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Templar’s Loss of Major Mending... The Loss of a Class
akray21
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TLDR: Templar healers are about to lose 86% of their healing output and much of their group utility if all of the PTS changes make it to the live server in June.
The removal of major mending from the Templar and replacement with minor mending is an immediate 17% nerf in a Templars healing effectiveness (25% healing buff diminished to a measly 8%). DK’s also lost some consistency in their source of major mending, but at least they still have a source! Templars are supposed to be the group support/utility class, the HEALING class! ZOS reasoning for this change was that it was simply too easy to maintain the buff on the Templar class… well the Wraden is going to have a source of Major Mending that is just as easy with their passives. Templars need a source of major mending plain and simple. I get that it was easy to maintain the Major Mending buff on a Templar, but at least give it to the class elsewhere! There are plenty of ways to reward skilled played with Major Mending, for example they could make the current passive only apply to channeled focus and not Ritual (a much smaller radius ability that is harder to stay inside of when trying to avoid damage from bosses, mobs, mechanics, other players, etc.). Another idea is that they could give 6 seconds of Major Mending after completing a Healing Ritual (an unused channeled ability would become useful for once). There are countless other ways they can provide the healing class the main healing tool in the game.
Also, keep in mind that the loss of Major Mending is ON TOP of the blanket sustain nerfs to EVERYONE! I get that they wanted to nerf sustain, but they hit it too hard! They are clearly balancing the game around the broken CP system. Just to test out the effect of these changes on my healing capabilities I went into the PTS with the EXACT same healing gear I am currently wearing in the live server. Keep in mind I am currently built for sustain, not big heals. Also, I used BoL in the following example just to test the drop-in healing skill output. I do not spam this skill in PvE or PvP, I only use it when someone is below 50%… Here are my results:
Live Server: I could cast 16 BoL before tapping out of Magicka. It took 30 seconds to regen back to full with no other buffs.
PTS: I could cast 11 BoL before tapping out of Magicka. It took 34 seconds to regen back to full with no other buffs.
The reduction from 16 to 11 BoL’s is a 69% reduction in the numbers of healing skills I can cast before running out of magicka. Keep in mind that this sustain nerf is on top of the loss of Major Mending! When we add the two nerfs together we get an overall reduction of 86% in healing effectiveness!
I am not even going to touch on the nerfs to Repentance, BoL, or the now non-unique skill of Spear Shards with the changes to Mystic Orbs. I used to be able to help my team in PvE by healing and providing meaningful sustain, now I will be blowing kisses your way while bosses and mobs beat you to death. Actually, I won’t be in there helping you at all if all of these changes go through… R.I.P. Templar healers…
The removal of major mending from the Templar and replacement with minor mending is an immediate 17% nerf in a Templars healing effectiveness (25% healing buff diminished to a measly 8%). DK’s also lost some consistency in their source of major mending, but at least they still have a source! Templars are supposed to be the group support/utility class, the HEALING class! ZOS reasoning for this change was that it was simply too easy to maintain the buff on the Templar class… well the Wraden is going to have a source of Major Mending that is just as easy with their passives. Templars need a source of major mending plain and simple. I get that it was easy to maintain the Major Mending buff on a Templar, but at least give it to the class elsewhere! There are plenty of ways to reward skilled played with Major Mending, for example they could make the current passive only apply to channeled focus and not Ritual (a much smaller radius ability that is harder to stay inside of when trying to avoid damage from bosses, mobs, mechanics, other players, etc.). Another idea is that they could give 6 seconds of Major Mending after completing a Healing Ritual (an unused channeled ability would become useful for once). There are countless other ways they can provide the healing class the main healing tool in the game.
Also, keep in mind that the loss of Major Mending is ON TOP of the blanket sustain nerfs to EVERYONE! I get that they wanted to nerf sustain, but they hit it too hard! They are clearly balancing the game around the broken CP system. Just to test out the effect of these changes on my healing capabilities I went into the PTS with the EXACT same healing gear I am currently wearing in the live server. Keep in mind I am currently built for sustain, not big heals. Also, I used BoL in the following example just to test the drop-in healing skill output. I do not spam this skill in PvE or PvP, I only use it when someone is below 50%… Here are my results:
Live Server: I could cast 16 BoL before tapping out of Magicka. It took 30 seconds to regen back to full with no other buffs.
PTS: I could cast 11 BoL before tapping out of Magicka. It took 34 seconds to regen back to full with no other buffs.
The reduction from 16 to 11 BoL’s is a 69% reduction in the numbers of healing skills I can cast before running out of magicka. Keep in mind that this sustain nerf is on top of the loss of Major Mending! When we add the two nerfs together we get an overall reduction of 86% in healing effectiveness!
I am not even going to touch on the nerfs to Repentance, BoL, or the now non-unique skill of Spear Shards with the changes to Mystic Orbs. I used to be able to help my team in PvE by healing and providing meaningful sustain, now I will be blowing kisses your way while bosses and mobs beat you to death. Actually, I won’t be in there helping you at all if all of these changes go through… R.I.P. Templar healers…
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Sydria✭✭✭I really like your idea of Healing Ritual and it's morphs giving the Major Mending buff for 6 seconds.
That would give Healing Ritual more of a use and would be a skillful way to gain the buff. It's also close enough to the DK's way of getting Major Mending.
You have my vote on that.
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Dracane✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭You all act like major mending is gone..... You just shouldn't spam your heals blindly, but use them when your ally or yourself is actually wounded enough to make it necessary.Auri-El is my lord,
Trinimac is my shield,
Magnus is my mind.
My debut album on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Gleandra/videos7 -
timidobserver✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭I really like your idea of Healing Ritual and it's morphs giving the Major Mending buff for 6 seconds.
That would give Healing Ritual more of a use and would be a skillful way to gain the buff. It's also close enough to the DK's way of getting Major Mending.
You have my vote on that.
I wish I could delete this thread before some dev sees this and thinks it is a great idea.V16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)5 -
akray21✭✭✭✭✭You all act like major mending is gone..... You just shouldn't spam your heals blindly, but use them when your ally or yourself is actually wounded enough to make it necessary.
The problem is builds that build around HoTs... the uptime of Major Mending is essential to assisting HoTs. I'm not concerned about the buff assisting burst heals...3 -
Ashtaris✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭The way it almost seems is that ZOS wants to make the Warden an attractive healing class for Morrowind, so to do so they had to take away something from Templars. Like taking the candy from one child and giving it to another? I know that's probably silly, but it sure feels that way
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Pallio✭✭✭✭✭
✭They are absolutely making Warden class the only option, unless you are happy to play a subpar version of any role with the other classes.8 -
Ashamray✭✭✭✭✭Templar's changes are almost fine.
I'm afraid a bit of buffed Befoul that can easily turn into 40% Major Defile (reverb bash spam can't be countered with cleanse), but I think I will adapt.
I dislike new Repentance. It could be cut, but making it solo is almost a death sentence to the morph.
I'm intrigued with new 3.5 second Unstable Core, but it has a teriible cost - 4141! It's the most expensive magicka damage spell in the entire game. Would be interesting though to combine it with Backlash to get some nice burst damage.Edited by Ashamray on April 19, 2017 3:43PMBoadrig, EU PC
Very Balanced
Battleground Beta Testers
Cite's Legacy
Colosseum
Imperial City frequenter
Imperial City feedback and suggestions1 -
Ruben✭✭✭✭✭#TerribleMathDK Stamina DPS
DK Magicka DPS
DK Tank
Templar Healer
Sorcerer Stamina DPS
Nightblade Magicka DPS
Nightblade Stamina DPS8 -
usmcjdking✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭You all act like major mending is gone..... You just shouldn't spam your heals blindly, but use them when your ally or yourself is actually wounded enough to make it necessary.
For templar it is gone. The only source for temp/nb/sorc to get major mending is via restoration staff.0331
06021 -
NACtron✭✭✭✭✭On the bright side you are not a stamplar :')Pact Militia GM
Nikolai the Nord - Stamplar1 -
Akimbro✭✭✭✭Wolfs_Blood wrote: »
It's ok. The way they "zos fixed" this was thru the nerf of all sustain. We're forced to heavy attack for resources now so healers should always have major mending! /sALACRITY Emperors united RIP
LAST PRODIGIES World first SO clear RIP
The last egg in the carton.2 -
Drdeath20✭✭✭✭✭
✭Reducing mm to minor mending and making bol a line of sight conal heal is fair.
Destroying repentance and shards is class destroying.
I logged on last night for 4 minutes, paused for a second and thought whats the point and logged off. Theres just no reason to even bother10 -
Akimbro✭✭✭✭Reducing mm to minor mending and making bol a line of sight conal heal is fair.
Destroying repentance and shards is class destroying.
I logged on last night for 4 minutes, paused for a second and thought whats the point and logged off. Theres just no reason to even bother
#wardenmarketingALACRITY Emperors united RIP
LAST PRODIGIES World first SO clear RIP
The last egg in the carton.0 -
Blackfyre20✭✭✭✭Giving major mending to healing ritual will benefit stamplars as much as the slight buff to the mending passive... not at all. People forget this hurts stamplars just as much, if not more, than magplars in PVP.Buff Soft Caps4 -
Twohothardware✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Blackfyre20 wrote: »Giving major mending to healing ritual will benefit stamplars as much as the slight buff to the mending passive... not at all. People forget this hurts stamplars just as much, if not more, than magplars in PVP.
Exactly. Stamplar is already the weakest Stamina class in the game for especially PvE and they just keep nerfing it.1 -
akray21✭✭✭✭✭Blackfyre20 wrote: »Giving major mending to healing ritual will benefit stamplars as much as the slight buff to the mending passive... not at all. People forget this hurts stamplars just as much, if not more, than magplars in PVP.
This is true, hadn't thought about it from that specific perspective. Regardless it needs to be a buff built into the class, it was a class defining buff after-all. They said it is changed because the ease of up-time, well why didn't they find a creative solution to increase the difficulty of keeping the buff up, instead of just removing it all together?Reducing mm to minor mending and making bol a line of sight conal heal is fair.
Destroying repentance and shards is class destroying.
I logged on last night for 4 minutes, paused for a second and thought whats the point and logged off. Theres just no reason to even bother
I don't think removing a class defining buff was fair, but I will concede the BoL nerf. Healing ward is now just as powerful as BoL. Ward can be cast preemptively to avoid damage entirely, under the right situations it heals for more, and it has no directional limits.2 -
Strider_Roshin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I don't know what you guys are complaining about. Your Mending passive increases your restoring light healing by 12%, your Restoring Focus gives minor vitality, and minor protection, and finally your sacred ground passive now gives minor mending. Right there you take 8% less damage, and your BoL does additional healing to you by 28%, and 20% to other people. You already have an insane amount of healing; and removing your major mending was most definitely warranted.
In your defense though, I'm not a fan of how easily the Warden gets their major mending, and allowing them to keep it is inconsistent to what they did to you Templars, and DKs. They're being partial towards Wardens in this aspect.2 -
Fuxo✭✭✭✭I used to main a Redguard stamplar. He is a master crafter now. Won't get much playtime anytime soon as nerfs keep rolling.1
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Blackfyre20✭✭✭✭@Strider_Roshin what about stamplars? If the mending passive game my vigor and rally heals a 12% boost my only gripe would be with wardens being the only class with easy access to major mending.Buff Soft Caps0
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Strider_Roshin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Blackfyre20 wrote: »@Strider_Roshin what about stamplars? If the mending passive game my vigor and rally heals a 12% boost my only gripe would be with wardens being the only class with easy access to major mending.
Yeah I know what you mean. You will have the additional 16% healing, but Stamplars definitely got hit harder than magplars in terms of survivability. On the flip side though power of the light is no longer dodgeable so your burst got a solid increase with this patch so this isn't a total loss for you guys.0 -
akray21✭✭✭✭✭Strider_Roshin wrote: »I don't know what you guys are complaining about. Your Mending passive increases your restoring light healing by 12%, your Restoring Focus gives minor vitality, and minor protection, and finally your sacred ground passive now gives minor mending. Right there you take 8% less damage, and your BoL does additional healing to you by 28%, and 20% to other people. You already have an insane amount of healing; and removing your major mending was most definitely warranted.
In your defense though, I'm not a fan of how easily the Warden gets their major mending, and allowing them to keep it is inconsistent to what they did to you Templars, and DKs. They're being partial towards Wardens in this aspect.
Good healers don't rely on BoL. The mending passive buff you are taking about is 2%, wohoo! And healers use channeled focus for the magicka sustain, which will be needed even more this patch, not restoring focus...
Major mending was necessary for HoTs... My main rotation used Rapid Regen (which gets a 17% nerf without Major Mending), Ritual of Retribution (which sees a 17% nerf without major mending, but a 2% increase to the mending passive, so 15% net loss), Purifying light (again sees a 17% nerf without Major Mending), and then I threw down some damage and shards when needed. And remember that the loss of major mending also reduces healing received from Puncturing Sweeps (17% reduction in healing), and Radiant Glory (another skill that sees a 17% reduction in healing). So 5 of my 10 main abilities on my bar have effectively been nerfed.Edited by akray21 on April 19, 2017 7:49PM6 -
BNOC✭✭✭✭✭I don't know whether I'm now the one doing it wrong as I don't think anyone has mentioned it, but:
16 BoL's now, that's your base.
11 BoL's on the PTS that's your current.
If 16 was your base, then losing 5 would be a 32.5% decrease in healing, that 4 seconds recovery time isn't making up 30%.
If I'm wrong, let me know how you worked it out so I don't get it wrong again.
Your idea is good, but you can already heavy attack with a restoration staff and acquire that buff for 3 seconds, it might not be part of your rotation/go-with-the-flow heals right now, but it might soon be and it doesn't sound that hard.
Pure healers in PvP will probably have this up at all times.vMSA - Magplar - Xbox EU - 15/11/16
578,000 - 36 Minutes 58 Seconds (Top 2 World?)
vMSA - Magplar - Xbox NA
569,000 - 40 minutes (350CP, Non optimised runs)2 -
Marto2Soul ShrivenAs a templar main, I feel that changing our bonus to minor mending works fine. Yeah, I'd say so.
It's only when compared to the Warden, who has reliable MAJOR mending, that I see a problem happening here.0 -
akray21✭✭✭✭✭I don't know whether I'm now the one doing it wrong as I don't think anyone has mentioned it, but:
16 BoL's now, that's your base.
11 BoL's on the PTS that's your current.
If 16 was your base, then losing 5 would be a 32.5% decrease in healing, that 4 seconds recovery time isn't making up 30%.
If I'm wrong, let me know how you worked it out so I don't get it wrong again.
Your idea is good, but you can already heavy attack with a restoration staff and acquire that buff for 3 seconds, it might not be part of your rotation/go-with-the-flow heals right now, but it might soon be and it doesn't sound that hard.
Pure healers in PvP will probably have this up at all times.
You are right... there is no real way to measure the exact nerf, I was just speculating based on my small test, the numbers on the nerfs, and wasted time having to heavy attack in-between each skill. It is a rough estimate.Edited by akray21 on April 19, 2017 8:28PM0 -
BNOC✭✭✭✭✭Also, in regards to this:I am not even going to touch on the nerfs to Repentance, BoL, or the now non-unique skill of Spear Shards with the changes to Mystic Orbs.
Repentance still provides 10% magicka and stamina recovery passively, I didn't see it in the notes but it didn't say it was gone?
It still recovers stamina to you and I don't really know where else you would use it except casual dungeons maybe? It's hardly mandatory for anything.
BoL was a heal, that would heal the lowest friendly within 28m and you can cast it looking at the sky, the ground, the wrong way; it doesn't matter, it will select the right target/s. Come on, I'm a Templar but that was so powerful, huge constant heals.
Bonus on the shards, if someone else can do your job of throwing shards with Mystic orbs, then you've got time to get that resto staff Major Mending buff up, welcome back.
vMSA - Magplar - Xbox EU - 15/11/16
578,000 - 36 Minutes 58 Seconds (Top 2 World?)
vMSA - Magplar - Xbox NA
569,000 - 40 minutes (350CP, Non optimised runs)1 -
akray21✭✭✭✭✭Also, in regards to this:I am not even going to touch on the nerfs to Repentance, BoL, or the now non-unique skill of Spear Shards with the changes to Mystic Orbs.
Repentance still provides 10% magicka and stamina recovery passively, I didn't see it in the notes but it didn't say it was gone?
It still recovers stamina to you and I don't really know where else you would use it except casual dungeons maybe? It's hardly mandatory for anything.
BoL was a heal, that would heal the lowest friendly within 28m and you can cast it looking at the sky, the ground, the wrong way; it doesn't matter, it will select the right target/s. Come on, I'm a Templar but that was so powerful, huge constant heals.
Bonus on the shards, if someone else can do your job of throwing shards with Mystic orbs, then you've got time to get that resto staff Major Mending buff up, welcome back.
How long does a fully charged heavy resto take? And for a 3 second buff? I will practically need to heavy attack weave in-between each skill! Not looking forward to a heavy attack meta...
"Repentance (Restoring Aura morph): This morph now restores Health and Stamina based on your character level instead of your Max Resource. It also only restores Stamina to the casting Templar, but continues to restore Health to the casting Templar and his allies."
I can deal with BoL changes, but the ranged DPS will have to learn to position themselves
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