Because that's the basic concept of every mmo

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

You can get those things through various business models. You don't have to use the exact model others use. Everything does not have to be like WoW. What works for one business may not work for another. Heck, I know plenty of people that have played wow for a long period of time and enjoy this setup more. If you want wow, go play that.

The "if you want wow" argument is so weak, it really is.

I have played in WoW in the past. But I enjoy the setting in ESO more, I like that faster more fluid combat. I much prefer the graphical style, the world building, the fact that NPC have voices that match their words. The audioscape of ESO is totally impressive as well. From the ambient noise of wildlife to the stunningly sounding thunderstorms.

I don't want ESO to be "just like WoW" - I want it to be better than that.

But I do think there are some lessons ESO can learn from WoW.
I also think there are some lessons ESO could learn from LOTRO - Cosmetics and Player Music for example.

bowmanz607 wrote: »

I am for anything that makes a player earn it rather than pay for it. That is a poor business model. I already don't care for race change. Class change goes to a whole new level and is just another stepping stone to a pay to win game. You say it makes players happy, I say many players are unhappy about things that are geared toward money grabs. As evidenced by crown crates and what not.

Offering a service (Race Change / Class Change) is NOT pay-to-win; it's not even a "cash grab" - it's a service.

I agree with your concerns about Crown Crates and will never use them.

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Offering those things also make players unhappy, makes people want to leave, could lose zenith money from people leaving. I say this because it is just another step towards a game going pay to win which makes people unhappy and want to leave. It is another money grab that makes people want to leave.

This is illogical in the extreme.

If they offer a service and you don't want to use it then don't use it... ...simples.

How does me hypothetically changing my Character from (for example) a Nord Templar to an Orc Warden affect you in any way? It doesn't... ...end of.

I don't PvP in MMORPGs (I genuinely think they are the wrong platform for genuine player skill based balanced PvP). But I don't throw a temper tantrum and claim I want to quit the game because PvP is offered to those player that want to use it.

All The Best

CarbonX wrote: »

CaptainVenom wrote: »

CarbonX wrote: »

Everyone is "Wow! Warden! New class! OMG! So cool! Warden! Wow!"... ... ...

I only use one character and I do everything with him in the game, from PvE, to PvP, to try go get all achievements in the game, etc.

So, new content is coming, I have to pay for it if I want it, but I'm forced to put my current character aside and play all the game again if I want to use the Warden? Why? (I know Morrowind has a lot of stuff to do, but this thread points to the use of the new class only).

Why I can't have an option to use the Warden with the character I have now (class change)?

Why am I forced to start the game from scratch and repeat all I have been doing for +2 years if I want to play with the Warden?

Or, am I also forced to create a Warden character, don't do any PvE (well, forcedly some to level it up) and use it for PvP only?

Why this game forces people to have more than one character and so do all things over again?

How I see things; ZOS doesn't think nor cares for players that play just one character.

Class change please, even if with crowns.

You sound like leveling up to 50 takes years. Please, It's possible to achieve lv50 in 7 days or less. You don't even need to level up CP. The only bad part on creating a new character is the mount upgrade.

Damn, sometimes ESO community is just a bunch of whiners.

What part of "I use only one character, don't use alts, and so would like to have the Warden on my current and only toon" you don't understand? My God! Is it really that difficult for some of you?

So every time something new comes along you want a token to change it? How about no.

Every time something new comes along I have access to it with my existing characters. I don't have to start from scratch to enter a new dungeon or equip higher level gear. The Warden is entirely different, and it's the only exception.
So how about yes.

CarbonX wrote: »

What part of "I use only one character, don't use alts, and so would like to have the Warden on my current and only toon" you don't understand? My God! Is it really that difficult for some of you?

We understand. We understand that you feel like you're being victimized by ZOS. They are purposely making it difficult for people who only play character. After all, they are not offering a class change with this new expansion. I guess you have a couple of options:

(1) Play your current character until the class change token becomes available
(2) Roll a new Warden and level it up like the rest of community.

Edit...a 3rd option: You could always quit and find something else to play...at least until the class change becomes real.

Who said anything about being forced? While it's good to get everything done on one character and be a completest (I am to a certain degree but love theorycrafting builds and classes more) it's also not a bad thing to have other characters, try different aspects of the game etc.

@CarbonX For instance I noticed that your current character is stamina according to your sig. Okay so maybe you roll a Dunmer magicka Warden, try out a magicka build and that'll be your magicka character. So now you have two, one for stam and one for magicka. Slowly level him with an ease on your completest burden because you got a lot of achievements already with one character.

If that doesn't work then I don't know what to say, you aren't forced to do anything. Simple solution is to either make another character finally as a Warden class and play him/her when you got time or don't play the new class at all and enjoy the Morrowind content on your main.

Plays one character
Complains about being unable to play the new class
So... Did you complain about the other three classes?

TequilaFire wrote: »

I am of the opinion that completing Cadwell's gold on at least one character should unlock mount leveling, crafting, alliance rank, skyshards and all achievements on all characters once they reach level 50.

Hell no! What would I do with those characters once they reach level 50 then?

TequilaFire wrote: »

For those who reply it takes no time to level to 50 that is not the issue.
It takes avery long time to unlock riding and crafting skill which is necessary to even craft furniture in housing.
Ever try to ride across Cyrodiil on a level 10 mount even though your character has reached lvl 50 CP160?
Achievements account wide are the real issue.

Stop talking like creating a new character automatically deletes the character you've been playing until now. If you have crafting unlocked on one character, log onto that character if you want to craft. It's not hard. You can even park them at a crafting station if that's all they are going to do from then on.

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

You can get those things through various business models. You don't have to use the exact model others use. Everything does not have to be like WoW. What works for one business may not work for another. Heck, I know plenty of people that have played wow for a long period of time and enjoy this setup more. If you want wow, go play that.

The "if you want wow, go play wow" argument is so weak, it really is.

I have played in WoW in the past. But I enjoy the setting in ESO more, I like that faster more fluid combat. I much prefer the graphical style, the world building, the fact that NPC have voices that match their words. The audioscape of ESO is totally impressive as well. From the ambient noise of wildlife to the stunningly sounding thunderstorms.

I don't want ESO to be "just like WoW" - I want it to be better than that.

But I do think there are some lessons ESO can learn from WoW.
I also think there are some lessons ESO could learn from LOTRO - Cosmetics and Player Music for example.

bowmanz607 wrote: »

I am for anything that makes a player earn it rather than pay for it. That is a poor business model. I already don't care for race change. Class change goes to a whole new level and is just another stepping stone to a pay to win game. You say it makes players happy, I say many players are unhappy about things that are geared toward money grabs. As evidenced by crown crates and what not.

Offering a service (Race Change / Class Change) is NOT pay-to-win; it's not even a "cash grab" - it's a service.

I agree with your concerns about Crown Crates and will never use them.

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Offering those things also make players unhappy, makes people want to leave, could lose zenith money from people leaving. I say this because it is just another step towards a game going pay to win which makes people unhappy and want to leave. It is another money grab that makes people want to leave.

This is illogical in the extreme.

If they offer a service and you don't want to use it then don't use it... ...simples.

How does me hypothetically changing my Character from (for example) a Nord Templar to an Orc Warden affect you in any way? It doesn't... ...end of.

I don't PvP in MMORPGs (I genuinely think they are the wrong platform for genuine player skill based balanced PvP). But I don't throw a temper tantrum and claim I want to quit the game because PvP is offered to those player that want to use it.

All The Best

@Gandrhulf_Harbard

Going all the way back....how does allowing you to change your class impact "me" or others?

The game shares experiences unless it's a solo only instance with everyone. If the developers were to enable anyone to change their class, it has a huge impact on everyone.

What happens is a new player would often not see players, which then, detracts from any social interactions. It creates a divide and could also present a situation where it's perceived that the game is dead because people aren't doing different content at different times.

For the experienced players...it packs everyone into one or few zones and creates congestion....basically issues that we saw upon PC launch even with the staggered starts. That does impact everyone even on solo instances cause server resources are shared

Let's use your reference to WoW.
I remember whenever there was a new expansion it would seem that everyone was in the same spot for the first month and it would cause some aggression and congestion

In my point of view, the ZOS decision to keep content fluid and not step by step in terms of progression, eliminates that from ESO compared to WoW and about 7 other MMO types I've played.

In terms of the new class and being forced to start over, I think this aligns with the above.


Now in all that I completely recognize the desires and even logical reasons players wouldn't want to redo content. It's completely logical to ask for and pursue a class change option and who knows if it won't come later....I don't.

I do, however, believe strongly that when it's being considered, all the comments I made above are something the developers consider.

I don't think a class change would be best for the game but perhaps other ideas to lessen the extent of repeating content may be more realistic

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

@Gandrhulf_Harbard

Going all the way back....how does allowing you to change your class impact "me" or others?

The game shares experiences unless it's a solo only instance with everyone. If the developers were to enable anyone to change their class, it has a huge impact on everyone.

@NewBlacksmurf

No, it doesn't.

What impacts you is if there other players around or not.

Their race, faction and class is 100% irrelevant and has no impact you on whatsoever.

All The Best

Stopnaggin wrote: »

Humatiel wrote: »

katiesmith12341 wrote: »

Well they could offer a start off at 160 champ for the warden? (of course it will need to be paid for) Some player's don't actually get a lot of time to level characters and it can take months. I can understand the frustration of leveling a character from the beginning up again...OR they could allow class switch on a character you already have leveled up..but in this situation you are kind of stuck... but if they did allow class switch, you could always switch it back again...however this still does not help the fact you will need to level out your skill line from the beginning. I am now champ 414 and that has taken me 2 years, but I do have numerous characters I play...although i normally just stick with the 3 at level 50 now. I am also a PVP player so I understand exactly what you are saying.

while I'm not opposed to the idea of buying a level 50 alt (assuming the main was at least 50), it takes ~10 hours to grind from 1 to 50 so trying to say it takes months is a bit of a stretch.

It takes about 6 hours to go from 1 to 50. Maybe less if you have a partner, you can use the ever popular Skyreach Catacombs and be at cp160 in lest than a week.

As for starting a new character and class it will probably be better to start fresh anyway. You will have a chance to learn the skills, a rotation, strengths and weaknesses.

What I really hate seeing anymore is everyone complaining that they are forced to do anything. Complaining about something that hasn't even been released yet is ever so popular these days. Also comparing ESO to any other mmos, this isn't another mmo, it's ESO, a different game. If all these other games are better than you are free to play those games. I'm not saying ESO doesn't have problems, but seriously it's been 3 years compared to 10 for WoW.

As for the OP, you are probably in the minority when it comes to only playing 1 character. Most players have several different classes for different things. Some have healer, tanks and dps for trials and dungeons, while they have other toons for pvp. So while yes you have to make another toon, you are by no means having to do anything others have already done.

6 hours? this grinding straight right?...It would take me much more than that to get to level 50. I also would only be able to play at the weekends, maybe I can throw in time after work but take for this week I have been to London and back (I live in the south west) and I just don't get the time.

People keep bringing up this "force you" of course your not forced to do it, but heck if your going to buy the expansion everyone is going to get a warden class and everyone is going to want to level it to 50.

Eso is a MMORPG and yes I will compare it to other games because I play both, and both have their ups and downs. I'm not saying ESO should take the route of other games, ESO has a different style and that is something I love about it. But after introducing the crate boxes it sounds awfully familiar to many others out there. What really bugs me are ESO's servers, and the amount of maintenance this game goes under...

Once again I think with many people it comes down with the repeat play of ESO's story, and having to "grind" your way through the game to get a good enough level to game or pvp.

Being able to play Morrowind at Level 1 and HOPEFULLY being able to go through the story and level to 50 (or close to) by the end of the story would be a massive thumbs up from me!

When I get home i like to get on ESO and play some PVP! even if it is for a little bit.

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

@Gandrhulf_Harbard

Going all the way back....how does allowing you to change your class impact "me" or others?

The game shares experiences unless it's a solo only instance with everyone. If the developers were to enable anyone to change their class, it has a huge impact on everyone.

@NewBlacksmurf

No, it doesn't.

What impacts you is if there other players around or not.

Their race, faction and class is 100% irrelevant and has no impact you on whatsoever.

All The Best

OK ok then we'll if it is all irrelevant and has no effect, then why don't we all run hybrid, argonIan, nb through some trials.

That shouldn't have any impact on compete img the trial right?

bowmanz607 wrote: »

OK ok then we'll if it is all irrelevant and has no effect, then why don't we all run hybrid, argonIan, nb through some trials.

That shouldn't have any impact on compete img the trial right?

This isn't about optimal builds, which is a separate issue entirely.

All The Best