Morrowind 0 free character slots for new warden, false advertising? (because of added cost)

DeadlyRecluse · May 2017

Hard for it to be false advertising when they were perfectly clear about it.

That said, 1 free slot would have been nice.

Kiralyn2000 · May 2017

essi2 wrote: »

While providing atleast 1 free character slot when releasing a new class is the Industry norm, ZOS and Bethesda decided long ago they were far too good for industry norms and best practices.

I couldn't remember (haven't played that game in a long time), so I checked what WoW did. They only gave extra character slots when the number of classes became higher than the number of slots. (So, the 11th class came with an 11th slot, etc.)

Not sure what other games with a million classes have done (like EQ, Final Fantasy, etc), because I never played them.

Pops_ND_Irish · May 2017

Who cares what the other game did.
Another flamer who speed reads then complains

Elsonso · May 2017

mandricus wrote: »

ArchMikem wrote: »

You should consider by now that anything extra is going to cost money. This is a long term game, and they need a constant flow of revenue.

I agree.
And for this very reason, I think that not giving free character slots to play the new class it is a bad marketing strategy, because it's pissing off mostly the people that are granting that constant flow of revenue to Zenimax: old and loyal customers, ESO+ subscribers, that likely already have all characther slots filled.

I think most active accounts that support the game have fewer than 8 characters. If we could see the demographics data, we would probably be quite surprised at how many accounts have at least one open free slot. From a practical stand point, if the majority of players in the game have not even used 8 slots, giving them more is going to be a waste.

People who are at 8 slots and have purchased additional slots have proven that they will buy slots. Once you start down that path, you have said that it is fine to be on that path. While they might appreciate a free slot, they are the customer that will buy slots, anyway.

The sufferers are the people who are at exactly 8 slots filled, and are not willing to buy more slots. If we could see the demographics, we would probably see a very small number of people. I am in this boat, but I don't think I am even close to being in a lot of company.

So, in the first case, we have supporters of the game who have extra slots, so they really don't need another. In the second case, we have supporters of the game who have purchased additional slots, and so they are fine with doing it again, on some level. It is only the latter case, which I think it a tiny number of people, who fit your comment.

While the extra free slot would be nice, I can certainly see where it might not make as much sense as people think. Not a popular stance to take, I know.

Cpt_Teemo · May 2017

ArchMikem wrote: »

You should consider by now that anything extra is going to cost money. This is a long term game, and they need a constant flow of revenue.

Except for the 2x bank space which luckily they gave us free included in ESO+

mikeabboudb14_ESO · May 2017

essi2 wrote: »

While providing atleast 1 free character slot when releasing a new class is the Industry norm, ZOS and Bethesda decided long ago they were far too good for industry norms and best practices.

says who? i think you just made this up.

mikeabboudb14_ESO · May 2017

Here is an idea, delete a toon, best of all its free.

Queo · May 2017

Tipsy247 wrote: »

In defense of OP (if I am understanding correctly), he/she is not arguing that it was not addressed from the announcement, but that it is wrong not to offer a complimentary character to slot to play the new content ie the warden without either deleting content already purchased (10 character slots) or paying more than the Morrowind cost.

hmm i dont know, in his opening statement he declared ZoS had done false advertisement, indicating that he believes ZoS said they will get a free a char. slot.

If you spend money on upgrading, why didnt also add the price of more slots into the total cost of morrowind?

Now here is a Q i have for ZoS, unless I'm mistaking, why didn't they add 1 Extra slot for the limited addition? with adding the 2 extra slots, your not cheating any one who may have been at max before Morrowind....

JKorr · May 2017

lordrichter wrote: »

mandricus wrote: »

ArchMikem wrote: »

You should consider by now that anything extra is going to cost money. This is a long term game, and they need a constant flow of revenue.

I agree.
And for this very reason, I think that not giving free character slots to play the new class it is a bad marketing strategy, because it's pissing off mostly the people that are granting that constant flow of revenue to Zenimax: old and loyal customers, ESO+ subscribers, that likely already have all characther slots filled.

I think most active accounts that support the game have fewer than 8 characters. If we could see the demographics data, we would probably be quite surprised at how many accounts have at least one open free slot. From a practical stand point, if the majority of players in the game have not even used 8 slots, giving them more is going to be a waste.

People who are at 8 slots and have purchased additional slots have proven that they will buy slots. Once you start down that path, you have said that it is fine to be on that path. While they might appreciate a free slot, they are the customer that will buy slots, anyway.

The sufferers are the people who are at exactly 8 slots filled, and are not willing to buy more slots. If we could see the demographics, we would probably see a very small number of people. I am in this boat, but I don't think I am even close to being in a lot of company.

So, in the first case, we have supporters of the game who have extra slots, so they really don't need another. In the second case, we have supporters of the game who have purchased additional slots, and so they are fine with doing it again, on some level. It is only the latter case, which I think it a tiny number of people, who fit your comment.

While the extra free slot would be nice, I can certainly see where it might not make as much sense as people think. Not a popular stance to take, I know.

Except for the altoholics. And the crafters who want to be able to farm mats of all levels. I sub. I filled my 8 original slots. Then bought the additional 4 slots for 12 slots. Bought the additional 2 for this account. Will buy the two additional slots for my second account tonight.

As long as they provided a way to add at least one additional slot, I have no issues. I would have hated to have to delete one of my characters/farmers.

Bravesteel · May 2017

No one is forcing you to keep your characters. No one is forcing you to play the Warden. No one is forcing you to buy character slots. It's not an industry standard to give away a free character slot when a new class comes out, give me a break. I can understand your frustration at not wanting to delete a character, buy a character slot, or just NOT play the Warden class, but this is a non-issue.

Slurg · May 2017

While I would have liked to see one free character slot included in the upgrade price, the company chose not to do that. However, we were given plenty of advance notice they were not including any free slots, so we all had the opportunity to either save subscription crowns or buy extra crowns during the last sale for new character slots. So of all the things I could potentially complain about, this is not one of them.

mandricus · May 2017

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

Except for the 2x bank space which luckily they gave us free included in ESO+

not because they love you, it's just because they want to hook you up more.

When your ESO plus will expire, and your bank will be filled twice over the limit, you won't be even able to pass any single object from one toon to another. May be you'll have to whitdraw something like 100 or 200 objects (across different toons) or even more, before you will be again able to pass a single object from one toon to another.

It will be a nightmare, so -> tied to ESO+ foverer as long as you play.

mandricus · May 2017

lordrichter wrote: »

I think most active accounts that support the game have fewer than 8 characters.

I think not. Most of the people I know in my guild, long-term eso players that are playing since the beta, they all have all slots filled. Simply because even if they do not play on 8 alts, they have some alt just to keep stuff (sets and / or other stuff) that you cannot store in your bank because you don't have enough space. May be we have different friends.

lordrichter wrote: »

If we could see the demographics data, we would probably be quite surprised at how many accounts have at least one open free slot. From a practical stand point, if the majority of players in the game have not even used 8 slots, giving them more is going to be a waste.

No, it's not.
4 classes = 8 slots (1 mag 1 stam for every class).This is how the game was designed and given to customers at launch date.
5 classes should lead to 10 slot. Simple as that. It's just logic.
As a matter of fact, look at what they did: they increased the number of purchasable slots by 2, from 12 to 14. 2 additional slots, 1 for a MagWarden 1 for a StamWarden. It's just logical, they are following the way the game was designed. But this time they decided that buying Morrowind was not enough. We also have to buy the additional slots with crown.

lordrichter wrote: »

People who are at 8 slots and have purchased additional slots have proven that they will buy slots. Once you start down that path, you have said that it is fine to be on that path. While they might appreciate a free slot, they are the customer that will buy slots, anyway.

Only until they are not pissed enough.

lordrichter wrote: »

The sufferers are the people who are at exactly 8 slots filled, and are not willing to buy more slots. If we could see the demographics, we would probably see a very small number of people. I am in this boat, but I don't think I am even close to being in a lot of company.

well, mate, I can say for sure that you are in company with me, and with a lot of my guildmates.

lordrichter wrote: »

In the second case, we have supporters of the game who have purchased additional slots, and so they are fine with doing it again, on some level.

I repeat myself: only until they are not pissed enough.
It's not that I don't have crowns. I pay ESO+ so crowns are not a problem. I can buy for sure the 2 additional slots. It's the idea of being treated this way. Paying a game and having to pay again just to use the new class. I feel it is not fair. It's not a practical issue, there's a principle involved. I don't like, as a paying customer, to be treated this way.
Pissing your customers is never a good idea. They will follow you until a certain point, because as every MMO gamers they are addicted. But when they hit the breakpoint, there is no turnback.

mandricus · May 2017

Double post

Huyen · May 2017

There have been numerous threads about this, and and its commonly known that the 2 extra slots can be bought. Nothing to see here. Move along.

Akevoriath · May 2017

S1ipperyJim wrote: »

Since ZOS was offering the new DLC for such a cheap price, it makes sense that they couldn't afford to offer free character slots for the new character and still pay the lease for their poor underfunded studio.

Cheap? CHEAP?!?! Really? You are joking.... right? The minimum price was $60. For an MMO expansion that is INCREDIBLY expensive.

Rosveen · May 2017

Akevoriath wrote: »

S1ipperyJim wrote: »

Since ZOS was offering the new DLC for such a cheap price, it makes sense that they couldn't afford to offer free character slots for the new character and still pay the lease for their poor underfunded studio.

Cheap? CHEAP?!?! Really? You are joking.... right? The minimum price was $60. For an MMO expansion that is INCREDIBLY expensive.

The post was sarcastic - and the minimum official price of Morrowind was $40 for the basic digital upgrade. It was even cheaper on GMG.

Akevoriath · May 2017

lnsane wrote: »

While they specifically stated that they'd only be expanding the maximum amount of slots (going from 12 to 14) and mentioned nothing about free ones whatsoever, I do agree with you that the result of not adding free slots is crippling experienced players with a full character list. They either have to fork over cash or delete a character they've invested in, to be able to play their new expansion.

It would have been nice of ZOS to add a free slot, or two.. Very nice indeed. But things don't tend to work that way in most businesses, as charity is a rare occurrence when you can just as easily make money off whatever you're releasing.

To say that they are increasing the maximum amount of slots while wording it carefully enough so that they never explicitly state that you receive an extra character slot if you purchase the DLC seems a bit misleading. They know most people who read that will not understand that this doesn't mean they will get an extra character slot. Personally I am not affected by this as I don't like to make too many characters, I like to stick with one main, but this seems very misleading and dirty to me.

Akevoriath · May 2017

Rosveen wrote: »

Akevoriath wrote: »

S1ipperyJim wrote: »

Since ZOS was offering the new DLC for such a cheap price, it makes sense that they couldn't afford to offer free character slots for the new character and still pay the lease for their poor underfunded studio.

Cheap? CHEAP?!?! Really? You are joking.... right? The minimum price was $60. For an MMO expansion that is INCREDIBLY expensive.

The post was sarcastic - and the minimum official price of Morrowind was $40 for the basic digital upgrade. It was even cheaper on GMG.

I'm an autist, my bad. GMG does not appear to have any collectors editions available - are they all out?

Edit: nevermind

Wreuntzylla · May 2017

Bravesteel wrote: »

No one is forcing you to keep your characters. No one is forcing you to play the Warden. No one is forcing you to buy character slots. It's not an industry standard to give away a free character slot when a new class comes out, give me a break. I can understand your frustration at not wanting to delete a character, buy a character slot, or just NOT play the Warden class, but this is a non-issue.

Which games haven't given a slot when a new class is released?

Elsonso · May 2017

mandricus wrote: »

lordrichter wrote: »

I think most active accounts that support the game have fewer than 8 characters.

I think not. Most of the people I know in my guild, long-term eso players that are playing since the beta, they all have all slots filled. Simply because even if they do not play on 8 alts, they have some alt just to keep stuff (sets and / or other stuff) that you cannot store in your bank because you don't have enough space. May be we have different friends.

lordrichter wrote: »

If we could see the demographics data, we would probably be quite surprised at how many accounts have at least one open free slot. From a practical stand point, if the majority of players in the game have not even used 8 slots, giving them more is going to be a waste.

No, it's not.
4 classes = 8 slots (1 mag 1 stam for every class).This is how the game was designed and given to customers at launch date.
5 classes should lead to 10 slot. Simple as that. It's just logic.
As a matter of fact, look at what they did: they increased the number of purchasable slots by 2, from 12 to 14. 2 additional slots, 1 for a MagWarden 1 for a StamWarden. It's just logical, they are following the way the game was designed. But this time they decided that buying Morrowind was not enough. We also have to buy the additional slots with crown.

lordrichter wrote: »

People who are at 8 slots and have purchased additional slots have proven that they will buy slots. Once you start down that path, you have said that it is fine to be on that path. While they might appreciate a free slot, they are the customer that will buy slots, anyway.

Only until they are not pissed enough.

lordrichter wrote: »

The sufferers are the people who are at exactly 8 slots filled, and are not willing to buy more slots. If we could see the demographics, we would probably see a very small number of people. I am in this boat, but I don't think I am even close to being in a lot of company.

well, mate, I can say for sure that you are in company with me, and with a lot of my guildmates.

lordrichter wrote: »

In the second case, we have supporters of the game who have purchased additional slots, and so they are fine with doing it again, on some level.

I repeat myself: only until they are not pissed enough.
It's not that I don't have crowns. I pay ESO+ so crowns are not a problem. I can buy for sure the 2 additional slots. It's the idea of being treated this way. Paying a game and having to pay again just to use the new class. I feel it is not fair. It's not a practical issue, there's a principle involved. I don't like, as a paying customer, to be treated this way.
Pissing your customers is never a good idea. They will follow you until a certain point, because as every MMO gamers they are addicted. But when they hit the breakpoint, there is no turnback.

You really need to step back and consider the fact that you, and your friends, might not be average players in the game.

I really think that the average active player, by a very wide margin, has less than 8 characters on the account. I define active as logging in at least once every 30 days, and playing the game. These players are likely to be ESO Plus or buy Crowns on a regular basis.

It would appear that the game was not originally designed to have 4 classes, each with a stamina and magicka flavor. They seemed surprised when the players did that. It seems they thought that people would make decisions on how to split Magicka and Stamina, not pile up one and ignore the other. Besides, there is no reason to believe that the majority of active players collect characters like that.

I stand by the whole line of reasoning. There is every reason to believe that the majority of players of this game do not need an extra character slot because they have unused character slots. For those players who do need extra character slots, they increased the max to 14. This is likely so that people can have two different Wardens, although not necessarily stamina and magicka. Whatever two varieties they want. Those people can buy additional slots, if they want to.

DeadlyRecluse · May 2017

Whenever people complain about cashgrabbiness in this game, I go check /played on my main. I encourage others to do likewise.

GlassHalfFull · May 2017

Before they give out a free character spot, posters should learn how to use paragraphs.

idk · May 2017

S1ipperyJim wrote: »

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

I do not find a need to read the OP since the title is so far off base it is absurd.

I did see a claim that Zos is "so greedy" when I skimmed through the first few sentenced. I wonder why we are not concerned about the equal greed most of our employers demonstrate. That greed that puts a room over our head, food on the table and pays for us to play this game.

Odd how greed works in the manner OP describes it.

It seems this may surprise you; but most successful businesses, even those not bound by industry codes of practice or specific legislation related to their business, work hard and make sure that they follow ethical business practices that give their customers value for money.

Customers are not stupid and will stop using your goods and or services if you are found to be unethical or misleading and offer poor value for money compared with competitors offering a similar product or service. Employees are also not so greedy as to feel good about ripping off customers and like to work for companies which provide a product or service they can be proud of.

@S1ipperyJim

This may come as a surprise to you but no one has provided any actual real information on how Zos was misleading or unethical and certainly no false advertising concerning character slots.

This is where it gets tricky. The information about each Morrowind package clearly stated what was included and none mentioned character slots. Further, Zos even stated as much and mentioned two additional slots would be available in the crown store for purchase.

Without a doubt very upfront and very clear on the matter of character slots. Very much ethical in every manner and statem on the subject.

and that's the facts jack, or Jim, etc.

SickDuck · May 2017

mikeabboudb14_ESO wrote: »

Here is an idea, delete a toon, best of all its free.

You mean delete one for free that you'd spent on loads of money and time before? I guess burning a sack of money costs nothing as long as you find a box of matches.

mandricus · May 2017

lordrichter wrote: »

I define active as logging in at least once every 30 days, and playing the game. These players are likely to be ESO Plus or buy Crowns on a regular basis.

A person that logs once every 30 days is likely to be ESO Plus subscriber? Meaning that he is paying 10 bucks each month just to login one or two times?
No offense, pal... on which planet do you live?

Elsonso · May 2017

mandricus wrote: »

lordrichter wrote: »

I define active as logging in at least once every 30 days, and playing the game. These players are likely to be ESO Plus or buy Crowns on a regular basis.

A person that logs once every 30 days is likely to be ESO Plus subscriber? Meaning that he is paying 10 bucks each month just to login one or two times?
No offense, pal... on which planet do you live?

I define active as logging in at least once every 30 days, and playing the game. Includes the possibility that they log in more frequently, but not the possibility that they log in less frequently.

These player are likely to be ESO Plus or buy Crowns on a regular basis. Likely, as in having a high probability of occurring or being true, but not guaranteed, they pay for ESO Plus or buy Crowns regularly. That means that they can do ESO Plus, or they can buy Crowns, or they can do both.

idk · May 2017

lordrichter wrote: »

mandricus wrote: »

lordrichter wrote: »

I define active as logging in at least once every 30 days, and playing the game. These players are likely to be ESO Plus or buy Crowns on a regular basis.

A person that logs once every 30 days is likely to be ESO Plus subscriber? Meaning that he is paying 10 bucks each month just to login one or two times?
No offense, pal... on which planet do you live?

I define active as logging in at least once every 30 days, and playing the game. Includes the possibility that they log in more frequently, but not the possibility that they log in less frequently.

These player are likely to be ESO Plus or buy Crowns on a regular basis. Likely, as in having a high probability of occurring or being true, but not guaranteed, they pay for ESO Plus or buy Crowns regularly. That means that they can do ESO Plus, or they can buy Crowns, or they can do both.

A person only logging in once or twice a month is most likely not a subscriber and has little reason to buy crowns.

That's the definition of a most casual player and the smallest source of revenue Zos would have. Some may subscribe or have bought some crowns but that's the exception rather than the rule for this group.

Maybe we can call the an active uber casual.

Elsonso · May 2017

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

lordrichter wrote: »

mandricus wrote: »

lordrichter wrote: »

I define active as logging in at least once every 30 days, and playing the game. These players are likely to be ESO Plus or buy Crowns on a regular basis.

A person that logs once every 30 days is likely to be ESO Plus subscriber? Meaning that he is paying 10 bucks each month just to login one or two times?
No offense, pal... on which planet do you live?

I define active as logging in at least once every 30 days, and playing the game. Includes the possibility that they log in more frequently, but not the possibility that they log in less frequently.

These player are likely to be ESO Plus or buy Crowns on a regular basis. Likely, as in having a high probability of occurring or being true, but not guaranteed, they pay for ESO Plus or buy Crowns regularly. That means that they can do ESO Plus, or they can buy Crowns, or they can do both.

A person only logging in once or twice a month is most likely not a subscriber and has little reason to buy crowns.

That's the definition of a most casual player and the smallest source of revenue Zos would have. Some may subscribe or have bought some crowns but that's the exception rather than the rule for this group.

Maybe we can call the an active uber casual.

I beg to disagree, obviously, but you probably already expected that.

idk · May 2017

lordrichter wrote: »

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

lordrichter wrote: »

mandricus wrote: »

lordrichter wrote: »

I define active as logging in at least once every 30 days, and playing the game. These players are likely to be ESO Plus or buy Crowns on a regular basis.

A person that logs once every 30 days is likely to be ESO Plus subscriber? Meaning that he is paying 10 bucks each month just to login one or two times?
No offense, pal... on which planet do you live?

I define active as logging in at least once every 30 days, and playing the game. Includes the possibility that they log in more frequently, but not the possibility that they log in less frequently.

These player are likely to be ESO Plus or buy Crowns on a regular basis. Likely, as in having a high probability of occurring or being true, but not guaranteed, they pay for ESO Plus or buy Crowns regularly. That means that they can do ESO Plus, or they can buy Crowns, or they can do both.

A person only logging in once or twice a month is most likely not a subscriber and has little reason to buy crowns.

That's the definition of a most casual player and the smallest source of revenue Zos would have. Some may subscribe or have bought some crowns but that's the exception rather than the rule for this group.

Maybe we can call the an active uber casual.

I beg to disagree, obviously, but you probably already expected that.

It's your right to disagree. I'm just stating facts rather than oppinions.

It's even in everyone's choice to falsely state Zos as unethical or did false advertising Even when the facts do not begin to support it.