Is ESO an MMO?

KochDerDamonen · June 2017

ESO is considered an MMO and has a blend of solo and group content

Bombashaman wrote: »

Stovahkiin wrote: »

ESO is massive. ESO is multiplayer. ESO is online. ESO is an MMO

Well you need to convince Firor about that. He thinks it's something different even if it fulfills the criteria of MMO. And I believe he wouldn't lie.

The point I was making on that other thread ( https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/4279769#Comment_4279769 ) was that people try to nail their vision of MMO on others. Should those who RPG in this game (follow the story and "interact"), bash people who just play the game because of PvP or just want to dress their toons pretty and prance around? I mean, this is also RPG.

ZOS says they don't want to consider this game as another "traditional" MMO. So why should we?

@Bombashaman I mean, I can start a band and call it Transcendental Moon Funk despite being a trashy first-time garage rock band, and have a big right-up about how we're not the usual rockband because we go beyond the moon for inspiration and allow our listeners to go on a journey of their own creation through the stars, maaan...

But well, you and I both know what it actually is. ESO is an MMO, it doesn't have to be a clone of WoW/Runescape/Everquest/Maplestory/etc. to be classified as such. It's an RPG with character building, and online with a large number of people including those in cooperative PvE instances, PvP situations, just... walking-around-and-maybe-socializing instances.

Belegnole · June 2017

ESO is considered an MMO and has a blend of solo and group content

What...... Can somebody just put the trolls back under the bridge.

GeorgeBlack · June 2017

ESO is not an MMO, and focuses on solo play with some group content available

May I suggest a fourth option "Eso is an mmorpg that does not follow mmorpg norms and rules"

If one char is able to learn all gathering/crafting, obtain highest weapons by soloing maelstrom arena and if they can reach Level Cap without forming a group not even once, I don't consider it a proper mmorpg.

It really feels like Assassin's Creed Unity in which you only have to group for a handful of group content.
Other mmrpgs have a majority of group orientated Hunting Zones and world bosses in each map zone. Eso has 1 dungeon that needs 4 people to clear in each map Zone.
Other mmorpgs have 5-10 world bosses deep inside tough group zones that drop legendary gear, eso has 4-5 trials, and many sets can be farmed in dolmens/overland "bosses" by soloing.

In the last Eso Live the PvPer guest made me kinda laugh when he said that ESO was his first mmorpg.
Eso PvP compared to PvP in other mmorpgs is soooooo casually made. No skill cooldown may work in rpg TES games but it's not the way to go in PvP. PvP in mmorpgs is the proper use of abilities against each enemy (tank, warrior, rogue, nuker, debuffer, support). PvP in Eso is number crunching and meta following.

ESO is an mmorpg. It's a very unique mmorpg. Even though I'm having a good time, I would dislike seeing other studios using ESO as an example for mmorpgs.

Bombashaman · June 2017

ESO is not an MMO, and focuses on solo play with some group content available

KochDerDamonen wrote: »

@Bombashaman I mean, I can start a band and call it Transcendental Moon Funk despite being a trashy first-time garage rock band, and have a big right-up about how we're not the usual rockband because we go beyond the moon for inspiration and allow our listeners to go on a journey of their own creation through the stars, maaan...

But well, you and I both know what it actually is. ESO is an MMO, it doesn't have to be a clone of WoW/Runescape/Everquest/Maplestory/etc. to be classified as such. It's an RPG with character building, and online with a large number of people including those in cooperative PvE instances, PvP situations, just... walking-around-and-maybe-socializing instances.

Well yeah, but where would all this beautiful discussion then be? I have interacted on these forums way way more than I have in the game. THIS is the MMORPG, not the game

Only reason I picked the dreaded another option was that the one maker of this game says this isn't an MMO. I have this (maybe illusory) opinion that who better to categorize a game than one making that very game.

Linaleah · June 2017

ESO is considered an MMO and has a blend of solo and group content

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

Bombashaman wrote: »

I just leave this here:

ESO isn't really an MMO in the traditional sense anyway:

"To answer your question about comparing ESO to other MMOs: ESO is not really a traditional MMO, so we don’t use that term much around the office – and it is this distinction that separates it from other games. If you want to play it solo, like you did with other Elder Scrolls games, you can do that. If you want to play it super-grindy with dungeons, Trials, and group bosses as the core of you experience, you can join up with others and do that too."

And made it even clearer in a recent interview last week:

“We don’t even use the term MMO with The Elder Scrolls Online anymore, because really it’s not,” game director Matt Firor says. “MMO was a term coined in 1997 with Ultima Online, EverQuest, and Dark Age of Camelot – we are not that game.”

He meant that ESO isn't a traditional MMO, but by the definition of an MMO, it is still an MMO, just not the kind of MMO that we are used to.

but its EXACTLY the kind of MMO's i'm used to. but.. i didn't get into MMO's until WoW came out and made MMO's accessible and playable solo. MMO hasn't meant "must group for everything, and cannot play solo at all" for a while now.

Bombashaman · June 2017

ESO is not an MMO, and focuses on solo play with some group content available

Linaleah wrote: »

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

Bombashaman wrote: »

I just leave this here:

ESO isn't really an MMO in the traditional sense anyway:

"To answer your question about comparing ESO to other MMOs: ESO is not really a traditional MMO, so we don’t use that term much around the office – and it is this distinction that separates it from other games. If you want to play it solo, like you did with other Elder Scrolls games, you can do that. If you want to play it super-grindy with dungeons, Trials, and group bosses as the core of you experience, you can join up with others and do that too."

And made it even clearer in a recent interview last week:

“We don’t even use the term MMO with The Elder Scrolls Online anymore, because really it’s not,” game director Matt Firor says. “MMO was a term coined in 1997 with Ultima Online, EverQuest, and Dark Age of Camelot – we are not that game.”

He meant that ESO isn't a traditional MMO, but by the definition of an MMO, it is still an MMO, just not the kind of MMO that we are used to.

but its EXACTLY the kind of MMO's i'm used to. but.. i didn't get into MMO's until WoW came out and made MMO's accessible and playable solo. MMO hasn't meant "must group for everything, and cannot play solo at all" for a while now.

On one interview ZOS said ESO is "online RPG". So they dropped the Massive Multiplayer from the MMORPG. Which is kinda weird as ESO do feel massive, and there do are many players zooming around, but it sure as h*ll doesn't feel like an RPG. More like an adventure park.

F7sus4 · June 2017

ESO is considered an MMO and has a blend of solo and group content

I didn't know it's possible to live without a brain, but so far 25 people managed to do it, somehow.

Bombashaman · June 2017

ESO is not an MMO, and focuses on solo play with some group content available

F7sus4 wrote: »

I didn't know it's possible to live without a brain, but so far 25 people managed to do it, somehow.

Pft. You can nag better than that, I have seen it. But some effort in it!

DarkAedin · June 2017

Bombashaman wrote: »

I just leave this here:

ESO isn't really an MMO in the traditional sense anyway:

"To answer your question about comparing ESO to other MMOs: ESO is not really a traditional MMO, so we don’t use that term much around the office – and it is this distinction that separates it from other games. If you want to play it solo, like you did with other Elder Scrolls games, you can do that. If you want to play it super-grindy with dungeons, Trials, and group bosses as the core of you experience, you can join up with others and do that too."

And made it even clearer in a recent interview last week:

“We don’t even use the term MMO with The Elder Scrolls Online anymore, because really it’s not,” game director Matt Firor says. “MMO was a term coined in 1997 with Ultima Online, EverQuest, and Dark Age of Camelot – we are not that game.”

I tend to believe what the people who makes the game, say. Maybe naive. A fault of mine, I admit.

Its ok morrowind wasnt a dlc either rrriiiiggggggghhhhttttt?????

While we are at it, I have this bridge over here....

CherryCake · June 2017

ESO is considered an MMO and has a blend of solo and group content

..................?

RIGHTEOUS_REPORT · June 2017

Its not a MMO, its a MDR.

Massive Disneyland Ride.

Dracindo · June 2017

ESO is considered an MMO and has a blend of solo and group content

No, it's an Assassin's Creed game.</sarcasm>
Or that's how me and my friend often play it.

ThoraxtheDark · June 2017

ESO is considered an MMO and has a blend of solo and group content

i feel like OP was originally against it being an MMO. The three choices were so coerced and gave you little room to even validate that, Yes it is an mmo. Not just " it is considered an MMO"

Do some people consider this the internet?

Do some people consider that they're hungry?

Very biased Poll lmao but i see the OP has changed his mind. 90% is a big thing to disagree against. lmao

Bombashaman · June 2017

ESO is not an MMO, and focuses on solo play with some group content available

ThoraxtheDark wrote: »

i feel like OP was originally against it being an MMO. The three choices were so coerced and gave you little room to even validate that, Yes it is an mmo. Not just " it is considered an MMO"

Do some people consider this the internet?

Do some people consider that they're hungry?

Very biased Poll lmao but i see the OP has changed his mind. 90% is a big thing to disagree against. lmao

It's the time for alternative facts!

Ozstryker · June 2017

ESO is considered an MMO and has a blend of solo and group content

Argah wrote: »

I think the question you should have asked was "is ESO a console game or PC"

Of course it's an MMO by definition but a PC type... No, not really.

For console yes.

How is a MMO on a Pc different to a MMO on a console......?

Bombashaman wrote: »

I just leave this here:

ESO isn't really an MMO in the traditional sense anyway:

"To answer your question about comparing ESO to other MMOs: ESO is not really a traditional MMO, so we don’t use that term much around the office – and it is this distinction that separates it from other games. If you want to play it solo, like you did with other Elder Scrolls games, you can do that. If you want to play it super-grindy with dungeons, Trials, and group bosses as the core of you experience, you can join up with others and do that too."

And made it even clearer in a recent interview last week:

“We don’t even use the term MMO with The Elder Scrolls Online anymore, because really it’s not,” game director Matt Firor says. “MMO was a term coined in 1997 with Ultima Online, EverQuest, and Dark Age of Camelot – we are not that game.”

I tend to believe what the people who makes the game, say. Maybe naive. A fault of mine, I admit.

"A rose by any other name is still a rose"

I think the reason the games creators try to label this as something other than an MMO is so that this game won't be considered in the same genre as other MMO's, therefore it won't be comparable to other games, such as WoW etc. Its a wonderful ploy to create ESO as a standalone brand!

It's like calling an expansion a chapter so it doesn't have to follow a traditional route..

Nermy · June 2017

Questions could be worded better. ESO is an MMO, not 'considered' one in my mind.

Sylosi · June 2017

GeorgeBlack wrote: »

If one char is able to learn all gathering/crafting, obtain highest weapons by soloing maelstrom arena and if they can reach Level Cap without forming a group not even once, I don't consider it a proper mmorpg.

You can get to level cap without forming a group in teh vast majority of MMORPGs, ESO is no different in that respect, getting top tier gear is hardly unique either, e.g in GW2 you can get the highest level tier of gear (armour, weapons and jewelry) completely solo.

GeorgeBlack wrote: »

ESO is an mmorpg. It's a very unique mmorpg.

Not really, ESO is fairly standard in many ways, the content is typical themepark MMORPG, quests, dungeons, raids, the action type combat is merely less common rather than unique, other MMORPGs like BDO have action combat, ESO is more "unique" than some of the WoW clones that have appeared over the years, but that is about it, an MMORPG like EVE Online is far closer to 'unique" than ESO will ever be.

GeorgeBlack wrote: »

In the last Eso Live the PvPer guest made me kinda laugh when he said that ESO was his first mmorpg.
Eso PvP compared to PvP in other mmorpgs is soooooo casually made. No skill cooldown may work in rpg TES games but it's not the way to go in PvP. PvP in mmorpgs is the proper use of abilities against each enemy (tank, warrior, rogue, nuker, debuffer, support). PvP in Eso is number crunching and meta following.

Not really, meta is the case in most MMOs, take GW2 for example, the meta is so pronounced in WvW (Cyrodil) that literally half the classes in the game are unwanted in any sort of large group play, whilst one is totally irreplaceable, even in the instanced PvP in GW2 there is always a dominating meta, and that is a game that was far more serious about "competitve" PvP than ESO, where it had ESL tournies for years, and guess what there would be tournies where some classes were entirely absent and other classes were in every single team comp, because 'meta' too strong....

The reality is that all themepark MMORPGs are joke PvP wise, the only sort of PvP MMORPGs can do well is large scale, but then really that only works when the game is based around it like in EVE.

Frankly if you want skilled, competitive PvP then the MMORPG genre is not the place to find it.

Wifeaggro13 · June 2017

ESO is not an MMO, and focuses on solo play with some group content available

Sibenice wrote: »

zyk wrote: »

The only thing massively multiplayer about ESO is Cyrodiil. PVE content is mostly single player/coop. I think Online RPG is a fitting description.

You can do a large portion of WoW single player as well. Does that make it not an MMORPG? In fact, most of the MMOs I just dabbled in I did everything solo. Just because you have an option to not do things with other people does not make the game not an MMO.

though im not a fan of WOW, it has incredible amounts of group content across all its level tiers. this game has very very little group content. and a lot of that group content can be solo'd or duo'd

GeorgeBlack · June 2017

ESO is not an MMO, and focuses on solo play with some group content available

Sylosi wrote: »

GeorgeBlack wrote: »

If one char is able to learn all gathering/crafting, obtain highest weapons by soloing maelstrom arena and if they can reach Level Cap without forming a group not even once, I don't consider it a proper mmorpg.

You can get to level cap without forming a group in teh vast majority of MMORPGs, ESO is no different in that respect, same thing with high level gear, e.g in GW2 you can get the highest level tier of gear (armour, weapons and jewelry) completely solo.

GeorgeBlack wrote: »

ESO is an mmorpg. It's a very unique mmorpg.

Not really, ESO is fairly standard in many ways, the content is typical themepark MMORPG, quests, dungeons, raids, the action type combat is merely less common rather than unique, other MMORPGs like BDO have action combat, ESO is more "unique" than some of the WoW clones that have appeared over the years, but that is about it, an MMORPG like EVE Online is far closer to 'unique" than ESO will ever be.

GeorgeBlack wrote: »

In the last Eso Live the PvPer guest made me kinda laugh when he said that ESO was his first mmorpg.
Eso PvP compared to PvP in other mmorpgs is soooooo casually made. No skill cooldown may work in rpg TES games but it's not the way to go in PvP. PvP in mmorpgs is the proper use of abilities against each enemy (tank, warrior, rogue, nuker, debuffer, support). PvP in Eso is number crunching and meta following.

Not really, meta is the case in most MMOs, take GW2 for example, the meta is so pronounced in WvW (Cyrodil) that literally half the classes in the game are unwanted in any sort of large group play, whilst one is totally irreplaceable, even in the instanced PvP in GW2 there is always a dominating meta, and that is a game that was far more serious about "competitve" PvP than ESO, where it had ESL tournies for years, and guess what there would be tournies where some classes were entirely absent and other classes were in every single team comp, because 'meta' too strong....

The reality is that all themepark MMORPGs are joke PvP wise, the only sort of PvP MMORPGs can do well is large scale, but then really that only works when the game is based around it like in EVE.

Frankly if you want skilled, competitive PvP then the MMORPG genre is not the place to find it.

We have not played the same MMORPGS

Linaleah · June 2017

ESO is considered an MMO and has a blend of solo and group content

Bombashaman wrote: »

Linaleah wrote: »

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

Bombashaman wrote: »

I just leave this here:

ESO isn't really an MMO in the traditional sense anyway:

"To answer your question about comparing ESO to other MMOs: ESO is not really a traditional MMO, so we don’t use that term much around the office – and it is this distinction that separates it from other games. If you want to play it solo, like you did with other Elder Scrolls games, you can do that. If you want to play it super-grindy with dungeons, Trials, and group bosses as the core of you experience, you can join up with others and do that too."

And made it even clearer in a recent interview last week:

“We don’t even use the term MMO with The Elder Scrolls Online anymore, because really it’s not,” game director Matt Firor says. “MMO was a term coined in 1997 with Ultima Online, EverQuest, and Dark Age of Camelot – we are not that game.”

He meant that ESO isn't a traditional MMO, but by the definition of an MMO, it is still an MMO, just not the kind of MMO that we are used to.

but its EXACTLY the kind of MMO's i'm used to. but.. i didn't get into MMO's until WoW came out and made MMO's accessible and playable solo. MMO hasn't meant "must group for everything, and cannot play solo at all" for a while now.

On one interview ZOS said ESO is "online RPG". So they dropped the Massive Multiplayer from the MMORPG. Which is kinda weird as ESO do feel massive, and there do are many players zooming around, but it sure as h*ll doesn't feel like an RPG. More like an adventure park.

it does feel like an rpg, a certain type of rpg. to me. but honestly it almost feels like ZOS is trying to appear to be different for the sake of seeming to be different even though they are not. to avoid the whole "another wannabe wow killer" stigma? or something. I don't even know, its the same mess with chapters. exercise in semantics to seem different

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

Sibenice wrote: »

zyk wrote: »

The only thing massively multiplayer about ESO is Cyrodiil. PVE content is mostly single player/coop. I think Online RPG is a fitting description.

You can do a large portion of WoW single player as well. Does that make it not an MMORPG? In fact, most of the MMOs I just dabbled in I did everything solo. Just because you have an option to not do things with other people does not make the game not an MMO.

though im not a fan of WOW, it has incredible amounts of group content across all its level tiers. this game has very very little group content. and a lot of that group content can be solo'd or duo'd

this game has lthe same amount of group content at all tiers as WoW does. possibly more, since with WoW you can outlevel EVERYTHING and including old raids (trial equivalents)that are MEANT to be soloed when at cap. here, you have to be pretty darn skilled and decently geared to solo instanced dungeons. in WoW.. all you need to do is go up a few levels. you can do far less grouping in WoW if you so wish, then in ESO.

world bosses in ESO unless you are above average? need a group. instanced dungeons? need a group and a bunch of them ARE meant to be done while still leveling. public dungeons - hit or miss, but its the equivalent of an overgeared WoW player soloing current dungeons. and btw, you can get overgeared in WoW completely solo as well, especially in this latest expansion. source? active WoW account. the only things I've been grouping for lately is once a week world bosses and holiday event - becasue for holiday event, you cannot reach it without being in group finder, at least as far as i know.

Sylosi · June 2017

GeorgeBlack wrote: »

Sylosi wrote: »

GeorgeBlack wrote: »

If one char is able to learn all gathering/crafting, obtain highest weapons by soloing maelstrom arena and if they can reach Level Cap without forming a group not even once, I don't consider it a proper mmorpg.

You can get to level cap without forming a group in teh vast majority of MMORPGs, ESO is no different in that respect, same thing with high level gear, e.g in GW2 you can get the highest level tier of gear (armour, weapons and jewelry) completely solo.

GeorgeBlack wrote: »

ESO is an mmorpg. It's a very unique mmorpg.

Not really, ESO is fairly standard in many ways, the content is typical themepark MMORPG, quests, dungeons, raids, the action type combat is merely less common rather than unique, other MMORPGs like BDO have action combat, ESO is more "unique" than some of the WoW clones that have appeared over the years, but that is about it, an MMORPG like EVE Online is far closer to 'unique" than ESO will ever be.

GeorgeBlack wrote: »

In the last Eso Live the PvPer guest made me kinda laugh when he said that ESO was his first mmorpg.
Eso PvP compared to PvP in other mmorpgs is soooooo casually made. No skill cooldown may work in rpg TES games but it's not the way to go in PvP. PvP in mmorpgs is the proper use of abilities against each enemy (tank, warrior, rogue, nuker, debuffer, support). PvP in Eso is number crunching and meta following.

Not really, meta is the case in most MMOs, take GW2 for example, the meta is so pronounced in WvW (Cyrodil) that literally half the classes in the game are unwanted in any sort of large group play, whilst one is totally irreplaceable, even in the instanced PvP in GW2 there is always a dominating meta, and that is a game that was far more serious about "competitve" PvP than ESO, where it had ESL tournies for years, and guess what there would be tournies where some classes were entirely absent and other classes were in every single team comp, because 'meta' too strong....

The reality is that all themepark MMORPGs are joke PvP wise, the only sort of PvP MMORPGs can do well is large scale, but then really that only works when the game is based around it like in EVE.

Frankly if you want skilled, competitive PvP then the MMORPG genre is not the place to find it.

We have not played the same MMORPGS

I've played most major MMORPGs, I have no idea what you have played that for example gives you the misconception that being unable to get to level cap without a group is a rarity. (hint: ESO, Rift, LOTRO, GW2, SWTOR and so on)

Bombashaman · June 2017

ESO is not an MMO, and focuses on solo play with some group content available

Linaleah wrote: »

it does feel like an rpg, a certain type of rpg. to me. but honestly it almost feels like ZOS is trying to appear to be different for the sake of seeming to be different even though they are not. to avoid the whole "another wannabe wow killer" stigma? or something. I don't even know, its the same mess with chapters. exercise in semantics to seem different.

ZOS and ESO doesn't really help RPing much. I'm comparing it to LOTRO as it is the other MMORPG I'm playing. LOTRO has better cosmetic system, more emotes and instruments you can play. Like really play, do music, pressing different notes. I don't RP, but many times I have stopped my grinding of different stuff just to pause and listen when group of roleplayers play like a band in towns.

Is a wonder, as this is supposed to be mmoRPG, that most of the people concentrate only that MMO part. In one poll, minority roleplays.

GeorgeBlack · June 2017

ESO is not an MMO, and focuses on solo play with some group content available

@Sylosi
Those games are bad.... except gw2

Sylosi · June 2017

GeorgeBlack wrote: »

@Sylosi
Those games are bad.... except gw2

Whether you think they are bad or not is irrelevant to the point.

Linaleah · June 2017

ESO is considered an MMO and has a blend of solo and group content

Bombashaman wrote: »

Linaleah wrote: »

it does feel like an rpg, a certain type of rpg. to me. but honestly it almost feels like ZOS is trying to appear to be different for the sake of seeming to be different even though they are not. to avoid the whole "another wannabe wow killer" stigma? or something. I don't even know, its the same mess with chapters. exercise in semantics to seem different.

ZOS and ESO doesn't really help RPing much. I'm comparing it to LOTRO as it is the other MMORPG I'm playing. LOTRO has better cosmetic system, more emotes and instruments you can play. Like really play, do music, pressing different notes. I don't RP, but many times I have stopped my grinding of different stuff just to pause and listen when group of roleplayers play like a band in towns.

Is a wonder, as this is supposed to be mmoRPG, that most of the people concentrate only that MMO part. In one poll, minority roleplays.

you know, I never understood that? I always thought that rp is about creativity of the mind. and rp doesn't always need to be done with other people. I like that in ESO I'm actualy helped by the game when it comes to figuring out what sort of person my character is - by being given choices in how I progress the quests. I have options for outfits to wear into battle vs outfits to wear when in their homes. they have homes! and mechanically, the skills we give to our characters, whether we focus them on magic or combat, passive bonuses - all of that is a part of an rpg. i mean... you don't get to rp against other people in solo games, and yet.. people don't argue whether they are rpg's. there are solo rpg's that have far fewer visual as well as mechanical customization options then ESO and yet there is no doubt that they are rpg's. there are rpg's that have no preset emotes. no toys.

and seriously housing was the biggest thing ZOS could have done to help rp along. because now there's a plethora of options on creating actual environments to play out the stories in, while keeping them private enough to not be disrupted by those not into role playing.

Wifeaggro13 · June 2017

ESO is not an MMO, and focuses on solo play with some group content available

Linaleah wrote: »

Bombashaman wrote: »

Linaleah wrote: »

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

Bombashaman wrote: »

I just leave this here:

ESO isn't really an MMO in the traditional sense anyway:

"To answer your question about comparing ESO to other MMOs: ESO is not really a traditional MMO, so we don’t use that term much around the office – and it is this distinction that separates it from other games. If you want to play it solo, like you did with other Elder Scrolls games, you can do that. If you want to play it super-grindy with dungeons, Trials, and group bosses as the core of you experience, you can join up with others and do that too."

And made it even clearer in a recent interview last week:

“We don’t even use the term MMO with The Elder Scrolls Online anymore, because really it’s not,” game director Matt Firor says. “MMO was a term coined in 1997 with Ultima Online, EverQuest, and Dark Age of Camelot – we are not that game.”

He meant that ESO isn't a traditional MMO, but by the definition of an MMO, it is still an MMO, just not the kind of MMO that we are used to.

but its EXACTLY the kind of MMO's i'm used to. but.. i didn't get into MMO's until WoW came out and made MMO's accessible and playable solo. MMO hasn't meant "must group for everything, and cannot play solo at all" for a while now.

On one interview ZOS said ESO is "online RPG". So they dropped the Massive Multiplayer from the MMORPG. Which is kinda weird as ESO do feel massive, and there do are many players zooming around, but it sure as h*ll doesn't feel like an RPG. More like an adventure park.

it does feel like an rpg, a certain type of rpg. to me. but honestly it almost feels like ZOS is trying to appear to be different for the sake of seeming to be different even though they are not. to avoid the whole "another wannabe wow killer" stigma? or something. I don't even know, its the same mess with chapters. exercise in semantics to seem different

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

Sibenice wrote: »

zyk wrote: »

The only thing massively multiplayer about ESO is Cyrodiil. PVE content is mostly single player/coop. I think Online RPG is a fitting description.

You can do a large portion of WoW single player as well. Does that make it not an MMORPG? In fact, most of the MMOs I just dabbled in I did everything solo. Just because you have an option to not do things with other people does not make the game not an MMO.

though im not a fan of WOW, it has incredible amounts of group content across all its level tiers. this game has very very little group content. and a lot of that group content can be solo'd or duo'd

this game has lthe same amount of group content at all tiers as WoW does. possibly more, since with WoW you can outlevel EVERYTHING and including old raids (trial equivalents)that are MEANT to be soloed when at cap. here, you have to be pretty darn skilled and decently geared to solo instanced dungeons. in WoW.. all you need to do is go up a few levels. you can do far less grouping in WoW if you so wish, then in ESO.

world bosses in ESO unless you are above average? need a group. instanced dungeons? need a group and a bunch of them ARE meant to be done while still leveling. public dungeons - hit or miss, but its the equivalent of an overgeared WoW player soloing current dungeons. and btw, you can get overgeared in WoW completely solo as well, especially in this latest expansion. source? active WoW account. the only things I've been grouping for lately is once a week world bosses and holiday event - becasue for holiday event, you cannot reach it without being in group finder, at least as far as i know.

just out of cursiousity what end game activites are you doing in ESO currently and what incentive do you find to do it. Personaly im not a fan of Tam one . it was a step to far in one direction , the fact that most of the four mans can be solo'd if your a good player with good gear is an indication its CP system is completely broken. the basic problem with am one is they nerfed the game to a diluted state that requires no skill , community developed friendships, though i thought ESO was going ina good direction fo r its first year albiet very slowly. from my perspective ESO has now focused on making money of the community that does not even play the whole game. throw out some single player zone 3 times a year with some quests and bad story, pump out some crow crate items and milk the churning player base. From my perspective thats something you start doing post 5 years of launch after you have expanded and enriched game systems, AA have a full class an roll roster, and several options to end game activities. they could have done a lot more EQ2 type development .

Bombashaman · June 2017

ESO is not an MMO, and focuses on solo play with some group content available

Linaleah wrote: »

Bombashaman wrote: »

Linaleah wrote: »

it does feel like an rpg, a certain type of rpg. to me. but honestly it almost feels like ZOS is trying to appear to be different for the sake of seeming to be different even though they are not. to avoid the whole "another wannabe wow killer" stigma? or something. I don't even know, its the same mess with chapters. exercise in semantics to seem different.

ZOS and ESO doesn't really help RPing much. I'm comparing it to LOTRO as it is the other MMORPG I'm playing. LOTRO has better cosmetic system, more emotes and instruments you can play. Like really play, do music, pressing different notes. I don't RP, but many times I have stopped my grinding of different stuff just to pause and listen when group of roleplayers play like a band in towns.

Is a wonder, as this is supposed to be mmoRPG, that most of the people concentrate only that MMO part. In one poll, minority roleplays.

you know, I never understood that? I always thought that rp is about creativity of the mind. and rp doesn't always need to be done with other people. I like that in ESO I'm actualy helped by the game when it comes to figuring out what sort of person my character is - by being given choices in how I progress the quests. I have options for outfits to wear into battle vs outfits to wear when in their homes. they have homes! and mechanically, the skills we give to our characters, whether we focus them on magic or combat, passive bonuses - all of that is a part of an rpg. i mean... you don't get to rp against other people in solo games, and yet.. people don't argue whether they are rpg's. there are solo rpg's that have far fewer visual as well as mechanical customization options then ESO and yet there is no doubt that they are rpg's. there are rpg's that have no preset emotes. no toys.

and seriously housing was the biggest thing ZOS could have done to help rp along. because now there's a plethora of options on creating actual environments to play out the stories in, while keeping them private enough to not be disrupted by those not into role playing.

LOTRO just has more tools for RP, they have these same things as are in ESO, and then some more. More ways to express oneself. I'm saying ESO could be more RP-friendly, as this is supposed to be also a roleplaying game.

Browiseth · June 2017

ESO is considered an MMO and has a blend of solo and group content

a meme for your thoughts

Bombashaman · June 2017

ESO is not an MMO, and focuses on solo play with some group content available

Browiseth wrote: »

a meme for your thoughts

Me. There isn't really anything else I want to debate about, the game is fine, no bugs and playing is fine. This is a good topic to discuss.

Linaleah · June 2017

ESO is considered an MMO and has a blend of solo and group content

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

Linaleah wrote: »

Bombashaman wrote: »

Linaleah wrote: »

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

Bombashaman wrote: »

I just leave this here:

ESO isn't really an MMO in the traditional sense anyway:

"To answer your question about comparing ESO to other MMOs: ESO is not really a traditional MMO, so we don’t use that term much around the office – and it is this distinction that separates it from other games. If you want to play it solo, like you did with other Elder Scrolls games, you can do that. If you want to play it super-grindy with dungeons, Trials, and group bosses as the core of you experience, you can join up with others and do that too."

And made it even clearer in a recent interview last week:

“We don’t even use the term MMO with The Elder Scrolls Online anymore, because really it’s not,” game director Matt Firor says. “MMO was a term coined in 1997 with Ultima Online, EverQuest, and Dark Age of Camelot – we are not that game.”

He meant that ESO isn't a traditional MMO, but by the definition of an MMO, it is still an MMO, just not the kind of MMO that we are used to.

but its EXACTLY the kind of MMO's i'm used to. but.. i didn't get into MMO's until WoW came out and made MMO's accessible and playable solo. MMO hasn't meant "must group for everything, and cannot play solo at all" for a while now.

On one interview ZOS said ESO is "online RPG". So they dropped the Massive Multiplayer from the MMORPG. Which is kinda weird as ESO do feel massive, and there do are many players zooming around, but it sure as h*ll doesn't feel like an RPG. More like an adventure park.

it does feel like an rpg, a certain type of rpg. to me. but honestly it almost feels like ZOS is trying to appear to be different for the sake of seeming to be different even though they are not. to avoid the whole "another wannabe wow killer" stigma? or something. I don't even know, its the same mess with chapters. exercise in semantics to seem different

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

Sibenice wrote: »

zyk wrote: »

The only thing massively multiplayer about ESO is Cyrodiil. PVE content is mostly single player/coop. I think Online RPG is a fitting description.

You can do a large portion of WoW single player as well. Does that make it not an MMORPG? In fact, most of the MMOs I just dabbled in I did everything solo. Just because you have an option to not do things with other people does not make the game not an MMO.

though im not a fan of WOW, it has incredible amounts of group content across all its level tiers. this game has very very little group content. and a lot of that group content can be solo'd or duo'd

this game has lthe same amount of group content at all tiers as WoW does. possibly more, since with WoW you can outlevel EVERYTHING and including old raids (trial equivalents)that are MEANT to be soloed when at cap. here, you have to be pretty darn skilled and decently geared to solo instanced dungeons. in WoW.. all you need to do is go up a few levels. you can do far less grouping in WoW if you so wish, then in ESO.

world bosses in ESO unless you are above average? need a group. instanced dungeons? need a group and a bunch of them ARE meant to be done while still leveling. public dungeons - hit or miss, but its the equivalent of an overgeared WoW player soloing current dungeons. and btw, you can get overgeared in WoW completely solo as well, especially in this latest expansion. source? active WoW account. the only things I've been grouping for lately is once a week world bosses and holiday event - becasue for holiday event, you cannot reach it without being in group finder, at least as far as i know.

just out of cursiousity what end game activites are you doing in ESO currently and what incentive do you find to do it. Personaly im not a fan of Tam one . it was a step to far in one direction , the fact that most of the four mans can be solo'd if your a good player with good gear is an indication its CP system is completely broken. the basic problem with am one is they nerfed the game to a diluted state that requires no skill , community developed friendships, though i thought ESO was going ina good direction fo r its first year albiet very slowly. from my perspective ESO has now focused on making money of the community that does not even play the whole game. throw out some single player zone 3 times a year with some quests and bad story, pump out some crow crate items and milk the churning player base. From my perspective thats something you start doing post 5 years of launch after you have expanded and enriched game systems, AA have a full class an roll roster, and several options to end game activities. they could have done a lot more EQ2 type development .

I do mostly occasional trials and dungeons. and thank the bloody god they didn't do more of full on evercrack type development, the days of forced grouping in MMO's are long LONG gone. and they are NOT coming back. vast VAST majority of moddern mmo's (and I only say majority, rather then all becasue i haven't played all existing MMO's) offer a mix of solo and group content, with ability to solo your way to level cap and experience large chunks of the game solo, without having to group even once. its done so that you can choose to be social, while still staying casual

incidentally, no, i cannot solo dungeons in ESO, especialy not after one Tamriel. one tamriel has done more to force grouping than anything else in this game. i HAVE to be in a group to do them, yes even on story mode. most people can't, btw. there are people who, in WoW at least - solo current raid bosses. they are NOT the norm. they do it for the challenge and to see if they can, the rest of us - NEED to group for them. just becasue a few people can solo group content, doesn't make it any less of a content meant for and usually done in a group.

Bombashaman wrote: »

Linaleah wrote: »

Bombashaman wrote: »

Linaleah wrote: »

it does feel like an rpg, a certain type of rpg. to me. but honestly it almost feels like ZOS is trying to appear to be different for the sake of seeming to be different even though they are not. to avoid the whole "another wannabe wow killer" stigma? or something. I don't even know, its the same mess with chapters. exercise in semantics to seem different.

ZOS and ESO doesn't really help RPing much. I'm comparing it to LOTRO as it is the other MMORPG I'm playing. LOTRO has better cosmetic system, more emotes and instruments you can play. Like really play, do music, pressing different notes. I don't RP, but many times I have stopped my grinding of different stuff just to pause and listen when group of roleplayers play like a band in towns.

Is a wonder, as this is supposed to be mmoRPG, that most of the people concentrate only that MMO part. In one poll, minority roleplays.

you know, I never understood that? I always thought that rp is about creativity of the mind. and rp doesn't always need to be done with other people. I like that in ESO I'm actualy helped by the game when it comes to figuring out what sort of person my character is - by being given choices in how I progress the quests. I have options for outfits to wear into battle vs outfits to wear when in their homes. they have homes! and mechanically, the skills we give to our characters, whether we focus them on magic or combat, passive bonuses - all of that is a part of an rpg. i mean... you don't get to rp against other people in solo games, and yet.. people don't argue whether they are rpg's. there are solo rpg's that have far fewer visual as well as mechanical customization options then ESO and yet there is no doubt that they are rpg's. there are rpg's that have no preset emotes. no toys.

and seriously housing was the biggest thing ZOS could have done to help rp along. because now there's a plethora of options on creating actual environments to play out the stories in, while keeping them private enough to not be disrupted by those not into role playing.

LOTRO just has more tools for RP, they have these same things as are in ESO, and then some more. More ways to express oneself.

and? a lot of games have fewer tools. some of the single player rpg's don't even let you customize appearance or gender of your character (like Witcher) and yet are lauded as best rpg of the generation.