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• https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/683901
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• https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/683901
Selfish tank or selfless (supportive)tank
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Tryxus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Supportive tank(ebon armory ofcourse, war horn, and buffs group)Selfless is the only way to go"Stand strong, stay true and shelter all."
Tryxus - Guardian of the Green - Warden - PC/EU0 -
Bowser✭✭✭✭✭Selfish tank that does nothing for group besides taunt, debuff and stay alive(min maxer maybe)Selfless is the only way to go
Speak for yourself.
Down with the meta, play how you want and stuff.2 -
sekou_trayvond✭✭✭✭✭Good topic, aside from the dopey poll phrasing.
I only tank when I run with PUGs. Generally, I'm personally buffed out to the max (30k plus resists), Armor Master and the monster set (I forget, which one) that gives u health back on being hit x %, or whatever it does. It makes the purple beam.
I suppose, definitionally, I'm a selfish tank. However, the main reason I run this setup is because I tank with PUGs. Doing so allows me to survive if the healer is sub optimal (or, psst, not a healer at all). Even better, I can take so much punishment that I can raise lowbies who've fallen so they can continue to participate and learn.
But then I also think I'm a helpful tank as well- caltrops, talons, the DK weapon buff, warhorn, vigor, etc.
So basically, I think a tank can borrow from both descriptions and succeed.2 -
willlienellson✭✭✭✭✭I wonder how many runs have failed outright because a tank was spec'd for "speed run" buffs instead of survivability?
If you only run with other min-maxed players then it probably makes sense to make your build with them in mind, but if you're grouping with randoms...."Selfish Tanks" GET....RUNS....COMPLETED.
When my tank is solo'ing the final boss of Tempest Island because all the pugs keep wiping over and over....Warhorn buffs aren't going to help them. Me not dying does.4 -
raj72616a✭✭✭✭✭Selfish tank that does nothing for group besides taunt, debuff and stay alive(min maxer maybe)i dont warhorn i dont ebon in 4 man dungeon because everyone stand in red, everyone die to mechanics, i'm the only one staying alive, and am busy running around to rez them, and heal them while they are alive, and do my main tanking job. oh and the stam dps is asking me to throw shard at him while i'm at it.
right, i'm so very selfish.1 -
Savos_Saren✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Meh. I think people look at it all wrong. I say both. Wear a set that you like (selfish) as long as you're helping the group (selfless). For a DK running vet dungeons, normal trials, and most content- you can run whatever gear you want. Personally, I prefer gear that helps me and the group. For instance, you can run a completely selfish set that helps everyone:
5 Knight Errant (selfish)
5 Akaviri Dragonguard (selfless)
2 Bloodspawn (a little bit of both)
I hate the idea that I, as a tank, have to run a very specific build for Damage Dealers who have min/maxed themselves to glass cannons. I might as well just have everyone tell me how to play, what gear to farm, and what buttons to push. No fun.Want to enjoy the game more? Try both PvP (crybabies) and PvE (carebears). You'll get a better perspective on everyone's opinion.
PC NA AD
Savos Saren2 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭To everyone saying that you have to run Ebon, you have to use warhorn and you have to provide group support please L2P.. Those are good but you dont need to have it to clear content..
Content in ESO is so easy unless you are pushing for scores only DPS matters.. Even them only DPS matters..
For 4 man dungeons I certainly agree. Especially since some can tank it on dps characters and actually tank dungeon bosses. Same can be said for normal trials.
However, for vet trials, especially HM, it is a different story. For one, the raid leader will often ask for certain gear to be worn. A tank that can provide what is asked for and do a good job will likely be asked to tank again.
One who insists on doing his own thing, even if he tanks the content well will be considered less often.1 -
clocksstoppe✭✭✭✭✭
✭Bloodspawn & Lord Warden are by far the best sets for a tank. Maybe Scourge Harvester in some situations but really doesn't come close to the former. Mighty Chudan and Pirate Skeleton are plain bad on any serious PvE tank. The latter will make the healer tear his hair out.
Lol get good son. How can pirate skeleton be bad for the healer if you need to heal 30% less health because of it? You have absolutely NO idea what you are talking about.0 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭clocksstoppe wrote: »Bloodspawn & Lord Warden are by far the best sets for a tank. Maybe Scourge Harvester in some situations but really doesn't come close to the former. Mighty Chudan and Pirate Skeleton are plain bad on any serious PvE tank. The latter will make the healer tear his hair out.
Lol get good son. How can pirate skeleton be bad for the healer if you need to heal 30% less health because of it? You have absolutely NO idea what you are talking about.
They offer nothing to the group in a vet trial and the rare instance the 30% less damage would be beneficial the chance it has proced is far to low to count on. For most boss fights it is not needed.
It can be a fun set to play with but not something for more serious tanking.0 -
clocksstoppe✭✭✭✭✭
✭Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »clocksstoppe wrote: »Bloodspawn & Lord Warden are by far the best sets for a tank. Maybe Scourge Harvester in some situations but really doesn't come close to the former. Mighty Chudan and Pirate Skeleton are plain bad on any serious PvE tank. The latter will make the healer tear his hair out.
Lol get good son. How can pirate skeleton be bad for the healer if you need to heal 30% less health because of it? You have absolutely NO idea what you are talking about.
They offer nothing to the group in a vet trial and the rare instance the 30% less damage would be beneficial the chance it has proced is far to low to count on. For most boss fights it is not needed.
It can be a fun set to play with but not something for more serious tanking.
Did i say anything about offering stuff to the group? I was addressing his "problem" with skeleton and healers.0 -
ElliottXO✭✭✭✭✭Even with full support sets you can tank for pug groups that have barely any damage or knowledge about mechanics. There is absolutely no reason at all to play a non-support tank in PVE. Zero, Null, Nothing.
But it takes ages. That is why my PUG tank runs viper and selene. Even if both DPS are underwhelming I can manage to contribute 10k DPS.
What good would it be to have 1k extra health if nobody comes even close to dying, because both DPS come in heavy armour doing dizzy swings?1 -
JinMori✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Supportive tank(ebon armory ofcourse, war horn, and buffs group)Of course a supportive tank is better, what kind of question is that?
The only time when a selfish tank could be better is if your group members are ***.0 -
Liofa✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I would say both for different people .
For pledges , I only run with people I know . We burn bosses so fast , they can't even start the animation for mechanics . Sets like Alkosh and support skills like Warhorn are increasing my group mates' damage by a percentage . That means if you are going with High DPS players , they will do even more damage . In this kind of situations , support tank is obviously better .
On the other hand , if you are a PUG tank , you not dying can be better . If your DD is spamming light attacks with bow , that special snowflake is heavy attacking with Frost Staff , your healer doesn't know what Springs are ; then going with selfish tank is better . Because whatever support you give to that kind of team , they still suck . So , you must take care of things by yourself with a selfish build .
To sum up , use selfish build if you don't trust your group . Solution : Don't join PUGs .3 -
Pallmor✭✭✭✭✭
✭Selfish tank that does nothing for group besides taunt, debuff and stay alive(min maxer maybe)Drummerx04 wrote: »The options here are pretty bad, but:
I have seen SO many pug tanks wearing ebon simply because they were told to apparently. They are so bad at positioning mobs and taunting the mobs that are actually kind of dangerous, and they are also terribad at surviving if the healer is unavailable for any reason. I have also seen some of these tanks using sturdy warhorn.
The real problem with your poll is that tanking styles/builds are not so black and white. I can have a completely selfish build with respect to direct group buffs... but if I can group every mob pack into one liquid lightning within 5 seconds and then root them in place and taunt them... that's still incredibly useful and I would run with that tank for any pledge.
This. Positioning is such an important (and underrated) tank skill. It's my job to position the boss right so he doesn't spit fire on you, chain in ranged ads for AoE's, taunt, debuff, and stay alive. If you're looking for a tank who can boost your dps so you can brag to your friends about your latest numbers or who can help you break your last speed-run record, then you need to hire someone else.
And also, screw your Ebon armor. So sick of hearing the groupthink that you just MUST have this exact same build and equipment that everyone else has. I don't play this game to be exactly like everyone else.
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Stratti✭✭✭✭✭Selfish tank that does nothing for group besides taunt, debuff and stay alive(min maxer maybe)Stupid poll. Do you want a tank that ensure aggro and lives or one that dies .
Dps can buff themselves. Tanks are meant to survive0 -
Oompuh✭✭✭✭✭Supportive tank(ebon armory ofcourse, war horn, and buffs group)Stupid poll. Do you want a tank that ensure aggro and lives or one that dies .
Dps can buff themselves. Tanks are meant to survive
You assume a supportive tank is a dead tank? A supportive tank (warden, ebon, alkosh) has max resistance, 30k+health, and heavy armor with a shield.. you shouldn't be dieing.
Losing ebon, a dps has to put more into health, dps loss. Losing alkosh, stamina has to run it or lost it entirely, dps loss. Losing warden, melee stack is more prone to dieing, dps loss. Not throwing orbs, dps have to stack more resource management, dps loss. No war horn rotation, dps loss. And on and on and on.Edited by Oompuh on March 25, 2017 4:05PMXbox NA - Oompa
Khajiit DK Tank
Founder of Major Aegis
Main Tank of Dissonant Crusade Uprising Savages1 -
Dr_Ganknstein✭✭✭✭✭
✭lol @ this poll
Translating text:
Whats better : Bad ass Wolverine Tank
OR
Block Potato Tank
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Volrion✭✭✭✭Selfish tank that does nothing for group besides taunt, debuff and stay alive(min maxer maybe)Hand me my frost staff...Edited by Volrion on March 25, 2017 4:06PM0 -
WhitePawPrints✭✭✭✭✭
✭I run an unconventional build so your meta or nothing poll options aren't valid for me.
My tank has amazing self sustain and self buffs, but is also built to aid the group significantly. So I'm selfish and selfless at the same time.1 -
DaveMoeDee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »The options don't make sense.
Selfish tank taunts and debuffs and is maybe a min/max tank. A min/max tank would be wearing sets that give the group bunus aether ebon/Alkosh or the former darling build if tavas and dragon.
A min max tank would maybe wear chudan set and plague doctor over bloodspawn(for magma armor or warhorn) and ebon armory. If you're you're greedy tank then you would rather have more armor and health for yourself rather than resources for your group.
Saying "min/max" does not specify what stats they are trying to optimize. A min/maxer could try to optimize support while staying alive by getting the best class, race, CP, skills, and gear.0 -
Wrecking_Blow_Spam✭✭✭✭✭
✭Supportive tank(ebon armory ofcourse, war horn, and buffs group)I would say both for different people .
For pledges , I only run with people I know . We burn bosses so fast , they can't even start the animation for mechanics . Sets like Alkosh and support skills like Warhorn are increasing my group mates' damage by a percentage . That means if you are going with High DPS players , they will do even more damage . In this kind of situations , support tank is obviously better .
On the other hand , if you are a PUG tank , you not dying can be better . If your DD is spamming light attacks with bow , that special snowflake is heavy attacking with Frost Staff , your healer doesn't know what Springs are ; then going with selfish tank is better . Because whatever support you give to that kind of team , they still suck . So , you must take care of things by yourself with a selfish build .
To sum up , use selfish build if you don't trust your group . Solution : Don't join PUGs .
This is similar to my thoughts on tanking.Xbox one EU
8 Flawless conquerors on all class specs (4 stam, 4 magicka)
Doesn't stand in red0 -
hmsdragonfly✭✭✭✭✭
✭Supportive tank(ebon armory ofcourse, war horn, and buffs group)Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »The options don't make sense.
Selfish tank taunts and debuffs and is maybe a min/max tank. A min/max tank would be wearing sets that give the group bunus aether ebon/Alkosh or the former darling build if tavas and dragon.
A min max tank would maybe wear chudan set and plague doctor over bloodspawn(for magma armor or warhorn) and ebon armory. If you're you're greedy tank then you would rather have more armor and health for yourself rather than resources for your group.
Ummm no. Min maxers are people who run for score. Running for score requires you to be a supportive tank. You cannot run for score in freaking Plague Doctor.
Aldmeri Dominion Loyalist. For the Queen!1 -
zuto40✭✭✭✭✭Selfish tank that does nothing for group besides taunt, debuff and stay alive(min maxer maybe)i only do dailies on him no trials if you need me to buff you in wayrest sewers youre bad end of storyEdited by zuto40 on March 26, 2017 8:28AMStamblade- Legate
Tank/Heals Templar- Sergeant
Magic DK- Corporal
Stam DK- Sergeant
Stamplar- Corporal
YouTube https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCy8uqORxhlrMh8oz2230s9g1 -
KeiruNicrom✭✭✭✭✭Selfish tank that does nothing for group besides taunt, debuff and stay alive(min maxer maybe)as a tank I exist to survive the damage and mechanics of all kinds of enemies. You deeps and heals do your jobs and ill do mine ya?0 -
Stratti✭✭✭✭✭Selfish tank that does nothing for group besides taunt, debuff and stay alive(min maxer maybe)Stupid poll. Do you want a tank that ensure aggro and lives or one that dies .
Dps can buff themselves. Tanks are meant to surviveStupid poll. Do you want a tank that ensure aggro and lives or one that dies .
Dps can buff themselves. Tanks are meant to survive
You assume a supportive tank is a dead tank? A supportive tank (warden, ebon, alkosh) has max resistance, 30k+health, and heavy armor with a shield.. you shouldn't be dieing.
Losing ebon, a dps has to put more into health, dps loss. Losing alkosh, stamina has to run it or lost it entirely, dps loss. Losing warden, melee stack is more prone to dieing, dps loss. Not throwing orbs, dps have to stack more resource management, dps loss. No war horn rotation, dps loss. And on and on and on.
Problem here is your running numbers in your head instead of reality. The amount of *** groups ive tanked forvin hm vet where they died multiple times and slow burned while my selfish whitestrake kept me alive - is countless. Truly countless
1 in 5 runs i get a pro group whose that on point where I barely use resources to tank. Here is will buff but honestly the dps is that op it is for nought.
A good tank sets up for the 4 out of 5 runs in finder where the dps are shocking and your often alone on boss with 1 guy rezzing 2 baddies. Keeping yourself up.
Min/max is for dps not tanking because we are situational and in this game the quality of dps is broad of range0 -
Pallmor✭✭✭✭✭
✭Selfish tank that does nothing for group besides taunt, debuff and stay alive(min maxer maybe)Losing ebon, a dps has to put more into health, dps loss. Losing alkosh, stamina has to run it or lost it entirely, dps loss. Losing warden, melee stack is more prone to dieing, dps loss. Not throwing orbs, dps have to stack more resource management, dps loss. No war horn rotation, dps loss. And on and on and on.
If you're building a glass cannon so fragile that you can't take even a small hit, don't blame the tank or healer when you die. Like I said earlier, it's not the tank's job to help you set a new dps record. Don't expect the tank and healer to do everything, just so you can build a ridiculously over-specialized glass cannon that shatters when an ad even looks at them.
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Voxicity✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Supportive tank(ebon armory ofcourse, war horn, and buffs group)gimme dat sweet alkosh0 -
Marktoneth3✭✭✭Selfish tank that does nothing for group besides taunt, debuff and stay alive(min maxer maybe)taking all damage and can survive by myself...let those healers focus on dps1 -
Oompuh✭✭✭✭✭Supportive tank(ebon armory ofcourse, war horn, and buffs group)Stupid poll. Do you want a tank that ensure aggro and lives or one that dies .
Dps can buff themselves. Tanks are meant to surviveStupid poll. Do you want a tank that ensure aggro and lives or one that dies .
Dps can buff themselves. Tanks are meant to survive
You assume a supportive tank is a dead tank? A supportive tank (warden, ebon, alkosh) has max resistance, 30k+health, and heavy armor with a shield.. you shouldn't be dieing.
Losing ebon, a dps has to put more into health, dps loss. Losing alkosh, stamina has to run it or lost it entirely, dps loss. Losing warden, melee stack is more prone to dieing, dps loss. Not throwing orbs, dps have to stack more resource management, dps loss. No war horn rotation, dps loss. And on and on and on.
Problem here is your running numbers in your head instead of reality. The amount of *** groups ive tanked forvin hm vet where they died multiple times and slow burned while my selfish whitestrake kept me alive - is countless. Truly countless
1 in 5 runs i get a pro group whose that on point where I barely use resources to tank. Here is will buff but honestly the dps is that op it is for nought.
A good tank sets up for the 4 out of 5 runs in finder where the dps are shocking and your often alone on boss with 1 guy rezzing 2 baddies. Keeping yourself up.
Min/max is for dps not tanking because we are situational and in this game the quality of dps is broad of range
The DPS I run with pull 50k+ with the help of a thing we call "raid buffs". Alkosh, war horn, spc, aether, etc. 5 out of 5 runs are with my guild who are end game dps. You should try it sometime instead of picking up randoms
Your reasoning for running a less effective setup is because you play with less effective playersEdited by Oompuh on March 26, 2017 2:27PMXbox NA - Oompa
Khajiit DK Tank
Founder of Major Aegis
Main Tank of Dissonant Crusade Uprising Savages2
