Morrowind 0 free character slots for new warden, false advertising? (because of added cost)

Bravesteel · May 2017

Wreuntzylla wrote: »

Bravesteel wrote: »

No one is forcing you to keep your characters. No one is forcing you to play the Warden. No one is forcing you to buy character slots. It's not an industry standard to give away a free character slot when a new class comes out, give me a break. I can understand your frustration at not wanting to delete a character, buy a character slot, or just NOT play the Warden class, but this is a non-issue.

Which games haven't given a slot when a new class is released?

I don't remember WoW giving out a free character slot when Death Knights or Monks were released. I don't remember Neverwinter doing so when they released the Ranger, or EQ2 when they brought in the Beastmaster.

ADarklore · May 2017

mandricus wrote: »

ArchMikem wrote: »

You should consider by now that anything extra is going to cost money. This is a long term game, and they need a constant flow of revenue.

I agree.
And for this very reason, I think that not giving free character slots to play the new class it is a bad marketing strategy, because it's pissing off mostly the people that are granting that constant flow of revenue to Zenimax: old and loyal customers, ESO+ subscribers, that likely already have all characther slots filled.
New players won't notice at all this issue, as they will have 8 free slots to play whatever they want. Nor casual gamers, who typically are not ESO+ subscribers, as they typically don't have more than 1-2 alts.
I already pointed out this in the PTS feedbacks (https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/4081895/#Comment_4081895) as well with other things. Some things were addressed between 3.0.2 and Live (Pirate Skeleton, Dungeon Finder), most of them not.
You are right. This is a long term game, and they need a constant flow of revenue. So ZOS' goald should be to have as much subbed customers as they can, customers that are paying them every and each month.
With the choiches they've made (not giving Morrowind to ESO+ subscribers, not giving free character slots so old players who preordered the game now will have also to buy additional free slots) looks like they are just pissing off the people that were granting them that constant flow of revenue, just to earn some more additional money in the short term, whitout considering the long term impact of such marketing decisions.

Honestly, it seems to me that it's the people who are NOT offering a constant revenue flow, because if you cannot contribute 1500 Crown for a character slot, then chances are you haven't been investing much financially into the game. I bought tons of Crowns when they were on sale, I added another character slot for Warden. I contribute constant revenue to this game and it doesn't bother me in the slightest when they charge for something.

DHale · May 2017

They said from the beginning two additional slots would be available to purchase. TO PURCHASE. Nothing more to add...

Elsonso · May 2017

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

lordrichter wrote: »

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

lordrichter wrote: »

mandricus wrote: »

lordrichter wrote: »

I define active as logging in at least once every 30 days, and playing the game. These players are likely to be ESO Plus or buy Crowns on a regular basis.

A person that logs once every 30 days is likely to be ESO Plus subscriber? Meaning that he is paying 10 bucks each month just to login one or two times?
No offense, pal... on which planet do you live?

I define active as logging in at least once every 30 days, and playing the game. Includes the possibility that they log in more frequently, but not the possibility that they log in less frequently.

These player are likely to be ESO Plus or buy Crowns on a regular basis. Likely, as in having a high probability of occurring or being true, but not guaranteed, they pay for ESO Plus or buy Crowns regularly. That means that they can do ESO Plus, or they can buy Crowns, or they can do both.

A person only logging in once or twice a month is most likely not a subscriber and has little reason to buy crowns.

That's the definition of a most casual player and the smallest source of revenue Zos would have. Some may subscribe or have bought some crowns but that's the exception rather than the rule for this group.

Maybe we can call the an active uber casual.

I beg to disagree, obviously, but you probably already expected that.

It's your right to disagree. I'm just stating facts rather than oppinions.

It's even in everyone's choice to falsely state Zos as unethical or did false advertising Even when the facts do not begin to support it.

While we wait for you to post your facts, you are focusing too much on "once or twice a month", so let me explain.

Inside, you will find numbers that are made up for the purpose of example. By clicking on the SPOILER you agree that the numbers presented within are arbitrary and serve only as examples.

If there are 8.5 million players, and 100,000 of them play at least once every 30 days, my statement says that, in that group of 100,000, people are likely to be either ESO Plus members, buy Crowns, or both. To me, that means that, out of those 100,000 people, there will be a group of ESO Plus and a group of Crown buyers. The two groups overlap, to a degree. Totaled together, people in one, or both, of these two groups will comprise a solid majority of the 100,000 people. Probably close to 75,000, possibly higher.

Now, I have no numerical facts. I made up the numbers for the purpose of example. I do have a sense, from being in the game, that this may not be far from the truth. The overall statement, not the numbers. I see a lot of Crown costumes, pets, mounts, and other stuff. I can only speculate at the size of ESO Plus, but let's call it half of the in game population, on any given day. What I see in the game suggests to me that a lot of people spend money on this game, above and beyond the "entry fee".

As for the 30 days, that is also an arbitrary number. It is loosely based on guild roster observation and how long it has been since people logged in. It is important to remember that this is an inclusive range designed to separate the population into two groups.

Now, back to your facts, because I certainly don't have any.

jeradlub17_ESO · May 2017

Noones fault that you are an altaholic. Buy another character slot.

Cpt_Teemo · May 2017

Bravesteel wrote: »

Wreuntzylla wrote: »

Bravesteel wrote: »

No one is forcing you to keep your characters. No one is forcing you to play the Warden. No one is forcing you to buy character slots. It's not an industry standard to give away a free character slot when a new class comes out, give me a break. I can understand your frustration at not wanting to delete a character, buy a character slot, or just NOT play the Warden class, but this is a non-issue.

Which games haven't given a slot when a new class is released?

I don't remember WoW giving out a free character slot when Death Knights or Monks were released. I don't remember Neverwinter doing so when they released the Ranger, or EQ2 when they brought in the Beastmaster.

WoW always gave out free slot for each new class, cause I have 12/12 and there's 12 max classes and never once I bought a character slot, just level boost.

PlagueSD · May 2017

Rewws wrote: »

This post may seem like a unrefined rant, perhaps because it is, but I want people to see this and what I feel about it, to hear if I am unreasonable or if I am right:

Ok, my issue right now is that I "can't play Morrowind." I have already made 10 characters, I have leveled them all to level 50 and I am happy with how they look and the role they are intented to have. In order for me to play warden I need to buy character slots to create a new character. The way I see it you have robbed me of a chance to play the game the way I want to play it, by adding an additional cost to the game that you know you will make money on when you launched morrowind, which I find very cynical and irritating.

In my opinion, without adding atleast 1 free character space, you ask people to "kill one of their children". Asking all who have made a character in all character slots to delete one of them or spend more money then they had hoped to to buy slots for more characters. The other problem is that you should be encouraging people to play more, have more characters, be more online, be more active with more roles and knowledge of the game, but when you are so greedy on character creation it feels demotivating. You should be glad if people want to experience the game in more then 1 way / character.

Now you crown store is down, or doesn't allow me to make purchases, I've been promised early access for a game that cost me 100$ and I can't make a warden without killing one of my "children". Gaming is important to me, and I don't mind spending money, but the way your game is now more concerned about how to make the most money instead of how to make your playerbase the most happy and content with their gaming experience makes me want to boycott ESO permanently.

I have paid subscription for a long time and thrown literally thousands of dollars on this game, but I am largely unhappy with some of the choices you make, especially regarding fixing the dungeon tool feature. In the last 5-6 months it has been a nightmare to be a "dungeoneer" meaning I love to do dungeons, and when I tried using the dungeon tool to get into dungeons it infuriated me when I 99/100 times got teleported out, got kicked from group, got kicked from group AND given a dungeon deserter penalty from a feature NOT WORKING IN YOUR GAME!

In my experience, your pride of your game and it's functionality wasn't good enough, you didn't fix this. It has inflicted me with a great deal of wasted time, and pain. I have been robbed of gametime because the game I was paying for didn't give me what it promised, and I have posted it on the forums. I have tried to send tickets, but to no avail. I can't see any good reason why you shouldn't address this. Sure, most people solo queue and experience little to no problems, but this is an MMO for crying out loud, and the early functionality of questing and grouping in this game was discouraging for group play with friends and others, and this dungeon tool flop is too, you HAVE TO fix this faster.

I have seen that you have mentioned dungeon related fixes in the morrowind patch, but the magnitude of this problem for the last 6 months for people like me can't be expressed through words. I demand some kind of compensation for this, as I have paid subscription and tried my best to solve this matter, but without a shred of help from you. You have marked my tickets with "solved" and you have given me answers such as "we will look into this" "we are sorry to hear that" but that's just talk, you did nothing and I had to tear my hair out for 6 months because doing dungeons with my friends is what I like and wanted to do. I love this game but the feeling of greed and fixing money-income issues as a preoritized way to go makes me nauseated.

Fixed...

Oh, and by the way, If you're a paying subscriber, you get crowns as part of your subscription. 1500 crowns is basically 1 month's reward for subbing. If you've spend "thousands" of dollars in subscription fees, you should have plenty of crowns to afford another character slot.

Just my 2cp.

Nyghthowler · May 2017

1. I agree we should have received a free slot for the new class.
2. ZoS does things their own way, often to their detriment.
3. @OP, if you're gonna type a manifesto of that length PLEASE take the time to punctuate and use paragraphs. Wall of text crit'ed my eyes.

Whatelse73b14_ESO · May 2017

Holy no Paragraphs Batman!

darthbelanb14_ESO · May 2017

It's clear that the OP is only looking for people that agree with his opinion base on the few responses he has given. Based off the "False Advertisement" in his title the people who disagree with him are right. ZOS made no mention of a free character slot, and were pretty clear, even to a casual observer such as myself, that you would have to purchase the extra slots. So no false advertisement.

Bravesteel · May 2017

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

Bravesteel wrote: »

Wreuntzylla wrote: »

Bravesteel wrote: »

No one is forcing you to keep your characters. No one is forcing you to play the Warden. No one is forcing you to buy character slots. It's not an industry standard to give away a free character slot when a new class comes out, give me a break. I can understand your frustration at not wanting to delete a character, buy a character slot, or just NOT play the Warden class, but this is a non-issue.

Which games haven't given a slot when a new class is released?

I don't remember WoW giving out a free character slot when Death Knights or Monks were released. I don't remember Neverwinter doing so when they released the Ranger, or EQ2 when they brought in the Beastmaster.

WoW always gave out free slot for each new class, cause I have 12/12 and there's 12 max classes and never once I bought a character slot, just level boost.

Fair enough, my friend, but that is hardly creating a "industry standard" if one game does it.

S1ipperyJim · May 2017

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

no false advertising concerning character slots.

This is where it gets tricky. The information about each Morrowind package clearly stated what was included and none mentioned character slots. Further, Zos even stated as much and mentioned two additional slots would be available in the crown store for purchase.

You're arguing the wrong point sonny. I disagreed with your guff that we should all be OK with greedy business practices since that's what pays our salary IRL. I said nothing about false advertising. Maybe comprehension is not your strong point.

Pops_ND_Irish · May 2017

Nyghthowler wrote: »

1. I agree we should have received a free slot for the new class.
2. ZoS does things their own way, often to their detriment.
3. @OP, if you're gonna type a manifesto of that length PLEASE take the time to punctuate and use paragraphs. Wall of text crit'ed my eyes.

Yet you are still here

Kiwi · May 2017

angry pointless whinge

1/10

Khenarthi · May 2017

I remember the thread on this very same forum where, after Warden was announced and people asked if there would be more character slots, ZOS said yes, 2 would be made available. NOWHERE did they advertise that we could expect one, or both extra slots, to be free. So the "false advertising" you accuse them of is wrong.

1500 is not even expensive, when you consider the prices for costumes, mounts, and other stuff in the Crown Store.

I am an altoholic and would hate having to delete a character. I deleted a few before (veteran 8, and a veteran 16... back in the day) and those were sad times.

At the moment, I will gladly spend my crowns on expanding my character roster everytime this becomes available. I now have 2 baby Wardens sitting at the stables with their mounts for the next few weeks, bringing my character list to a happy group of 14 assorted Khajiit.

Also: just because some other games gave you a free slot, does not mean that this game is obliged to. It really irks me when people want free stuff because some other rival company gave them free stuff... it creates a culture and mentality that rub me the wrong way.

Maff · May 2017

I don't feel misled at all by ZOS not including extra slots, however I feel for anyone that didn't know about it before and find they have to spend more money after purchasing Morrowind.
This situation has disappointed me though. It's obvious the only reason to not include extra slots was to push people towards spending more money, be it for slots or mount and inventory upgrades. And this only targets certain players too.
Of course they need to make money but this method is a little underhanded in my opinion so I won't be buying Morrowind.

ookami007 · May 2017

It's ZoS, if you expected free.... you haven't been playing long enough.

Merlin13KAGL · May 2017

Rewws wrote: »

Ok, my issue right now is that I "can't play Morrowind" I have already made 10 characters.

Wait, I'm confused, because the base game comes with 8 slots.

So you've already paid for more slots, and you're upset that you have (the option) to pay for more slots?

You can play Morrowind. You can play it on one of 10 existing characters. You can add a slot and start new. You can delete a character and start new.

Is it lame that they did not include one complementary slot with purchase? Yes. Would people (especially those that didn't buy the expansion) raise holy P2W hell? Absoutely yes.

However, this isn't a surprise they forgot to mention - it's been known since the first announcement.

Again, this is no different than if you decided you wanted to make a new (insert any class here) in the current context.

Vivecc · May 2017

8 EIGHT !! slots for toons as a basis....and up to 14 if you spend your crowns on that.
This is great , just go out and compare that to other mmo´s.
Can´t understand whats to complain about, and no i don´t wanna read all that op

malchior · May 2017

Pretty much this. Why give value to customers when you can just fleece them again and again.

lnsane wrote: »

While they specifically stated that they'd only be expanding the maximum amount of slots (going from 12 to 14) and mentioned nothing about free ones whatsoever, I do agree with you that the result of not adding free slots is crippling experienced players with a full character list. They either have to fork over cash or delete a character they've invested in, to be able to play their new expansion.

It would have been nice of ZOS to add a free slot, or two.. Very nice indeed. But things don't tend to work that way in most businesses, as charity is a rare occurrence when you can just as easily make money off whatever you're releasing.

ANGEL_BtVS · May 2017

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

Bravesteel wrote: »

Wreuntzylla wrote: »

Bravesteel wrote: »

No one is forcing you to keep your characters. No one is forcing you to play the Warden. No one is forcing you to buy character slots. It's not an industry standard to give away a free character slot when a new class comes out, give me a break. I can understand your frustration at not wanting to delete a character, buy a character slot, or just NOT play the Warden class, but this is a non-issue.

Which games haven't given a slot when a new class is released?

I don't remember WoW giving out a free character slot when Death Knights or Monks were released. I don't remember Neverwinter doing so when they released the Ranger, or EQ2 when they brought in the Beastmaster.

WoW always gave out free slot for each new class, cause I have 12/12 and there's 12 max classes and never once I bought a character slot, just level boost.

Well there are only five max classes in ESO so you and everyone else should be good to go. In fact, ESO threw in an extra three free slots. Time to stop the unwarranted whining.

cbaudersub17_ESO · May 2017

I reflected on my childhood anger on all those Christmas mornings where 'batteries not included' wrecked my playtime fun. There's only so many smoke detectors in the house to steal those precious 9-volt batteries. And with siblings on the hunt too, well....

Not including a character slot (or both added) with the PURCHASE of the "chapter" was not exactly an angelic business move. Any marketing of Morrowind touting the warden as a playable class, WITHOUT the proper qualification, doesn't exactly pass the 'sniff test'. I really don't care to check as there's little doubt in my mind that ZOS is exercising an opportunity to exploit at least some of their customers with this release opportunity. Take money out of the equation, adding a character slot or two to a digital world as part of or for an additional fee to an expansion is a pretty insignificant action compared to all that went into the expansion.

At least in my 'batteries not included' jest, the toy company doesn't make the batteries.

As an aside, I find it interesting what others qualify as 'free' in this and every other discussion that centers on the dynamic ZOS monetization model and the business choices made behind its interpretive implementation.

sParkSnare · May 2017

Answer to question posed in title of thread: No

Elsonso · May 2017

Khenarthi wrote: »

1500 is not even expensive, when you consider the prices for costumes, mounts, and other stuff in the Crown Store.

Yeah, 1500 is expensive for a character slot. It is an entire month of ESO Plus.

I am full up (8/8), so a Khajiit Nightblade is going to the glue factory when the time comes to make a Warden.

Prof_Bawbag · May 2017

One of the reasons I'm not buying Morrowind until it hits the bargain bins. Their game, their rules and I have no issue with them charging for anything. Everything was clearly stated beforehand and is why I was able to make an informed choice of not pre ordering the game. That and no way am I paying more for an "expansion" than I did for ME:A, Horizon etc. They can charge what they like for their fluff, but I still have some standards when it comes to what I'm willing to pay for dlc, expansions and games.

Due to the price drop it has received on PSN before it's even been released, I can only assume the uptake hasn't been great due to the absurd pricing.