dpencil1 wrote: »

They specifically said in an ESO Live that future DLCs would not be tied to chapter purchases.

They've said many things in the past that haven't held true.

STEVIL wrote: »

"That's because there's no difference and it's not an expansion. Literally nothing was expanded so no idea why ZeniMax chooses to describe a chapter as an expansion."

typing one handed to double check my math...

Number of classes available before morrow expansion - 1-2-3-4... 4 fingers so... 4

Number of classes after Morrow expansion... 1-2-3-4-5... 4 finger plus a thumb so....5

5 is more than 4.

hmmm...

Did any other DLCs add classes?
IC - no
orsinium - no
Tg - no
DB - no
hist pits - no

So, literally the number of classes expanded from 4 to 5 and no other DLC did this...

Hmmm...

Are you using the new mis-definition of literally that means "not literally at all"?

Oh c'mon man, I watched a review video somewhere on youtube that clearly stated WARDEN as a playable class. That was 2013...NOT new by any means >_< More like waaaay late :P

STEVIL wrote: »

"That's because there's no difference and it's not an expansion. Literally nothing was expanded so no idea why ZeniMax chooses to describe a chapter as an expansion."

typing one handed to double check my math...

Number of classes available before morrow expansion - 1-2-3-4... 4 fingers so... 4

Number of classes after Morrow expansion... 1-2-3-4-5... 4 finger plus a thumb so....5

5 is more than 4.

hmmm...

Did any other DLCs add classes?
IC - no
orsinium - no
Tg - no
DB - no
hist pits - no

So, literally the number of classes expanded from 4 to 5 and no other DLC did this...

Hmmm...

Are you using the new mis-definition of literally that means "not literally at all"?

Dlc. Can be purchased with crowns. Lower income from Morrowind release because they get no new income from people with plenty of crowns.

Chapter. Can be purchased only with real currency. Every purchase is money in their companies pocket.

This is the difference with Wrothgar and Morrowind. They are equivalent in terms of content but are sold in different ways. It assures them new revenue, no one can buy it with crown they may have stored for years.

As for expansion... wrothgar added a new mode with leaderboards and expanded the world of Tamriel significantly. Any content dlc expands the game. That doesn't seem like an argument for expansion. Expansions don't have to include classes.

I'm not going to say I agree with how they sold this thing. It is in my opinion worth what they are charging. Calling it a chapter and not allowing crown purchase is debatable.

Avalon wrote: »

This is the problem. The only thing I can see as a possibility is that they have stuff planned to be built off of Morrowind somehow, and this will be the gateway to getting those extra pieces. But, that would then mean further movement away from the ESO+ gets all DLC's free thing, since those DLC's would say ESO+ & Morrowind 'chapter'. I don't see a good, reasonable path from here without completely seeming like cash grabs.

This right here would make me stop paying any more into the game.

Xylphan wrote: »

The other problem here is that complainers keep comparing it to expansions in other games. Morrowind is a one time purchase. You buy it once, and you can play it for as long as the servers remain active. No subscriptions, not crown store purchases, nothing. You can go away for a year, come back, and hop right into the game. A special event is coming up you want to hop back in the game for, feel free to do so.

You can buy four DLC right now in the crown store for 5500 crowns. Which is what I did. I will wait for a price drop to play Morrowind as it looked small and I didn't like the way ZoS made the change to "Chapters"

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

Fun Fact for the OP:

Completing the Morrowind Main quest is not the same as completing all the Morrowind achievements.

Achievements are not content. They are goals.

Uncle_Sweetshare wrote: »

Ya'll are sitting here arguing over whether or not Vvardenfell has enough content (which I don't think it does), and meanwhile, all the players that bought Morrowind for Battlegrounds are stuck sitting on their hands waiting for the patch notes that will likely never come implementing features that should have been in Battlegrounds from the start...

But don't mind us, we'll just be waiting.

Saw this coming a mile away.
Not sure as to why others would thing BG would work when they have had GF problems since day one.
I can only imagine you where hopeful or that you believed in the Devs.
I have as much faith in the Devs as I have in the Bible being a true story.
Facts tend to say that the Devs have no clue.
Yet I still enjoy playing the game as it is fun until you hit a bug.
Say like GF and that is why I'm here and not playing in there.

My life is more important then your life, my problems are more real then your problems, my view is more correct then your view, my ignorance is less ignorant then your ignorance, I care only what I say and not about what you say.

What is what to whom and why.

Have a nice day.

STEVIL wrote: »

"That's because there's no difference and it's not an expansion. Literally nothing was expanded so no idea why ZeniMax chooses to describe a chapter as an expansion."

typing one handed to double check my math...

Number of classes available before morrow expansion - 1-2-3-4... 4 fingers so... 4

Number of classes after Morrow expansion... 1-2-3-4-5... 4 finger plus a thumb so....5

5 is more than 4.

hmmm...

Did any other DLCs add classes?
IC - no
orsinium - no
Tg - no
DB - no
hist pits - no

So, literally the number of classes expanded from 4 to 5 and no other DLC did this...

Hmmm...

Are you using the new mis-definition of literally that means "not literally at all"?

By your mis-definition the dark brotherhood and thieves guild were 'expansions' since they 'expanded' the existing guilds and skill lines, at least according to my rough count on fingers-and-thumbs.

Only trouble is ZOS themselves don't think it's an expansion they call it a chapter, which is basically whatever they say it is, so long as it means they don't have to include it in subscriptions or offer it for crowns.

In any case it is a DLC, very similar to Wrothgar. But don't let that stop you continuing to pop up on every thread as leading lady of the ZOS cheerleading squad

Orsinium spoiled us.
It's too bad we will only see something like that as a chapter from now on. It was basically Chapter 0.

Im having tons of fun for sure.

That's bussiness for you: New things are always more expensive, but die-hard fans will always want to be one of the first to have it in their possession. But I don't care for fashion, I prefer to buy my clothes at the lowest price.

Always wait for the price drop, and even then, wait for the sales. Don't pay more than €20 for Morrowind. It's not worth it. Hopefully you get a refund

JimT722 wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

"That's because there's no difference and it's not an expansion. Literally nothing was expanded so no idea why ZeniMax chooses to describe a chapter as an expansion."

typing one handed to double check my math...

Number of classes available before morrow expansion - 1-2-3-4... 4 fingers so... 4

Number of classes after Morrow expansion... 1-2-3-4-5... 4 finger plus a thumb so....5

5 is more than 4.

hmmm...

Did any other DLCs add classes?
IC - no
orsinium - no
Tg - no
DB - no
hist pits - no

So, literally the number of classes expanded from 4 to 5 and no other DLC did this...

Hmmm...

Are you using the new mis-definition of literally that means "not literally at all"?

Dlc. Can be purchased with crowns. Lower income from Morrowind release because they get no new income from people with plenty of crowns.

Chapter. Can be purchased only with real currency. Every purchase is money in their companies pocket.

This is the difference with Wrothgar and Morrowind. They are equivalent in terms of content but are sold in different ways. It assures them new revenue, no one can buy it with crown they may have stored for years.

As for expansion... wrothgar added a new mode with leaderboards and expanded the world of Tamriel significantly. Any content dlc expands the game. That doesn't seem like an argument for expansion. Expansions don't have to include classes.

I'm not going to say I agree with how they sold this thing. It is in my opinion worth what they are charging. Calling it a chapter and not allowing crown purchase is debatable.

Orsinium added solo arena and morrow added bg

Both added a new element to the competitive game options in that way.

Both added world bosses, delves, dailies, pub dungeons, and quests too.

Both were accompanied by significant base game changes.

Meanwhile, morrow also added new class while Orsinium... Uhhh...

Literally... Nothing.

STEVIL wrote: »

JimT722 wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

"That's because there's no difference and it's not an expansion. Literally nothing was expanded so no idea why ZeniMax chooses to describe a chapter as an expansion."

typing one handed to double check my math...

Number of classes available before morrow expansion - 1-2-3-4... 4 fingers so... 4

Number of classes after Morrow expansion... 1-2-3-4-5... 4 finger plus a thumb so....5

5 is more than 4.

hmmm...

Did any other DLCs add classes?
IC - no
orsinium - no
Tg - no
DB - no
hist pits - no

So, literally the number of classes expanded from 4 to 5 and no other DLC did this...

Hmmm...

Are you using the new mis-definition of literally that means "not literally at all"?

Dlc. Can be purchased with crowns. Lower income from Morrowind release because they get no new income from people with plenty of crowns.

Chapter. Can be purchased only with real currency. Every purchase is money in their companies pocket.

This is the difference with Wrothgar and Morrowind. They are equivalent in terms of content but are sold in different ways. It assures them new revenue, no one can buy it with crown they may have stored for years.

As for expansion... wrothgar added a new mode with leaderboards and expanded the world of Tamriel significantly. Any content dlc expands the game. That doesn't seem like an argument for expansion. Expansions don't have to include classes.

I'm not going to say I agree with how they sold this thing. It is in my opinion worth what they are charging. Calling it a chapter and not allowing crown purchase is debatable.

Orsinium added solo arena and morrow added bg

Both added a new element to the competitive game options in that way.

Both added world bosses, delves, dailies, pub dungeons, and quests too.

Both were accompanied by significant base game changes.

Meanwhile, morrow also added new class while Orsinium... Uhhh...

Literally... Nothing.

Add the TG and DB DLC. Then you have two skill lines added, which is one skill line less than Morrowind, but makes up with extra content. Actually, let me throw in the Imperial City DLC as well. Now, you can buy the Guilds and Glory pack for €35 (€5 cheaper than MW).

Conclusion: Morrowind is worth much less than €34,99.

I finished oblivion's main quest in less than a night so i think its normal. never played morrowind though

Dracindo wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

JimT722 wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

"That's because there's no difference and it's not an expansion. Literally nothing was expanded so no idea why ZeniMax chooses to describe a chapter as an expansion."

typing one handed to double check my math...

Number of classes available before morrow expansion - 1-2-3-4... 4 fingers so... 4

Number of classes after Morrow expansion... 1-2-3-4-5... 4 finger plus a thumb so....5

5 is more than 4.

hmmm...

Did any other DLCs add classes?
IC - no
orsinium - no
Tg - no
DB - no
hist pits - no

So, literally the number of classes expanded from 4 to 5 and no other DLC did this...

Hmmm...

Are you using the new mis-definition of literally that means "not literally at all"?

Dlc. Can be purchased with crowns. Lower income from Morrowind release because they get no new income from people with plenty of crowns.

Chapter. Can be purchased only with real currency. Every purchase is money in their companies pocket.

This is the difference with Wrothgar and Morrowind. They are equivalent in terms of content but are sold in different ways. It assures them new revenue, no one can buy it with crown they may have stored for years.

As for expansion... wrothgar added a new mode with leaderboards and expanded the world of Tamriel significantly. Any content dlc expands the game. That doesn't seem like an argument for expansion. Expansions don't have to include classes.

I'm not going to say I agree with how they sold this thing. It is in my opinion worth what they are charging. Calling it a chapter and not allowing crown purchase is debatable.

Orsinium added solo arena and morrow added bg

Both added a new element to the competitive game options in that way.

Both added world bosses, delves, dailies, pub dungeons, and quests too.

Both were accompanied by significant base game changes.

Meanwhile, morrow also added new class while Orsinium... Uhhh...

Literally... Nothing.

Add the TG and DB DLC. Then you have two skill lines added, which is one skill line less than Morrowind, but makes up with extra content. Actually, let me throw in the Imperial City DLC as well. Now, you can buy the Guilds and Glory pack for €35 (€5 cheaper than MW).

Conclusion: Morrowind is worth much less than €34,99.

If that is how you choose to make value assessments that's on you.

For me, I do it differently.

To me and others who have in the past with db and 15th made similar points, a new skill line of 5-6 passive is not on par with a new skill line including 5 active, 1 ulti and 4+. Passives. But you choose to count them one for one, that's you.

To me and others comparing the way after launch discount bundle prices to the initial release price is also not a reasonable comparison.

But hey for some its conclusion first then construe a path to that.

I agree that Morrowind didn't deliver a great amount of content to be called an "Expansion" (See Diablo 2 LOD for example).
I believe that in time they will add more content (Jewelry crafting??) and make the game better.
But I must agree it's overpriced though Im still happy with the game

Hi, this is an entertaining and sometimes informative thread.

I hope to add something though I probably won't manage it. I don't think "adding something to this thread" has been a pre-requisite of all the posting people here though so hopefully I'll be forgiven regardless.

I paid for the Digital Collector's Edition on PSN so I'm surely in the high risk category of being ripped off.
I'm not pro or anti ZOS, I see this thread as pretty much an exploration of opinion peppered with genuine experience.

Like a lot of things you acquire only once, you never really know what you have until you buy it (or try it) and in that regard the OP has given some useful feedback for others - probably those who have read the comments but have not commented themselves. However, it's a forum and many users have taken this thread as a platform to share their own views or in some cases argument (possibly simply argumentative nature or even humour) rather than treat it as feedback.

I enjoy all of it, the opinions help me to understand what people consider fair or normal or about different expectations. It also shows me how we value different aspects of a game or how we play differently.

So basically, thanks everyone.

For my own personal input. I knew that I would be getting something I liked, though not necessarily how much of it or how it compares to other games in terms of value for money. I just knew I wanted to pay and have it rather than not. Finishing it in 5 hours, 10 hours, 25 hours, etc. probably wouldn't involve more than the difference of me checking a survey of "slightly satisfied with the value" compared with "very satisfied with the value". It probably wouldn't change my decision in retroactively anyway.
I like the update, I particularly like the Champion Points revamp and think that ZOS has put time into this, in order to improve and make viable several aspects of both PvE and PvP. I certainly feel that they have tried in this area. I am content for Morrowind to be satisfying for some but disappointing for others - this is normal for gamers. Perhaps ZOS will absorb some of the feedback though the most useful is how they can improve the game, specifically the mechanics, requests, solutions or ideas. Slamming an release regarding cost in a thread like this will only go so far against the actual money that will be harvested from such a release method.

I'm happy with it but I think it is important that those who are not can express that, especially if they explain why, and ways in which their dissatisfaction could have been avoided.

Happy adventuring.