving sorcs this strength is way too much.
And we don't even talk about the new staff that is another balance nightmare

Not to mention that it's ranged, so they can camp in atro+mines while doing that. LMAO GOOD THING I HAVE A FULLY GOLDEN OUT SORC

ak_pvp · September 2017

IAVITNI wrote: »

ak_pvp wrote: »

I didn't expect to need to put out a flashing neon sign saying pvp, I think the skills mentioned express that. Here are the contexts:

Highest mobility: sorc
Burst: sorc/warden/nb
Survivability: sorc shields, easily up to par when running resto ult, DKs tied, but lose damage, sorcy pie doesn't.
Ccs: Used to be fear, but DK and sorc both have root+unblockable cc (not DK prior because break via damage) beneficial in group situations. Negate too, if that counts.

Sorc is effectivly one of the best in pvp, with top cc, damage, ignoring roots with streaks. The only thing they aren't best in is pvp group healing.

Mobility:
In open world, sure sorc has the best mobility. But Streak is meant to allow sorcs hyper mobility in open world. In a duel or in the case of a good sorc that isn't attempting a 1vz what does mobility matter? And if your talking about repositioning in a duel, Nightblades can reposition much better, Magicka DK's can reposition well by limiting their opponents mobility, Templars have 100% uptime on a 30% snare and most run Mist Form in PvP. Idk the warden class all that well, but they can get near 100% uptime on major expedition.

Burst: sorc/warden/nb/templar
Every class has high burst if played right except maybe DK which often rely on their ultimate/skoria to help execute.

Survivability:
Uhm no, not up to par regarding resto ultimate. 1v1 yes shields are hard to get through. 1vx, shields will melt vs people non-potatoes without LoS. Every class is OP against potatoes. And oh, look. Sorc shield stacking isn't BiS in all context. 1v1, ya I'd rather shield stack. 1vx, i'd prefer to dodge roll and break free from infinite snares and CC.

Cc:
You keep saying Sorcs have the "best root along with etc." which is true, but a statement without context. The average PvP sorc will run:

Front bar- Frag, Curse, Fury, Crushing Shock/Mage Light, Entropy/Hardened.
Backbar- Dark Deal/Mines/Thundering, Healing Ward, Harness, Streak, Entropy/Hardened

To run encase they need to give up one of your "sorc is BiS in all these areas" (areas?)

Sorc burst is THE MOST TELEGRAPHED burst in the game. Watch the sorcs hands and learn to dodge roll when they glow and you will do much better vs sorcs on your medium armor night blade. Also try running Rally to heal after burst.

I can list all the strengths of every class and omit their weakness and they will all look OP. Your posts are not constructive, they're simply you complaining about a class you clearly do not understand.

But beside from your blatant anti-sorc propaganda, I agree that this CC change is over the top. Sorc burst should be set up through player skill (timing DawnBreaker/Streak, Baiting, Pressure etc.). Not fond of a guaranteed CC. I prefer the old morphs myself for reasons already mentioned in this thread.

So your point is, mobility doesn't matter?

NB may be valid, even though cloak is breakable, but templars snare and DKs cc (which sorcs has) is a bad excuse, also any class can run mist, despite how bad it is, (no regen, slow, no healing, silenced, snared by gap close) Expedition alone doesn't make mobility, pots exist, that doesn't make stamina DK mobile.

You also omit the use of overload for some of the utility skills, and the fact that sorcs can dodge and break free with shields still up.

I agree sorcs bust is one of the most manageable, I said that in my op. But they can retain it with tankiness.

ak_pvp · September 2017

Cage_Lizardman wrote: »

ak_pvp wrote: »

Streak: No counters until the sorc has already crossed the border and started a new life.

Maybe... if you don't feed your mount?

Aha the attempts at justification.

OK guys, we are in the middle of a fight, dots ticking and the sorcs farted lighting through every root in the game and has gone to regen. Everyone mount up and chase.

Enslaved · September 2017

Elder Sorcs Online

Cheaper ultimates
Cheaper use of both magicka/stamina skills
Top tier sustain
Shield stacking
Passive execute
Active AOE execute
Best mobility in game

I mean, wtf Zos? Is there any point playing any other class?

Derra · September 2017

Joy_Division wrote: »

What I am more worried about is the new asylum Crushing shock buff which gives 3 automatic 100% uptimes buffs on a skill that isn't refelctable, I get it Crushing Shock isn't technically a sorcerer skill, but that call by far gets the most mileage out of it. And these weapons, unlike Masters/Maelstrom, are not only easy to get from normal versions, but the "imperfect" variety is practically every bit as powerful as the "perfect" ones.

Though I will say now NBs, Sorcs, and DKs all have a CC that goes through block and through dodgeroll - another trend toward easy mode no counter game-play, meanwhile templars have ...wait for it ... javelin.

Please for the love of god.
It´s theoretically 100% uptime on the perfect weapons - which are goign to be quite uncommon as it requires you to run vet + hardmode.

In my testing uptime was between 80 and 90% for perfect weapons and around 70% for imperfect weapons.

Now putting that into context: Sorcs generally already have relatively high uptime on concussed when using lightning enchants on staff (especially with infused or charged builds - yes the latter does exist).
Also sorc builds mostly already have acess to minor maim (shadowrend or wizards).

You´re talking about giving up 5p necro, 5p lich or a 2p undaunted bonus to gain a little higher uptime on concussed and gain burning while loosing uptime on maim.

The combination of masterbow infused providing you with 850 weapondmg + asylum 2h giving you ultimate for spamming finisher 2 or 3 times is something that is wjust as good as what destro staff provides.

On topic of nerf sorcs: Make harness + hardened unstackable. Kappa.

Feanor · September 2017

@Enslaved

Your view as much as anyone else's is warped by the Sorcs you see on CP campaigns. Those with 30k shield stacks. Try a Sorc in noCP and Tell me how OP they are. Hint: You don't encounter that many Sorcs in noCP (at least that's my impression of Sotha Sil EU and BGs). Cyrodiil is filled with DKs and NBs with the odd Templar and Warden.

Also a lot if items on your list are not class specific, but set induced.

WreckfulAbandon · September 2017

Enslaved wrote: »

Elder Sorcs Online
Cheaper ultimates

Cheaper use of both magicka/stamina skills

Top tier sustain

Shield stacking

Passive execute

Active AOE execute

Best mobility in game

I mean, wtf Zos? Is there any point playing any other class?

Lol, cheaper ults? Yeah and you know how often they get used on actual sorc ults negate aside?

Top tier sustain? Not from endless fury, power stone, and regen passive alone. I'm all for nerfing Dark Deal to 2 sec cast time.

Any class can perform in PvP.

And since we're talking about magsorcs (we're always talking about magsorcs unfortunately) best mobility in the game???

Oh and 2 of your points are actually the same point stretched into two for maximum whinging potential.

Subversus · September 2017

Derra wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

What I am more worried about is the new asylum Crushing shock buff which gives 3 automatic 100% uptimes buffs on a skill that isn't refelctable, I get it Crushing Shock isn't technically a sorcerer skill, but that call by far gets the most mileage out of it. And these weapons, unlike Masters/Maelstrom, are not only easy to get from normal versions, but the "imperfect" variety is practically every bit as powerful as the "perfect" ones.

Though I will say now NBs, Sorcs, and DKs all have a CC that goes through block and through dodgeroll - another trend toward easy mode no counter game-play, meanwhile templars have ...wait for it ... javelin.

Please for the love of god.
It´s theoretically 100% uptime on the perfect weapons - which are goign to be quite uncommon as it requires you to run vet + hardmode.

In my testing uptime was between 80 and 90% for perfect weapons and around 70% for imperfect weapons.

Now putting that into context: Sorcs generally already have relatively high uptime on concussed when using lightning enchants on staff (especially with infused or charged builds - yes the latter does exist).
Also sorc builds mostly already have acess to minor maim (shadowrend or wizards).

You´re talking about giving up 5p necro, 5p lich or a 2p undaunted bonus to gain a little higher uptime on concussed and gain burning while loosing uptime on maim.

The combination of masterbow infused providing you with 850 weapondmg + asylum 2h giving you ultimate for spamming finisher 2 or 3 times is something that is way stronger than what the destro staff provides.

On topic of nerf sorcs: Make harness + hardened unstackable. Kappa.

Yeah, all I need to do is swap killer's blade for executioner on my duel build and I can spam my incap every 4th weave on enemies under 50% health as opposed to 15% uptime I currently have

all I have to give up is 4p alchemist wep dmg bonus. Balanced

Koensol · September 2017

Vapirko wrote: »

Sorcs got an unblockable undodgebale cc because the freakin amazing amount of crying on this forum. That long with the Asylum staff should be "interesting." It's completely ridiculous, im legit kind angry rn.

Amen. They damn well balance this *** before they put it live. I wonder why it is so hard for ZOS to see consequences? This change is completely uncalled for. Again ZOS makes the fatal mistake that they think they are offering a counter to blocktards, while at the same time that specific cc completely wrecks other playstyles too. A ranged, undodgable cc... How much more easymode do you want sorc burst to be? For real? Frikkin hell guys...

Vaoh · September 2017

Enslaved wrote: »

Elder Sorcs Online
Cheaper ultimates

Cheaper use of both magicka/stamina skills

Top tier sustain

Shield stacking

Passive execute

Active AOE execute

Best mobility in game

I mean, wtf Zos? Is there any point playing any other class?

This is cringeworthy..... I feel bad for players that have to tell themselves these things to keep their pride intact and justify deaths.

pieratsos · September 2017

ak_pvp wrote: »

IAVITNI wrote: »

ak_pvp wrote: »

I didn't expect to need to put out a flashing neon sign saying pvp, I think the skills mentioned express that. Here are the contexts:

Highest mobility: sorc
Burst: sorc/warden/nb
Survivability: sorc shields, easily up to par when running resto ult, DKs tied, but lose damage, sorcy pie doesn't.
Ccs: Used to be fear, but DK and sorc both have root+unblockable cc (not DK prior because break via damage) beneficial in group situations. Negate too, if that counts.

Sorc is effectivly one of the best in pvp, with top cc, damage, ignoring roots with streaks. The only thing they aren't best in is pvp group healing.

Mobility:
In open world, sure sorc has the best mobility. But Streak is meant to allow sorcs hyper mobility in open world. In a duel or in the case of a good sorc that isn't attempting a 1vz what does mobility matter? And if your talking about repositioning in a duel, Nightblades can reposition much better, Magicka DK's can reposition well by limiting their opponents mobility, Templars have 100% uptime on a 30% snare and most run Mist Form in PvP. Idk the warden class all that well, but they can get near 100% uptime on major expedition.

Burst: sorc/warden/nb/templar
Every class has high burst if played right except maybe DK which often rely on their ultimate/skoria to help execute.

Survivability:
Uhm no, not up to par regarding resto ultimate. 1v1 yes shields are hard to get through. 1vx, shields will melt vs people non-potatoes without LoS. Every class is OP against potatoes. And oh, look. Sorc shield stacking isn't BiS in all context. 1v1, ya I'd rather shield stack. 1vx, i'd prefer to dodge roll and break free from infinite snares and CC.

Cc:
You keep saying Sorcs have the "best root along with etc." which is true, but a statement without context. The average PvP sorc will run:

Front bar- Frag, Curse, Fury, Crushing Shock/Mage Light, Entropy/Hardened.
Backbar- Dark Deal/Mines/Thundering, Healing Ward, Harness, Streak, Entropy/Hardened

To run encase they need to give up one of your "sorc is BiS in all these areas" (areas?)

Sorc burst is THE MOST TELEGRAPHED burst in the game. Watch the sorcs hands and learn to dodge roll when they glow and you will do much better vs sorcs on your medium armor night blade. Also try running Rally to heal after burst.

I can list all the strengths of every class and omit their weakness and they will all look OP. Your posts are not constructive, they're simply you complaining about a class you clearly do not understand.

But beside from your blatant anti-sorc propaganda, I agree that this CC change is over the top. Sorc burst should be set up through player skill (timing DawnBreaker/Streak, Baiting, Pressure etc.). Not fond of a guaranteed CC. I prefer the old morphs myself for reasons already mentioned in this thread.

So your point is, mobility doesn't matter?

NB may be valid, even though cloak is breakable, but templars snare and DKs cc (which sorcs has) is a bad excuse, also any class can run mist, despite how bad it is, (no regen, slow, no healing, silenced, snared by gap close) Expedition alone doesn't make mobility, pots exist, that doesn't make stamina DK mobile.

You also omit the use of overload for some of the utility skills, and the fact that sorcs can dodge and break free with shields still up.

I agree sorcs bust is one of the most manageable, I said that in my op. But they can retain it with tankiness.

You refer to the use of resto ult in one post as a tool helping them facetank (even tho resto ult isnt even a sorc skill) and in another post you refer to the use of overload bar to get more skills.

Do you see now why people tell you that you dont understand the class?

Brrrofski · September 2017

Derra wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

What I am more worried about is the new asylum Crushing shock buff which gives 3 automatic 100% uptimes buffs on a skill that isn't refelctable, I get it Crushing Shock isn't technically a sorcerer skill, but that call by far gets the most mileage out of it. And these weapons, unlike Masters/Maelstrom, are not only easy to get from normal versions, but the "imperfect" variety is practically every bit as powerful as the "perfect" ones.

Though I will say now NBs, Sorcs, and DKs all have a CC that goes through block and through dodgeroll - another trend toward easy mode no counter game-play, meanwhile templars have ...wait for it ... javelin.

Please for the love of god.
It´s theoretically 100% uptime on the perfect weapons - which are goign to be quite uncommon as it requires you to run vet + hardmode.

In my testing uptime was between 80 and 90% for perfect weapons and around 70% for imperfect weapons.

Now putting that into context: Sorcs generally already have relatively high uptime on concussed when using lightning enchants on staff (especially with infused or charged builds - yes the latter does exist).
Also sorc builds mostly already have acess to minor maim (shadowrend or wizards).

You´re talking about giving up 5p necro, 5p lich or a 2p undaunted bonus to gain a little higher uptime on concussed and gain burning while loosing uptime on maim.

The combination of masterbow infused providing you with 850 weapondmg + asylum 2h giving you ultimate for spamming finisher 2 or 3 times is something that is wjust as good as what destro staff provides.

On topic of nerf sorcs: Make harness + hardened unstackable. Kappa.

Who use a lightning staff in PvP? The PVErs that stand at the back of a zerg might. And sorcs don't tend to run wizards and definitely don't use shadowrend. Again, competent sorcs don't.

Yeh, one guy might have a nice PvP lightning destro build. But I mean overall. Not one deviation of that.

Enslaved · September 2017

WreckfulAbandon wrote: »

Enslaved wrote: »

Elder Sorcs Online
Cheaper ultimates

Cheaper use of both magicka/stamina skills

Top tier sustain

Shield stacking

Passive execute

Active AOE execute

Best mobility in game

I mean, wtf Zos? Is there any point playing any other class?

Lol, cheaper ults? Yeah and you know how often they get used on actual sorc ults negate aside?

Top tier sustain? Not from endless fury, power stone, and regen passive alone. I'm all for nerfing Dark Deal to 2 sec cast time.

Any class can perform in PvP.

And since we're talking about magsorcs (we're always talking about magsorcs unfortunately) best mobility in the game???

Oh and 2 of your points are actually the same point stretched into two for maximum whinging potential.

How clueless you sound right now.
You want to say Sorc does not have passive that makes all ultimates cheaper than same used by other classes? How much does it cost to cast fiery rage, compared to DK casting it?
You want to say Sorc does not have top tier sustain? Wow, just wow.
Any class can perform in PvP? Sure, m8, but can any class stand 28+ meters away from other groups and AOE execute spam like there is no tomorrow?
On top of everything you wrote, you want to deny that sorc have best mobility in game. Boundless storm - 6 sec major expedition, while providing major resistances and damaging everything around caster. And bolt/streak, non target spammable
engage/escape mechanics... Who on Nirn have better mobility than that? Oh, yeah, I know. A stamina sorcerer Orsimer.

Derra · September 2017

Brrrofski wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

What I am more worried about is the new asylum Crushing shock buff which gives 3 automatic 100% uptimes buffs on a skill that isn't refelctable, I get it Crushing Shock isn't technically a sorcerer skill, but that call by far gets the most mileage out of it. And these weapons, unlike Masters/Maelstrom, are not only easy to get from normal versions, but the "imperfect" variety is practically every bit as powerful as the "perfect" ones.

Though I will say now NBs, Sorcs, and DKs all have a CC that goes through block and through dodgeroll - another trend toward easy mode no counter game-play, meanwhile templars have ...wait for it ... javelin.

Please for the love of god.
It´s theoretically 100% uptime on the perfect weapons - which are goign to be quite uncommon as it requires you to run vet + hardmode.

In my testing uptime was between 80 and 90% for perfect weapons and around 70% for imperfect weapons.

Now putting that into context: Sorcs generally already have relatively high uptime on concussed when using lightning enchants on staff (especially with infused or charged builds - yes the latter does exist).
Also sorc builds mostly already have acess to minor maim (shadowrend or wizards).

You´re talking about giving up 5p necro, 5p lich or a 2p undaunted bonus to gain a little higher uptime on concussed and gain burning while loosing uptime on maim.

The combination of masterbow infused providing you with 850 weapondmg + asylum 2h giving you ultimate for spamming finisher 2 or 3 times is something that is wjust as good as what destro staff provides.

On topic of nerf sorcs: Make harness + hardened unstackable. Kappa.

Who use a lightning staff in PvP? The PVErs that stand at the back of a zerg might. And sorcs don't tend to run wizards and definitely don't use shadowrend. Again, competent sorcs don't.

Yeh, one guy might have a nice PvP lightning destro build. But I mean overall. Not one deviation of that.

Lightning enchant. Not staff.
Staff light and heavy attacks can not procc status effects at all.

I´d consider myself a competent sorc. Somewhat.
I personally don´t think any setup comes close to running necro lich shadowrend currently when fighting a capable opponent especially not those amber, shackle + domi builds (those are great for enhancing what sorc does best though - killing noobs or people in medium armor).

But then again - NA or consoles seem to have a completely different meta than EU PC so if you´re playing there *shrug*.

Enslaved · September 2017

Vaoh wrote: »

Enslaved wrote: »

Elder Sorcs Online
Cheaper ultimates

Cheaper use of both magicka/stamina skills

Top tier sustain

Shield stacking

Passive execute

Active AOE execute

Best mobility in game

I mean, wtf Zos? Is there any point playing any other class?

This is cringeworthy..... I feel bad for players that have to tell themselves these things to keep their pride intact and justify deaths.

Who is speaking of deaths or anything? You wanna talk deaths?

Pick mSorc and go where large scale clashes are on. Just spam AOE ranged execute. I did it myself, you get hundreds of kills in short time of ONE BUTTON ACTION.

Any other class can do this with one button?

Feanor · September 2017

You can be an NB and spam Impale. Same 28m range. Or be a Templar and use RD. Same huge range. Honestly spamming executes from the back of a zerg will always have that result. It's a problem with zerging and not with the skill.

Enslaved · September 2017

Feanor wrote: »

You can be an NB and spam Impale. Same 28m range. Or be a Templar and use RD. Same huge range. Honestly spamming executes from the back of a zerg will always have that result. It's a problem with zerging and not with the skill.

Problem is you want to say it is all the same if you use AOE execute vs single target one. The difference is huge. On the other hand, there are classes without any execute at all. And yet, somehow that is balanced. @Vaoh pretty much soloed all non trial content with his mSorc on veteran and dare to lecture me how other classes are on even grounds or something.

I am not saying Sorc should be nerfed. Point is others could have some buffs to be able to do the same.

Feanor · September 2017

@Enslaved

The reason @Vaoh soloed the dungeons in his magSorc is that the pets allowed him to circumvent certain mechanics that need a 2nd player normally. If those mechanics aren't present he can solo anything on any class.

Also you refer to the "pre-execute" of Fury. That mechanism doesn't make it an AoE execute. The damage still has to come from somewhere, and there is not much difference in just spamming RD. It even has the higher threshold, whereas Impale has a 300% modifier. Fury is a static value with a 20% threshold, lowest of all executes.

Zer0oo · September 2017

Do people really have so much problems with sorcs in pvp or just like to create thread about how good they are?
Does it feel better when you got destroyed in pvp by a sorc and you keep telling you that has nothing to do with skill-level difference just that sorcs are too strong?

I really don't get this kind forum posts.

Is the new staff good: Yes, but everyone can use it. It buffes a none class skill (fp) so every class can make use of it. Sorc are just kinda forced to use fp since they don't have any spammable class skill. You can easy make a mag nb warden with fp it is just that their class spam skill is superior to fp(it kinda works for templer and dks too but it is alittle more adjusting needed). Also it would be interesting to compare it to uptime on normal fp weave. (i think each of the fp beams has a 10-20% chance to proc the effect so you already should have a nice uptime)

Also why should i slot rune cage if i already have another hard cc? I don't think it is so good that i would slot if for open world pvp and give up another skill(Maybe nice for duels or special 1shot builds).

For the rest i really don't want to comment on that bs.

P.S only thing that really should change is the way harness magica return works

pieratsos · September 2017

Enslaved wrote: »

WreckfulAbandon wrote: »

Enslaved wrote: »

Elder Sorcs Online
Cheaper ultimates

Cheaper use of both magicka/stamina skills

Top tier sustain

Shield stacking

Passive execute

Active AOE execute

Best mobility in game

I mean, wtf Zos? Is there any point playing any other class?

Lol, cheaper ults? Yeah and you know how often they get used on actual sorc ults negate aside?

Top tier sustain? Not from endless fury, power stone, and regen passive alone. I'm all for nerfing Dark Deal to 2 sec cast time.

Any class can perform in PvP.

And since we're talking about magsorcs (we're always talking about magsorcs unfortunately) best mobility in the game???

Oh and 2 of your points are actually the same point stretched into two for maximum whinging potential.

How clueless you sound right now.
You want to say Sorc does not have passive that makes all ultimates cheaper than same used by other classes? How much does it cost to cast fiery rage, compared to DK casting it?
You want to say Sorc does not have top tier sustain? Wow, just wow.
Any class can perform in PvP? Sure, m8, but can any class stand 28+ meters away from other groups and AOE execute spam like there is no tomorrow?
On top of everything you wrote, you want to deny that sorc have best mobility in game. Boundless storm - 6 sec major expedition, while providing major resistances and damaging everything around caster. And bolt/streak, non target spammable
engage/escape mechanics... Who on Nirn have better mobility than that? Oh, yeah, I know. A stamina sorcerer Orsimer.

You know you are clueless when you refer to streak as a spammable

pieratsos · September 2017

Enslaved wrote: »

Vaoh wrote: »

Enslaved wrote: »

Elder Sorcs Online
Cheaper ultimates

Cheaper use of both magicka/stamina skills

Top tier sustain

Shield stacking

Passive execute

Active AOE execute

Best mobility in game

I mean, wtf Zos? Is there any point playing any other class?

This is cringeworthy..... I feel bad for players that have to tell themselves these things to keep their pride intact and justify deaths.

Who is speaking of deaths or anything? You wanna talk deaths?

Pick mSorc and go where large scale clashes are on. Just spam AOE ranged execute. I did it myself, you get hundreds of kills in short time of ONE BUTTON ACTION.

Any other class can do this with one button?

templar spamming jesus beam.

Enslaved · September 2017

pieratsos wrote: »

Enslaved wrote: »

WreckfulAbandon wrote: »

Enslaved wrote: »

Elder Sorcs Online
Cheaper ultimates

Cheaper use of both magicka/stamina skills

Top tier sustain

Shield stacking

Passive execute

Active AOE execute

Best mobility in game

I mean, wtf Zos? Is there any point playing any other class?

Lol, cheaper ults? Yeah and you know how often they get used on actual sorc ults negate aside?

Top tier sustain? Not from endless fury, power stone, and regen passive alone. I'm all for nerfing Dark Deal to 2 sec cast time.

Any class can perform in PvP.

And since we're talking about magsorcs (we're always talking about magsorcs unfortunately) best mobility in the game???

Oh and 2 of your points are actually the same point stretched into two for maximum whinging potential.

How clueless you sound right now.
You want to say Sorc does not have passive that makes all ultimates cheaper than same used by other classes? How much does it cost to cast fiery rage, compared to DK casting it?
You want to say Sorc does not have top tier sustain? Wow, just wow.
Any class can perform in PvP? Sure, m8, but can any class stand 28+ meters away from other groups and AOE execute spam like there is no tomorrow?
On top of everything you wrote, you want to deny that sorc have best mobility in game. Boundless storm - 6 sec major expedition, while providing major resistances and damaging everything around caster. And bolt/streak, non target spammable
engage/escape mechanics... Who on Nirn have better mobility than that? Oh, yeah, I know. A stamina sorcerer Orsimer.

You know you are clueless when you refer to streak as a spammable

Never ever seen Sorc using it 3 times in a row? Guess you never ever set foot or whatever u use to move in Cyrodiil

Murador178 · September 2017

Derra wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

What I am more worried about is the new asylum Crushing shock buff which gives 3 automatic 100% uptimes buffs on a skill that isn't refelctable, I get it Crushing Shock isn't technically a sorcerer skill, but that call by far gets the most mileage out of it. And these weapons, unlike Masters/Maelstrom, are not only easy to get from normal versions, but the "imperfect" variety is practically every bit as powerful as the "perfect" ones.

Though I will say now NBs, Sorcs, and DKs all have a CC that goes through block and through dodgeroll - another trend toward easy mode no counter game-play, meanwhile templars have ...wait for it ... javelin.

Please for the love of god.
It´s theoretically 100% uptime on the perfect weapons - which are goign to be quite uncommon as it requires you to run vet + hardmode.

In my testing uptime was between 80 and 90% for perfect weapons and around 70% for imperfect weapons.

Now putting that into context: Sorcs generally already have relatively high uptime on concussed when using lightning enchants on staff (especially with infused or charged builds - yes the latter does exist).
Also sorc builds mostly already have acess to minor maim (shadowrend or wizards).

You´re talking about giving up 5p necro, 5p lich or a 2p undaunted bonus to gain a little higher uptime on concussed and gain burning while loosing uptime on maim.

The combination of masterbow infused providing you with 850 weapondmg + asylum 2h giving you ultimate for spamming finisher 2 or 3 times is something that is wjust as good as what destro staff provides.

On topic of nerf sorcs: Make harness + hardened unstackable. Kappa.

I like the last line.

Tbh when fighting sorcs I dont fear their damage too much- as long as u dodgeroll/block the frags ur fine on a medium armor build. The problem with sorcs is their absurd defense. A high magicka sorc rotating shields is almost unkillable, like the permablock tanks. It's like hitting a wall and as a medium armor player I need to backout after a while of spamming execute on shields or block. I think instead of buffing medium armor we could reduce blocked dmg and nerf shield size.

pieratsos · September 2017

Enslaved wrote: »

pieratsos wrote: »

Enslaved wrote: »

WreckfulAbandon wrote: »

Enslaved wrote: »

Elder Sorcs Online
Cheaper ultimates

Cheaper use of both magicka/stamina skills

Top tier sustain

Shield stacking

Passive execute

Active AOE execute

Best mobility in game

I mean, wtf Zos? Is there any point playing any other class?

Lol, cheaper ults? Yeah and you know how often they get used on actual sorc ults negate aside?

Top tier sustain? Not from endless fury, power stone, and regen passive alone. I'm all for nerfing Dark Deal to 2 sec cast time.

Any class can perform in PvP.

And since we're talking about magsorcs (we're always talking about magsorcs unfortunately) best mobility in the game???

Oh and 2 of your points are actually the same point stretched into two for maximum whinging potential.

How clueless you sound right now.
You want to say Sorc does not have passive that makes all ultimates cheaper than same used by other classes? How much does it cost to cast fiery rage, compared to DK casting it?
You want to say Sorc does not have top tier sustain? Wow, just wow.
Any class can perform in PvP? Sure, m8, but can any class stand 28+ meters away from other groups and AOE execute spam like there is no tomorrow?
On top of everything you wrote, you want to deny that sorc have best mobility in game. Boundless storm - 6 sec major expedition, while providing major resistances and damaging everything around caster. And bolt/streak, non target spammable
engage/escape mechanics... Who on Nirn have better mobility than that? Oh, yeah, I know. A stamina sorcerer Orsimer.

You know you are clueless when you refer to streak as a spammable

Never ever seen Sorc using it 3 times in a row? Guess you never ever set foot or whatever u use to move in Cyrodiil

3 times = spammable
*facepalm*

You are right tho. 3 times. Thats as much as u can cast it. Cause after that the cost is 10k+ and you have already spent about 15k magicka for those 3 streaks. Problem is that those 3 casts wont get you anywhere most of the time. The first two casts are barely enough to get you out of gap close range.

Like i said. Clueless.
So instead of you telling me if i ever step foot in cyro, how about you actually playing a sorc for at least 1 hour before you refer to streak as a spammable.

Feanor · September 2017

@pieratsos

Ssssshhh. Don't shatter his world view. Don't tell him that Sorcs get additional fun attached to Streak with that self root. He might think that it's not so great after all (yes Streak is nice if you use it offensively but bad as an escape skill).

Enslaved · September 2017

pieratsos wrote: »

Enslaved wrote: »

pieratsos wrote: »

Enslaved wrote: »

WreckfulAbandon wrote: »

Enslaved wrote: »

Elder Sorcs Online
Cheaper ultimates

Cheaper use of both magicka/stamina skills

Top tier sustain

Shield stacking

Passive execute

Active AOE execute

Best mobility in game

I mean, wtf Zos? Is there any point playing any other class?

Lol, cheaper ults? Yeah and you know how often they get used on actual sorc ults negate aside?

Top tier sustain? Not from endless fury, power stone, and regen passive alone. I'm all for nerfing Dark Deal to 2 sec cast time.

Any class can perform in PvP.

And since we're talking about magsorcs (we're always talking about magsorcs unfortunately) best mobility in the game???

Oh and 2 of your points are actually the same point stretched into two for maximum whinging potential.

How clueless you sound right now.
You want to say Sorc does not have passive that makes all ultimates cheaper than same used by other classes? How much does it cost to cast fiery rage, compared to DK casting it?
You want to say Sorc does not have top tier sustain? Wow, just wow.
Any class can perform in PvP? Sure, m8, but can any class stand 28+ meters away from other groups and AOE execute spam like there is no tomorrow?
On top of everything you wrote, you want to deny that sorc have best mobility in game. Boundless storm - 6 sec major expedition, while providing major resistances and damaging everything around caster. And bolt/streak, non target spammable
engage/escape mechanics... Who on Nirn have better mobility than that? Oh, yeah, I know. A stamina sorcerer Orsimer.

You know you are clueless when you refer to streak as a spammable

Never ever seen Sorc using it 3 times in a row? Guess you never ever set foot or whatever u use to move in Cyrodiil

3 times = spammable
*facepalm*

You are right tho. 3 times. Thats as much as u can cast it. Cause after that the cost is 10k+ and you have already spent about 15k magicka for those 3 streaks. Problem is that those 3 casts wont get you anywhere most of the time. The first two casts are barely enough to get you out of gap close range.

Like i said. Clueless.
So instead of you telling me if i ever step foot in cyro, how about you actually playing a sorc for at least 1 hour before you refer to streak as a spammable.

Lol I can streak 3 times on stamina Sorc Orsimer. I am terribly sorry that you cannot streak 27x in a row, seems that your idea of spammable is a bit inflated.

Enslaved · September 2017

Feanor wrote: »

@pieratsos

Ssssshhh. Don't shatter his world view. Don't tell him that Sorcs get additional fun attached to Streak with that self root. He might think that it's not so great after all (yes Streak is nice if you use it offensively but bad as an escape skill).

Not that other gap closers are not bugged. Try 2h charge or 1h&s one. Every now and then you end falling trough world or in loading screen of death.

pieratsos · September 2017

Enslaved wrote: »

Feanor wrote: »

@pieratsos

Ssssshhh. Don't shatter his world view. Don't tell him that Sorcs get additional fun attached to Streak with that self root. He might think that it's not so great after all (yes Streak is nice if you use it offensively but bad as an escape skill).

Not that other gap closers are not bugged. Try 2h charge or 1h&s one. Every now and then you end falling trough world or in loading screen of death.

Streak is spammable and OP because gap closers are bugged. Got it now.

But since you like talking about bugs let me refer to the streak bug. Streak was bugged for like 3 months if not more. You were literally casting the skill and not only streak wouldnt go off, but you also couldnt cast any ability at all for a few seconds.

Feanor · September 2017

@Enslaved

The difference is that it's not a bug. It's intended. Streak always roots the Sorc in one direction. Streak is a great offensive tool but not a very good one for escaping - if you can't LoS.