AS a note StamDK is strong because heavy is strong. because the CP system passives are poorly thought out. because blocking is cheap. All of these change to some degree so why gut the actual class along with it?

StamDK is far more balanced in no cp.

Here's the changes that would have been required:

Nerf heavy sustain as was done.
Nerf blocking as was done.
Make leap 125 ult in line with ferocious leap and dbos.

But your CP system makes everyone and everything capable of running broken builds.

krathos wrote: »

yet it gets an easy major mending.

I believe wardens get major mending only in these conditions:
"This passive ability now grants you Major Mending when you heal an ally who is below 40% Health, reduced from 50%, and the duration of Major Mending has been reduced to 1.5/3 seconds, down from 3/6 seconds."

I agree with the OP ... The stam DK changes while in PVE not are much of an issue (DPS)...... In PVP the changes are huge .... We have been preaching this for weeks.... In 5 weeks they will be going hmmmmm why are there no stam DK's anymore???? The only stam builds we see are Stamblades, Sorcs, and Templars then there will be a general buff to the class again ..... Then they will ask the question maybe we over did it with major mending and helping hands !!!

What aggravates me with ZOS right now they are talking about feedback and there has been no STAM PVP DK saying that there is a work around or fix with the meta after these changes.... ZOS its broke we are all telling you this !!!

No sympathy. DK is effectively losing it but Templar fully lost it.

Basically, go buy a Warden if you want that buff.

KingJ wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

No sympathy. DK is effectively losing it but Templar fully lost it.

Basically, go buy a Warden if you want that buff.

Templars at least got minor mending replacing their major mending lose while Dragon Knights have nothing when they actually needs it. Do you know a DK can not run in a group with another DK now or they will take the buff away from the other dk?

Being completely honest, I'd trade the minor mending for something similar to what DK have with major mending or better yet what warden has with major mending..

I mean, isn't the answer obvious?

@timidobserver
I know you're mad and a lot of temps are mad at the loss of major mending which I believe is definitely stupid since both DKs and Templars are innately a support based class but you do not want the major mending that the DKs have. Many have pointed it out, you will never get access to it unless you do not have a DoT applied to you and if you are not in direct combat. The shield scales off of max health which is immediately halved in PvP with battle spirit.

In PvE I have tried using it and I can only get 1 tick of vigor in when fighting mobs as they would break the shield immediately. The best part is there are DoTs in vMSA and they do not allow me to heal through the damage (although on live I do not use igneous shield but with the CP changes I feel/felt I may need to use it on certain portions).

With all that said Major mending on the DK class is almost quite literally unattainable with the current version of PTS. It was fine they way it was and templars should never had theirs taken away as well because its utter b.s.

MaxwellC wrote: »

@timidobserver
I know you're mad and a lot of temps are mad at the loss of major mending which I believe is definitely stupid since both DKs and Templars are innately a support based class but you do not want the major mending that the DKs have. Many have pointed it out, you will never get access to it unless you do not have a DoT applied to you and if you are not in direct combat. The shield scales off of max health which is immediately halved in PvP with battle spirit.

In PvE I have tried using it and I can only get 1 tick of vigor in when fighting mobs as they would break the shield immediately. The best part is there are DoTs in vMSA and they do not allow me to heal through the damage (although on live I do not use igneous shield but with the CP changes I feel/felt I may need to use it on certain portions).

With all that said Major mending on the DK class is almost quite literally unattainable with the current version of PTS. It was fine they way it was and templars should never had theirs taken away as well because its utter b.s.

Coincidently both the two classes with major mending don't have any escape... CUZ THATS HOW THEYRE SUPPOSED TO SURVIVE WITH HEALING but ZOS doesn't get this. We need major mending, as do Templars so the changes need to be reverted.

The biggest issue in PvP currently were those nearly unkillable DKs/ Templars that required 10 people to kill, as when their health got low enough, it would burst up to full off of one heal. Now I can imagine that this was based off of a number of things, namely skill (including a calm mind), armor sets, and attribute allocation. I don't know how ZOS determined that nerfing major Mending and helping hands was the solution to preventing this.

With DKs effectively losing Major Mending and not given back anything in return, I would actually like to see a cleanse/purge just as much, or even more. This would give the (Mag)DK at least some indirect mobility. Playing MagDK, nothing is more annoying imo, than those incoming snares that pretty much freeze you on the spot. Which also for some reasons I don't grasp, work on Mist Form too.

olsborg wrote: »

Stamdks in heavy armor built with 50k stamina is ridiculously strong in pvp atm, yes they needed nerfs, was the nerfs on pts the right ones? Many of them was not, but atleast its better then nothing imo. DKs still have good healing, take a look at nightblades or stamsorcs, they basicly have nothing to boost their healing except cp, and that got nerfed too.

While using Draconic Power abilities:
Increases healing received by 12% while a Draconic ability is activated

Stop commenting on DK threads you know absolutely nothing of the class. You always move the subject to try and boost nightblades yet neglect to acknowledge that nightblades also can be built for tankiness with heavy armour. Heavy armour cloaking surprise attack spamming nightblade with fear ? Yet you comment that DK's need to be nerfed on every thread just stop.

olsborg wrote: »

D0ntevenL1ft wrote: »

olsborg wrote: »

Stamdks in heavy armor built with 50k stamina is ridiculously strong in pvp atm, yes they needed nerfs, was the nerfs on pts the right ones? Many of them was not, but atleast its better then nothing imo. DKs still have good healing, take a look at nightblades or stamsorcs, they basicly have nothing to boost their healing except cp, and that got nerfed too.

While using Draconic Power abilities:
Increases healing received by 12% while a Draconic ability is activated

Stop commenting on DK threads you know absolutely nothing of the class. You always move the subject to try and boost nightblades yet neglect to acknowledge that nightblades also can be built for tankiness with heavy armour. Heavy armour cloaking surprise attack spamming nightblade with fear ? Yet you comment that DK's need to be nerfed on every thread just stop.

So youre saying that the build I mentioned specificly isnt overperforming in pvp? Hmmkay. @D0ntevenL1ft

The only thing ive claimed nbs(stam) need is better healing/defence, wich imo happens to be true. Youre free to disagree.
I know nothing of the class according to you, but I feel I know enough having played one before, having pvped for 3 years, and the majority of the dk-pvpers in the guilds im in happily acknowledge the fact that the specific build I mentioned in this thread is overperforming. Youre free to disagree with me, this is a forum where people air out their opinions. Youre coming off very agressive, I think I triggered you or something.

Then ill say this; have you ever played a stam DK in non cp? No you've just been beaten by one in open world. The problem is the champion point system combined with a heavy armour meta. I can build my night blades to easily beat DK's while having max resist cap; and i can also build my DK's to beat night blades.

ITS THE PLAYER AND BUILD NOT THE CLASS. Nobody gets this. ZOS can't nerf talent but they will sure as hell try to make all players a lot more even by making certain classes that people whine about on the forums obsolete.

Wow I did not know they removed major mending form the DK damn I guess the one on my test character is a bug then.

Well in one sec and get the heal off. I know I did it many times in PvP battle grounds.

olsborg wrote: »

Stamdks in heavy armor built with 50k stamina is ridiculously strong in pvp atm, yes they needed nerfs, was the nerfs on pts the right ones? Many of them was not, but atleast its better then nothing imo. DKs still have good healing, take a look at nightblades or stamsorcs, they basicly have nothing to boost their healing except cp, and that got nerfed too.

While using Draconic Power abilities:
Increases healing received by 12% while a Draconic ability is activated

I hope that this is sarcasm. Nightblades have cloak and new siphoning strikes (how many people who complain that this skill is useless right now have actually tested it on PTS? Probably nobody) as defense and stamsorcs have critsurge and Dark Deal for extra healing while the defense of dks and temps (mending) got completely removed without giving them any replacement. I haven't lost to any dk on nightblade (neither on PTS nor on live server with a decent heavy armor build) and saying that stamblade is in a similar spot like dks are comes close to an insult to every dk player.

Gan Xing wrote: »

The biggest issue in PvP currently were those nearly unkillable DKs/ Templars that required 10 people to kill, as when their health got low enough, it would burst up to full off of one heal. Now I can imagine that this was based off of a number of things, namely skill (including a calm mind), armor sets, and attribute allocation. I don't know how ZOS determined that nerfing major Mending and helping hands was the solution to preventing this.

Please... the issue are more 10 people who struggle to kill one single person.