You're going to have to do something about Sorcs in Morrowind when concerning the new changes.

Paraflex · April 2017

Sorc DPS will be hands down the best for PvP at this point...it would be insane if they didn't make any adjustments before patch goes live.

FriedEggSandwich · April 2017

clocksstoppe wrote: »

Shad0wfire99 wrote: »

Firerock2 wrote: »

Shad0wfire99 wrote: »

Everyone got hit with sustain nerfs. Get over it.

Sorc's didn't

You're right. Sorcs didn't have access to the Magician or LA passives before Morrowind. Anyways, you guys enjoy your whine session. I'll leave you to it.

I don't get what you're trying to argue about here. Every single class loses the cp sustain, and on top of that, NB, templar, and DK get a massive hit to their resource sustain, while sorc gets away for no reason. Ironically, sorc is the class that currently has the least sustain issues. How is this balanced again?

Sorcs are not without sustain issues; they are mostly tied to sustain sets in pvp and their skills are expensive, when compared to mageblade for example, and magicka skills have always been more expensive than stam. Despite cp and cost reduction/regen sets their skills are still more expensive than they were 2 years ago thanks to ability cost increases almost every other patch.

The recent change that diminished these regen issues was the 8% damage buff from destro staff, and stacking that with minor beserk/vulnerability, which allowed sorcs to stack a lot more damage for free. Harness magicka is an ever present regen boon that people often overlook, this skill is now obviously out of place when looking at the pts patch notes. I don't like using harness in pvp but I'd be stupid not to when the next patch drops, just like I'd be stupid to use anything other than flame staff now. I used to enjoy using an ice staff in pvp.

Zos are forcing sorcs into narrow playstyles and opening the class up to direct class nerfs as a result. I wouldn't be surprised to see base damage nerfs to skills like curse and frags as a result of the destro buff and that doesn't make me feel good.

Strider_Roshin · April 2017

Guys, we've all been through this before. Expect more changes in the PTS. Put the pitch forks down.

Mojmir · April 2017

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

Guys, we've all been through this before. Expect more changes in the PTS. Put the pitch forks down.

i know your rep is good here and i dont want to insult you because i respect alot of your opinions,BUT we all know how this turns out, they dont listen and we get a crumb off the top and everyone rejoices. consider this live content outside of the "easy" fixes they make to keep the artsy/simple quest gltiches in line.

Killset · April 2017

These are the first set patch notes where I am truly speechless. If this were to roll live, Mag Sorcs would dominate so thoroughly and completely in PvP and PvE it would be laughable. I kept telling myself at least there is Bone Pirates Tatters until that got gutted. Where is the nerf to Lich? Heavy Armor is destroyed which was the only thing keeping stamina in the game against Destro Ults and Soul Assault. Increase the cost of Vigor? This is a joke.

Twohothardware · April 2017

Shad0wfire99 wrote: »

You know the regen and cost reduction nerfs hit every class, right?

Not even close. Sorc can run Lich on the back bar and have no issues at all with sustaining despite these changes. Stamina classes have no such set to counter it. Bastion which increases shields up to 25% was also completely ignored and shield stacking is the #1 imbalance issue in PvP right now. They then nerfed major mending and increased the cost of Vigor but where is the increased cost or nerf to size of shields like Harness Magicka and Healing Ward that MagSorc can spam all day?

STEVIL · April 2017

With what I see so far I would strongly recommend that dark exchange and morphs and magical return from say endless fury (???) should be looked at as well if they aren't now.

They may think the time tick for DX is a start cuz its interruptable. Playtest can see if its enuf.

But I want to review to see if what got hit mostly were damage+sustain or passive sustain and not DX type full action sustain only.

If so, they have targeted the sustain by offense type of effect. Not sure yet. Have to review more and see in play.

So, amid the rage/panic, keep in mind where day one pts it was clear 2 hand ultimate was game killer and destroy ulti was useless.

Minalan · April 2017

If they want to hit Sorcs in all fairness to other classes:

Nerf bastion to the same cap as the healing CP. Fair is fair.
Nerf the resource return on harness like everything else in the game, it's a major source of sustain and can make a shield stack free.

There you go. Fix'd.

WraithGore · April 2017

So will the Devs, or moderator Speaking for the Devs please be able to explain the Logic to make these changes or are these just for the Closed Beta Currently and have possibility due to what you see two pages thus far made which will continue to grow in upset player base? In lamens terms = Can these changes be changed in code or are set in stone and the only reason to have Closed Beta is to find bugs not fix and help keep a player base?

I am sorry to sound jaded myself with this, but hearing friends stating they are going to leave the game because of these changes to character/class modifications truly sets into me uneasily. I understand their frustration as they might be a minority in the demographic here as they work to testing their mettle through 1vXX PVP battles.

Still an answer whether these are 100% set in stone as sadly I have not had time to read the whole patch notes. (Apologies to previous posters but i think some or most of you will agree with me)? Zenimax and Bethesda, as you ask us to give feedback to help you give us content or game play that will keep us coming back, at least answer my post with some form of answer. It would be greatly appreciated by me and probably a good portion of your gamer community.

An Answer would be greatly appreciated Behtesda/ZOS..

Beardimus · April 2017

Lol, Sorc got an extra curse pulse in U13, and some scamp extra time and yet the whines about shield stacking come back.

Anyone that couldn't kill Sorcs last year still can't kill them, an whine about wards. All decent players kill sorcs easy enough with their measily 6sec wards.

Active defence is a huge resource drain, more so in U14, if ur warding ur not attacking. Do not get the moaning on this.

Izaki · April 2017

Okay think of the cost of shields yeah? Now picture that cost without the 100 points into magician yeah? Now see how expensive it is to shield stack and you'll quickly realize that a Sorc who actually wants to sustain will have to give up a lot of damage to be able to shield stack consistently over a long period of time (like on live basically). I run my Sorc with 1.2k regen (3k with Lich). Full damage spec with the Thief mundus. Ain't gonna happen next patch. Cost reduction and regen glyphs are making a big comeback.

Derra · April 2017

Sorc shieldstacking is harshly affected by the removal of cost increase.

Harness will barely be able refund it´s own cost and the current situation of harness paying for hardened and harness both will be basically impossible to achieve.

Bashev · April 2017

Dark deal should be toned down!

Draqone · April 2017

They should increase the cost of shield skills by 50% every time you cast it for 4 seconds, similar to Streak.

technohic · April 2017

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

Guys, we've all been through this before. Expect more changes in the PTS. Put the pitch forks down.

Usually they start with sorc nerfs then end with sorc buffs after whining and more nerfs for other classes. They didn't even lead with a nerf this time.

It's whatever. I've leveled different classes just for these situations to find what I can enjoy. I honestly don't think my Templar or NB have been nerfed much harder than anything else but sorcs advantages gap look to be in tact

Lord_Eomer · April 2017

Nerf is killing this game so please do not do anything to Sorceter,

This is only DPS class i use, Mag NB doing poor a lot since ages. do not let this class die like mag mb nb!

eserras7b16_ESO · April 2017

You're all forgetting something really, really important:

Befoul

Increases the effectiveness of healing reduction abilities by [x]%.

Now this goes up something like, to 55%? It's crazy, while the CP for the damage to shields remains unchanged practicaly. They'll put major defile on you and you're absolutely done for healing. No way to heal yourself up, no way to counter it. Classes relying on Healing for defence are COMPLETELY AND ABSOLUTELY DUMPED while classes remaining on shields are still strong.

Carbonised · April 2017

Yes, we all received blanket nerfs with the CP changes.

On top of that, DKs received nerfs to:
- Battle Roar
- Helping Hands
- Talons rooting
- Blocking
- Igneous Shield

Templars received heavy nerfs too, and even NBs received some nerfs specifically for them.

Meanwhile, show me the sorc nerfs? None! Still the masters of both PvE and PvP insane DPS, still the masters of awesome survivability and sustainability. Still the best sustain skills of all. Still allowed to sit at range and tear everything apart, and still allowed to pack everything into one stat for both maximum damage and maximum survivability, while the DK has to smear stats all over the place to keep all stats equal and to not get punished by the diminishing returns of ressource regains.
And the sorc gets to keep his light armor and DPS + sustain passives, while the DK (in PvP) is still forced into heavy armor to even have a sliver of survivability, and still that heavy armor - and the blocking - are seeing large nerfs.

The specific nerfs to DKs (and to Templars and NBs, though I'm no expert on those) seem extremely unfair in the light of making sorcs go absolutely free of everything but the blanket nerfs to CPs that affect everyone.

Why exactly did everyone else BUT sorcs need specific nerfs? "Sorcs are affected by less cost reduction to shield stacking" someone already state, like it's the end of discussion. Like my mDK isn't using Harness in PvP? Like I don't have to spam a tiny Igneous Shield and hope it doesn't get removed by a light attack before I get the usefulness of the Mending passive? Like I don't use the still mediocre Dragon's Blood all the time to keep alive? Everyone uses magicka to stay alive (as a magicka based class anywway), everyone ELSE'S way of staying alive just got double and triple nerfed, however, while sorcs only receive the blanket nerfs to CP.

Seriously, devs, what justifies this? Were you under the impression that sorcs somehow underperformed in PvE or PvP compared to, say, mDKs? That's incomprehensible to say the least.

#NerfSorcsJustAsMuchAsTheOtherClasses

FMonk · April 2017

Another patch, another Xsorus thread complaining about sorcs. Nothing new to see here.

Joy_Division · April 2017

Derra wrote: »

Sorc shieldstacking is harshly affected by the removal of cost increase.

Harness will barely be able refund it´s own cost and the current situation of harness paying for hardened and harness both will be basically impossible to achieve.

The same logic applies to every class's spammable defensive mechanics. On top of that DKs igneous shield buff now lasts 1 light attack and helping hands passive nerfed. These changes have not effected all classes equally.

Malamar1229 · April 2017

with the entire cost reduction tree gone youre saying nothing being done to their sustain?

Bashev · April 2017

Malamar1229 wrote: »

with the entire cost reduction tree gone youre saying nothing being done to their sustain?

It is for all classes. Sorcs still have the reduce cost of stam and magicka skills and they have 10% magicka recovery and if needed they can have 20% stamina and health regen. On top of that dark exchange is not touched. I hope that now if it is interrupted the cost of the skill will be taken.

technohic · April 2017

Malamar1229 wrote: »

with the entire cost reduction tree gone youre saying nothing being done to their sustain?

That affects everyone. Everyone else also is getting their battery skills nerfed. Dark exchange is not. Not to mention healing is getting CP nerfs as well as some nasty maim debuffs while shields stay pact. They will suffer from the sustain nerfs as well; but the other mitigation is taking that as well as more hits.

I'm kind of over it though. If you read the forums too much, it will tear you down. I'm just going to try to make my Templar and stamblade work and if sorc really is that much better when this hits live; I'll play that or Warden. Life goes on

Cyantific87 · April 2017

Twohothardware wrote: »

Shad0wfire99 wrote: »

You know the regen and cost reduction nerfs hit every class, right?

Not even close. Sorc can run Lich on the back bar and have no issues at all with sustaining despite these changes. Stamina classes have no such set to counter it. Bastion which increases shields up to 25% was also completely ignored and shield stacking is the #1 imbalance issue in PvP right now. They then nerfed major mending and increased the cost of Vigor but where is the increased cost or nerf to size of shields like Harness Magicka and Healing Ward that MagSorc can spam all day?

This is a troll post, right?

Any magicka class can use any of those skills/sets. I use them all on my magblade.

Hoked_on_ponix · April 2017

clocksstoppe wrote: »

Shad0wfire99 wrote: »

Mojmir wrote: »

Shad0wfire99 wrote: »

You know the regen and cost reduction nerfs hit every class, right?

And? Sorc has never had a sustain issue likes of which dk and templar have.wheres our dark deal/pact?

Oh, this is a PVP QQ thing. Sorry. My mistake. And it's called "Spell Symmetry," for the record.

Go use spell symmetry on your sorc, then come back and delete this comment to not embarrass yourself further.

HAHA get Rekt

luen79rwb17_ESO · April 2017

So how many hours did you spend on PTS to come to such conclusion? Or is this just based because you're angry at skills balance?

Let's see sorc's exclusive resource skills and passives and which of them gives resources back with Zero effort / Zero opportunity cost:

Power surge: HP gain was nerfed already.

Shield: as a preventive skill was nerfed already.

Dark exchange: High risk / High reward, long cast, a sorc commiting to this skill is open to punishment, or is safe to cast it only when he/she has the Upper hand in the fight. For PVE is a DPS loss and used between pulls. Skill requires... Actual skills! Alot of micromanagement, usually slotted on sorc 3rd bar.

Overload: in order to get magicka back (only one of the morphs btw) the ability must hit its target, in PVP this skill is more comparable to a jester's dazzler than a proper ulti. Mainly used for 3rd bar.

Empowered ward: gives minor intellect but is the weaker shield. Again a choice must be made with this skill.

Endless fury: magicka return is situational.

Rebate passive: your pet must die un order to get magicka back.

Unholy knowledge passive: this could be a debatable passive but other classes' passives similar to this should be revised too in that case.

Capacitor passive: same as UKwldg

Malamar1229 · April 2017

Bashev wrote: »

Malamar1229 wrote: »

with the entire cost reduction tree gone youre saying nothing being done to their sustain?

It is for all classes. Sorcs still have the reduce cost of stam and magicka skills and they have 10% magicka recovery and if needed they can have 20% stamina and health regen. On top of that dark exchange is not touched. I hope that now if it is interrupted the cost of the skill will be taken.

Sorcs just got their shielstacking nerfed. Have you played sorc on PTS yet?
It will now be hardened ward only. I cant sustain with harness anymore.

Xsorus · April 2017

Anyone who says shield stacking is nerfed on PTS is full of it.

FMonk wrote: »

Another patch, another Xsorus thread complaining about sorcs. Nothing new to see here.

I'm sorry, I'm clearly not the only one pointing out the blatant favoritism shown to the Sorcs this patch. I also play a Sorc in PvP..Its freakin easy mode right now and a joke.

Derra · April 2017

Joy_Division wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Sorc shieldstacking is harshly affected by the removal of cost increase.

Harness will barely be able refund it´s own cost and the current situation of harness paying for hardened and harness both will be basically impossible to achieve.

The same logic applies to every class's spammable defensive mechanics. On top of that DKs igneous shield buff now lasts 1 light attack and helping hands passive nerfed. These changes have not effected all classes equally.

It does not - as harness returning more magica than invested is/was highly dependant on two things: Magica pool and stacked cost reduction.

Harness is extremely expensive compared to hardened ward and the return scales linear (meaning the more cost reduce you had, the better harness magica return in relation to skillcost became).

Currently on live you can achieve the point where harness pays for both shields (and returns further magica given high enough maxmag). This is what makes infinite shieldstacking so strong.
This scenario is almost unachieveable on the pts (i say almost because it´s still theoretically possible but you will be left with a build that does not work).

Malamar1229 · April 2017

lol favoritism,